Random(?) Daily Gifts

[r_Micky30 4]

This ^, The developers have better things to do then choose what every single player gets in their daily gift.

 

Daily gift is completely random.

 

Thread closed.

This week again 2 DoubleCrystal cards already.

Including previous week that will make 6 DoubleCrustal Cards in 12 days.

Completely random you say :shock:

 

Once implemented, settings weights on different "random" options to make the probability of certain selection higher doesn't require any effort from developers.

If there is such system, the management can easily give a preference to one or several "random" events.

 

Are you 100% certain, that this functionality isn't built in ?

Come on, everybody who has write "Hello World" knows that adding weights to random selection is a as easy as ... I don't know ... anything :-)

 

 

PS! Whats the point locking threads this way.

[r_speedy560 0]

I also saw your original topic and thought that mods totally missed your point.

 

With "random" you meant if the chances of getting drugs/crystal/no supply battle pass/double crystal card were equal(ish).

The question was not about if there is somebody choosing the bonus for each players...

 

Anyways, it's obvious to me and you that the chance of getting double crystal card or no supply battle pass is much higher than say, daily crystal bonus.

So the answer is yes it is "random" (as in it's done by program) but the weights of each gifts are not equal.

[AnuBoi 19]

The different dailies do indeed have different weights after much experiments of the tanki community, but it is still random. I heard the crystal daily is somewhere near 1%, but seems a bit off, but nonetheless... it is obvious that the different one are weighted.

[r_nuclearbom0 62]

I have also become many Double Crystal cards, but the epidemic has stopped now :mrgreen:

[r_Micky30 4]

I have also become many Double Crystal cards' date=' but the epidemic has stopped now :mrgreen: [/quote']

Can you recommend a medicine against this decease.

It's really annoying when businesses grow so big they start cheating on customers.

[skitee 555]

There, of course, are weightings. Just because there are weightings does not make it not "random". The gifts are random: there is a 20% chance, say, that you'll get a DCC, about 10% for Nsbp, and about 10% for crystals - these are just rough estimates from experience, and probably if a dev reads this they'll laugh at how off I am. But there is still weightings. However, as you should know, it doesn't mean that one poor guy in Perm sorts out the daily bonus for everyone, handing them whatever he wants, does it?

 

P.S. You'll also find that when you want a DCC, a week (the amount of time it takes for someone to get a DCC on average) is a long time to wait. Tanki can't please everyone - they have to choose between the nonbuyers and the buyers, and, as any sensible company would, they choose to favour the buyers.

[MisterGeneral 692]

i got alot of dcc's this week !! hmm

[r_Micky30 4]

There, of course, are weightings. Just because there are weightings does not make it not "random". The gifts are random: there is a 20% chance, say, that you'll get a DCC, about 10% for Nsbp, and about 10% for crystals - these are just rough estimates from experience, and probably if a dev reads this they'll laugh at how off I am. But there is still weightings.

With weightings its not random any more -- random means, that all events have equal probability.

 

If one sets weights so that there is a 100% chance that you'll get a DCC and 0% chance that you'll get anything else that wouldn't be random or would it?

If it wouldn't, then How much weight can you add before the selection becomes non-random.

[tankcalm 324]

There, of course, are weightings. Just because there are weightings does not make it not "random". The gifts are random: there is a 20% chance, say, that you'll get a DCC, about 10% for Nsbp, and about 10% for crystals - these are just rough estimates from experience, and probably if a dev reads this they'll laugh at how off I am. But there is still weightings.

With weightings its not random any more -- random means, that all events have equal probability.

 

If one sets weights so that there is a 100% chance that you'll get a DCC and 0% chance that you'll get anything else that wouldn't be random or would it?

If it wouldn't, then How much weight can you add before the selection becomes non-random.

 

You're wrong, the "random" that you are talking about is "random with uniform distribution", when all events have the same probability (not exactly that way, but for this purpose works). There are a lots of differents distribution for generate a random number, Ex: Binomial, Poisson, Chi, Stable. They use weight, of course, but still is "random" gift, using "tanki distribution".

 

And don't presume of write code in a forum of a game where the most people are under 18.

[skitee 555]

With weightings its not random any more -- random means, that all events have equal probability.

 

If one sets weights so that there is a 100% chance that you'll get a DCC and 0% chance that you'll get anything else that wouldn't be random or would it?

If it wouldn't, then How much weight can you add before the selection becomes non-random.

 

Of course it's still random, even if it's weighted. Go to this website: http://www.random.org/. On the right, you'll see that the number is defaultly set at between 1 and 100. Using your logic, the number the "random number generator" generates is not random because it cannot be, say, 102. That, as you will see, is completely hideous logic. The random number generator on that website is random, even if it is limited. Just the same, the Daily Bonus is random, albeit weighted. Imagine if daily bonuses weren't weighted, but each option (Which leads to another question - what is an option - is "drugs" one option or is it "first aids/doublepowers" or "Double Armours") were equal. It'd still be weighted - just weighted equally. Weights are necessary - in fact, not just nec. So what you should be asking is not for weights to be removed - but for the weightings to be changed with less favour to DCCs. In that case, then I would disagree with you. Remember, DCCs come too uncommonly for many people. Everyone will NEVER be satisfied, and in this case Tanki should favour the buyers to earn themselves more money.

[r_Micky30 4]

With weightings its not random any more -- random means, that all events have equal probability.

 

If one sets weights so that there is a 100% chance that you'll get a DCC and 0% chance that you'll get anything else that wouldn't be random or would it?

If it wouldn't, then How much weight can you add before the selection becomes non-random.

 

Of course it's still random, even if it's weighted. Go to this website: http://www.random.org/. On the right, you'll see that the number is defaultly set at between 1 and 100. Using your logic, the number the "random number generator" generates is not random because it cannot be, say, 102. That, as you will see, is completely hideous logic. The random number generator on that website is random, even if it is limited. Just the same, the Daily Bonus is random, albeit weighted. Imagine if daily bonuses weren't weighted, but each option (Which leads to another question - what is an option - is "drugs" one option or is it "first aids/doublepowers" or "Double Armours") were equal. It'd still be weighted - just weighted equally. Weights are necessary - in fact, not just nec. So what you should be asking is not for weights to be removed - but for the weightings to be changed with less favour to DCCs. In that case, then I would disagree with you. Remember, DCCs come too uncommonly for many people. Everyone will NEVER be satisfied, and in this case Tanki should favour the buyers to earn themselves more money.

Sorry, buddy, but that makes me ask, do you understand what does mean random and random number in an interval?

What makes you think I proposed a random number outside of an interval as you are suggesting :shock:

Did you understand my point?

 

Let me just try to explain it again using random.org as an example.

If on that site weights would be set so that like number 37 has 100% weight and others 0% then the "random" number would always be 37. Would that be a random number in that case?

 

So yes, I'm asking to make daily gift random if they are promised to be random. Period :!:

Otherwise its cheating on clients. :evil:

 

If somebody needs DCC too much or too often ... sorry, it comes randomly ... somebody may be unhappy, but at least its FAIR.

 

PS! "Option" -- it seems that an option is DCC, NsBP, crystals or a chunk of supplies of one or two kinds.

[skitee 555]

Sorry, buddy, but that makes me ask, do you understand what does mean random and random number in an interval?

What makes you think I proposed a random number outside of an interval as you are suggesting :shock:

Did you understand my point?

 

Let me just try to explain it again using random.org as an example.

If on that site weights would be set so that like number 37 has 100% weight and others 0% then the "random" number would always be 37. Would that be a random number in that case?

 

So yes, I'm asking to make daily gift random if they are promised to be random. Period :!:

Otherwise its cheating on clients. :evil:

 

If somebody needs DCC too much or too often ... sorry, it comes randomly ... somebody may be unhappy, but at least its FAIR.

 

PS! "Option" -- it seems that an option is DCC, NsBP, crystals or a chunk of supplies of one or two kinds.

 

Of course the two circumstances, the one you are discussing and the one that I made an example of, are very different. They certainly cannot be translated directly. However, my point is that the logic used in both situations is equal: a big oval with a whole in the middle.

 

And so what you are saying is that the gift is not random at the moment? Why isn't it? The gift certainly is random, albeit with certain weightings towards certain things. If the weightings were all equal - then they would still be weightings, just equal weightings, no?

 

And without weightings, then what? You say that an "option" would be "DCC, NSBP, crystals or a chunk of supplies of one or two kinds"? Are you saying that there should be 25% chance of getting a DCC, 25% of getting NSBP, 25% for crystals, and 25% for drugs? If so, then there would conversely be only 2% chance for first aids and double armours - which means weightings will favour, say, crystals ahead of Double armours and first aids - which means there still are weightings in favour of one thing, so that cannot be what you are talking about.

 

So what are you saying? Are you saying that there should be 4% chance for crystals, 4% chance for first aids and nitroes, 4% chance for double armours and double powers, 4% chance for mines and double armours, 4% chance for DCC, etc? If so, then how often would DCCs come? Far too few for the buying community, and a lot of people will grow tired of waiting for a DCC and spend their cash on another game. That surely is a poor option from tanki's point of view, so that cannot be what you are talking about?

 

What then are you talking about, other than decreasing the current weightings for a DCC, which you seem to get too often for your liking? Or are you feeding the conspiracy theory that tanki "fix" your daily bonus for you in advance, which is certainly a ridiculous option whichever way you look at it.

[r_Micky30 4]

... Far too few for the buying community, and a lot of people will grow tired of waiting for a DCC and spend their cash on another game. That surely is a poor option from tanki's point of view, so that cannot be what you are talking about?

 

What then are you talking about, other than decreasing the current weightings for a DCC, which you seem to get too often for your liking?

So the main problem is, that TO is afraid, that buyers will spend money on some other game and because of that offers DCC almost every second day ... how ingenious, now they piss off the people who don't buy ... sure, since they don't pay they are worth nothing.

 

And I'm getting offered lot of DCC after I used this option :evil:

Yep, since I know that sometimes DCC comes, I use sometimes it as a small help. But I plan this ahead, and don't need it offered every day, I WILL NOT BUY MORE BECAUSE OF THAT.

I'm pretty sure that other people will not leave the game if they don't have DCC available constantly.

If the crystals cost too much so people don't buy with regular price, then that should be corrected instead of making DCC permanent. IMHO. :roll:

 

You keep referring the weightings that exist in the system, most of the times the proportions are tolerable, from time to time they are tuned to very irritating ratios.

Please stop doing that.

[r_AdvocatusDiaboli0 861]

IMO, it is random. Because even if I got 1 or 2 DCCs, I have also gotten 5 or 6 crystal bonuses in a row.

[SilentShadow 104]

IMO' date=' it is random. Because even if I got 1 or 2 DCCs, I have also gotten 5 or 6 crystal bonuses in a row.[/quote']

 

Yes it is all coincidence if you happen to get many in a row, or you don't get one that you want when you usually get it when you don't want it.

[r_Micky30 4]

IMO' date=' it is random. Because even if I got 1 or 2 DCCs, I have also gotten 5 or 6 crystal bonuses in a row.[/quote']

Yes it is all coincidence if you happen to get many in a row, or you don't get one that you want when you usually get it when you don't want it.

Wait a second ... you are trying to turn this into subjective non-satisfaction ...

 

I got 6 DCC in 12 days -- its almost two weeks. This is more than just 2 DCC's in a row, or "I needed something else more at the moment". It became really irritating.

Especially when the gift selection was supposed to be random.

[r_AdvocatusDiaboli0 861]

Micky, this is different from the randomness you're familiar with.

There are not that many options in the first place. People haven't gotten Double Crystal cards for weeks and they've been begging to get one.

While other people have gotten the supply passes in rows. Where as many have not.

 

This is a matter of satisfaction. If you get something you wanted.

"I must have gotten it because I want it"

 

If you don't get something you want,

"I didn't get it because I want it"

 

Yes, it works both the ways and when it comes to randomness the latter is more probable. Because there are more ways for you to not get what you want instead of actually getting what you want.

I have been with daily crystal bonus back to back as well as no supply passes, double crystals and well... every other possible outcome.

 

Also, once you buy the no supply pass you remove one option from that "random" table. So you can get anything except the pass. Such that the chances of getting everything is increased.

 

Even in the past week, where free crystals were given people got daily crystals along with them. This is a non-satisfaction problem. ;)

[r_Micky30 4]

...

There are not that many options in the first place. People haven't gotten Double Crystal cards for weeks and they've been begging to get one.

While other people have gotten the supply passes in rows. ...

This is a matter of satisfaction....

Hi, I see what you mean, but I stand at my point, it is not a matter of satisfaction.

 

I accept random distribution and that I usually don't get what I need most at the moment :)

Random is random, and if the probability is 1 DCC in week getting 1 in two weeks is quite normal fluctuation.

But that's not a problem, since after some time and many random selection I will have almost equal amount of all random options (gifts), if the selection is really random.

I can wait.

 

50% DCC in two week just doesn't fit into random distribution

* 50% in 4 days -- OK,

* 50% in 8 days -- rare but possible

* 50% in 12 days -- unbelievable coincident (one wise individual said -- there are no accidents)

Lets just hope it doesn't happen again.

 

Also, once you buy the no supply pass you remove one option from that "random" table. So you can get anything except the pass. Such that the chances of getting everything is increased.

You already mentioned that in another thread and as soon my budget will be less tight I'll buy NsBP :-)

 

Even in the past week, where free crystals were given people got daily crystals along with them.

I hope the rise of DCC probabilty isn't anyhow connected to extra daily crystals during these 5 days. :roll:

[r_AdvocatusDiaboli0 861]

Well considering your 50% proof, even if they did increase it, it is still quite low. People still ask for double crystal cards .... That is completely against this theory @_@

 

Also, isn't 50% a little bit too much? Like, Seriously? You're saying this on what? one daily bonus out of 10 million max? Sorry, but that is a really bad evidence. Get a group up of around 100 people and the evidence might be acceptable.

 

 

EDIT: Just logged in for science' sake on all my accounts, Not a single DCC in two days on 5 accounts. GG~ (That's 10 tries right there)

[r_Micky30 4]

Also, isn't 50% a little bit too much? Like, Seriously? You're saying this on what? one daily bonus out of 10 million max? Sorry, but that is a really bad evidence. Get a group up of around 100 people and the evidence might be acceptable.

 

EDIT: Just logged in for science' sake on all my accounts, Not a single DCC in two days on 5 accounts. GG~ (That's 10 tries right there)

Hi,

The fact that you don't have any DCC right now doesn't void the fact, that I did get 6 of these in two weeks. Right?

50% is too much ... thats what all this thread is about.

BTW, I don't remember any more, but wasn't it that 10 tries gives the result with 95% accuracy.

What accuracy % would you get having a group of 100 people?

 

People still ask for double crystal cards .... That is completely against this theory @_@

And there are people who doesn't want to get so many DCC as well -- as somebody said -- you can't please everyone.

And that's how it should be -- not to tune the gifts for a favor of one group.

 

PS! I read farewell post of one person who said, that one reason he leaves TO is too much DCC's in short period. Maybe it was in the Russian forum.

 

I hope Tanki Online doesn't blow up the entire game when trying to make more money on it.

Very soon there might be left only two groups of players -- one with NsBP and another of kids with rich parents who keeps buying supplies for $ -- recently almost every (bigger) game tends to end as drug war. So the less supplies I'll get the less I play, simple.

I certainly will not buy supplies ...

[SilentShadow 104]

You will get DCC when you don't want it.

You will never get it when you do want it.

 

Accept the fact, that fate is a cruel mistress :lol:

There's nothing you can do my friend.

[r_AdvocatusDiaboli0 861]

BTW, I don't remember any more, but wasn't it that 10 tries gives the result with 95% accuracy.

What accuracy % would you get having a group of 100 people?

Pretty sure that is stupid. 10 people is enough if there are only two possibilities, we have a lot of possibilities ranging from a single drug, 5 possibilities? Double drugs? More than 5? DCC? NS? Crystals? We need well over 10 people for this.

 

EDIT: No DCC on all 5 accounts again.

[r_Micky30 4]

EDIT: No DCC on all 5 accounts again.

Well, I maintain 10 accounts for my family ... only one DCC today ...

If you want to ask, did these other accounts get many DCC in mentioned period, the answer is yes.

 

Empirically I would say, that this DCC epidemic happens in the middle of every month. But I don't have any real data to prove that.

I could also say that empirically it seems to be that there is higher probability of getting the supplies you already have most -- again, I haven't collected any data to support this hypothesis.

 

Both these observations would be classified as subjective or conspiracy theory if I'd propose these :)

 

Since nobody have said that the adjustable weighting system doesn't exist and the focus keeps moving away from that question I wouldn't object against closing this thread.

 

I just hope Tanki Online management considers not tuning "random" selection too much.

[r_AdvocatusDiaboli0 861]

Why close this thread if we can get some proof? :) Let us start recording what we get? :)

[r_1215231 0]

:mrgreen: