Drugging - Old Tanki vs New Tanki

[ThouShallNot 963]

bump

[ThouShallNot 963]

bump

[fufususumumu1 240]

u frickin flooder!!

i jjust hope it was a computer problem and not on purpose

and btw tanki put those drug kits to make more buyers, the cool thing is  that it is not so bad to make people leave but it does make the game a little unbalanced and thats the aim of tanki, to give buyers the slight advantage of the game required as they are the ones filling their pockets

Edited October 31, 2014 by fufususumumu1

[r_DidYouKnowThat0 1,662]

If all you're trying to say is that Drugging was not a "problem" until Kits came, then there really is no point in "bumping" this topic.

And like it or not, (drug) kits are here, and are here to stay, so tolerate their presence as they are a part of the game, and will NOT be taken out whatsoever. What is it so hard to understand? :P

 

You're just being a flooder, sorry. I'm agreeing with the person above.

Edited October 31, 2014 by r_DidYouKnowThat0

[fufususumumu1 240]

If all you're trying to say is that Drugging was not a "problem" until Kits came, then there really is no point in "bumping" this topic.

And like it or not, (drug) kits are here, and are here to stay, so tolerate their presence as they are a part of the game, and will NOT be taken out whatsoever. What is it so hard to understand? :P

 

You're just being a flooder, sorry. I'm agreeing with the person above.

duh tanki needs their money too. a few just dont realize that tanki is run by real people who need to survive and u have to realize that corpsecrusher. one reason why many play this game is because the tanki company makes the game playable for all. favouritism to buyers is not as bad to make non-buyers leave and thats why i play this game.

if u play games like asphalt 8 or something u will realize that many have left this game due to the imbalance of it. most of my frends say that it was too difficult to play against those buyers as they had a 90:10 ratio of winning

Edited October 31, 2014 by fufususumumu1

[snudl3 0]

Played a game last night when all 8 of opposing team were drugging all the time. They scored 80-odd flags in no time to win. No challenge for them, purely mercenary. If that team got satisfaction from that, they are deluded. What an achievement - being good at drugging - against non-druggers (that's sarcasm, for any literalists). Sad that TO is like that. Still badly broken.

 

Most of our original team left, long before the end. Others joined, but we barely got a kill, let alone a flag return. Spoilt what had been a good game.

 

TO get their revenues (not a bad thing), but the trade-off is high in terms of enjoyment. The balance still isn't right imo.

[tommybau 1,033]

this is not a discussion about the smart cooldowns, this is a discussion about the changes in the amount of drugs used by the players, so i dont think this should be closed. 

 

 

talking about this... is PARTIALLY true. i started to play tanki lots of time ago, and it was really worse than now for newbies to play the game just after they passed the warrant officers ranks. you could see thunder-mammoths m3 playng against m0 hornet-m0 freezes and such. there still were lots and lots of hight spenders whit permanent 234-1. dugs were rarely used only at the first ranks, and that is what all of our remember, cause we were low ranks.

tanki balanced the game by making m1-2-3 unlocked later, giving free players time to get crystals and buy themselfes a set of m3's.

tanki gave supplies kit so the free players and low spenders could buy them at a decent price to avoid being massacred by the high spenders.

tanki gave kits avaible to everyone, and not only to buyers. many of my friends bought lots of kits by saving in the game. is your fault if you did not manage to buy one.

tanki introduced smart cooldowns to penalize the unskilled 234's and to make life easier for non druggers. you will now hardly see a full drugged tank. and that is not thank to his wallet, but thank to his skill.

tanki made drop boxes better, to give another advantage to non-druggers.

tanki gives out a LOT of discount to let free players get things at even 70% discount.

 

now tell me, WHAT DO YOU WANT MORE?

Edited October 31, 2014 by tommybau

[snudl3 0]

Interesting history, thank you. Shows how much more it was pay-to-win in the past. All the changes are in the same direction. That would suggest the balance wasn't right before - and doesn't necessarily imply they have it right now. Druggers will argue it one way, non-druggers the other. (We know who holds the greater economic weight of argument.) 

 

Doubling everyone's crystals may have led to more drugging in the short-term. Nice gesture perhaps, but I expect TO had an initial revenue boost just before, as you could buy 2000 supplies for the price of 1000. The long-term problem (for non-druggers, but not necessarily TO) is if this extra drugging becomes the new norm.

[Vil_tanker 5]

Hello.

 

I think you should stop the colldown in speed up because otherwise it does not get used.

 

Put the speed up cooldown just dependent on speed up itself.

 

The same should be applied to mines. The cooldown should be dependent on the use of mines and nothing else.

 

So in conclusion, Mines and speed up should be taken out from cooldowns related to other supplies and just depend on the previous use of that supplie.

 

Cooldowns should only be related in repair, double layer and double power.

 

Just an ideia, hope you take it.

 

Best regards and TANK you!

 

Vil.

[Vil_tanker 5]

Supplies or drugs as you call it are part of the game and it takes skill to use them right.

When you have a higher rank gun or hull it is not drug so why should supplies be.

 

Learn to use supplies and let the game evolve.

 

TANK you,

Vil.

[ThouShallNot 963]

this is not a discussion about the smart cooldowns, this is a discussion about the changes in the amount of drugs used by the players, so i dont think this should be closed. 

 

 

talking about this... is PARTIALLY true. i started to play tanki lots of time ago, and it was really worse than now for newbies to play the game just after they passed the warrant officers ranks. you could see thunder-mammoths m3 playng against m0 hornet-m0 freezes and such. there still were lots and lots of hight spenders whit permanent 234-1. dugs were rarely used only at the first ranks, and that is what all of our remember, cause we were low ranks.

tanki balanced the game by making m1-2-3 unlocked later, giving free players time to get crystals and buy themselfes a set of m3's.

tanki gave supplies kit so the free players and low spenders could buy them at a decent price to avoid being massacred by the high spenders.

tanki gave kits avaible to everyone, and not only to buyers. many of my friends bought lots of kits by saving in the game. is your fault if you did not manage to buy one.

tanki introduced smart cooldowns to penalize the unskilled 234's and to make life easier for non druggers. you will now hardly see a full drugged tank. and that is not thank to his wallet, but thank to his skill.

tanki made drop boxes better, to give another advantage to non-druggers.

tanki gives out a LOT of discount to let free players get things at even 70% discount.

 

now tell me, WHAT DO YOU WANT MORE?

i want drug kits and the rest of the kits REMOVED.

[ThouShallNot 963]

Supplies or drugs as you call it are part of the game and it takes skill to use them right.

When you have a higher rank gun or hull it is not drug so why should supplies be.

 

Learn to use supplies and let the game evolve.

 

TANK you,

Vil.

im not talking about supplies them selves im talking about drug kits...

[r_koolwalky0 2]

Cooldowns didn't make drugging worse, the kits did...

good point +1

[ThouShallNot 963]

If all you're trying to say is that Drugging was not a "problem" until Kits came, then there really is no point in "bumping" this topic.

And like it or not, (drug) kits are here, and are here to stay, so tolerate their presence as they are a part of the game, and will NOT be taken out whatsoever. What is it so hard to understand? :P

 

You're just being a flooder, sorry. I'm agreeing with the person above.

everything was balanced and fun until drug kits came.

Edited October 31, 2014 by ThouShallNot

[RustyNail 1,538]

Here I am.

I started to collect posts to comment but I changed my mind, I have been complaining so much in regard to this issue that even I got tired... short of..

HOWEVER,

stop abusing the terms "strategy", "skill" etc.

Admitt (you know who) that all this was just so that drugs' use and sales increase, and strategy has nothing to do with that, but for being an excuse providing the alibi.

TO should either eliminate the possibility for players to buy drugs or the amount of drugs used in a given battle time.

This would solve the issues without further complications.

Not even income rates would have to lessen if a certain raise would apply to drug cost.

etc, etc, I have been saying this for weeks now...

Have a good night :)

[r_DidYouKnowThat0 1,662]

Yes, exactly. Back then, drugs weren't used that much - a claim both experienced, and that of which can be supported by others.

So, what did TO do? They wanted to increase the use of them. After all, they are an important aspect of the game, AND a big money maker.

Tanki Online runs on money for those who do not know.

 

So that was the solution of making drugs more popular, and pretty much gain more money in the process. Though it shouldn't be looked at as something bad. Again, it's an aspect of the game that you can't take out, so your suggestion of eliminating the possibility for players to buy drugs is both extreme, and impossible. Did you know that?

 

And strategy does come into play when you looked at what Devs were trying to do when implementing the Smart Cooldowns. If you checked, the Devs did agree that 234 showed no skill, really. Furthermore it was considered "pointless" because in the end, the drugs cancelled out. Not to mention the fact that x3 Drugging pretty much gave you no blind spots, it was overpowered. So that was the aim of Smart Cooldowns, to control the more active use of power-ups. So it's not necessarily "abusing" those terms. It's just the answer's right in plain sight, and some just don't seem acknowledge it.

 

Basically you're going to have to realize that that was exactly the point. Devs wanted drugs to be used more. Though it's reasonable I guess, after all, what good was having a feature if nobody used it or was discouraged to use it? And how were they going to raise more money to keep the game running?

 

So they increased drugging, and attempted to control it so it wouldn't spin out of control.

Personally I'd favor this in comparison of making a "premium" currency and/or membership. *shudders*

 

Everyone can aim for the same thing, and have the same options. Sure, some may not have the luxury of always being on par with others, but that's something you'll have to face when you're not the one donating to the game to keep it running AND developing for everyone to play, and enjoy.

Edited November 1, 2014 by r_DidYouKnowThat0

[RustyNail 1,538]

My God, you're impossible! :unsure:

 

Candies are a kind of "energy boost" for man. When one consumes a candy one gets an extra amount of energy to use, for a certain amount of time.

When another one sells candies for a living and this one needs more money, this one raises the price of candies, rather than manipulating the customers into consuming more candies.

If this one does the second (manipulating into consuming more candies) the customers can rightly accuse this one of being hypocrite and a lier.

The reasonable, straight and honest attitude is the raise of the cost and whoever can pay can follow (which is the same about increasing the quantity consumed, so no reason to choose one over the other). Anything else is double talk.

Is that clear enough?

Or do I have to address adjectives to TO Administration?

[r_DidYouKnowThat0 1,662]

All you're taking into account is money, money, money. Although that may play a part, you don't look at the big picture.

In the previous post, you used the key phrase "all this." So you're rounding up the Drug Kits, Smart Cooldowns, etc. all into this. And yet you still do not acknowledge skill as any part of the purpose, when it was exactly the purpose when you look at things like Smart Cooldowns and what Devs had said.

 

But anyways, so to you, you're implying that there's only ONE way to do it - which would be to raise the initial price of drugs.

Sorry, but business is not that simple, especially in online games. You criticize how people MUST do this, and MUST do that, and the solutions you suggest reflect upon exactly that. Well then, how must Devs make money?

 

If you haven't noticed, Devs make money when people BUY crystals with their own money, real money. And then they have to use that money to pay for the bills, servers, etc. etc. and then distribute it to each employee, etc. etc. In Tanki Online, (before MU's, and not counting Drugs, Passes, and Score Improvers), there are the Turrets, Hulls, and Paints. And there are only a set amount of them, so if someone owns everything at M3, they have nothing to buy. No more money coming from them to TO. Not many people MU until M3, nor do they spend real money on them due to the fact that their benefits are minimal. And do include the fact that there is only ONE currency in TO. We can earn everything the Buyers can, for free. And does it actually take more time, with all the give-aways and contests and double funds TO hosts for us?

 

And since that is how things go, do you think that majority would buy when you could just earn the same exact things buyers could? It's a one-currency game, so be prepared for "expensive" prices.

 

Also, if you didn't notice, Tanki Online actually DOUBLED everyone's supplies at the start of this new update. How's that for money money money?

 

So then we have Drugs, Passes, and Score Improvers. Although I do say so myself that I don't think people would actually spend real money on Passes and Score Improvers. That price could be bought just by earning them in-game. Which leaves Drugs as one of their biggest money-makers, no? So thus, drugs are pretty important to the game, and their rise in use was possibly bound to happen anyway.

 

So now we go back to your suggestion of increasing the initial prices of the drugs directly. And I'd like to quote this from your own post "The reasonable, straight and honest attitude is the raise of the cost and whoever can pay can follow," Yes, whoever can pay can follow. LOL.

When you increase the price of something, it's setting the bar higher, and pretty much setting restrictions in a way. Do Devs want to decrease the amount of players buying? Of course not!

You see, it's not the same as increasing the quantity consumed. Just like other games around the web, you don't want to discourage the players from buying, and raising the prices directly will do just that. When something is viewed firstly as cheap, people will consider buying. When you raise it directly, you set off intimidation in a way, and make the product seem more unappealing. You don't want to drive people away before they even try out the product. By not touching the initial pricing of drugs, the Developers are keeping the drugs available to buy for everyone.

So if we're talking about how manipulating the audience to buy something is being a hypocrite and liar, then (almost) every game dev in the world is a hypocrite and liar. Lol. Although I'd view it more towards "encouraging people to buy."

It's simply business.

Edited November 2, 2014 by r_DidYouKnowThat0

[RustyNail 1,538]

Dude, are you satisfied by your arguments? ... Probably, since you post them. I am not, though.

 

First, you say they have to increase the drugs consumption because that's all they have to sell. Well, that's not true. When I tried this update in the testing server, I bought 2-3 tanks, 2-3 paints and I ended with three - if I 'm not mistaken - combos, fully MU...  long story short, it costed more than 10 million crystalls.

Ten million crystals! Do you know how much (real) money is that? A LOT! So, when someone becomes generalissimo and aquires pretty much everything there is in the garage, this person has already spend a certain amount of real money.

Furthermore, this person keeps spending in buying drugs, that's something generalissimo druggers where shouting from the beggining.

Conclusion: Gismo also costs money and is a serious income resource for TO.

 

Second, I understand the wish to increase the drugs consumption, I would have the same wish if I was in their position. But I wouldn't enforce it via an obligatory drug interaction. Let them find another way to make drugs more appealing.

You understand, making players use drugs in certain combinations or restriction is not the best way to make them more appealing.

 

But please, let's not repeat everything over and over again. I 'm tired of this. Game is not (that) fun anymore, and I have stoped paying real money and will keep this untill they find a way to restore the fun and the freedom to use whatever I have as I see fit. Or, untill I get really bored and abandon TO altogether.

 

(if you want to go on with this conversation, please feel free to do so, without me. Thank you)

[r_DidYouKnowThat0 1,662]

Satisfied by my arguments? Yes, I am. :D And it seems others are too, as shown with votes here, and with past posts. ^_^

 

Well if it came out that way, then whoops. What I meant was, there are multiple ways to make money. There's not just ONE way to do it, and thus, it results in better ways than others, etc. etc.

 

And also, what you did has a major flaw. You did the ./addcry command. LOL! :lol:

If you didn't realize, Micro-upgrades are a gradual thing- bit by bit. They were not meant to be like regular Modifications where you get it all at once.

Of course they're expensive as heck! It's a one-currency game.

And of course you do not take heed that people can EARN crystals too - and use them on MU's! Did you know that? :o

That's why it doesn't HAVE to cost you real $$$, and again, you earn it bit by bit. If you take a step back and look at it, you could understand it instead of keep calling TO greedy.

 

Also, enforcing an obligatory drug interaction? Hehehe. . . .

Ever heard of PRO battle passes? What do you think was the point of them being here in the first place? I'll leave that up to you to think about.

And that was the idea however, "strategy." So then people can't just go god_mode on form, with the x3 drugs. . . .But eh. I'm still hesitant on that.

 

Well, that's the thing. TO is a game that will keep changing, so you'll have to be ready for that. You liked the game back then, right?

Same thing, I REALLY REALLY liked the game back then in like 2012 when I first joined. Then I joined Forums in 2013. . . .

But that's how the game rolls. :P Then there will always be the people who haven't experienced what it was like in the older times (newbies), and who will obviously be attracted to TO in how it is now, etc. etc.

[ThouShallNot 963]

didyouknowthat doesnt understand that drugging wasnt a problem in 2012 until KITS came, 

[r_DidYouKnowThat0 1,662]

Drugging became more popular when Kits came, yes I agree.

Come back when your reading skills exceed that of a 2nd grader's.

 

So why don't you try and make some more valid posts and participate properly in a conversation?

You shouldn't be so biased or narrow-minded. Instead, step-back and be willing to listen and consider others' views.

Otherwise, you will never be able to talk about these kinds of things properly.

 

(edit) And of course, the person who downvotes my comment is non other than an alternate account of someone's. :lol:

It's funny, since it happens when I put this in the beginning of my post: "Satisfied by my arguments? Yes, I am. :D And it seems others are too, as shown with votes here, and with past posts. " It's absolutely surprising how desperate/immature people get, and the grudges they hold.

Edited November 5, 2014 by r_DidYouKnowThat0

[ThouShallNot 963]

Drugging became more popular when Kits came, yes I agree.

Come back when your reading skills exceed that of a 2nd grader's.

 

So why don't you try and make some more valid posts and participate properly in a conversation?

You shouldn't be so biased or narrow-minded. Instead, step-back and be willing to listen and consider others' views.

Otherwise, you will never be able to talk about these kinds of things properly.

 

(edit) And of course, the person who downvotes my comment is non other than an alternate account of someone's. :lol:

It's funny, since it happens when I put this in the beginning of my post: "Satisfied by my arguments? Yes, I am. :D And it seems others are too, as shown with votes here, and with past posts. " It's absolutely surprising how desperate/immature people get, and the grudges they hold.

omg why do you need to say all the unecesary crap, just tell me if you like my idea or if you dont like dont make it confusing with all those words.

Edited November 5, 2014 by ThouShallNot

[r_DidYouKnowThat0 1,662]

"

in the old tanki i didnt need to drug to get to the top score, it was really rare for me to do that, i didnt need to spend a single drug to be the top killer... watch this video from the old tanki (2012) and tell me if you see ANYONE drugging.

 

~Video~

 

Seems like the person with the most health packs wins... 

MODS please do not close this topic i wanna see what people think!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

Lol, read it carefully. There is no proposed suggestion/idea. :lol:

Then later on in the posts, you suggest Kits be taken out of the game. You don't realize what you're talking about, really.

Tanki Online doesn't revolve around one person, and it is a business. -Shakes head-

 

And to my current understanding, paragraphs confuse you? Huh. . . .Interesting.

[wild001 786]

By doubling people's supplies and giving them massive supply gifts they actually made drugging much worse...

 

i still have 300+ drugs after the give away. :D  seems how hard for me to waste drugs as much as i can