Reduce power of garage supplies

[The.Destroyer.FX 6]

I've just played a one-hour-game in noise map. Everything was great and my team was winning by 7-2. Suddenly, 2 guys who where first lieutenants joined -after half an hour- the enemy team with m2 vikings and they were drugging insanely. The enemy had one drugger before they joined, he wasn't that threat thanks to great teamowrk, but after those 2 joined everything has changed. Most of the enemy became druggers of all types of drugs (that surprised me actually). 2 of my mates were drugging double damage to stop the enemy but it won't work at all. As a result, we lost maybe 15-7 !!!! That was really bad considering that I was in the blue team and my team had good teamwork. That really disappointed me and I didn't leave the game because I had a high score and thought I would take anything instead of leaving and lose the score for nothing. The funny thing that one of the 2 guys left the game 5 seconds prior to its ending!

 

I think this is a good example of the concept: DRUGS RUIN THE GAME

 

And if someone was wondering why didn't I drug: I really hate using them, the only time I use them is when "gold box will be dropped soon" notification appears to maximize my opportunity.

 

Perhaps I'm not a pro but I got some skills, and definitely that wasn't the reason of the loss I talked about.

 

One last thing: please do something about the old kits that some guys have, it's really very unfair to get into a game that has a range of ranks from warrant officer 4 till major and be surprised that some of the second and third lieutenants of the enemy have viking m2 (the game should allow them to use m1 viking instead). Yeah I face them in other games, but my teammates who have m1 weapons would face trouble against them, even I still use m1s as I don't have m2s except for isida (the game is too expensive so I'm saving up as I don't buy crystals)

 

Sorry forgot to say that I totally agree with Brubook, more time in smart cooldown (suggested by someone above) is a good alternate though.

[Maf 32,317]

Definitely agree on this one.

 

When the enemy isn't drugged, the matches never get dull, because if you

can't confront them directly, you can always develop a convenient strategy

to flank them, and when that evantually fails, you develop another one.

That's you. You are in the minority of players, who actually use strategy and tactics to attack an enemy base. Most players are far less advanced and all they want to do is respawn, go to enemy base, kill everybody, get flag, capture, die, repeat. At the moment they have supplies to make this activity of theirs a lot easier, allowing them to overpower the other team and feel strong. Without supplies, their gameplay will become a lot more dull as all they will do is respawn, meet an enemy and either die or kill them and die from the next encounter. Flags will barely ever get captured. I guarantee it.

[ArgentHellion 41]

Unfortunately the problem doesn't seem to stop when players run out of their daily supplies.

Unlike those of us that can't afford to throw tons of money on the game just so we could

satisfy our primeval dominatory instincts, many players out there rely on their mummies and

daddies wallets to have fun at other people's expence. That demographic right there, that's

where most of Tanki's druggers are comming from.

 

Those whales are the thing that keeps the game affloat commercialwise, let's be honest,

and it's the main reason why these powerups aren't going to be removed from the game.

But that's NOT what we are asking, what we want is to have the option to create battles

with disabled powerup drops and usage on a regular basis, so we can play the game the

way it's meant to be played, with pure wits and strategy and without overpowered Rambo

wannabes ruining the experience for everybody. This option should be available to all of

us, not just those on the higher ranks and in pro leagues. Unless Tanki Online turns into

a freemium game, which will most likely cripple the community...

[Brubook 1,161]

Brubook, you touch on a critical point here that I was thinking about this morning.

 

As Tanki Online is maturing up, players get to know its flaws and loopholes more and more, and more and more players take advantage of that and derail the purpose of everything. That makes it miserable for the mass. The dev team needs to look seriously at this and react promptly if we do not have any hope they would act proactively to it.

 

I realize that TO wants to sell drugs and PRO passes, but they do not have to be mean and miserable about it. There is no way everyone will be buying those, especially paying real money for it. They need to rebalance things to entice more people to buy and more people to play the game and like it, not ride the wave until there is no wave and there is no players to keep the game afloat.

You described the perfect human factor of this problem! Thanks for writing!

[Brubook 1,161]

As a relative newcomer to Tanki Online, I have to agree with most of the posts regarding this topic,

and yes I have actually taken the time to read most of them rather than just skipping to the end.

Since I live in Bosnia and cannot afford money to spend online, because my full-time job barely

covers my basic needs, I am a non-buyer player, and I can say that this game is brutally unbalanced

when it comes to using power-ups, or drugging, as you call it.

 

At first the game seemed to be good, but at this current rank of mine, I'm hitting a difficulty spike,

and not because I lack the skills but because I just don't have the stats. I'm constantly engaging

opponents who are constantly drugged and there is nothing I can do about it, and my daily supplies

aren't worth the payback so I barely use them. The only thing left for me to do is camp around the

powerup spawns and rack up as much as I can before trying to engage the enemy.

 

I don't know what the high-ranked games look like, but I honestly hope I will some day, in the meantime

I can only hope that  advanced game options exist that PREVENT the usage and spawning of powerups

during the battle. If there isn't such an option, there clearly has to be, because battles should be won

through skill and teamwork, not brute monetary force.

 

I played quite a lot of online games, I'm over 25, but I have to admit that I have NEVER come across

such overpowered Pay-To-Win content as Tanki Online offers. Something seriously needs to be done

about it, otherwise the non-buyer players will leave the game out of frustration. I came here to play

a game, find a team and have fun, not to be abused by somebody who has the money to buy an

overpowered Shaft and one-shot me every time I try to leave my spawn.

Fully agree with your post. On higher ranks the situation do not change! And when the game becomes a "I am richer and I win" the "critical mass" (the number of non payers players that fill the game and the battles) will get frustrated and leave!

Dober dan

[dilsharox 2,395]

tanki should give new players info about pro battles & make them more popular at low ranks by reducing the price of the pass 

[Brubook 1,161]

 

I am not saying everything is good with supplies. From the gameplay point of view I see why they should be in the game. But economy behind them was never truly revised. Supplies should've either be not that expensive or there should be ways to get more of them (by daily missions or something). But as I said before — current version most likely won't be changed.

I have to underline again that the payers directly support the economics of the game, but the CRITICAL MASS satisfaction support the entire mechanism.

No critical mass = no satisfaction = less players = LESS PAYERS

[Opex-Rah 5,388]

I have to underline again that the payers directly support the economics of the game, but the CRITICAL MASS satisfaction support the entire mechanism.

No critical mass = no satisfaction = less players = LESS PAYERS

There is no such issue with less players at the moment. It seems to be "critical mass" chooses to use supplies, ruther then not.

[Brubook 1,161]

I don't think you believe that PRO battles with no supplies are always the same. What brings the different scenarios is the random spawning and the human factor. Even when you have the same two soccer/football teams meet in the same tournament without either taking drugs, it is not the same scenario, and one team may win one match and lose the other unless there is total unbalance as in M0 versus M3+.

 

Anyway, I think you got the idea that the complaint is that drugs don't give an edge to the user, they give a huge edge that makes everything else useless.

Agree!

 

And I want to underline again that PRO battles does NOT necessarily mean NO DRUGS!

 

Right now there are few pro battles, mostly for generalissimo rank and mostly with drugs allowance!

PRO battles are not an alternative for non or little drug users!

 

Not talking about the cost of pass for lower ranks or the "criteria" of them (like 999 flags or several hours time)

[Brubook 1,161]

Trust me - they are. Only the most dedicated and enthusiastic players will play PRO battles all the time. While in normal drug wars you get flags being captured at about 1-10 every 5 minutes, a 1 hour long PRO battle with no supplies and drop boxes often ends up with a 0-0 score. If players wouldn't be able to capture a single flag after countless attacks on the enemy base, they would quickly lose interest towards the game. That's the main reason why no-supply battles are called PRO battles, because it takes great skill and strategy to outplay the other team when you don't have supplies at hand. Less experienced players in normal battles do need something to unbalance the game, otherwise matches will in fact get repetitive and boring.

Actually, as you perfectly know, PRO BATTLE does NOT mean NO DRUGS BATTLE !!!

 

Also, a easy game can be fun for a 6 years old child ... but will be boring in a short time for anyone aged older than that!!

Anyone quicly loose interest in a easy game!!!

 

Instead a 20-0 score game is boring, probably for both teams! Think about football .... you play the whole game to get that 1 or maybe 2 goals. Is football boring?

 

Difficulties make the player think how he can get to flag, think on tactics and strategy, use at best his weapon .... this should be the idea of a game!!

 

Go to flag, destroy all enemies, press 1 (healing) and run away with flag can be fun for some minutes for the author, but he get bored shortly! Meanwhile the whole opponent team will get frustrated!!

[Brubook 1,161]

I've just played a one-hour-game in noise map. Everything was great and my team was winning by 7-2. Suddenly, 2 guys who where first lieutenants joined -after half an hour- the enemy team with m2 vikings (WTF?!!) and they were drugging insanely. The enemy had one drugger before they joined, he wasn't that threat thanks to great teamowrk, but after those 2 joined everything has changed. Most of the enemy became druggers of all types of drugs (that surprised me actually). 2 of my mates were drugging double damage to stop the enemy but it won't work at all. As a result, we lost maybe 15-7 !!!! That was really bad considering that I was in the blue team and my team had good teamwork. That really disappointed me and I didn't leave the game because I had a high score and thought I would take anything instead of leaving and lose the score for nothing. The funny thing that one of the 2 guys left the game 5 seconds prior to its ending!

 

I think this is a good example of the concept: DRUGS RUIN THE GAME

 

And if someone was wondering why didn't I drug: I really hate using them, the only time I use them is when "gold box will be dropped soon" notification appears to maximize my opportunity.

 

Perhaps I'm not a pro but I got some skills, and definitely that wasn't the reason of the loss I talked about.

 

One last thing: please do something about the old kits that some guys have, it's really very unfair to get into a game that has a range of ranks from warrant officer 4 till major and be surprised that some of the second and third lieutenants of the enemy have viking m2 (the game should allow them to use m1 viking instead). Yeah I face them in other games, but my teammates who have m1 weapons would face trouble against them, even I still use m1s as I don't have m2s except for isida (the game is too expensive so I'm saving up as I don't buy crystals)

 

Sorry forgot to say that I totally agree with Brubook, more time in smart cooldown (suggested by someone above) is a good alternate though.

Please DEVs .... READ THIS!

 

This is a typical story of drugging .... anyone of us could have written the exact same words, the exact same story!!!

 

Fighting and putting your effort on a battle for a considerable time, and see everything going to the dogs for a little bounch of "buttons pressers" .... feeling happy that your skills and tactics brought you to victory first, and feeling sad that you become a useless spectator in a battle where you can do nothing about.

 

Have a think on that .... it is the most common story I see and read here on Tanki!

 

Tanki is a great game .... let's make it a great game in the future too! Time change, people change, situations evolve .... Tanki has to follow evolutions!

[Brubook 1,161]

That's you. You are in the minority of players, who actually use strategy and tactics to attack an enemy base. Most players are far less advanced and all they want to do is respawn, go to enemy base, kill everybody, get flag, capture, die, repeat. At the moment they have supplies to make this activity of theirs a lot easier, allowing them to overpower the other team and feel strong. Without supplies, their gameplay will become a lot more dull as all they will do is respawn, meet an enemy and either die or kill them and die from the next encounter. Flags will barely ever get captured. I guarantee it.

I think that ArgentHellion is not the minority of players!

 

Also, on the example you made, let's suppose there are 8+8 players. Let's suppose 3 of them isanely drug.

We have:

- 3 players happy (until they find all that too easy and boring)

- 5 player spectators (they maybe somehow happy to get more crystals than loosers, but they realise they did nothing for the battle)

- 8 players frustrated (by being spectators of a battle where they just explode everytime under druggers attacks)

 

So, 3 players happy vs 13 indifferent or unhappy .... are those 13 the minority???

 

I mean ... if someone wins for me, I cannot consider myself happy! I am definitely not!

[Brubook 1,161]

There is no such issue with less players at the moment. It seems to be "critical mass" chooses to use supplies, ruther then not.

We talk about buying, not only using drugs!

 

A use based on daily supply do not allow you to drug insanely for hours!

 

Also, as even written here, some players come in Tanki just for daily supply for months, to be at same conditions with insane druggers when they play (once in a month or so). They actually create several accounts (I heard about 20-30 accounts) to do so.

 

But tell me ... do you call that "strategy"? Do you call those 20-30 accounts of a single person "critica mass"?

 

Is this the "saving-up strategy" you talked about?

 

By the way, I heard on the V-LOG that this will not be possible anymore. V-LOG said that daily reward will be conditioned by some task completion (like "kill 3 mammouth" or else). This will surely change your "strategy"!

[Baby_Sam 614]

Flags will barely ever get captured. I guarantee it.

I am sure you don't want me to post screenshots of no-drug battles with both sides having captured flags.

 

If you mean you will not see results like 40 - 0, sure.

[LaLisa_My_Queen 271]

I am sure you don't want me to post screenshots of no-drug battles with both sides having captured flags.

 

If you mean you will not see results like 40 - 0, sure.

Yes, that's right.

 

It will still be the same, why? Its because not everyone has the same skill level.

 

Then the game will be all about who has the most skilled players instead of who has the most druggers.

[r_belege0 41]

There is no such issue with less players at the moment. It seems to be "critical mass" chooses to use supplies, ruther then not.

Some decide to use supplies. But what can you do with ”skilled” players that play a drug battle but choose not to use supplies? They are basically mults, ruining the game. What cam you do to remove this players from battle?

If 10 players from 1 team drug, and only 5 from the other ream, who will win?

How will be compensated those 5 that used supplies, but lost the game because of the other 5 mults that didn t drug?

[classyplebs 1,786]

"Drugs - the only today Tanki strategy to win a battle"

 

Umm, isn't that what they have Pro Battles for o_o

 

Edit: 700th post :D

[ArgentHellion 41]

Yes, that's right.

It will still be the same, why? Its because not everyone has the same skill level.

Then the game will be all about who has the most skilled players instead of who has the most druggers.

 

THIS...

 

I don't have a record of the match I just recently played, so you're going to have to trust me on

this one. We were playing Rio CTF, and initially it was a 6v6 battle, we lost the first round 1-4, and

then a single drugger joined our side... the end result... 12-1, even though there were only 5 of us,

and 7 enemies, all active.

 

Also, when players are drugging, their ego gets bloated to such an extent it causes dire concequences

not just for the enemies, but even for their teammates. I lost count how many times an obvious drugger

decided to kill me using friendly fire, flip me over, or simply block me from delivering the flag because

all they care about are their precious points. Sometimes I get a "friendly" warning saying "DROP FLAG",

3-4 seconds of room to think about it, and bam... I'm a goner...

 

When I open a particular server, I start searching for appropriate battles to join, and the sad truth is,

thanks to all the druggers running around, it takes me several tries before I settle on a single battle,

until 2-3 rounds later a drugger comes by and ruins that too...

[LaLisa_My_Queen 271]

THIS...

 

I don't have a record of the match I just recently played, so you're going to have to trust me on

this one. We were playing Rio CTF, and initially it was a 6v6 battle, we lost the first round 1-4, and

then a single drugger joined our side... the end result... 12-1, even though there were only 5 of us,

and 7 enemies, all active.

 

Also, when players are drugging, their ego gets bloated to such an extent it causes dire concequences

not just for the enemies, but even for their teammates. I lost count how many times an obvious drugger

decided to kill me using friendly fire, flip me over, or simply block me from delivering the flag because

all they care about are their precious points. Sometimes I get a "friendly" warning saying "DROP FLAG",

3-4 seconds of room to think about it, and bam... I'm a goner...

 

When I open a particular server, I start searching for appropriate battles to join, and the sad truth is,

thanks to all the druggers running around, it takes me several tries before I settle on a single battle,

until 2-3 rounds later a drugger comes by and ruins that too...

 

So you choose skills. (I agree about searching a lot to find a good battle, anyway the only team thats open is the losing team.)

 

Guys can we make a deal with the developers?

 

Maybe we can tell them to not allow drugs for a week or more if possible and see the results.

[LaLisa_My_Queen 271]

50 kills should equal 1k crystals

 

100 kills should equal 2k crystals

 

Gold boxes should in crease at least 2k/3k/ or more to be worth a normal gold.

 

 

By the way do deaths count in the game?

[Baby_Sam 614]

So you choose skills. (I agree about searching a lot to find a good battle, anyway the only team thats open is the losing team.)

 

Guys can we make a deal with the developers?

 

Maybe we can tell them to not allow drugs for a week or more if possible and see the results.

This is not possible. You need to put forth a feasible solution. No matter how much I'd have liked it, stopping drugs is not an option, period.

[Baby_Sam 614]

"Drugs - the only today Tanki strategy to win a battle"

 

Umm, isn't that what they have Pro Battles for o_o

 

Edit: 700th post :D

I hope the others were more valuable than this one. Sorry for being harsh, but the thread has been going on for 220 posts so far, and no matter how eloquent you are, you can't summarize it with this piece of wisdom.

[Brubook 1,161]

50 kills should equal 1k crystals

 

100 kills should equal 2k crystals

 

Gold boxes should in crease at least 2k/3k/ or more to be worth a normal gold.

 

 

By the way do deaths count in the game?

Sorry, your calcs are wrong! And also they depend on rank.

On lower ranks (in winning conditions) crystals/xp ratio is max 40% (100xp brings 40 crystals)

On higher ranks (in winning conditions) crystals/xp ratio is max 90% (100xp brings 90 crystals)

That is only an estimation, but just to give an idea.

[Brubook 1,161]

"Drugs - the only today Tanki strategy to win a battle"

 

Umm, isn't that what they have Pro Battles for o_o

 

Edit: 700th post :D

As I mentioned already, PRO BATTLE does not necessarily means NO DRUGS BATTLE.

 

Actually often it is not like that. On higher ranks there are few PRO battle, they are mostly for generalissimo and abt. 90% of them allow drugging (you can select any option). On lower ranks the PRO battles are even more rare, and dramatically too expensive!

[classyplebs 1,786]

5000 crystals pro pass is 'dramatically too expensive.' ;)