About New Shaft... (Please think this update)

[spino.ska 19]

That's not how this tactic is supposed to be used in this game. You re supposed to hide the laser by aiming at something REALLY close to you. I'll show a screenshot example soon.

 

I think an example is good, because I can't figure well. In my mind, if I think to aim to something close to me, I fear that my crosshair will be too far from the target. But maybe it's just my imagination (as Cranberries used to sing hahahaha).

 

 

 

The steady aim is supposed to counteract the fat that your opponents will try to avoid the laser. Now, you have the issue of the wobbly aim, while after the update you will have the issue of moving opponents.

I mean this: I will be able to set my crosshair in a spot that was quite impossible to reach with wobbly aim. Maybe in this case I am the one who need to post an example :)

 

 

 

This feature pretty much already exists - the laser start out very faint and transparent when you enter sniping mode and it gradually gets brighter and more visible as you charge up. Making the laser invisible until the charge is full pretty much destroys its purpose. I can just shoot pretty much full damage shots with almost full charge, while the laser will still be invisible, or I can wait until I charge up the full shot and shoot the second it charges up. The enemy won't have time to react and escape the laser, yet you still get the 10% damage bonus. I don't think that's fair.

 

A red dot will only be visible on the front of the tank and the player never sees the front of their tank, making such a feature completely useless. You can't expect teammates to notice the dot and warn the player in chat before they get shot....

 

Ok I get your point of view, I guess I can agree on these :)

 

 

 

You said it yourself - shaft snipes players, racking up kills and they can't do anything about it other than "dealing with it". This update is meant to add some interaction between the shafts and their enemies, so that there's some dynamic gameplay between the two, rather than players helplessly driving into the line of fire and getting shot.

Here I don't agree much but it's just a point of view. Someone gets angry, someone else does not :)

[Maf 32,300]

 

I think an example is good, because I can't figure well. In my mind, if I think to aim to something close to me, I fear that my crosshair will be too far from the target. But maybe it's just my imagination (as Cranberries used to sing hahahaha).

Aiming at tree:

 

 

Aiming at floor:

 

Edited December 1, 2014 by Maf

[Athena369 265]

I love when all these noob shaft users keep crying about this update that balanced the OP shaft. Now its even easier to pwn them :). Feel free to down vote .

 

Regards,

athena

[St.HawK 741]

In Short...."Every Turret have special unique ability and 1 Disadvantage"

Edited December 1, 2014 by St.HawK

[kayitsiz 621]

 

Aiming at tree:

 

 

Aiming at floor:

 

 

But problem is, all of the playerssee your laser. Especially in DM's. How many time can you hide laser?

But, if we can hide laser, we got more power because no "shake." İf we can use this effectively, especially in team battles, maybe we can get our achievment again "The most annoying gun"  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

 

There are different advantages now but it will be very hard for DM. Probably i will buy ricochet because these weapons general targets are same.

Edited December 1, 2014 by kayitsiz

[GG_reg 1,521]

Looks more realistic :)

I love it!

[Mdanger 0]

I was so agree when I hear this news :angry:  

because my favorite tank is getting bad because of this Update :angry:

I want to say the developer, please don't update it!!!  :lol:

[Maf 32,300]

Looks more realistic :)

I love it!

What if I told you, you can't see a laser beam unless the air is full of smoke or other semi-transparent medium? If anything, it makes the game less realistic, but more interesting though.

[Maf 32,300]

But problem is, all of the playerssee your laser. Especially in DM's. How many time can you hide laser?

In DM the whole battlefield is a mess and players will be too occupied with other enemies to worry about your laser. As long as you don't sit there and constantly aim with the sniper, waiting for someone to drive right into it, the laser shouldn't bee to much of a disadvantage. Like Hazer-Rah said - aim and fire ONLY when the enemy is already in sight and after one of two shots change your location because players would have seen where you are.

[Mdanger 0]

rail gun player will be benefited with this update because 

this update enable them to easily damage shaft after

they see the direction of  the laser (light)!!! :angry:  -_-

 

 

Please Don't Update it  !!!

[kayitsiz 621]

In DM the whole battlefield is a mess and players will be too occupied with other enemies to worry about your laser. As long as you don't sit there and constantly aim with the sniper, waiting for someone to drive right into it, the laser shouldn't bee to much of a disadvantage. Like Hazer-Rah said - aim and fire ONLY when the enemy is already in sight and after one of two shots change your location because players would have seen where you are.

Sometimes, yes. They will think my laser. Especially in big maps.

 

Another way some teams in DM. How i can play against teams? Old times, i used ambushes and beat teams, but now?

 

More, they can learn what time i using my scope mode. İt wiil give great advantage to my opponent. 

 

İt is not only about hitting. All players will know where are you and shaft can not fight while moving except arcede shots. Some shaft haters and whole another snipers try to kill me quickly. İf i try to move too much, i can not get anythink. Sometimes i should camp for short time after move but not only one shot.

 

They will learn where am i going. They can try "ambush" Killing shaft with ambush is not hard so it will be "easy kill".

 

 

İ can find a lot of more.

[Maf 32,300]

I haven't actually tried playing with the new shaft on the test server yet, so we'll have to wait until the update comes out on the main servers. The developers can always change new features with new updates based on player feedback.

[r_mephala0 1]

The update makes the game even less realistic.

 

 

Do real-life battles mark snipers so that  anyone can detect and avoid them?The whole point of sniping is not being seen. Open areas are dangerous and anyone who has been in a real battle knows that. Happily, almost every map has ways of providing cover to players who can avoid shafts.

 

One-hit kills are possible for light hulls only. But light hulls have the advantage of speed. Currently. if you use a light hull, USE it. Don't go in straight lines, don't be predictable. It is easy to avoid veing shot. Furthermore, light hulls often move faster than the scope.

 

Heavy hulls take several shots to kill,  so they can fight back.

 

I was get shot by a shaft thousands of times. However, detecting them was never a problem -- you can sacrifice a few lives to look around and detect the shaft's spot.

 

Furthermore, a laser beam can only be seen in dirty (moist or dusty) air. If you make it visible, add fog or dust clouds to the maps.

Edited December 1, 2014 by r_mephala0

[Athena369 265]

The update makes the game even less realistic.

 

 

Do real-life battles mark snipers so that  anyone can detect and avoid them?The whole point of sniping is not being seen. Open areas are dangerous and anyone who has been in a real battle knows that. Happily, almost every map has ways of providing cover to players who can avoid shafts.

 

One-hit kills are possible for light hulls only. But light hulls have the advantage of speed. Currently. if you use a light hull, USE it. Don't go in straight lines, don't be predictable. It is easy to avoid veing shot. Furthermore, light hulls often move faster than the scope.

 

Heavy hulls take several shots to kill,  so they can fight back.

 

I was get shot by a shaft thousands of times. However, detecting them was never a problem -- you can sacrifice a few lives to look around and detect the shaft's spot.

 

Furthermore, a laser beam can only be seen in dirty (moist or dusty) air. If you make it visible, add fog or dust clouds to the maps.

Meh..... Do you think this game was ever intended to be a realistic one? With all those Freeze's and Isida's mounted on tanks? I don't see why adding a simple laser beam would make it so "unrealistic".

 

Ok but you know.... there are maps with 2 or 3 entrances to the enemy base. Most of these "noob" (forgive me if I offended anyone) shaft users target these entry points which give them easy kills at no cost. Have you ever thought about the life of wasp fire user in this kind of a situation? How much unfair is it for such a player to get owned regularly even without making it to the enemy base? not even knowing where he got hit from. ( I'm not talking about Wasp Fire alone here) and what's your solution for this? Get Mammoth fire just to stop yourself from being pawned like that?

 

This update gives a second chance to those light hulled tankers and also nullifies some stuff of the already over powered shaft. To me shaft is nothing but a turret requiring no skills other than the ability to react quickly. I'm still searching for an answer why this turret is ever exists in this game at the first place.

 

As  mentioned above stop crying already when your  favorite noob toy got nerfed ( I do still believe that it is still OP). I wonder how you guys might have reacted when shaft was nerfed at the "rebalance". For fact the pre re balance M0 shaft could deal 300+ damages as I remember....

[Loackie 269]

I love the new red dot- Laser b) It prevents shaft from being too OP unless camper noob or actually skilled shaft. It allows anyone to know the general idea of where a shaft is. I will keep supporting this until I see Shafts starting to get D/Ls under 9001 mkay

[r_mephala0 1]

Meh..... Do you think this game was ever intended to be a realistic one? With all those Freeze's and Isida's mounted on tanks? I don't see why adding a simple laser beam would make it so "unrealistic".

 

Ok but you know.... there are maps with 2 or 3 entrances to the enemy base. Most of these "noob" (forgive me if I offended anyone) shaft users target these entry points which give them easy kills at no cost. Have you ever thought about the life of wasp fire user in this kind of a situation? How much unfair is it for such a player to get owned regularly even without making it to the enemy base? not even knowing where he got hit from. ( I'm not talking about Wasp Fire alone here) and what's your solution for this? Get Mammoth fire just to stop yourself from being pawned like that?

 

This update gives a second chance to those light hulled tankers and also nullifies some stuff of the already over powered shaft. To me shaft is nothing but a turret requiring no skills other than the ability to react quickly. I'm still searching for an answer why this turret is ever exists in this game at the first place.

 

As  mentioned above stop crying already when your  favorite noob toy got nerfed ( I do still believe that it is still OP). I wonder how you guys might have reacted when shaft was nerfed at the "rebalance". For fact the pre re balance M0 shaft could deal 300+ damages as I remember....

The answer to that "problem"  is teamwork. Those points can usually be shot at from some other place. So, first someone eliminates the shaft from a distance, then the light hulls come in. Another option is coming to the enemy base not alone - the first one get kiled, but the others kill the shaft user. The same camping can be done with a railgun, btw, and wasps  can be killed in one shot. Do you propose to nerf railgun as well? A third option is to accelerate and come in at top speed by surprise, a small light hull can get past thew scope quckly and kill the shaft easily while the turret rotates. A fourth way is to appear and to turn immediately. A human can't react instantly, so the aim is usually along the taarget's predicted path, so that the shafter can see the incoming target, estimate its velocity and fire, knowing of the delay between the brain's command and the keypress. So, any sudden change in velocity - both absolute value and direction - can make the shafter fire at the empty space. A fifth way is to use Rico to deal damage and disrupt the aim - while one person fires at the camper disrupting the aim, others go in and destroy him.

 

Basically, any gun here is a "point and shoot" one, do you consider every turret a noob weapon? Perhaps a person who can't develop a way of countering the turret should be called a noob instead? I get killed by Freeze lotss of times, but I don't cry "Freeze is OP,  nerf it".

[Thekillerpenguin 1,731]

 

• Do not enter sniper mode unless you see your enemy. This will help you remain hidden and your enemy will not be aware of your presence until it is too late The issue I've been having on the test server is that everybody immediately gets out of your line of sight once they see your laser sight. Since it's visible as you're still charging, most players will get out of the way before your shot's been charged enough to deal significant damage.
• Do not aim directly at your enemy while your energy is not maxed. This way your enemy will probably see your laser, but he will not consider you as a threat while he thinks you aiming somewhere else It's really hard to keep your enemies on-screen while you're in scope mode; move it far away enough to avoid suspicion, and often you won't have enough time to aim once it's fully charged.
• Hide your laser pointer by aiming at vision blockers that closer to your. Back to the Rio map, you can use trees as vision blockers so you can see far, but your laser is hidden. Also, you can aim to the ground so enemy won't see your laser.  Sounds like a good idea, but I find it really easy to see Shaft's laser sight even when it's not pointing directly at me. I don't know if other people can see it as clearly as I can, but still something to note.
• Scare your enemy. Laser pointer is not just a debuff, but an interesting psychological weapon if used properly. I love not to shoot at once but keep aiming at my target up to the last moment. It annoys him and makes it a lot of fun for me. This probably would be fun, but the psychological effect of having a sniper hidden somewhere you can't see on the map is far more intimidating in my opinion.
• Quickscope like a boss. Scoring has been changed recently so you can get your points by assists. And you can shine with this technique. Aiming no longer than 1-2 seconds and not killing your enemies got more advantages than you think. Damaged enemy attacker is better target for your team, then respawned attacker at enemy base. While you are not at full energy your pointer is much harder to spot. Hmm, I didn't notice that the laser sight was dimmer when not fully charged. Thanks for letting me know.

I'm not a fan of the laser pointer, but I think I could learn to adapt and deal with it. Thanks for the tips.

[kayitsiz 621]

Meh..... Do you think this game was ever intended to be a realistic one? With all those Freeze's and Isida's mounted on tanks? I don't see why adding a simple laser beam would make it so "unrealistic".

 

Ok but you know.... there are maps with 2 or 3 entrances to the enemy base. Most of these "noob" (forgive me if I offended anyone) shaft users target these entry points which give them easy kills at no cost. Have you ever thought about the life of wasp fire user in this kind of a situation? How much unfair is it for such a player to get owned regularly even without making it to the enemy base? not even knowing where he got hit from. ( I'm not talking about Wasp Fire alone here) and what's your solution for this? Get Mammoth fire just to stop yourself from being pawned like that?

 

This update gives a second chance to those light hulled tankers and also nullifies some stuff of the already over powered shaft. To me shaft is nothing but a turret requiring no skills other than the ability to react quickly. I'm still searching for an answer why this turret is ever exists in this game at the first place.

 

As mentioned above stop crying already when your favorite noob toy got nerfed ( I do still believe that it is still OP). I wonder how you guys might have reacted when shaft was nerfed at the "rebalance". For fact the pre re balance M0 shaft could deal 300+ damages as I remember....

Actually problem, "control the doors" is not fruitfull. And you can not kill all of the targets. A lot of opponent shaft and railgun can kill these players. Good point, but not true generally. Eapecially if shaft don't use a heavy hull.

 

Player can change another equipments, if it don't want to hit. All of the games or equipments, we can say this.

 

By the way all of the players should see shaft's weaknesses. Especially in DM and sometimes CP, with someother special situations CTF can be very hard.

 

Alot of people's opinion, shaft is only shot to opponents easily and no one can do for this. But in matches, there are a lot of "shaft hunter" in this game.

Edited December 2, 2014 by kayitsiz

[kayitsiz 621]

The answer to that "problem"  is teamwork. Those points can usually be shot at from some other place. So, first someone eliminates the shaft from a distance, then the light hulls come in. Another option is coming to the enemy base not alone - the first one get kiled, but the others kill the shaft user. The same camping can be done with a railgun, btw, and wasps  can be killed in one shot. Do you propose to nerf railgun as well? A third option is to accelerate and come in at top speed by surprise, a small light hull can get past thew scope quckly and kill the shaft easily while the turret rotates. A fourth way is to appear and to turn immediately. A human can't react instantly, so the aim is usually along the taarget's predicted path, so that the shafter can see the incoming target, estimate its velocity and fire, knowing of the delay between the brain's command and the keypress. So, any sudden change in velocity - both absolute value and direction - can make the shafter fire at the empty space. A fifth way is to use Rico to deal damage and disrupt the aim - while one person fires at the camper disrupting the aim, others go in and destroy him.

 

Basically, any gun here is a "point and shoot" one, do you consider every turret a noob weapon? Perhaps a person who can't develop a way of countering the turret should be called a noob instead? I get killed by Freeze lotss of times, but I don't cry "Freeze is OP,  nerf it".

Basically this is a very good explain. İf you just go front of the enemy base, it ia not shatf's fault.

[spino.ska 19]

İf you just go front of the enemy base, it ia not shatf's fault.

It is called suicide...even if there is no shaft in opponent team :D

[spino.ska 19]

I had another idea!!!

 

Assumptions:

1. A single DOT is too difficult to see: no benefit for player who has been targeted

2. A whole beam (starting from shaft barrel and ending to target) gives a benefit to the target and, at the same time, is a penalty for the shaft user.

 

Well, the idea is:

The beam could be just 10 meters (30 feet) long, starting from target tank (or wall/building). In this way, the player is aware that he has been targeted; other players will see the segment of the beam and will know an approximate direction to discover the shaft, but not the exact location of the tank itself.

 

I think this could be a WIN-WIN solution.

What do you think?

Edited December 2, 2014 by spino.ska

[WarMonkey51Austin 68]

If some shaft hacker joined and shot you from random places you don't know, then you won't be able to vote him cuz he'll just say you couldn't spot him. the new laser thing helps this case a lot

[Maf 32,300]

the idea is:

The beam could be just 10 meters (30 feet) long, starting from target tank (or wall/building). In this way, the player is aware that he has been targeted; other players will see the segment of the beam and will know an approximate direction to discover the shaft, but not the exact location of the tank itself.

 

I think this could be a WIN-WIN solution.

What do you think?

I know I was the one, who said that this game isn't a realistic simulator and shouldn't be over-analysed, but a beam that's invisible and becomes visible in the last ten meters just makes no sense to me... 

[Maf 32,300]

The answer to that "problem"  is teamwork. Those points can usually be shot at from some other place. So, first someone eliminates the shaft from a distance, then the light hulls come in. Another option is coming to the enemy base not alone - the first one get kiled, but the others kill the shaft user. The same camping can be done with a railgun, btw, and wasps  can be killed in one shot. Do you propose to nerf railgun as well? A third option is to accelerate and come in at top speed by surprise, a small light hull can get past thew scope quckly and kill the shaft easily while the turret rotates. A fourth way is to appear and to turn immediately. A human can't react instantly, so the aim is usually along the taarget's predicted path, so that the shafter can see the incoming target, estimate its velocity and fire, knowing of the delay between the brain's command and the keypress. So, any sudden change in velocity - both absolute value and direction - can make the shafter fire at the empty space. A fifth way is to use Rico to deal damage and disrupt the aim - while one person fires at the camper disrupting the aim, others go in and destroy him.

 

Basically, any gun here is a "point and shoot" one, do you consider every turret a noob weapon? Perhaps a person who can't develop a way of countering the turret should be called a noob instead? I get killed by Freeze lotss of times, but I don't cry "Freeze is OP,  nerf it".

The problem is that most of the games on Tanki Online are random battles with random players joining and playing together. I have played in an organised team many times before. In a few of these battles there were shafts on our side and/or on the enemy's side. Even then, thinking up an effective strategy to kill the shaft and carrying it our is simply not worth it because you could just avoid the shaft and use your team to do something more effective, like... capture the flag maybe? There's no point spending a lot of valuable time to kill the shaft,because he will just respawn and occupy the sniping location again. Unless your strategy is fast and simple, it's best to just avoid the shaft.

That 's if you're playing in an organised team. In a random battle there is barely any teamwork and getting your team to do something organised is nearly impossible. It's much easier to just avoid the shaft and hope that he doesn't see you, which is why shaft needs to be changed to add that interaction between the shaft and the player.

[spino.ska 19]

I know I was the one, who said that this game isn't a realistic simulator and shouldn't be over-analysed, but a beam that's invisible and becomes visible in the last ten meters just makes no sense to me... 

 

Well, if we have to follow this path, does shaft "shaking aim" make sense?

In the game there are nanotech, railguns, freeze, protective paints and so on...but "engineers" were not able to design a stable crosshair!!! :)

 

Shaking has been added to counter balance shaft power, and it's ok, even if it is quite out of place.