Let's Discuss Smoky!

[wolverine848 13,097]

No it is not. Having to make trade-off decisions is at the core of the concept of gaming. 

Just bought the Assault Ammo alt other night.

 

Won't be winning many DMs with it but - it is pretty funny to flip over the flag carrier as they try to get to their base. :lol:

I may keep that alt on all the time, and go to Ricco when I feel like inflicting more damage.

 

So a decent alt that does gives more options depending on the mood I'm in at the time.

[TheAncientMariner 57]

Just bought the Assault Ammo alt other night.

 

Won't be winning many DMs with it but - it is pretty funny to flip over the flag carrier as they try to get to their base. :lol:

I may keep that alt on all the time, and go to Ricco when I feel like inflicting more damage.

 

So a decent alt that does gives more options depending on the mood I'm in at the time.

i tried it some time back, its very good against thunder/rail/shaft, but other turrets like rico/twins/fire-/freeze/isida run straight into your face, so the impact doesn't help much.

 

that extra damage of critical hit is always useful - enemy sometimes thinks he will last a few shots more, and saves RK for later use, but the critical ! dead before used RK used.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

i tried it some time back, its very good against thunder/rail/shaft, but other turrets like rico/twins/fire-/freeze/isida run straight into your face, so the impact doesn't help much.

 

....

Speaking as a freeze-hornet user, this couldn't be further from the truth.  The impact of even standard smokies make it near-impossible to approach them, especially if they are backing up.  Each hit turns your tank so you end up swerving and wasting time correcting your drive, meaning that the overall path you take to get to them is much, much longer.  There's a reason Smoky was voted the "most annoying turret" in another thread.

 

Part of it is psychology.  As a smoky you feel that the freeze shouldn't (doesn't have a right to) approach you at all.  But as a freeze you feel that you should be able to kill the smoky.  This psychology leads people thinking their own gun is "underpowered."

[wolverine848 13,097]

Speaking as a freeze-hornet user, this couldn't be further from the truth.  The impact of even standard smokies make it near-impossible to approach them, especially if they are backing up.  Each hit turns your tank so you end up swerving and wasting time correcting your drive, meaning that the overall path you take to get to them is much, much longer.  There's a reason Smoky was voted the "most annoying turret" in another thread.

 

Part of it is psychology.  As a smoky you feel that the freeze shouldn't (doesn't have a right to) approach you at all.  But as a freeze you feel that you should be able to kill the smoky.  This psychology leads people thinking their own gun is "underpowered."

In Kunger there were many hornets trying to grab our Blue flag.  I hit them as they navigated that "village" and many of them ended up driving into walls. Got a couple more "free" shots in as they tried to correct course.

 

It's not a great "killer" but it really messes up movement of medium,and especially light hulls. Time it right against hornets on Boost as they come up a ramp and it's like cheesy television show where the car goes flying for no reason.

[TheAncientMariner 57]

Speaking as a freeze-hornet user, this couldn't be further from the truth.  The impact of even standard smokies make it near-impossible to approach them, especially if they are backing up.  Each hit turns your tank so you end up swerving and wasting time correcting your drive, meaning that the overall path you take to get to them is much, much longer.  There's a reason Smoky was voted the "most annoying turret" in another thread.

 

Part of it is psychology.  As a smoky you feel that the freeze shouldn't (doesn't have a right to) approach you at all.  But as a freeze you feel that you should be able to kill the smoky.  This psychology leads people thinking their own gun is "underpowered."

You are right. I assumed there are no light hulls in the battle, which is generally true in most high rank battles.

IMO light hulls are almost always poor performers in non-pro battles because of their instability and low health.

(By high rank I mean, say, Colonel onwards)

 

Against poor opposition, they may do well, but in general, against a good team they are just mults. Sure their speed helps in carrying flags from one end to another, but they do not have the strength to break through the defence.

Of course you may say that they can "sneak through" the defence, but that is easier said than done against more experienced enemies.

Sometimes you need to take a DA and bust those mines protecting the flag before taking, which makes heavy and medium hulls more popular.

 

And against these medium and heavy hulls, the extra damage is more useful than the extra impact.

 

Also, the poll may have been outdated, because smoky has been nerfed several times in the past 6 months. 

[wolverine848 13,097]

You are right. I assumed there are no light hulls in the battle, which is generally true in most high rank battles.

IMO light hulls are almost always poor performers in non-pro battles because of their instability and low health.

(By high rank I mean, say, Colonel onwards)

 

Against poor opposition, they may do well, but in general, against a good team they are just mults. Sure their speed helps in carrying flags from one end to another, but they do not have the strength to break through the defence.

Of course you may say that they can "sneak through" the defence, but that is easier said than done against more experienced enemies.

Sometimes you need to take a DA and bust those mines protecting the flag before taking, which makes heavy and medium hulls more popular.

 

And against these medium and heavy hulls, the extra damage is more useful than the extra impact.

 

Also, the poll may have been outdated, because smoky has been nerfed several times in the past 6 months. 

 

 

80% of the Rails I see in battles are Hornets.  And I see a lot of rails...

[TheAncientMariner 57]

80% of the Rails I see in battles are Hornets.  And I see a lot of rails...

and i don't think hornet rails do well in legend non-pro battles, where most have serious protection against it.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

and i don't think hornet rails do well in legend non-pro battles, where most have serious protection against it.

Partly true, we'll see now with the Matchmaking forcing players to play on medium-large maps.

 

Of course, back when all you could find was Polygon, Silence, etc., yes, hornet-rails were simply not as effective.

[wolverine848 13,097]

Partly true, we'll see now with the Matchmaking forcing players to play on medium-large maps.

 

Of course, back when all you could find was Polygon, Silence, etc., yes, hornet-rails were simply not as effective.

Match-making will be mostly large maps. Even the medium maps are getting re-designed. There will still be lots of hornet-rails.

[LittleWillie 3,199]

Just bought the Assault Ammo alt other night.

 

Won't be winning many DMs with it but - it is pretty funny to flip over the flag carrier as they try to get to their base. :lol:

I may keep that alt on all the time, and go to Ricco when I feel like inflicting more damage.

 

So a decent alt that does gives more options depending on the mood I'm in at the time.

Yes the two Smoky alts are actually what TO advertised alts to be:  a different sense of game-play.  They both are actually viable in battle too.

 

I hardly play DM but yeah maybe the standard mode is better for that. But OTOH maybe not.  You get a lot of impact effect every shot. You might get one crit in a battle with another tank. So you are not giving up a whole lot of damage.

 

I use it all the time now. My combat efficiency has gone up no question. When I go Smoky / Viking I shoot and maneuver and go full Matrix on the enemy shots. 

 

In the last month when I play Smoky / Titan I am getting used to K/ds in the 5 to 15 range in many games.Major impact to throw off enemy aim and fat armor for when they don't. It can be a rekking machine.

 

Remember to aim for corners and turret tops. You are gonna have a ot of fun. :)

 

i tried it some time back, its very good against thunder/rail/shaft, but other turrets like rico/twins/fire-/freeze/isida run straight into your face, so the impact doesn't help much.

 

that extra damage of critical hit is always useful - enemy sometimes thinks he will last a few shots more, and saves RK for later use, but the critical ! dead before used RK used.

Heh I eat short-range turrets for lunch all the time.  They are almost all on a light or medium hull. I get to the side a bit and hit a corner. Good luck keeping your weapon on me. I do not sit still to make it easy for you.

 

Of course Freeze is the toughest. But you can even beat them reasonably often.  Mind you, I am not talking about the times a freeze ambushes you .  When you are got like that you are almost always got, 

 

Fire ambushing me from behind? Pfft. Spin shoot disrupt pound pound pound pwn. (I do use Fire protection(. Isida can be a deathblow if they have DD up and I do not have DA . But otherwise they cannot keep the beam on me all the time. 

 

Rico and Twins are a PITA because they impact you so often. But if I can land a shot on them I can break their impact chain and start my own. My standard ,pdile is Fire/Rico/Twins for this reason.

 

The worst hulls are Mammoth of course and Dictator. That big hull just does not seem to rock that much.  But they do rock a bit and they are slow.

 

====

 

One of the best  shots came on a hornet ( I forget the exact turret)  who charged me when I was on a bridge. I had expected teh charge so dropped a mine. As he charged I backed up and shot. He hit the mine a split-second before I shot. The mine liften his nose up, the impact flipped him flat over on his back.  He literally was blown 180 degrees backwards.(and upside-down) :)

 

Every so often you catch a light hulll just as they emerge over a ramp. That too can flip them staight over.

Edited November 3, 2017 by LittleWillie

[robbie56 2,403]

When I play against Smoky it seems OP, when I play with Smoky myself it seems UP. The shots are very weak, and especially when the enemy is far away, I'd say Thunder is superior over Smoky as it is now.

Edited November 3, 2017 by robbie56

[caiosilvac 567]

Almost everyone has Smoky protection at my level, and most are not even buyers! 90% of modules I see protect against Smoky.

[Akame 4,578]

Out of all my m4's, smoky is probably the one i'd least use, simply because I prefer higher damage in such turrets, however, if smoky gained a splash alteration, i may consider it, since I already find thunder great to use despite many modules around against it.

[robbie56 2,403]

Out of all my m4's, smoky is probably the one i'd least use, simply because I prefer higher damage in such turrets, however, if smoky gained a splash alteration, i may consider it, since I already find thunder great to use despite many modules around against it.

I think they need to add more range to make it atleast decent

[wolverine848 13,097]

Out of all my m4's, smoky is probably the one i'd least use, simply because I prefer higher damage in such turrets, however, if smoky gained a splash alteration, i may consider it, since I already find thunder great to use despite many modules around against it.

Ach! - no more splash please. We get enough of that from turrets alts already.

 

I might use it more if they improved the re-load a bit or gave it better dmg at long range.  "Weak" dmg is a lousy 10%. 

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

Ach! - no more splash please. We get enough of that from turrets alts already.

 

I might use it more if they improved the re-load a bit or gave it better dmg at long range.  "Weak" dmg is a lousy 10%. 

Or an alteration that rips a page straight out of WoTś book: give it a "negative chance".  Opposite of a critical chance, there is a 20% chance of doing no damage.  However, weak damage is buffed to 30%. 

 

They also might be trying to push players towards the "assault ammo"? that Thunder uses.  Hard-hitting smoky at long range.

Edited November 4, 2017 by r_I_already_won0

[LittleWillie 3,199]

No thank you for that alteration.

 

I have no problems with Smoky. Smoky functions like a weapon should in this game. It takes aiming each shot. It does not simply kill with one shot. Weapons like Smoky mean that tank under attack has a chance to fight back.  

 

The problem lies in too damn many 1-hit turrets. That's not combat. That's shooting fish in a barrel.  Shaft, Rail, Magnum to a lesser extent Hammer.  There are other turrets that kill you quickly like Isida, Rico and to a lesser extent Twins, but you do have a chance to fight back.

 

It can be very annoying as Smoky to work hard to get a good firing angle, land 4-5 shots, then some Shaft a mile away 1-hits you.  That is why Smoky appears weak. It' not weak so much as there are too many too strong.

 

I know what the 1-hitters are there. Tanki wants alot of tanks to blow up because without that that is what drives the Cr pool to grow.  How the DR pool grows is another issue.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

No thank you for that alteration.

 

I have no problems with Smoky. Smoky functions like a weapon should in this game. It takes aiming each shot. It does not simply kill with one shot. Weapons like Smoky mean that tank under attack has a chance to fight back.  

 

The problem lies in too damn many 1-hit turrets. That's not combat. That's shooting fish in a barrel.  Shaft, Rail, Magnum to a lesser extent Hammer.  There are other turrets that kill you quickly like Isida, Rico and to a lesser extent Twins, but you do have a chance to fight back.

 

It can be very annoying as Smoky to work hard to get a good firing angle, land 4-5 shots, then some Shaft a mile away 1-hits you.  That is why Smoky appears weak. It' not weak so much as there are too many too strong.

 

I know what the 1-hitters are there. Tanki wants alot of tanks to blow up because without that that is what drives the Cr pool to grow.  How the DR pool grows is another issue.

It seems weak when you are using it.  You wonder why it takes so many shots to seemingly kill an enemy.

 

But when you are fighting it, you wonder why it took away such a large chunk of your life. Part of the problem is that you cannot see enemies' health-bars.  And Shafts are at least predictable, railguns have warm-up, Magnum is inaccurate, etc.

[LittleWillie 3,199]

It seems weak when you are using it.  You wonder why it takes so many shots to seemingly kill an enemy.

 

But when you are fighting it, you wonder why it took away such a large chunk of your life. Part of the problem is that you cannot see enemies' health-bars.  And Shafts are at least predictable, railguns have warm-up, Magnum is inaccurate, etc.

Right it is more perception than imbalance. I see that more with Isida.  That turret can kill you so fast. I know how to fight it and how to attack with it but evn so there are times I just cannot kill it before it kills me.  However that also ususaly involves a drug mis-match.

 

Most of that post was really a side comment.  In theory (or a theory) the pace of combat is "too fast". It would be "nice" if there weren't 1-jits so tanks under attack had a chance to participate in the battle too.

 

But it is set this way to make it more a twitch arcafe game than a strattegy gsame. After all a AFV simulator iit ain't.  :lol:

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

Right it is more perception than imbalance. I see that more with Isida.  That turret can kill you so fast. I know how to fight it and how to attack with it but evn so there are times I just cannot kill it before it kills me.  However that also ususaly involves a drug mis-match.

 

Most of that post was really a side comment.  In theory (or a theory) the pace of combat is "too fast". It would be "nice" if there weren't 1-jits so tanks under attack had a chance to participate in the battle too.

 

But it is set this way to make it more a twitch arcafe game than a strattegy gsame. After all a AFV simulator iit ain't.  :lol:

Yes.  Definitely unique in its own right.  WoT sits in the slow-paced region of gaming and isn't going anywhere.

 

Probably why the protections are geared to be more effective against these high-damage, long reloading guns.  One extra shot means a lot of extra seconds to hide.  Most people will wear these at the high ranks.

[omarhero1 401]

Give Smoky some extra damn range or at least a better reload time!

M4 can't even inflict full damage across Monte-Carlo! Shots usually range from 200 to 260! 

[wolverine848 13,097]

Give Smoky some extra damn range or at least a better reload time!

M4 can't even inflict full damage across Monte-Carlo! Shots usually range from 200 to 260! 

On Monte-Carlo smoky should not be used for killing (for reasons you state above).

 

Instead use the Impact Alt and make them spin every time they use a ramp. Most will not make that jump successfully. ;)

 

But yes - in general I would like a bit better reload or the "weak" damage increased from 10% to 20% or even 25%.

Many other ranged weapons have a much better "weak" damage.

[LittleWillie 3,199]

One of the most fun things in TO is landing the +impact on a foe doing a jump, or just about to launch off a cliff.  If you hit them from the rear just as they are leaving the edge it is about 95% they will land upside down.  Even the fat ones.

[omarhero1 401]

On Monte-Carlo smoky should not be used for killing (for reasons you state above).

 

Instead use the Impact Alt and make them spin every time they use a ramp. Most will not make that jump successfully. ;)

 

But yes - in general I would like a bit better reload or the "weak" damage increased from 10% to 20% or even 25%.

Many other ranged weapons have a much better "weak" damage.

Yea, but i can't merely rely on the impact force to harm my opponents.

At the end the day, many experienced tankers know how to cope with high impact turrets, they simply drive carefully and slow down before doing any risky maneuver.

 

Meanwhile, Thunder has almost the same impact force but with a much higher damage and a better effective range in addition to splash damage.

Edited November 8, 2017 by omarhero1

[The_Pakistani 16,768]

When smoky m4 do 15 damage from distance me be like