The problems of TO [Part 1: The gameplay]

[Guest]

 

 

Before I begin this 2 part series I would like to clarify that this is not

1. a "Tanki is Dying" post
2. a hate rant about druggers and buyers.

In addition, despite my rank, I have over a year and a half of experience in this game.

 

 

     What is balance in this game, I ask?  A conglomerate of P2W tactics! There are many tactics, but the main one I will cover is Supplies. At first, you may just roll your eyes and say, "Dude, you can get them easily from missions and mission chains! Why are you complaining?" But a closer analysis discovers that this is not the case. Look below:

 

 

 

Only 60 repair kits at Legend for the week 10+ mission chain reward? That won't last him/her for three days, let alone a week!

However, you may be thinking, "LOL, there are 4 containers that come with it too! Are you blind or what?" Well... stop and think about it. How often will you get a supply kit which will evenly distribute all the supplies? Mostly, you will get 125 mines or something of that sort. Point is, containers aren't a reliable source of supplies. They sometimes give you one thing and sometimes will give you another item. However, this is the nature of containers, a gambling item so to speak.

 

     OK, mission chains are useless. Let's go to the garage and buy a drug kit! Oh, right...

 

Sorry for bad quality, Lightshot takes crap photos :/

 

Only a supplies 100 kit, which is worse than the already inadiquite week 10 mission chain!

The other, more adiquite supply kits, are safely stored in the shop, out of reach from the normal player...

 

     ...but yet the developers are pushing this new supply meta where "everyone is a drugger". 

Now I am okay with this meta, but only if, and that's a big if, the players are allowed unlimited access to these consumables, as in Tanki X. But TO is not allowing this. Why is this so? If you want players to use a consumable meta, why are buying large quantities of drugs stuck behind a paywall? Well... in one word: MONEY. In fact, the developers have blatantly shown that they are inclined to make the game more P2W. What proof do I have? Drones and Batteries. These supplies cost 300 crystals per unit, about the average amount of crystals a tanker might earn in a battle. And what happens to these expensive consumables? They get hoarded by the drones, getting used left and right whether you like it or not. 

 

     Shifting our focus to the gameplay itself, we find ourselves in the typical battle. Attacking depends on either 

• Having more supplies than the enemy 
• Using the repair kit faster when you are low on health
• Whoever has Overdrive at 100 automatically wins

     Defence, despite what you may think, is no diffrent from attacking because it is pretty much about either

• Your team planted more mines at the entry points than the other team
• Having more drugs than the attackers

     Is this kind gameplay encouraging thinking outside the box and/or team coordination? It, from my point of view, doesn't and is one of the main causes for all these "noob teams" when in reality it is simply the developer's fault for pushing this gameplay style. (Also this is due to the 10 minute battle times and server merging but I'll cover this in Part 2  I didn't do that, crap :x) This may seem fine if both teams are "noob teams" but when a squad of clanmates or simply people using voice chat join, the unsuspecting "noob team" gets demolished by the other, more coordinated team. This was one of the reasons MM was added. Unfortunately for us, the devs added Squads, which essentially puts us back to square one. Even with squads only containing three players*, that is still enough to seriously disrupt the game. 

 

    In short, most of the balance problems I have covered have one solution, that is remove drugs from being a core part of gameplay. I am NOT saying to remove drugs entirely, as that would cause major budget deficits. 

---

*at the time of this writing 8/3/18 (MM/DD/YY)

Edited August 21, 2018 by Guest

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

Supplies are easily obtainable. You look at each individual source of supplies separately but do not consider them as one whole. Altogether they add up.

 

Case in point: Nives, as a WO3 who made his account after the updates that made supplies easily obtainable and has not spent any money on the game, has more supplies and has used more supplies than I have as a Major General who made my account 3 years ago.

[Pyre 3,485]

I personally find that the supplies received from mission chain are adequate or even excessive. Factoring in the 4 containers every week, I dont know how you can complain.

[Maf 32,300]

in one word: MONEY.

Developers obviously won't publicly say "We're making decisions that aim to get you to spend more money", since that would create a bad image of their company, but it only takes common sense to understand that AlternativaPlatform is a for-profit organisation, and the purpose of their projects is to bring profit. So yes, they want players to spend money.

 

As we can see from the example of Tanki X (which seems to be failing, if you ask me), cosmetic-only purchases do not generate enough profit to support a free-to-play MMO. Of course there are games like Fortnite, where cosmetic items bring millions in profits, but that's an exceptional case, where the developers had a lot of expertise and a bit of luck. Tanki developers didn't even strat off as game devs - they created a software demo and converted their company into a game dev studio when their demo caught on.

 

So yes, supplies will remain as purchasable consumables that give power in battles because they are the most reliable source of revenue. A player can eventually buy all equipment, paints, skins, upgrades and they would have nothing left to buy, but with consumables there is always something that they could spend money on. Hazel Rah said a long time ago that he would love to make supplies free and unlimited, since, as a game mechanic, they are really interesting and make gameplay more diverse. But unfortauntely they have to remain as they are.

 

However, I'd like to point out that the situation with supplies greatly improved over the years. Back in 2012 we had no mission chains, no missions, no permanent supply kits, very rare sales, no containers and generally no reliable source of free supplies other than the measly Daily Gift, which gave just 60 of 1 supply (or 30 of two types) to a Marshal. That was nothing, and buyers with infinite supplies could easily dominate games alone as no one ever had enough supplies to oppose them.

 

Nowadays it's absolutely possible to use everything you are provided with (sales, kits, mission chains, etc.) to have enough supplies, especially at high ranks. As long as you don't play longer than 30-40 minutes per day and only do enough to complete your three daily missions, you can use supplies non-stop in battles and you won't run out. I'm telling you from presonal experience that I didn't run out of supplies for the past two years now, simply by completing daily missions. I just occasionally spend about 50k crystals to fill up my stash of repair kits during a 50% sale, and it lasts me until the next sale.

 

Drones are a slightly different story, and their extreme prices and lack of free sources for batteries does remind me of the 2012 supply situation. Although they don't seem to give you that big of an advantage, so I wouldn't call them completely balance-breaking.

 

---

tl;dr version:

You have some valid points, but supplies are very easy to obtain for free now, while drones are not as OP as they seem. So while the truth is that supplies exist to generate revenue, I wouldn't consider them to be P2W.

[aqwzsxedc 699]

Probably you're right about the 60 repairs (although for me i can waste them in a couple hours lol)

But for the drones; they don't give a HUGE advantage... Overdrive doesn't mean 100% win... it depends on how you use it (mostly need to be used with teammates else it's a waste; for me.)

and usually, for me, 100 drugs is enough to play few battles to earn enough stars and go back to pro battles (XP mostly) where i don't need drugs or anything

So yeah i'm fine with the drugs atm; tho i agree with you for the chain thingy, it could be better if gets a slight change (increase number of drugs obtained)

[Guest]

 

Supplies are easily obtainable. You look at each individual source of supplies separately but do not consider them as one whole. Altogether they add up.

 

Case in point: Nives, as a WO3 who made his account after the updates that made supplies easily obtainable and has not spent any money on the game, has more supplies and has used more supplies than I have as a Major General who made my account 3 years ago.

...but will they last for a week? Barely

 

 

 

But for the drones; they don't give a HUGE advantage... Overdrive doesn't mean 100% win... it depends on how you use it (mostly need to be used

I didn't say that drones gave you any OP advantage.

 

Developers obviously won't publicly say "We're making decisions that aim to get you to spend more money", since that would create a bad image of their company, but it only takes common sense to understand that AlternativaPlatform is a for-profit organisation, and the purpose of their projects is to bring profit. So yes, they want players to spend money.

 

As we can see from the example of Tanki X (which seems to be failing, if you ask me), cosmetic-only purchases do not generate enough profit to support a free-to-play MMO. Of course there are games like Fortnite, where cosmetic items bring millions in profits, but that's an exceptional case, where the developers had a lot of expertise and a bit of luck. Tanki developers didn't even strat off as game devs - they created a software demo and converted their company into a game dev studio when their demo caught on.

 

So yes, supplies will remain as purchasable consumables that give power in battles because they are the most reliable source of revenue. A player can eventually buy all equipment, paints, skins, upgrades and they would have nothing left to buy, but with consumables there is always something that they could spend money on. Hazel Rah said a long time ago that he would love to make supplies free and unlimited, since, as a game mechanic, they are really interesting and make gameplay more diverse. But unfortauntely they have to remain as they are.

 

However, I'd like to point out that the situation with supplies greatly improved over the years. Back in 2012 we had no mission chains, no missions, no permanent supply kits, very rare sales, no containers and generally no reliable source of free supplies other than the measly Daily Gift, which gave just 60 of 1 supply (or 30 of two types) to a Marshal. That was nothing, and buyers with infinite supplies could easily dominate games alone as no one ever had enough supplies to oppose them.

 

Nowadays it's absolutely possible to use everything you are provided with (sales, kits, mission chains, etc.) to have enough supplies, especially at high ranks. As long as you don't play longer than 30-40 minutes per day and only do enough to complete your three daily missions, you can use supplies non-stop in battles and you won't run out. I'm telling you from presonal experience that I didn't run out of supplies for the past two years now, simply by completing daily missions. I just occasionally spend about 50k crystals to fill up my stash of repair kits during a 50% sale, and it lasts me until the next sale.

 

Drones are a slightly different story, and their extreme prices and lack of free sources for batteries does remind me of the 2012 supply situation. Although they don't seem to give you that big of an advantage, so I wouldn't call them completely balance-breaking.

 

---

tl;dr version:

You have some valid points, but supplies are very easy to obtain for free now, while drones are not as OP as they seem. So while the truth is that supplies exist to generate revenue, I wouldn't consider them to be P2W.

But were drugs a main part of the meta as they were now?

[Maf 32,300]

But were drugs a main part of the meta as they were now?

They weren't, but there's no reason why they shouldn't be. Ignoring the P2W aspect of them, supplies take a lot of skill to use. Knowing in which order to activate them and when takes a lot of practice and can give you a massive advantage over another player, who also has infinite supplies but doesn't know how to use them.

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

...but will they last for a week? Barely

I have over 2k of each . . . they clearly do.

[Strikechard123 241]

the game is won by who drugs the most. No skill, no outplay, no fun, just supplies everywhere

[Guest]

I have over 2k of each . . . they clearly do.

Unless you are like me, who logs on, does missions, and logs off. If you start playing 5-6 battles, those drugs will dry up in an instant.

[C.O.N.Q.U.E.R.O.R 3,845]

Unless you are like me, who logs on, does missions, and logs off. If you start playing 5-6 battles, those drugs will dry up in an instant.

Farm stars in the war. My drug count basically tripled already.

[Guest]

They weren't, but there's no reason why they shouldn't be. Ignoring the P2W aspect of them, supplies take a lot of skill to use. Knowing in which order to activate them and when takes a lot of practice and can give you a massive advantage over another player, who also has infinite supplies but doesn't know how to use them.

1. These tactics only apply if you are in a larger map. If you are in a smaller map, like sandal (and soon to be) sandbox, this is hardly needed. And what tactics? Only one I know of is this: Bait the enemy to use their repair kit, then use yours.

2. Unless that player is a , I doubt this will happen. 

 

 

Farm stars in the war. My drug count basically tripled already.

Problem is... you gotta use em' before you get the unreliable containers. 

Also I'm not doing the war because I don't really have the time.

Edited August 4, 2018 by Guest

[NatchGa 665]

At your rank drugs are a larger issue than at ranks marshal and above. Most legends have already quite the stash of drugs they have accumulated, and can usually keep it balanced as long as they aren't playing a ridiculous amount of non pro battles. However, around the rank of captain, you probably do have to drug more to compete against kit buyers if you want to stand a chance against them, pro battles are not as common, especially non drug ones, and you don't have that "stash" you can always rely on since the lower ranks hardly give you any. So yes, drugs around your rank are an issue, but the mid ranks have always been tough. unfortunately the best strategy is to just power through until marshal or give in and buy a kit. 

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

Honestly, if people are calling TO P2W, then they sure as Hell haven't seen TX yet.

[lukey0 27,543]

they sure as Hell haven't seen TX yet.

Not since early 2017 when my computer could handle it's graphics. :LOL: But I have heard some of their modules are completely OP and P2W.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

Not since early 2017 when my computer could handle it's graphics. :LOL: But I have heard some of their modules are completely OP and P2W.

They are.

[GorgoBlesk 831]

Take a closer look at meta in Tanki:

 

1.Take Viking Thunder, drug, use it at close range

2.Take Viking Freeze, -||-

3.Take Viking Twins, -||-

4.Take Titan/Mammoth Magnum, drug, camp

 

As you see, there is no skill in it.

[Pyre 3,485]

As we can see from the example of Tanki X (which seems to be failing, if you ask me), cosmetic-only purchases do not generate enough profit to support a free-to-play MMO.

 

TX is not P2cosmetic anymore. Not even close.

[GuidoFawkes 2,361]

Supplies are easily obtainable. You look at each individual source of supplies separately but do not consider them as one whole. Altogether they add up.

 

Case in point: Nives, as a WO3 who made his account after the updates that made supplies easily obtainable and has not spent any money on the game, has more supplies and has used more supplies than I have as a Major General who made my account 3 years ago.

that guy has random people giving him the flag to capture in every battle he plays in..

 

 

he also sometimes drops golds to distract everyone

 

 

he also has access to informations normal players don't

[Total_SkiIl 1,983]

looky here

 

 

and that's a shadow of what I have now, after Vaults and previous turns' containers, on that account. @Total.Skill

Edited August 4, 2018 by Total_SkiIl

[nemoetnihil 388]

Supplies are not hard to get. On paper, they may appear to be, but not in practice. I have never spent a cent on this game, and you can see from my profile that I have used a good many supplies. The crazy thing is not that I have used so many, but that I have probably 80% of the total amount I have used up till now sitting in my account ready to use. Given this fact I do not view buyers as having a large advantage from supplies.

[u812ic 1,629]

I'd like to put my 2 cents worth in about supplies.

 

Before the last War, TW 1, I was a non-buyer. I had one hull and one turret that were M0s with a couple upgrades. I entered in the WAR which, as you recall, required 200 kills and a K/D 1.0 and above. It took me all week to get 200 kills and my K/D was in danger. I had no supplies and didn't do missions. I logged out of a lot of battles if I thought my K/D would drop. 

 

My plan of action:

 

I bought a supply kit from the store and some crystals to increase my MUs, my first purchases, and started doing missions. During the WAR I also bought a supply kit from the garage with the crystals I earned in battle and what I had left of the crystals I bought. All this was just a chance to survive so I could be an asset to my team and keep my K/D alive. 

 

Since the last WAR, I've kept up my missions and haven't needed to buy any more supplies. I've used the crystals I earn in battle, missions and ranking up to MU my main turret/hull to M1 10/10 way before I could rank up and get the M2 for free. I now have 3 M2 hulls and 1 M1 hull, 4 M2 turrets. I got thousands of crystals from the TW 1, which helped a lot. I got Premium with my crystal purchase and containers. I recently bought Crystals from the store to buy Thunder M2. I didn't have to, though. I had a few extra bucks burning a hole in my wallet. 

 

My main source of crystal and supply income is from the mission chains and the containers from completing the chain. Since I bought crystals and supplies during TW 1 and the recent purchase of Thunder M2, I guess I could be labeled a buyer, even though I only made 2 store purchases. OOOPPSSS....Oh yeah, I forgot, I also keep up my Premium account. Yeah, ok, I guess I'm a buyer. Just take what you will from this experience and leave the rest for someone else. 

[Guest]

 

 

Supplies are not hard to get. On paper, they may appear to be, but not in practice. I have never spent a cent on this game, and you can see from my profile that I have used a good many supplies. The crazy thing is not that I have used so many, but that I have probably 80% of the total amount I have used up till now sitting in my account ready to use. Given this fact I do not view buyers as having a large advantage from supplies.

I am not saying that they are hard to get, but rather that they will get used up too quickly if this meta continues.

 

 

 

looky here

 

 

 

 

and that's a shadow of what I have now, after Vaults and previous turns' containers, on that account. @Total.Skill

Here is why you have that amount of drugs:
1. Not many people drug at that rank
2. You bought one of the most OP kits for that rank bracket
3. You have previous experience in the game rather than these noobs who don't really know anything about it.

[mhh.2000 888]

they're not hard to obtain , and they won't even run out if you use them correctly
for example , you don't have to use a speed boost exactly when you spawn , you don't have to use a repair kit every time you see an enemy , you don't have to use double armor whenever it's available , yes you will die more but so what ? you can still come up first in battles and be a great help to your team
 
everyone's main source of supplies is mission chains and free containers , and judging by how many they're giving during this war , I'd say I'm legitimately never going to run out of them , I already have 73 containers and the war is not even close to an end , by the end of the war I should have about 150 or more (even if I don't win which is likely) , opening 150 containers will give me an enormous amount of supplies , batteries and crystals , you can't just spend them in a day or 2 , not even if you try to .
 
plus there are other events that give out containers for free , take for example crazy weekends , newspaper contests , V-Log contests , Parkour contests , they aren't that rare and you can earn quite a lot from them .

 

you shouldn't hate buyers , without them this game would eventually close because the developers will not have enough money to run the servers , so yeah , you should thank them instead for giving you this free fun .

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

Here is why you have that amount of drugs:

1. Not many people drug at that rank

2. You bought one of the most OP kits for that rank bracket

3. You have previous experience in the game rather than these noobs who don't really know anything about it.

Right, but little of that has to do with how many supplies he or she has.