Let's Discuss Smoky!

[wolverine848 13,097]

on DP a critical hit from a Smoky M1(+0mu) oneshots a Wasp M0 (+2..3mu's).

As Overdrives give a perfect source of dp and criticals are pretty common, the critical dmp feels wrong.

 

but as said so often... the real problem is the x2 factor of the DP. Balance would be way easier, if that x2 would not be as tough

Criticals happen at 11.5% / 14.5% / 17.9% / 18.9% / 20.2% depending on M-level.  I would hardly call that "common".

 

It is almost sheer luck to have that happen as a first hit on said Wasp.

 

Agreed. I think the main advantage of crits should be their infinite range, not their damage. 

 

I mean Smoky has quite enough damage already with the regular hits

and the impact force

Criticals boost smokys average damage by 9%.  Nine. Percent.  Not world-beating by any means.

[thesquarerootof2 165]

Criticals happen at 11.5% / 14.5% / 17.9% / 18.9% / 20.2% depending on M-level.  I would hardly call that "common".

 

It is almost sheer luck to have that happen as a first hit on said Wasp.

 

Criticals boost smokys average damage by 9%.  Nine. Percent.  Not world-beating by any means.

AVERAGE damage. But what about burst damage? 

 

And also it's a lot more than 9% once the normal shots start to lose damage from range. 

Edited September 11, 2018 by thesquarerootof2

[wolverine848 13,097]

AVERAGE damage. But what about burst damage? 

 

And also it's a lot more than 9% once the normal shots start to lose damage from range. 

The point is, critical damage at m3+ does not do a lot more damage than a good normal shot. And it's 1-in-5 chance. Not something very reliable.

 

At lower m-levels the critical is a bigger boost than normal shots, but the wider the gap, the lower the % chance it happens.

 

Put it another way...

Would you prefer smoky critical was affected by range, but it's "weak" damage was boosted to ~ 40%?

Edited September 11, 2018 by wolverine848

[thesquarerootof2 165]

Put it another way...

Would you prefer smoky critical was affected by range, but it's "weak" damage was boosted to ~ 40%?

God no. I'd much rather have an occasional long-range Smoky than a perpetual one. 

Edited September 11, 2018 by thesquarerootof2

[thesquarerootof2 165]

So my main issue with the crit right now (at the lower ranks) is just how much damage it deals. At these ranks it's like 2x normal damage, and that's really devastating. Smoky's regular shots are already quite good, so these crits are basically just added OPness. 

 

My idea was that instead of giving the crit a major damage advantage, we give it some other advantage. I'm not sure what though. Additional impact force? splash damage? And should the infinite range thing stay? idk. 

[wolverine848 13,097]

So my main issue with the crit right now (at the lower ranks) is just how much damage it deals. At these ranks it's like 2x normal damage, and that's really devastating. Smoky's regular shots are already quite good, so these crits are basically just added OPness. 

 

My idea was that instead of giving the crit a major damage advantage, we give it some other advantage. I'm not sure what though. Additional impact force? splash damage? And should the infinite range thing stay? idk. 

More splash?  :huh:  We have enough of that already...

 

Sure the crit at lower m-levels does more damage relative to a normal hit. But - remember it starts out at 11.5%.

Does not happen often.

[nemoetnihil 388]

 

Would you prefer smoky critical was affected by range, but it's "weak" damage was boosted to ~ 40%?

Crits are still infinite, but weak damage was boosted to 50%. 

[wolverine848 13,097]

Crits are still infinite, but weak damage was boosted to 50%. 

"Weak damage" on what was boosted to 50%?

[Tani_S 736]

"Weak damage" on what was boosted to 50%?

The weak damage on the normal damage was boosted to 50%. The average damage of M4 Smoky (without critical damage) is 535, so you make 267.5 damage on average when shooting a tank in over 150 m distance.

[wolverine848 13,097]

The weak damage on the normal damage was boosted to 50%. The average damage of M4 Smoky (without critical damage) is 535, so you make 267.5 damage on average when shooting a tank in over 150 m distance.

"weak" damage was 10%.  Now it is 50%? :o   Patch Notes did not provide this info. Has WIKI been updated?

 

Is that how weak damage works?  take % of the average damage?  Always thought it was % of the Maximum damage...

[Tani_S 736]

"weak" damage was 10%.  Now it is 50%? :o   Patch Notes did not provide this info. Has WIKI been updated?

 

Is that how weak damage works?  take % of the average damage?  Always thought it was % of the Maximum damage...

Yep, now it is 50%, just like Thunder -> so together with the critical it is in theory stronger on long-range than Thunder. On the other hand long-range weapons should usually need more damage per shot and less shots to be effective. The patch note said >>Increased middle-to-long range effectiveness.>so the damage fall off will be noticeably weaker

 

I just took the average damage to make it easier to explain. I understand it this way, that there is still the bell curve between max. dmg (650) and min.dmg. (420) but it is 50% of that => so the damage varies then between max.dmg (325) and min.dmg. (210). Yes, the numbers for Smoky are in the Wiki now, but not those for Striker. I am waiting for the latter  -_-

[wolverine848 13,097]

God no. I'd much rather have an occasional long-range Smoky than a perpetual one. 

All I can say is... WOW :ph34r:

 

Yep, now it is 50%, just like Thunder -> so together with the critical it is in theory stronger on long-range than Thunder. On the other hand long-range weapons should usually need more damage per shot and less shots to be effective.

 

 

 

The patch note said >>Increased middle-to-long range effectiveness.<< which is a vague info. So when ever a vague info is provided, I'd expect changes of several parameters. The topic also talked of >>so the damage fall off will be noticeably weaker<< which is pointing to the weak damage change.

 

I just took the average damage to make it easier to explain. I understand it this way, that there is still the bell curve between max. dmg (650) and min.dmg. (420) but it is 50% of that => so the damage varies then between max.dmg (325) and min.dmg. (210). Yes, the numbers for Smoky are in the Wiki now, but not those for Striker. I am waiting for the latter  -_-

 

 

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

Criticals happen at 11.5% / 14.5% / 17.9% / 18.9% / 20.2% depending on M-level.  I would hardly call that "common".

It is almost sheer luck to have that happen as a first hit on said Wasp..

I agree to you, that the an 15% chance is not thaaaat high (its 1-out-of-7.. should be ok). Still I died almost every time at first shot when he came around with activated DP. Maybe I was just out of luck this weekend :)

[thesquarerootof2 165]

Is that how weak damage works?  take % of the average damage?  Always thought it was % of the Maximum damage...

No, it takes % of the damage you WOULD'VE dealt without dropoff. 

 

Example: M1 Smoky does between 259 and 405 damage. You fire a shot, and the game randomly chooses for you to deal 300 damage. But your target is beyond your min. damage range so you'd deal 150 damage (50% weak damage). Then you fire another shot, and the game chooses 350 damage. This would become 175 damage due to range dropoff. 

 

I still cannot believe they buffed the weak damage to 50% though. Smoky is now better than Thunder in basically every single way. Impact force, damage, reload are both better than Thunder. And now the range is the same (heck it might even be a bit better since Smoky's crit doesn't even have dropoff). Considering that Thunder is already most likely OP... 

Edited September 12, 2018 by thesquarerootof2

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

Lol, why are people so addicted to this lets discuss topic now? :rolleyes:

 

Yes we get it, smoky got buffed, and yes I was expecting discussing here to pick up little.

 

But this is ridiculous, ever since the buff, it's like the only active discussion.

[wolverine848 13,097]

Lol, why are people so addicted to this lets discuss topic now? :rolleyes:

 

Yes we get it, smoky got buffed, and yes I was expecting discussing here to pick up little.

 

But this is ridiculous, ever since the buff, it's like the only active discussion.

Smoky's been hiding in shadows for so long, give it some love Kill-joy.

 

Alright - let's talk about how supplies need to be nerfed.   ;)

[gokuMI6 1,290]

They complain about Pea shooter  :ph34r:  

Looks like Zombie's ate thier Brains  :lol:

[Benefactor 6,888]

Time to roll out the Wasp again!

Yay! More Smoky/Wasp videos with local folk music!  :lol:

[gokuMI6 1,290]

Yay! More Smoky/Wasp videos with local folk music!  :lol:

<_<

I like to Roll with Hornet

[splitterpoint 10,986]

Le Wasp:

 

[wolverine848 13,097]

Le Wasp:

 

 

 

 

 

Looks like you were playing TDM while the rest were playing CTF.  <_<

 

Did you even try to cap a flag?  :D     But ya got your 3 stars - amirite?

Edited September 12, 2018 by wolverine848

[splitterpoint 10,986]

True that, clearly capturing flags is not my job as a Wasp.

[Mr.Rage 2]

Its very OP, during m1 and m2 section, but in m3 u got those protections looking at you, Wide Eyes!

[MachineoWar1000 0]

I don't speak from experience but in my opinion the hornet is better than the wasp in the long run, as it is more steady than wasp and has more armor while not sacrificing too much speed at m3.

[gokuMI6 1,290]

I don't speak from experience but in my opinion the hornet is better than the wasp in the long run, as it is more steady than wasp and has more armor while not sacrificing too much speed at m3.

Well Both have their pros and cons

I also prefer Hornet with Smoky that Wasp 

But Wasp is small so it will be so easy to hide in bushes and start killing