Do you believe in evolution?

[kingeoin14 30]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem

 

Unrelated, but if everything is decided, every outcome, by God, then why are there so many sperm?

[DiSoRderLY 141]

Many creationists would not believe in evolution if prove was handed to them on a silver platter, understandable because it would destroy that what they so strongly belief. No more after-world perhaps...

 

Evolution is a flawed "Theory" Even Darwin admitted it had problems.

1. Carbon dating has been proven to be very inaccurate (discrepancies in the same block of rock, etc)

They often turn to pointing out the flaws in Darwin's evolution theory, inaccurate details, or other missing pieces of the puzzle. Sorry, but Darwin's theory is more than a hundred years old, many study's have followed since. Some study's might have some inaccurate details or missing pieces, but one must look at the bigger picture. All those study's combined lead to only one conclusion; evolution cannot be denied!! Something every scientist agrees upon.

Edited November 29, 2013 by DiSoRderLY

[kingeoin14 30]

Many creationists would not believe in evolution if prove was handed to them on a silver platter, understandable because it would destroy that what they so strongly belief. No more after-world perhaps...

 

They often turn to pointing out the flaws in Darwin's evolution theory, inaccurate details, or other missing pieces of the puzzle. Sorry, but Darwin's theory is more than a hundred years old, many study's have followed since. Some study's might have some inaccurate details or missing pieces, but one must look at the bigger picture. All those study's combined lead to only one conclusion; evolution cannot be denied!! Something every scientist agrees upon.

+1

[DrSaint 176]

Evolution is true, it is THE never-ending process TO precise perfection … you all can find evidence everywhere.

 

All the other explanations are bankrupted philosophers’ innocent hallucinations!

Edited November 29, 2013 by DrSaint

[GoldRock 6,165]

Let me tell you what science says---GOD'S CREATION-- written all over it. The great I AM created science, and can conquer it as well. So the fact that "science would say otherwise on the matter" is true, but irrelevant since I AM is above science and the nature of it.

Firstly, science does not support the need for there to be a God, though both theories can work together... Also, if Mr. I AM is above science, then why doesn't he intervene to save lives? To stop chaos, destruction and unnecessary death?

 

Writing your opinion in great big letters does not make it fact.

 

Cool story (not saying it's false)

However, almost everyone regarding religion is biased. At youth, they go for whichever theory that empowers them the most. Whether it's parent, teacher, mentor, etc., that's the theory that will lead them. Most of the sources that are unbiased consist of people that are not passionate about the subject thus not even wanting to write a book, article, or maybe even speak about it. If they ever get passionate and want to do research, chances are they'll go to whatever article or book they read first or whoever they hear from first. The rest of the people are people who do much research on the subject and go one way or the other.

I agree with much of what you have said - most people who are passionate about religion (as am I) have personal opinions on it. However, whilst it is not possible to completely rid an article on religion of bias, it is possible to minimise such bias.

 

There is also huge amount of evidence to disprove the theory ;) Creation aka Catastrophist theory is also accepted as scientifically and spiritually accurate :)

It may be accepted as spiritually accurate, yes, but I have not seen much evidence at all for it being scientifically accurate... Feel free to point out such evidence.

 

Oh, he can't? You sure? If he's truly a "God", one that can conquer anything, including eternity, why can he not be eternal? Meaning, he's always been here. There's never been a "beginning" and there will never be an "end" to him. Our minds cannot comprehend it, because we are merely humans. God is God--the Great I AM. Since your theory doesn't consist of God, I can make the argument of, "Where did life come from? You say the "Big BANG", so are you saying that life came from a bang? Like, a bang from some kind of sun? Then you're saying life came from a bang from a sun, which means life came from an object, which we know since the old days that flies do not come from meat. Hey pal, we're not in the 1300s anymore.

Saying that the Big Bang came from 'a sun' is incorrect. The idea is that the Big Bang occurred from literally nothing, and was on a much larger scale than that of 'a sun'. In this way, there are actually similarities between religion and science.

 

He can't? Where do you make these assuptions? There is much purpose of us here--to spread the Gospel and his Word to all nations and kingdoms. Eating, breathing, and dying are all part of life. There is many religions, clearly. All these religions are beliefs. Evolution is one of them. Only one belief can be true.

Well, that is your opinion - though a fascinating one.

 

As for your point about only one belief being true... I cannot put into words how much I disagree with that statement. Science and religion can both work. The majority of religious believers in the US support evolution, studies have shown... Also, your statement implies that there is only one correct religion. Well, wrong, in my view. I believe that all religions are equal, as diverse ways of life, and different ways of reaching a 'God'. Our different beliefs, and the tolerance of them (ie not just 'My belief is the only right belief') is what makes us wonderful human beings.

 

I know what you believe. Holy men sin more than unholy man? Proof? I do recognize that everyone sins. There are many Christians that do evil deeds due to not caring and not feeling the water of life flowing through him. "For all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God" -Romans 3:23. But God gives us all another chance for free "By the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life through Christ Jesus our Lord." -Romans 6:23

I don't believe that personally. I believe they sin equally - we're all human, our beliefs do not remove our imperfections. I also think that anyone, religious or non-religious, can be a good human being - atheists aren't all necessarily horrible people :P

 

That's an interesting quote, thanks for sharing it :)

 

As for your other question, the Lord is with those who believe, even if they're in war. It's evident the way he was with Israel, until they rebuked his name.

Again, interesting concept. I'd personally say that if God exists, he would not be with those who believe (for believers can be both good and bad), but with those who do the right thing.

 

That's cruel. I don't want to think about anyone going to Hell. Not even those who rebuke and mock his name with the strongest hatred.

Good to hear - I agree completely ^_^

 

Wow....you contradict yourself. I'm not a Roman Catholic, but one of my sets of grandparents are and they have a big book--a creed. This creed says everything it really can against the theory.

Well, the majority of Catholics in

the US support evolution... Go and tell them they've all got it 'wrong'.

 

All beliefs should be valued, as I said before; a Catholic who supports evolution is just as Catholic as one who doesn't. This 'creed' is open to interpretation; as the theist philosopher Iranaeus once said: "Without free will, we would not be able to fully develop as human beings".

 

Good argument! Though, are you not commiting the fallacy of Ad Hominem Circumstantial?

Yes, he is - well noticed. In that way, his argument wasn't very sound.

 

Though it sometimes seems that the picture he shared has a point (not saying that applies to all religious followers, but some do act like they must be right, and that their opinion must be fact).

 

@navi613, I'll provide some evidence once there is an opportunity to fit some into this lengthy debate :lol:

Edited November 29, 2013 by GoldRock

[navi613 73]

Evolution is true, it is THE never-ending process TO precise perfection … you all can find evidence everywhere.

 

All the other explanations are bankrupted philosophers’ innocent hallucinations!

If you can find evidence that evolution is true anywhere, then go and find some and show us your evidence.

 

@navi613, I'll provide some evidence once there is an opportunity to fit some into this lengthy debate :lol:

Okay, you might be able to change my mind if you can provide me with some proper evidence :P

Edited November 29, 2013 by navi613

[LiquidGold 1,370]

evolution took place even if you don't believe it, it still took place. It is one of those things that belief has nothing to do with. I do not need faith to know evolution took place and anyone who says they do not think it's real, and is still happening is misguided.

 

If you can find evidence that evolution is true anywhere, then go and find some and show us your evidence.

 

Okay, you might be able to change my mind if you can provide me with some proper evidence :P

evidence is all around you look outside your window, most intellectuals concur... and by your argument you should also go join the flat earth society

[The-PIayer2 39]

...

Edited November 30, 2013 by Irontank1v

[The-PIayer2 39]

...

Edited November 30, 2013 by Irontank1v

[DirtFighter 199]

Many creationists would not believe in evolution if prove was handed to them on a silver platter, understandable because it would destroy that what they so strongly belief. No more after-world perhaps...

 

They often turn to pointing out the flaws in Darwin's evolution theory, inaccurate details, or other missing pieces of the puzzle. Sorry, but Darwin's theory is more than a hundred years old, many study's have followed since. Some study's might have some inaccurate details or missing pieces, but one must look at the bigger picture. All those study's combined lead to only one conclusion; evolution cannot be denied!! Something every scientist agrees upon.

You might be right on your first point, however, can the same can be said for evolutionist?? I think so. It is very hard to change ones mind on matters like these that people are so entrenched in.

 

Evolution absolutely can be denied and is being denied right now by me and many other participants of this conversation. Evolution is still a Theory and not a scientific law because it can not be empirically proven to be fact. Look into the history of education ever since evolution emerged on the scene. There are people that want any and all references to God removed from "public education" and daly life  for that matter. Evolution is the almost "perfect tool" to prove God does not exist. 

 

I was an Atheist until I was 30 years old. Actually I just did not care but I leaned toward Atheism. I then seriously and with an open mind contemplated the meaning of life, the existence of God and the purpose for our existence as humans. I have investigated a lot of this stuff to my own satisfaction (religion, evolution, the existence of God and so on) I have found a lot of holes in evolution...It sounds good at first but when you really dig deeper then you will see the holes. 

 

Religion is not with out its flaws either. I don't care much for organized religion and if you study what Jesus taught he did not care much for it either. 

 

What drives my beliefs is truth...I can not deny truth even if i don't like it

[Ilia.ArchangeI 6,785]

 I don't care much for organized religion and if you study what Jesus taught he did not care much for it either. 

Well said :)

[Fresh 2,390]

can u please close this topic, i am getting offended coz of this guy, only scientist with no religion believe in evolution so could u close it as u do not need to know if we believe in evolution, you have created a big mistake yele

[DirtFighter 199]

can u please close this topic, i am getting offended coz of this guy, only scientist with no religion believe in evolution so could u close it as u do not need to know if we believe in evolution, you have created a big mistake yele

Don't be offended!!...I am taking it you are "Religious" and that is cool...there are many different beliefs in this community. We should be able to talk about these things with out getting offended. I don't agree with the people that believe in evolution but that does not mean I don't like them. 

Take GoldRock for example , he states he is an Atheist ( or Agnostic I am not sure) and I disagree with his belief but I like him as a friend in Tanki and respect his opinions. As a matter of fact he articulates him self very well and is for the most part is respectful to everyone even if he disagrees with them. So please, do not be offended and take this as an opportunity to sharpen up the reasons you believe what you believe and practice being able to respectfully articulate your position on this subject. People may not see things your way and that is OK but if you present your self in a respectful manner people will at the very least listen to what you are saying. If you get all offended and say things out of line then your position on a subject will not matter but your behavior is what others will remember. Please don't take offense to me saying this, I am only trying to keep an open channel for debate o this subject. 

 

 

I enjoy debating these things and I love to be challenged by opposing thoughts (respectfully of course) Plus it is not my job to "convert" people I can only speak the truth the way I see it and God is the one who reveals him self to a person and can change the heart. 

[JL6H 1,220]

Well,this got off topic quickly and bumped racism.

[Irontank1v 836]

Le not making sense pic

There DNA is different in the same way as the DNAs of all living creatures are different even if all evolve from single cell (aka evolution)

 

 

Note: Avoid posting such pictures/statements in future, and please just keep your discussion about Evolution only.

Edited November 30, 2013 by Irontank1v

[RampagingVenom 554]

I love the cars & if there is free beer then that`s ok :D

[GoldRock 6,165]

can u please close this topic, i am getting offended coz of this guy, only scientist with no religion believe in evolution so could u close it as u do not need to know if we believe in evolution, you have created a big mistake yele

I repeat myself for the third time: more than half of religious believers in the US support evolution...

 

I actually find your post quite derogatory towards those who do support evolution.

 

Well,this got off topic quickly and bumped racism.

I agree that some posts here are not appropriate. I recommend, however, that these posts are removed and the topic is left open, rather than punishing those who are using this topic well by closing it.

 

 

Don't be offended!!...I am taking it you are "Religious" and that is cool...there are many different beliefs in this community. We should be able to talk about these things with out getting offended. I don't agree with the people that believe in evolution but that does not mean I don't like them.

Take GoldRock for example , he states he is an Atheist ( or Agnostic I am not sure) and I disagree with his belief but I like him as a friend in Tanki and respect his opinions. As a matter of fact he articulates him self very well and is for the most part is respectful to everyone even if he disagrees with them. So please, do not be offended and take this as an opportunity to sharpen up the reasons you believe what you believe and practice being able to respectfully articulate your position on this subject. People may not see things your way and that is OK but if you present your self in a respectful manner people will at the very least listen to what you are saying. If you get all offended and say things out of line then your position on a subject will not matter but your behavior is what others will remember. Please don't take offense to me saying this, I am only trying to keep an open channel for debate o this subject.

 

 

I enjoy debating these things and I love to be challenged by opposing thoughts (respectfully of course) Plus it is not my job to "convert" people I can only speak the truth the way I see it and God is the one who reveals him self to a person and can change the heart.

 

Excellently said, thumbs up. Yes, I am an agnostic-atheist (someone who doesn't believe in God, though accepts that he could exist), but my belief is not set in stone - I actually tended to agree with theistic concepts at a younger age. My own research and discussion on religion, and the environment around me, is what has influenced my current belief. And I still have a long way to go in my life.

 

Also, this idea about respect when discussing religion:

 

- Theists, stop thinking that atheists are ignorant and un-enlightened people (e.g. "Just wait till the next resurrection/judgement day thingy on Earth, then you'll see who's right. The truth is the truth, and God will make you pay.")

 

- Atheists, stop thinking that theists are blinded and close-minded people (e.g. "Those who don't accept evolution are ignoring the facts. Religion is violent and ignorant; can't they see what century we're in now?")

 

Look guys; has anyone ever thought that there might be some truths in all beliefs, rather than "My way is the only way"?

 

There you go - problem sorted! :lol:

 

Religion is an awesome subject, and it holds so many moral/practical truths. Science is an awesome subject, and it holds so many moral/practical truths. What's the big issue about accepting that both could be right, whilst believing what you wish? As I have stated, many people believe both, and that both paths should be valued... even if you only believe in one of them (religion or science), you can still value the other...

Edited November 30, 2013 by GoldRock

[LiquidGold 1,370]

how many wars got started by the argument my god is better than your god? how many wars got started by the argument my tree is better than your tree?

[Irontank1v 836]

how many wars got started by the argument my god is better than your god? how many wars got started by the argument my tree is better than your tree?

This is the final warning. No more posts discussing religion. Discuss evolution as much as you want.

[skitee 555]

Having read a bit on this topic, I'd just like to say a few things - first of all, can we keep this to a discussion about evolution/non-evolution and not a discussion about religion/morals/race/heaven/football/cookery/the weather or anything else? Also, can we all, whichever side we're on, accept that the other side has people who sincerely believe in it and that both sides are reasonable theories, no matter whether you believe one or the other? And then as a result of that, can we please provide evidence and deal with the points which other people bring up, trying to support/disprove them with evidence and how we personally interpret the evidence? And finally, can we be mature about this and not stereotype people who hold to the opposite view or accuse them of holding that view because their parents said so/they hate the concept of God/they refuse to open their mind or whatever?

 

When it comes to creation, let me explain why I personally hold to it. Firstly, the Bible says so, and the Bible as yet (as far as I can see) has not been proven wrong in any aspect, so why would it be wrong when describing creation? Contemporary historical accounts have so far only supported the Bible's histories in the Old Testament, the stories about Jesus are also supported by contemporary historians, and the prophecies which were written many years before the events which they prophesied about have so far never failed come true. I also believe that the Bible in Genesis chapter one doesn't really allow interpretation for evolution.

 

Secondly, I would say that I don't see any solid evidence for evolution and as a result of that I don't believe it took place. I don't think that there is any evidence for macro-evolution as a whole, mainly due to the fact that there is biologically no way that we know of of animals forming new species by genetic change. Also, I would say that the majority of "evidence for evolution" simply goes to proving micro-evolution, which nobody is denying.

Thirdly, I would say that I believe in creation because I think that it is the only way of explaining the existence of our world in the perfect or near-perfect way which it is. I think that the way in which our bodies are so designed as to if we had one less gland or whatever we would be dead is just too good to be true, as is the existence in our universe as carbon being able to bond so perfectly, the way in which ice is one of the very few materials to be less dense in its solid state than its liquid state, the "coincidence" of hydrogen bonding and so forth all just seems too good to be true in a world of chance. I accept that this isn't really an argument against evolution but rather a support for a creator (who could have used evolution), yet that is why I believe in creation.

 

A few questions I would have which suggests why I don't believe in evolution:

1. How do you explain the amazing perfection of science and our body?

2. What about entropy?

3. What evidence for macro-evolution is there, if any?

4. Why aren't there any partial reptile-partial mammal creatures around today? Or do they exist?

 

Many creationists would not believe in evolution if prove was handed to them on a silver platter, understandable because it would destroy that what they so strongly belief. No more after-world perhaps...

The same applies to many evolutionists, most of whom refuse to even deal with any debate about creationists using non-arguments such as "Oh, that's old-fashioned."; "Nobody believes that anymore"; "Just look at the evidence!" [whilst providing no evidence for us too look at]. I'm not claiming creationists have a kind of moral superiority here and I really dislike the people who refuse to even consider themselves being wrong, both creationists and evolutionists - but these people exist on both sides and to tarnish everyone on one sound with the same brush is childish and untrue.
 

They often turn to pointing out the flaws in Darwin's evolution theory, inaccurate details, or other missing pieces of the puzzle. Sorry, but Darwin's theory is more than a hundred years old, many study's have followed since. Some study's might have some inaccurate details or missing pieces, but one must look at the bigger picture. All those study's combined lead to only one conclusion; evolution cannot be denied!! Something every scientist agrees upon.

Oh, so these people: http://creation.com/creation-scientists don't exist? There are some pretty high-up scientists there! I'd hardly accept that "all scientists" believe in evolution. And Darwin's theory might be more than a hundred years old, but creation theory goes back since the beginning of time... does that make it more irrefutable? Hardly. Both have their merits, and both might be correct - although I personally would believe in six-day creation, I accept that evolution is still a reasonable scientific theory, despite being one I believe from the evidence around to be incorrect.

[GoldRock 6,165]

This is the final warning. No more posts discussing religion. Discuss evolution as much as you want.

Well, it's impossible to discuss evolution without discussing religion... Up until now, we have been discussing both in a fairly respectful manner. LiquidGold's post just then was rather off-topic, and I agree that it was unnecessary here. However, are we allowed to discuss religion, so long as we do so respectfully, and within the context of evolution (so no going on about religious war etc.)? That is what most of us have been doing, and it has stayed, for the large part, fairly productive and respectful (see already.dead's, skitee's, DirtFighter's, JonathanBernatowicz's, and my posts for examples of what I mean).

[DirtFighter 199]

how many wars got started by the argument my god is better than your god? how many wars got started by the argument my tree is better than your tree?

It is true, many wars have been fought in the name of God. How ever it does not prove the existence or lack there of God. Nor does it prove that evolution is a scientific fact and not just a plausible  "theory"

[RampagingVenom 554]

It is always possible to discuss religion without insulting others or bringing the race issue into it

it just depends how intelligent or how ignorant you are & if your intention is to offend.

[DirtFighter 199]

Well, it's impossible to discuss evolution without discussing religion... Up until now, we have been discussing both in a fairly respectful manner. LiquidGold's post just then was rather off-topic, and I agree that it was unnecessary here. However, are we allowed to discuss religion, so long as we do so respectfully, and within the context of evolution (so no going on about religious war etc.)? That is what most of us have been doing, and it has stayed, for the large part, fairly productive and respectful (see already.dead's, skitee's, DirtFighter's, JonathanBernatowicz's, and my posts for examples of what I mean).

Agreed..It is impossible to discuss this topic with out the inclusion of the religious aspect. Not to beat a dead horse...but for the most part I think this tread has behaved quite well

[Irontank1v 836]

And how is this called behaving well

http://en.tankiforum.com/index.php?showtopic=184805&p=3264452
http://en.tankiforum.com/index.php?showtopic=184805&p=3266236