Reduce power of garage supplies

[kayitsiz 621]

If they made the tanks cheaper to buy it would offset changes that might reduce income from drugging. $700 for an item in an online game is insane.

The total amount of the crystals which I get in 3 or 4 months is more expensive than my other all account from different games which I have played since 10. 

[RustyNail 1,538]

Not much today, as I 'm not in the mood (to play)...

 

Same unbalance as always...

 

 

Get's boring... games like running on asphalt (for some) or moving in the water (for the rest)

[Brubook 1,161]

Hazel - you must be joking.

However, at least you bother to come and chat with us from time to time.

 

Please can you try and get Tanki to take our problem seriously?  (I know it's not been easy to explain this - so many people just see us as 'anti-drug' - which is not entirely true.)

 

As you know Tanki tried an 'unlimited drugs' day and it did not work well for the following reasons:

Nearly all battles on that day were 'wipe-outs'.  (Ignore the fact that it was popular for 1 day).

The stronger teams got stronger and the weaker teams got weaker 'relatively'.  I.e. the stronger teams found it easy to take over the enemy base and not let anyone out.

Unlimited drugs are not the answer - it ruins the careful balance that the Devs have put into the tanks.

There was a much reduced element of strategy on that day - it was mostly mindless kill or be killed.

Many of us can afford unlimited drugs - but this is NOT the kind of game most of us want.

 

To sum up what's being asked for.

1.         'Air dropped' supplies are not a problem - please leave as is.

2.         However, it is noted that too many 'garage drugs' used per hour represents 'abuse' by a relatively small number of tankers and this ruins the game as an 'interesting sport'.

3.         We cannot use Pro Mode because the pricing has meant very few battles are available.

            The 500 crystal Pro mode offer helped for a short while and I don't mind if you vary the price of Pro Mode at each rank to  keep it at no more than 50% of battles.

            (The odd time I did get to use Pro mode battles without drugs I had some good games - I would like to have access to more like this.)

            Strangely I do like to use the odd mine - mostly in self defence but occasionally 'dropped from above'.

4.         Because we generally believe that Tanki will not give us the OPTION in standard mode to remove garage drugs - I would recommend to reduce the amount of garage drug use:

            Garage drug use can be reduced by simply increasing the smart cooldown times.

            A simple way to do this in a dynamic way: you may find that increasing the smart cooldown time only for the leading team would help get closer balanced games - I.e. the further ahead the leading team gets the longer the cooldown times.  At present a leading team will continue to use excessive garage drugs and this usually causes the weaker team to quit.

            The most important garage drugs to control are the health packs.  These are expensive drugs and should be limited to the equivalent of no more than 3 per hour (some players only make 150 crystals per hour on the battle field.)

            Health packs also cause the most frustration as 'un-sporting' behaviour - a bit like making the goal twice as large in a football game or the net in Tennis half as high = completely ruins the balance.

5.         To help Tanki reduce the pressure from 'drug earnings' - we have suggested selling the advertising space on the billboards (imagine what Coke Cole would pay for such a global audience!)

            We could buy all sorts of items from Tanki, T-shirts, coffee mugs, parts of our tanks could have extra customisations - i.e. all cosmetic things that do not give us a performance advantage.

6.         Why not allow us to have a simple vote and ask tankers if they like any of the above ideas.  (Tanki has lots of other votes but never on this, what are you afraid of?  Surely you want to please your user population?)

 

Please note that in the recent competition Tanki did not allow garage drugs - I presume you did this in the interest of better sport?  So why can't the rest of us have this in daily battles?

 

I believe the vast majority of Tankers know the difference between the battles they enjoy the most and those ruined battles caused by too much drug use which have limited entertainment value.  The above is all aimed at getting more of the best kind of battle which in my mind are the best entertainment to be found on the Internet.  The strength of feeling on this forum means Tanki must do something soonest.

 

By the way I'm now concluding that on all my accounts above WO1: skill alone cannot defeat the over use of garage drugs - unless you're content to camp in a good position as a sniper with an izzy behind you.

 

It has not been good news that Tanki have appeared unwilling to discuss this subject with us.

 

 

PS: just noticed the ideas for drugs 1,2,3 needing to have some sort of negative consequence from using them which I quite like. If using a health pack meant you lost a life could be interesting, or better still if each garage drug 1,2,3 meant you lost some points this might make some think twice about over use.

I also forgot the point about showing the amount of garage drugs used on the scoreboard so we know who the abuses are! :0)

I would add a little drugs nerfing and I want to underline to refer to RustyNail ideas on "counter-effects" when using drugs.

 

If something like this can be done, Tanki would be the great enjoyable game it was!

[Brubook 1,161]

Although your points are fair, do not bother...I think that Hazel is done with this topic. Too many suggestions about further affecting the power of supplies, I think. Apparently smart cooldowns were enough to him. Also, this

 

 

Has been suggested an uncountable number of times since the beginning of the game, yet nothing about it has happened yet. Personally I wouldn't mind seeing a few advertisements while the battle is loading, as long as they aren't too intrusive (like click Play to continue). Still, you think that advertising would bring in more income than a legion of drug-addicted thick-walleted players?

 

Cheaper PRO passes would be fair though. There's very little (if any) logic behind its current cost. And I think that could offset some of the rage a bit.

 

 

Not unwilling, just tired. You have no idea how many times this has been discussed in Russian forum. Why, because Russians feel the same way as English community do. But it seems developers are tired of hearing complaints about the same thing over and over again about things that won't be changed. Which to me is very sad.

Let's focus on a fact: Hazel, as the entire Tanki team is suppose to take care of the Game interests ... and the customer satisfaction should be one of these.

So, saying that "Hazel is done with this topic" is quite reductive of his work and would be quite a shortseeing attitude!

 

Advertising: Of course I can't compare numbers. What I know is that advertising with Tanki diffusion numbers has quite a high value.

 

Finally, if Devs are tired to hear complain about this, I think this should be quite an alarm bell. I mean that after so many complains, don't they think that there could be something wrong, something to be solved or fixed??

Infortunately, due to my ignorance, I can't read russian forum.

[Brubook 1,161]

Lately I have had many confirms of my thoughts. Many players I talk with or I read their chat that are gradually loosing interest in playing. This is confirmed also by graph numbers and by readers and commenters of this post.

 

I really hope Tanki will do something soon, or it will be too late! Anyway, most games have a short/medium lifetime!

 

If nothing will change, sure Tanki will loose me (which is not a great loss, you may say!! :) ) ... yet I wouldn't like it! And surely they will loose many other players!

 

I am starting thinking that a stubborn mind (or determined if you prefer) is hard to deal with (being stubborn myself I know what I am talking about :) ) ... and I am beginning to ask myself why should I do this? Why should I help someone I don't even personally know ... for free? I mean I do that as a job and get paid for that!!

Probably Hazel is asking himself the same thing (about me I mean)!!

 

Just late night sad thoughts

[wildgooseman 90]

The original post here is very well written and sums up the whole issue very well. When the opposition are all appearing in you base with multiple drugs the game is instantly ruined as half of the defending team leave due to the ridiculous drugging they are encountering.

 

For me Tanki players fall into 2 groups. The first group are able/prepared to spend real money on the game, the second group are not.

 

Those spending real money for crystals think nothing of buying the supplies kits and using drugs at every available oportunity. The worst ones being those that have to drug the second they spawn as they do not even seem to be able to drive a tank without having double armour or shields active. These are also the players who need to drug even if their team has double the number of players than the opposition. These players do not see how ilogical it is to spend 1000 crystals worth of drugs to win 200 or 300 at the end of the battle.

 

Then there is the second group like myself that does not see the point of spending money to buy crystals for drugs. I do use mines and heal packs at times, but rarely use the other 3 (I have thousands of each in my garage) unless absolute frustration kicks in and I use a double power on the persistant druggers. I would rather save my crystals for better equipment and upgrades.

 

I would like it that Tankers can only use one drug at a time, even if they are airdrops. That way you must pick which of the 3 (armour/speed/dp) you want to use. After the drug has run out there will be a 30 second gap before you can activate the next one.

 

I think it would also be good if Tanki made some drug free servers. If the server was called DF 1 everyone entering it would know that no one will be using drugs.

 

Druggers say go play pro battles... I do, I have a pro pass but the downside is the majority of pro battles will be on a very limited number of maps. Trying to get enough people playing a 6v6 Rio for instance can take an age. Pro passes must also come down significantly in price to make them available to everyone. At lower to middle ranks they are simply not cost effective as the battle funds will never justify the outlay.

 

The sad thing is my friends list is littered with people who no longer play Tanki because they were fed up with losing to the "who drugs most" team. Even more sad is the ammount of people I see in chat talking of giving the game up because of it.

 

I get that Tanki need people spending real money, they aren't developing the game just for fun but to earn a living. The irony is those who spend hard cash now still will, they will buy equipment and upgrades instead.

 

 

Goose

 

[Brubook 1,161]

Thank you for coming and for your comment, Goose

 

You got the point.

 

I'd like to underline something:

 

"I would like it that Tankers can only use one drug at a time, even if they are airdrops. That way you must pick which of the 3 (armour/speed/dp) you want to use."

Even if they are airdrops: drugs are soo overpowered that they have to be limited somehow, even if coming from the sky!

 

"The sad thing is my friends list is littered with people who no longer play Tanki because they were fed up with losing to the "who drugs most" team. Even more sad is the ammount of people I see in chat talking of giving the game up because of it."

This is another indication of the "sentiment", the frustration and unsatisfaction we are all talking about!

 

Anyway we will soon make a sum-up with all our thoughts and ideas, a kind of receipt for re-establish Tanki balance and fun to play!

 

Ideas make the difference

[RustyNail 1,538]

Thank you for comment

 

RustyNail made up a "side effect" list for every drug used and, together with drug nerfing, it could be a good idea. The criteria are listed some pages earlier, but soon we will make a "sum-up" of the whole discussion, with players ideas and suggestions.

Anyway it is a good idea. It has to be analysed and studied in details, but it is something very applicable to the game, I think!

 

Keep following the discussion! :)

 

Actually, it was not me the one to propose side-effects. We will find the one who said that in the following days, while we update this topic.

As a form of updating it, there will be a list of all the issues caused by overuse of supplies and another list of all the proposals for a possible problem solution.

 

[It is my personal belief that Devs already know quite well all of this stuff. So, why should we do it if they already know? The answer is "we do it for the players that have not make themselves familiar with the severity of the issue and for them that so far think that there is no alternative to the drugs issue". Hoping to raise a massive demand for Devs to restore ballance.]

 

 

Meanwhile, here are two wonderful battles held just a few minutes ago in Serpuhov. Notice the balanced score AND the high funds available in the end.

 

 

 

 

Well, see what a balanced battle can be? Great battles both, although we won only the one.. Why both great? Because we enjoyed them and because there was enough funds in the end, due to the healthy distribution of personal score.

Neeless to say, these were Pro battles, no garage supplies, only drops available. So supplies where distributed more or less fair.

[creeperskelly 1,281]

Wow. Nice. And also notice the kill ratios are respectable.

[beaku 2,656]

Actually, those are the kind of battles I get to play 20% of the time. The only time when I enjoy strategising, communicating with players: Basically everything which this game was meant to be.

[Papaya14 481]

RustyNail, those are the kind of battles I love to see! This is why I advocating for cheaper PRO pass, so we can see more and more of this. Balanced teams and scores, modest yet intense gameplay, with respectable rewards! In the end it's all worthwhile. And that's the true essence of Tanki!

[Brubook 1,161]

No, Papaya

 

That WAS the essence of Tanki!!

 

Now it is all replaced by greed and shortsight ... they don't care about you, me or anyone else! We are just damned cows to milk, finished to milk we are ready for slaughterhouse ... and that is it! (But they didn't noticed that some of us are bulls!! :) )

 

You can confirm it from the devs "presence" here!

 

Now there is no strategy, teamwork or other silly useless things ... just money! Spend, drug, loose (because even when you win you loose), open your wallet again and go once again to spend, drug, loose! This is their only interest now. The hero, the warrior is ONLY the xmas tree tank! The rest is meat!

 

And the "warrior" actually waste about twice what he gain from battles ... and that is important ... that is good ... that is how EVERY tanker should be ... an infinitely deep walking wallet!

 

This is how a good free-to-pay game is and should be!

[RustyNail 1,538]

... while a little time ago I fell in a Drugging party (from one team only, so unsportsman like...)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

no need to stay after two rounds of constant drugging.... (I would have left sooner but for the pic capturing)

[Brubook 1,161]

That stats on front page? Seasonal decrease will kick in soon and we are on viral traffic only for time being. Any other game would fall flat by now.

 

Uhm ... we are having quite a long "season"!!

(Please check dates)

[VaudeVille 1,428]

Brubook is very right. there should be drugs but as he said, a m0 shouldn't do more damage than m1.

the developers should reduce the X 2 damage and X 2 armor to only + 30%. I have never bought a single drug so as to save up for turrets and hulls, and this the reason I lose half my battles

[beaku 2,656]

Uhm ... we are having quite a long "season"!!

(Please check dates)

Let's not really go there for the hundredth time. They have a whole team of professional analysts looking into these numbers everyday. The server load graph is just a part of it. The summer is kicking in. Most children have exams. Families go for a vacation. All these reasons add up to lower the max limit of the graph.

You might remember that medium and heavy Hulls were given a buff few months ago. Why was that? Simple reason that the analysts found that 50% of the Hulls being sold were Hornets.

My point is that if they see that number of customers is below mark, they will do something about it. Any business would.

[genak138 950]

Actually, it was not me the one to propose side-effects. We will find the one who said that in the following days, while we update this topic.

As a form of updating it, there will be a list of all the issues caused by overuse of supplies and another list of all the proposals for a possible problem solution.

 

[It is my personal belief that Devs already know quite well all of this stuff. So, why should we do it if they already know? The answer is "we do it for the players that have not make themselves familiar with the severity of the issue and for them that so far think that there is no alternative to the drugs issue". Hoping to raise a massive demand for Devs to restore ballance.]

 

 

Meanwhile, here are two wonderful battles held just a few minutes ago in Serpuhov. Notice the balanced score AND the high funds available in the end.

 

 

 

Well, see what a balanced battle can be? Great battles both, although we won only the one.. Why both great? Because we enjoyed them and because there was enough funds in the end, due to the healthy distribution of personal score.

Neeless to say, these were Pro battles, no garage supplies, only drops available. So supplies where distributed more or less fair.

Maybe this is why I have different opinions on drugs than most people in this topic. Nearly all of the battles I play seem like this, with one exception: Both teams usually have a couple of drugging players. My thinking that drugging is just fine as it happens everywhere (druggers being on both teams) probably comes from the happy chance of me being in battles with balanced drugging.

 

Just thinking that this probably means something :)

[kayitsiz 621]

Maybe this is why I have different opinions on drugs than most people in this topic. Nearly all of the battles I play seem like this, with one exception: Both teams usually have a couple of drugging players. My thinking that drugging is just fine as it happens everywhere (druggers being on both teams) probably comes from the happy chance of me being in battles with balanced drugging.

 

Just thinking that this probably means something :)

But in your team, there is one non-drugger, you!

This means, opponent team will probably have more drugger.

[beaku 2,656]

But in your team, there is one non-drugger, you!

This means, opponent team will probably have more drugger.

Why are you assuming that everyone in Tanki except people here drug?

[kayitsiz 621]

Why are you assuming that everyone in Tanki except people here drug?

This is statictic.

[RustyNail 1,538]

Behold! The great warriors! :P

 

 

 

So very stupid game*, either you win or you lose... just meaningless. There's no reason at all in constant drugging.

 

* battle I mean

[Brubook 1,161]

Why are you assuming that everyone in Tanki except people here drug?

Not everyone ... but there are! If (virtually) everyone drugged, battles would be balanced!

When you see (as you can easily check) 90% of battles with scores like 15-0, 12-2 or even 45-1 and soo on, you are quite sure that there is unbalance. When you check the numbers in them and you see the first 2-4 winners having 2-3 times the score than the others and the first players on the other side, you confirm that is excessive drugging that cause that unbalance!

[Brubook 1,161]

 

Behold! The great warriors! :P

 

 

 

So very stupid game, either you win or you lose... just meaningless. There's no reason at all in constant drugging.

 

 

MERRY CHRISTMAS!!!

[Brubook 1,161]

Let's not really go there for the hundredth time. They have a whole team of professional analysts looking into these numbers everyday. The server load graph is just a part of it. The summer is kicking in. Most children have exams. Families go for a vacation. All these reasons add up to lower the max limit of the graph.

You might remember that medium and heavy Hulls were given a buff few months ago. Why was that? Simple reason that the analysts found that 50% of the Hulls being sold were Hornets.

My point is that if they see that number of customers is below mark, they will do something about it. Any business would.

Well, I don't think exams or vacations are running from march ... anyway of course I have not the complete figure!

 

The heavy hull push was a direct interest! They made heavy hulls, they are "on the shelf" and they just promote them. That is a direct action ... promotion ---> money. It is a quite different situation!

 

And "any business would" also take appropriate care of customer satisfaction ... and I don't think here that we are in a situation one-on-a-million ... here many players have problems playing!

[RustyNail 1,538]

Let's not really go there for the hundredth time. They have a whole team of professional analysts looking into these numbers everyday. The server load graph is just a part of it. The summer is kicking in. Most children have exams. Families go for a vacation. All these reasons add up to lower the max limit of the graph.

You might remember that medium and heavy Hulls were given a buff few months ago. Why was that? Simple reason that the analysts found that 50% of the Hulls being sold were Hornets.

My point is that if they see that number of customers is below mark, they will do something about it. Any business would.

And why should I trust that they (Devs) tell the truth about it?

I mean, if you run a business and starts losing its customers, would you admitt it in an open forum where competition can access freely?

...

I don't think so either!

 

 

Ps. Another "pro" group