completed Hover Tank

[i200000 717]

Well, I really don't think that we are the people supposed to decide how it will be balanced - if the devs had a look on it maybe they had their own model.

[Phoenix.Raised 5,992]

And how mines can damage this hull? Having in mind that it floats in the air and not touching the surface

[Viking4s 10,791]

And how mines can damage this hull? Having in mind that it floats in the air and not touching the surface

hehe, good technical remark/question.

To work with the current TO system, the hovercraft hull Triton I propose is a air-cushion vehicle type. Triton does not really floats on the air, it glides over the ground. On the game it would be shown exactly the same way has a standard hull with tracks, however  the tracks being replaced by a the flexible skirt. See this video (Hovercraft race video) you see that the hovercraft stays in close contact with the ground.

 

Also I think that even if the hovercraft float a bit it should trigger the mine as any other tank when they ride over, otherwise this hull would have too many advantages. Remember also that only enemy tank are destroyed by your mine and your team mate are not destroyed even if they drive on it, how come? The same way enemy tank with Triton hull will trigger the mines and your teammate with the same hull will be safe. Therefore no need to change the current game play rules here regarding the mine.

 

Technically in the real life the air-cushion vehicle is made of metal, we can imagine that the mine can be trigger by a metal detection sensor. Also the AVC uses powerful blowers to produce a large volume of air flow below the hull that is above atmospheric pressure. The pressure difference between the higher pressure air below the hull and the lower pressure of the ambient air produces lift, which causes the hull to float above ground surface, this higher pressure will trigger a pressure sensitive mine.

 

However ... when you start to look at map with water prop (river, lake, canal) a lot more question emerge. Keep in mind that water can be at different level (25 cm high, 4.75 meter high or 5.25 high). Currently mines stay on the solid ground 25cm underwater while the hovercraft is on the water out of reach of the mine (same as when tanks jump over mine are not triggering the mine), standard hull would still drive on the ground and would trigger the mine. Also if a hover craft can deploy mine, where does it lands? On the water surface or on the ground underwater below?

Can we imagine floating mine?...

 

What would be the best technical answer and games rules modification that will keep the game-play fair/balanced. I have some ideas but they need to be reviewed and improved at this stage.

 

Here is below some drafted ideas:

# A/ Low flood level 25cm high (small canal (e.g. Tribute) & lightly flooded map (e.g. Sandbox)), either:

   1-  the mine deployed by any tank go down and stay on the ground. only standard hull will trigger it. Not fair  for standard hull but hey, more fun.

   2-  the mine deployed goes up and float on the surface. Any hull will trigger the mine in either gliding over it or driving thought (same mechanic as the drop box). Fairest option. it should also be easier to spot.

   3-  normal tank deploy mine on the ground, hovercraft deploy floating mine on water (and normal mine when on solid ground). Still not fair & 2 different mechanics at works.

   4- Hover craft can only deploy floating mine on water (not allow on the ground). Standard tank deploy them only on dry ground. like this to each is own domain of supremacy. Still less fair for standard tank (more mine deploy-able against them).

 

# B/ Water lake and river (water level on 4.75 meter high).

  1-  the mine deployed by any tank go down and stay on the ground. Only standard hull will trigger it. Not fair for standard hull.

  2-  the mine deployed goes up and float on the surface. Only hovercraft hull will trigger the mine  Fairest option. it should also be easier to spot.

  3 - same as A3

  4 - same as A4

  5 - dual mine:  once deploy is separate into 2 mines still linked to each other one goes on the ground underwater and the second goes vertically to the surface. The mine can be trigger once by enemy tanks either when touch under water or on the water surface. Seems complicated mechanism.

 6 - the mine float mid stream ( lest say 2.5 meters) attached to the ground by an anchor (like a submarine mine). any enemy tanks that goes above or under the mine will trigger the mine and loose life point.

 

# C/ more than > 5 meter high water (lower level filled with water (up to 5 m and the level above flooded with 25cm) some area with point A and some are with point B. I don't know the height of each prop level. I assume it's 5 meters.

=> to complicated, don't do map like that.

 

Next chapter on Flag, if flag lost over water prop or underwater.

[Viking4s 10,791]

doesnt go along with the game and would be way to overpowered if it was added. New tanks cannot be added unless you want to make them underpowered, overpowered, or the exact same thing as another tnka that already exists. 

There is other physics at work, than speed and shield. Other physics can be still tweak to make it new and original.

And yes, making a new hull underpowered, overpowered, or the exact same thing, is not a good idea.

However make this new hull go to place where other can't go (over water) or include more drifting in the driving system will make it different from what's currently existing.

Specific hull being able to go to places on map were other tank can't go is not new. Wasp can go into small passage way (e.g. Future) small spcaces and edges (e.g. Brest top floor beking the wall, side of mountains props)... this would be the same for this hull over water (my hull proposal Triton would be a medium size tank as wide as Viking hull).

[Viking4s 10,791]

Planned

 

Hovercraft-like hull. The idea has been going around the office for a while. Will most likely be added at some point in the future. Only problem at the moment is that it doesn't fit in with the other hulls, so if this is added, then all other hulls will also need to be unique in very specific ways.

[hll]

Great, 2 potential uniqueness for this hull:

* go over water prop

* skidding and lots of drifting

See video Hovercraft race

The video shows small hovercraft drifting and hover over water at high speed (fast like Wasp hull) but the best hull proposal, considering of what existing already in the game, should be slower (as fast as Hunter hull) and with a Viking hull size ans stability.

[Phoenix.Raised 5,992]

hehe, good technical remark/question

Just two more questions.

 

Ok, it glides over the surface. But still, it is not touching the surface like the other hulls.

 

"The pressure difference between the higher pressure air below the hull and lower pressure ambient air above it produces lift, which causes the hull to float above the running surface"

 

Accordind to this^, this hull can not necessarily fall into the abyss on Polygon. Abyss under the small bridge. No matter how high pressure under the hull is, you can't simply stand over that abyss on Polygon. But you can possibly glide over it, like you are jumping over it. It is a short distance.

 

That makes me wonder, how it will affect the gameplay? When someone can simply glide over the abyss, while others self destruct.

 

And can you flip with this hull?

[Viking4s 10,791]

Just two more questions.

 

Ok, it glides over the surface. But still, it is not touching the surface like the other hulls.

 

> "The pressure difference between the higher pressure air below the hull and lower pressure ambient air above it produces lift, which causes the hull to float above the running surface"

 

Accordind to this^, this hull can not necessarily fall into the abyss on Polygon. Abyss under the small bridge. No matter how high pressure under the hull is, you can't simply stand over that abyss on Polygon. But you glide over it. Like you are jumping over it.

 

That makes me wonder, how it will affect the gameplay? When someone can simply glide over the abyss, while others self destruct.

 

> And can you flip with this hull?

> To my knowledge the pressure is very local and applies only between the cushion and the ground/water for this kind of AVC (as per the video). If there is no ground/water under the hull you loose very rapidly the hover effect thus you would fall into any void beneath. I don't think that the hull (even in reality) would be even able to peer over edges, as soon as the flow escape through big hole you loose the air cushion and got stuck (you have no wheels). That's my understanding about AVC. They cannot fly, not enough power to do so, they just glide onto the abyss and self-destruct.

 

When the sales forces says they go every where i don't think so, they can be easily stuck on long grass meadow or terrain with medium rocks. The best terrain is flat continuous surfaces (water land, wet sand beaches golf courses). I know people would want to fly but this would not the best solution for the Game.

 

> Yes, can be flip, see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPkip8OSEJo

Too close to edges with slow speed and then you flip forward, with the right speed and shoot it jumps straight. If hull equipped with turret with no recoil you will have to use the technique given by the V-log # (can't remember the number). During the gold hunt melee other hull can flip you too (would behave like the physics that applies to hunter/viking hulls).

 

For the proposal Triton, apart from the ability to go on water and the excessive drifting behavior, it would follow the same physics like other hull with tracks.

Any proposal more powerful and able to fly high over land (see picture on first post of this topic) or higher would not be a reasonable proposal.

If not going over water an no more drifting ability then it's no point to create an hovercraft hull, its just cosmetic change.

[Phoenix.Raised 5,992]

They cannot fly, not enough power to do so, they just glide onto the abyss and self-destruct.

Of course you can not fly with it, but some very short distances can be jumped over. In theory it is possible with tanks that are like toys :)

[D.a.r.kShadow 551]

isnt too long.

:ph34r:  :ph34r:  :lol:

[Viking4s 10,791]

Of course you can not fly with it, but some very short distances can be jumped over. In theory it is possible with tanks that are like toys :)

:D toy, the bigger the better.

Polygon gap is 10m wide, and ditches on Kungur are 5 meter wide. You can already go over ditches on Kungur, with speed supply, M3 wasp and a shoot at the right time tank will jump over the ditches in the middle of the map (v-log# with pro advice on Kungur). So yes in pratic you already have tanks jumping over small gaps (5 meters wide).

If you double the gap distance like on Polygon, I don't think a tank can do it alone.

To jump over gap with a vehicle you need a small ramp. The speed give you forward momentum in the direction you are aiming but the gravity pull you down, therefore you always go lower than you staring point. Without a ramp your vehicle can always jump over gap from a higher point to a lower point.

If it makes the game more interesting, so yes maybe the hover craft should be able to jump/slide over 5 meters wide gap (maybe with the M3 upgraded hull and nitro supply activated w/wo shoot).

[SUP3R_ST4R 1,205]

It must have a weakness! 

How about soo unstable? Like not getting flipped but getting distracted 

[Jack_Fehran 34]

I already have a sound of its' motor in my mind  :D

I would like it!

[Viking4s 10,791]

It must have a weakness! 

How about soo unstable? Like not getting flipped but getting distracted 

Yes. Hovercraft like ACV does have weakness due to its lack of friction with the ground:

1. - Drifting at high speed: need to be a good pilote
2. - While firing the AVC will be more affected than standard hull by the recoil, unless an automatic electronic compensating system is fitted (start @ M1 level and then further improved at each M upgrade). You will have to replace the hull after each shoot.
3. - When shoot at, the Triton will be more affected by the impact, this effect can reduced by installation of an automatic electronic compensating system (start @ M1 level and then further improved at each M upgrade). Will be difficult to aim will shoot at by a smoky for example, more difficult than a viking/hunter hull which have tracks in contact with the ground.
4. - takes times to breaks and reverse. You would need more power to slow down the kinetic energy gain from the speed.
5. - this hull would be easier to push and corner (compared to same power level). Could be and the other end easier to get on top of other tank ;) if contested.

Then these weaknesses can be tweak (increased / reduced) depending of the M level.

Strength/weakness is a matter of point of view and bench marking: what is the weakness of Hornet or Dictator?

[SUP3R_ST4R 1,205]

Yes. Hovercraft like ACV does have weakness due to it's lack of friction with the ground:

- Drifting at high speed: need to be a good pilote

- While firing the AVC will be more affected than standard hull by the recoil, unless an automatic electronic compensating system is fitted (start @ M1 level and then further improved at each M upgrade). You will have to replace the hull after each shoot.

- When shoot at, the Triton will be more affected by the impact, this effect can reduced by installation of an automatic electronic compensating system (start @ M1 level and then further improved at each M upgrade). Will be difficult to aim will shoot at by a smoky for example, more difficult than a viking/hunter hull which have tracks in contact with the ground.

- takes times to stop and reverse.

 

Then these weakness can be tweak (increased / reduced) depending of the M level.

Strength/weakness is a matter of point of view and bench marking: what is the weakness of Hornet or Dictator?

Well the power is way high hh 

hornet? Drifts way high , big target in horizontal way easy can be deflected by shooting at corner , cant be turned quickly 

[Viking4s 10,791]

Well the power is way high hh 

hornet? Drifts way high , big target in horizontal way easy can be deflected by shooting at corner , cant be turned quickly 

yes but it has more armor than wasp, more likely to survive one shot kill. more stable than wasp too.

Faster than hunter.

It's all a matter of tuning the different settings to make the game balanced between each hulls (which is an illusion).

[TANKMASTERKEVIN 40]

I don't think this was mentioned.. but what about gold boxes? Wouldn't you be able to just float above the other tanks and catch it easily?

[Viking4s 10,791]

I don't think this was mentioned.. but what about gold boxes? Wouldn't you be able to just float above the other tanks and catch it easily?

To my knowledge, all hulls physics are set by the following parameters (Wiki Hulls):

Protection (hp) — tank's health. Damage dealt by a turret is subtracted from a tank's protection. Once the protection gets to zero, the tank explodes.

Weight — affects tank's stability, i.e. impact force of hits, recoil of its own turret, and partly, ability to move other tanks (this parameter does not affect tank's speed).

Top speed (m/sec) — maximum speed the tank can get to on a straight.

Acceleration (m/sec²) — affects the time it takes a tank to get to its maximum speed and ability to push other tanks.

Reverse acceleration (m/sec²) — anti-inertial acceleration that comes into force when a tank is moving in one direction and a player presses the button of moving to other direction. It works until speed gets to zero. After that, usual acceleration starts working.

Lateral acceleration (m/sec²) — responsible for damping of lateral speed. The less this parameter is, the easier tank can drift. The higher it is, the more difficult it is for a tank to move sideways.

Turning speed (deg/sec) — the maximum speed at which the tank can turn.

Turning acceleration (deg/sec²) — affects the time it takes a tank to get to its maximum turning speed.

Anti-inertial turning acceleration (deg/sec²) — works like reverse acceleration but for left-right turns instead of moving forward/backwards.

 

The setting of these above parameters will define ACV/Triton: hull behavior in the game (driving, jumping, wrestling...) and Gold box hunt. I do not know what would be the settings, therefore my guess is good as yours. It the set up is close to wasp, then the hull Triton will behave like wasp. If set up closer to Dictator then it would behave like Dictator.

In real life the ACV would be stuck, it would loose it hovering power if remote from the ground, in the game this behavior would not make driving this enjoyable. However its behavior in the game towards the Gold Box melee should be (to me) between hornet and hunter hulls.

The main assets/interest of the hull would be to be able to hover on water. for the rest it would behave like other tanks but with some differences (drifting, and other weakness).

 

Other hovering vehicle such as star wars hovering craft might behave differently (not sure that the current game setting could fit these behavior without major re-coding).

[Silver-Lining 2]

Hover tank very good idea!!

[DESTROYER_13 1,019]

dont made it better than viking!!!!!

already u have make very bad update in game dont make tanki more boring its my fav game

Most people would say that adding a new hull would make it less boring, I am sure.

[Phoenix.Raised 5,992]

^ light hull? :D

 

It can be called "Mermaid"

[Viking4s 10,791]

Yes, it is a light hull, but it could be very heavy too:

 

or medium:

[Phoenix.Raised 5,992]

^ Poseidon and Amphitrite :D

[Viking4s 10,791]

^ Leviathan and Hydra

[Yisroel.Rabin 16,224]

Not a bad idea, I made my own hull back in 2015, never got around to posting about it though. I prob will do eventually though.

[Capable 4,614]

Nice Nice. Good idea