Notification about discontinuing of the game in the Netherlands/Belgium

[Snafu 139]

On 12/13/2020 at 2:58 PM, Adriel.RB said:

What if we contact the support team that are on the russian forum about this issue?

You might give it a try but I suspect it went like this:

- [Manager] We cannot sell loot boxes in NL and BE anymore. Devs, how much would it cost us to remove them from the shop?
- [Dev manager] Lets see. Design, coding, testing, support - about $150k.

- [Manager] Finance, how much revenue we get from these markets?
- [Finance] In 2020 we project $50k.

- [Manager] Well, never mind. Operations, please block NL and BE starting in 2021.

[falcosenna1 18]

On 12/10/2020 at 11:02 PM, Spy said:

That's completely understandable, I will keep you guys updated.

Would be cool if we get compensated financially since players have spent money to the game, which is lost now. 

[falcosenna1 18]

9 minutes ago, Adriel.RB said:

WELCOME BACK :0000000

it's been so long ;-; back on topic I highly doubt they would even do such things, sadly

Thanks. Only back for this issue though.

Highly doubt it either. Though it'd be a fair thing to do when a game kicks players from a country. Then again it's TO, a game that doesn't even mind promoting gambling. 

Edited December 15, 2020 by falcosenna1
grammatical error

[Spy 14,687]

1 hour ago, falcosenna1 said:

Would be cool if we get compensated financially since players have spent money to the game, which is lost now. 

I doubt you will get anything, but feel free to contact the Tech Support and discuss it with them.

[Blutaar 1,904]

5 minutes ago, Spy said:

I doubt you will get anything, but feel free to contact the Tech Support and discuss it with them.

As I have heard from other Tankers and speculated on what it is said on the stream of last weekend, nothing will be done about this situation? On the short term that is. 
If so, the only solution would be to purchase VPN? Or what other ways do you suggest?

[falcosenna1 18]

35 minutes ago, Spy said:

I doubt you will get anything, but feel free to contact the Tech Support and discuss it with them.

Thanks. I sure will. I'd also like an answer from our CM since he hasn't said anything close to it on the last stream. 

[Spy 14,687]

46 minutes ago, falcosenna1 said:

Thanks. I sure will. I'd also like an answer from our CM since he hasn't said anything close to it on the last stream. 

I will see what can be done about it

[Destined 11]

1 hour ago, falcosenna1 said:

Thanks. I sure will. I'd also like an answer from our CM since he hasn't said anything close to it on the last stream. 

keep us posted! i want to know how these stupid devs are going to chicken out of this mess.

[falcosenna1 18]

1 hour ago, Destined said:

keep us posted! i want to know how these stupid devs are going to chicken out of this mess.

Will update you if anything happens, be it positive or negative.  My mail to Tech Support has been sent. 

Edited December 15, 2020 by falcosenna1

[falcosenna1 18]

1 hour ago, Destined said:

keep us posted! i want to know how these stupid devs are going to chicken out of this mess.

So here is the first answer: 

 

"Hello,

Unfortunately the compensation is not provided in this case."

Well, unjustice must be fought I guess. 

 

[Fighter 26]

Keep in mind that you can just play until the end of December and not after that. Almost all of us have spent money on the game, but Tanki is not going to do anything with that (like compensation). as I hear from all Dutch and Belgian friends, most of them are not going to buy a VPN. I won't be meeting many friends on the battlefield anymore. I don't really feel like purchasing a VPN myself. too bad we can't just get into the game normally

[Blutaar 1,904]

1 hour ago, Fighter said:

Keep in mind that you can just play until the end of December and not after that. Almost all of us have spent money on the game, but Tanki is not going to do anything with that (like compensation). as I hear from all Dutch and Belgian friends, most of them are not going to buy a VPN. I won't be meeting many friends on the battlefield anymore. I don't really feel like purchasing a VPN myself. too bad we can't just get into the game normally

buying VPN only to play Tanki Online is a big purchase I have to make. In my opinion, the deverlopers should come up with advice and suggestions what we can do. As it is not our fault that the game is discontinuing, we should not get the responsibility to find a solution ourselves because developers decided to stop the game. 

[falcosenna1 18]

So far my next mail to Tech Support remains unanswered while the previous one was answered within 5 minutes exactly. If I'm not getting an answer by tomorrow evening, I'll resend my mail. 

And I agree on not spending money on a VPN just to play a game. 

[sezze100 416]

25 minutes ago, falcosenna1 said:

So far my next mail to Tech Support remains unanswered while the previous one was answered within 5 minutes exactly. If I'm not getting an answer by tomorrow evening, I'll resend my mail. 

And I agree on not spending money on a VPN just to play a game. 

True , and everybody will do what is best for them . I can only speak for myself , and i regret having to play from VPN but i will go that route because several reasons ( 1 is that i thought about a vpn before because i spend a few m/y outside Belgium anyway ) . I am not ready to give up my account just because Tanki drops my country because a law which does not imply on me or Tanki . 1st loot boxes ( containers ) cannot be traded , not for cash , not against any other player .2nd it is a rule to protect children from gambling , and i am well over the age ( multiple times ) that implies to .

I would not count on getting anything back from Tanki , because you bought something and they delivered . If they stop the game at all , you also got nothing left . The only thing you can try is if you got Premium for significant time after 31 december , and you bought it like 1 week before they send out the notice .

[falcosenna1 18]

28 minutes ago, sezze100 said:

True , and everybody will do what is best for them . I can only speak for myself , and i regret having to play from VPN but i will go that route because several reasons ( 1 is that i thought about a vpn before because i spend a few m/y outside Belgium anyway ) . I am not ready to give up my account just because Tanki drops my country because a law which does not imply on me or Tanki . 1st loot boxes ( containers ) cannot be traded , not for cash , not against any other player .2nd it is a rule to protect children from gambling , and i am well over the age ( multiple times ) that implies to .

I would not count on getting anything back from Tanki , because you bought something and they delivered . If they stop the game at all , you also got nothing left . The only thing you can try is if you got Premium for significant time after 31 december , and you bought it like 1 week before they send out the notice .

I'm over 18 too, hence I'm free to gamble whenever I want, though intelligent enough not to. I'm not counting on a compensation. I have stopped playing the game more than 5 years ago and have no interest in rejoining. There's many way better games to spend some free time on. On the other hand, TO has had enough time to find or create a solution for Belgian/Dutch players. They didn't tho. And I find it interesting how the game managers will handle this. Simply kicking players from the game while they've spent money to it while TO has had time to find solutions is mind-blowing in a negative way. I wonder what both countries governments think of such practices. 

Edited December 15, 2020 by falcosenna1
Typo, might not be the only one

[sezze100 416]

1 hour ago, falcosenna1 said:

I'm over 18 too, hence I'm free to gamble whenever I want, though intelligent enough not to. I'm not counting on a compensation. I have stopped playing the game more than 5 years ago and have no interest in rejoining. There's many way better games to spend some free time on. On the other hand, TO has had enough time to find or create a solution for Belgian/Dutch players. They didn't tho. And I find it interesting how the game managers will handle this. Simply kicking players from the game while they've spent money to it while TO has had time to find solutions is mind-blowing in a negative way. I wonder what both countries governments think of such practices. 

I highly doubt they ever heard of TO , or are busy with them . Theres tons of gambling websites which they did not fix in the past also . But you are right , they certainly could handle it much better . Simply banning IP is probably the easiest , but i think it would be very easy also to not let containers be bought by IP from Belgium/Netherlands . They would still be able for tankoins / cry / gold box / premium ... which now they do not have that option anymore . Thinking all people switching over to VPN is dreaming , i guess only very small amount of people will do that .

I actually don't know about EU rules about loot boxes .

[falcosenna1 18]

6 hours ago, sezze100 said:

I highly doubt they ever heard of TO , or are busy with them . Theres tons of gambling websites which they did not fix in the past also . But you are right , they certainly could handle it much better . Simply banning IP is probably the easiest , but i think it would be very easy also to not let containers be bought by IP from Belgium/Netherlands . They would still be able for tankoins / cry / gold box / premium ... which now they do not have that option anymore . Thinking all people switching over to VPN is dreaming , i guess only very small amount of people will do that .

I actually don't know about EU rules about loot boxes .

I'm sure they haven't heard of TO yet. They're busy with practices of gambling exposure to minors tho. I'm even willing to contact the right Belgian authorities who fight such practices, just to inform myself and for my own interest. It's an interesting case. 

[tankkiller37 2]

TO is kicking us out, since the Netherland has kicked out their spies. The Loot-boxes story ain't right, as, as a player, I cannot trade the content of my garage. The difference with EA is, that players/items from loot-boxes were tradeable.

If someone knows how I can still sell my 50K mines to other players, I'm eager to know.

[sezze100 416]

23 minutes ago, tankkiller37 said:

TO is kicking us out, since the Netherland has kicked out their spies. The Loot-boxes story ain't right, as, as a player, I cannot trade the content of my garage. The difference with EA is, that players/items from loot-boxes were tradeable.

If someone knows how I can still sell my 50K mines to other players, I'm eager to know.

It is the trading which is a problem , but TO does not see that line in the law . When you can trade it , then you got the option to buy , gamble , and trade it for something else ( aka cash ) . In tanki they are only tools ( drugs cry ...) inside or with a bit of luck a skin or augment or when very lucky a Crisis drone . You cannot however change your lucky drone to somebody else , and neither are you allowed to trade your full account to another person .

Netherlands have kicked out their spies , hmm UK and US got more problem with Russia then Netherlands , and Belgium got no issue with such cases .So that has got nothing to do with it .

[falcosenna1 18]

2 hours ago, tankkiller37 said:

TO is kicking us out, since the Netherland has kicked out their spies. The Loot-boxes story ain't right, as, as a player, I cannot trade the content of my garage. The difference with EA is, that players/items from loot-boxes were tradeable.

If someone knows how I can still sell my 50K mines to other players, I'm eager to know.

I don't know about the Dutch law, but the Belgian law defines both as gambling, whether you're able to trade the product or not. The way you got the product is what counts in the Belgian law. 

"Games of chance are all activities that combine a direct or indirect payment by the player with the chance to win or lose something insofar that this chance depends, even partially, on coincidence."

"The Law of May 7, 1999 on games of chance, bets, gaming establishments and the protection of players, as amended by the law of 10 January, 2010 (Wet van 7 mei 1999 op de kansspelen, de weddenschappen, de kansspelinrichtingen en de bescherming van de spelers,as amended by the two laws of January 10, 2010), explicitly states that all games of chance and bets and the exploitation of gaming establishments are prohibited unless they are licensed by the Kansspelcommissie.  Offering these unlicensed games is prohibited, but it is also prohibited to promote them, and to participate in them, if you are aware of their unlicensed nature."

Therefore TO has been violating the Belgian law for quite some time already. 

 

Concerning FIFA, a game I am still able to play as a Belgian:

"The Belgian federal Minister of Justice Koen Geens is pleased that videogame publisher EA Games has stated that it will remove the paying loot boxes in the game FIFA and that it will comply with the Belgian gambling legislation, and thus follow the position of the Belgian Gaming Commission. The Gaming Commission submitted this file to the Crown prosecutor’s office of Brussels in 2018. Earlier, other international publishers such as Activision Blizzard, Valve and 2K also complied at request of the Gaming Commission. At the request of Minister Koen Geens, the Gaming Commission investigated various video games, including FIFA from publisher EA Games. The conclusion this investigation, as mentioned in the report of the Belgian Gaming Commission released in April 2018, was that a paying loot box meets the definition of a game of chance. According to the Belgian Gaming Commission, paying loot boxes must therefore be regarded as a form of gambling under Belgian law. The loot boxes are, according to the Gaming Commission, subject to the Belgian rules on gambling and betting.

Shortly after the completion of the investigation, the Gaming Commission reached an agreement with publishers Activision-Blizzard, Valve and 2K. Now EA Games also declares to comply with the Belgian legislation, an important step in the protection of especially young and vulnerable players against unexpected gambling elements and influences.

Minister of Justice Koen Geens: Mixing gambling and gaming, especially at a young age, is dangerous for mental health. We have already taken numerous measures to protect minors as well as adults against the influence of, for example, gambling advertising. That is why we must also ensure that children and adults are not confronted with games of chance when they seek pleasure in a video game. I am therefore very pleased that publishers of the investigated video games have already complied with Belgian legislation or are planning to do so very soon and thus put the player's well-being first."

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

2 hours ago, falcosenna1 said:

EA Games has stated that it will remove the paying loot boxes in the game FIFA and that it will comply with the Belgian gambling legislation

WTH? Funny thing is Alternativa decided to comply with the Chinese gaming regulation but can't comply with Belgian and Dutch's gaming regulation?

Edited December 16, 2020 by FrozenRailgun

[Fighter 26]

if you think buying a VPN is too expensive and you ask tanki online support for another solution.  then tanki will recommend you to choose free vpn.  personally i would never go for free.  then your data is not safe

[uno1011 7]

1 hour ago, FrozenRailgun said:

WTH? Funny thing is Alternativa decided to comply with the Chinese gaming regulation but can't comply with Belgian and Dutch's gaming regulation?

U sure?

 

[tankkiller37 2]

17 hours ago, Fighter said:

if you think buying a VPN is too expensive and you ask tanki online support for another solution.  then tanki will recommend you to choose free vpn.  personally i would never go for free.  then your data is not safe

There is some information about free VPN on internet : https://www.techradar.com/uk/vpn/best-free-vpn.

I just don't know how many data you're sending when you play two hours a day.

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

21 hours ago, uno1011 said:

U sure?

Yes I'm sure.