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[Issue 34] Recent Update: Has game balance improved?


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The latest round of rebalance has been put in place, and it is a significant one, especially with the recent addition of all the new paints and of course, the new turrets that are Hammer and Vulcan. These recent additions have definitely had some effect on game balance, which of course has been picked up by the community and the keen-eyed developers. With this update, Tanki has promised to resolve the game balancing issues. Have they been successful? Here I share my thoughts!

The structure I will try to follow will be this. I will discuss whether the weapon strength has been increased, or decreased, as well as why and by how much. Then, I will try and make a judgment on whether it was a good improvement for the game.
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Firebird
Let's identify what has actually changed with Firebird first. Damage has been increased across the main modifications, but at M4, the damage is still the same at 72 DPS. So, in fact it has not changed. However, what will indirectly affect the damage dealing capacity of this weapon is the slight decrease in reloading time. The reload time has slightly decreased from 12 to 11 seconds, meaning that you will be able to recharge back to full a second more quickly. Sounds insignificant, and I suppose it's nothing huge, but even one second can be a large difference in a game.

The heating speed has decreased so that it now takes Firebird 5 seconds rather than 4 to heat a tank to the maximum temperature limit. However, this is due to the huge 50% increase in burn damage. 30 damage per second is now incredibly powerful, and considering the burn time has not been changed (tanks still burn for over 60 seconds), the potential for afterburn damage alone has increased to a ridiculous 900 damage points. That's insane.

Overall, Firebird has definitely been buffed. A slightly shorter reload time, but more importantly, the afterburn effect is now definitely a major asset to its user. Personally, I think this is a welcome change. A slight buff in Firebird's strength makes up for the increased HP update for hulls, and maintains its position as the strongest close range weapon in terms of damage.


Freeze
Many small changes have been made on this weapon, and will change the dynamics of its gameplay. The first thing to notice is the changes in its firing rate. Freeze now shoots for 6 seconds rather than the previous 7, and reloads in 10 seconds rather than 11. This means that overall, Freeze will be shooting for a lower average time than before. However, this is balanced by the significant increase in base damage of this weapon. The increase from 68 to 80 DPS is huge. Doing the maths, the new freeze only does a slightly greater damage per full charge, but it does so in a shorter time and so at a faster rate, meaning you will take less damage and be exposed for less time.

The change in freezing mechanics (it now works more effectively in slowing turret rotation than hull movement) I believe is a welcome update. Now defending Freezes are a little less overpowered, but it makes aggressive freezes that like to circle and outmanoeuvre enemies a little stronger. Turning to face a skilled freeze has now become more difficult than before. One small trick I have seen is ensuring you stay right up close the the side of an enemy tank, making it harder for the enemy to turn the hull, and ensuring you are within the 5 metres in which your damage is maximised.

Overall, like Firebird, Freeze has received a definite buff, and it definitely is a great change. Previously, Freeze lacked the firepower to compete with Firebird as a great offensive weapon, and excelled in defence. Now, it is more of a universal and versatile turret.


Isida
For Isida, damage has increased by a small margin to match healing rate which is 66 per second. This change is insignificant really. However, the shooting rate has been improved by a noticeable margin. Isida now shoots for 7 seconds rather than 6, and reloads in a quick 9 seconds. This means an Isida user can be shooting up to 40% of the time.

The slight increase in range but slight decrease in cone angle makes Isida slightly better on flat maps but slightly worse on layered maps. From personal experience, it has become much harder to use Isida effectively at close range, and it requires more skill to keep a hold of the enemy. The longer range is noticeable however, and I guess this distinguishes Isida from the other two typically classified short range weapons. When dealing with other short range weapons, since their damage decreases with range, it helps to keep distance on the enemy while shooting.

Overall, I think Tanki has made a good change here. The previous increase in hull HP has meant that Isida has had more difficulty in taking on the heavier hulls especially. Now, Isida can pretty much take out even the heaviest of hulls without protection in one burst, and remains a strong weapon.


Hammer
I have never used Hammer, but I can say for sure that going up against it has become a lot easier after this update. It has been weakened in two respects. First is the longer reload time - Hammer now reloads in 1.8 seconds rather than 1.6. Now Hammer isn't as strong as it was as a hit-and-run turret. The other nerf has been the increase in the cone of fire, meaning that at any range, less pellets will hit the tank. At short ranges, this won't be noticeable, but this severely cripples Hammer's effective range.

I will have to play a bit more against it to come to a conclusion, but I definitely support the change. Hammer no longer seems overpowered, but still remains a strong weapon with its unique perks.


Vulcan
Vulcan has been reduced in power considerably. Before, a Vulcan mounted on a heavy hull was a nightmare to face, but now it has become a little more in line in terms of strength with the other turrets. The maximum damage has been reduced to 60 DPS. Still strong, but not like the 70 DPS it was originally. The increase in burn damage will also hurt this weapon a lot. 30 DPS of burn damage will hurt a user even with a Firebird protection paint.

However, even with these changes, Vulcan still remains an extremely dangerous turret to face, particularly in team games. Vulcan still has the ability to deal large amount of damage indefinitely, and still has an extremely strong impact force that can literally turn your turret as it shoots. Tanki has definitely made a change in the right direction, although I still suspect Vulcan is a little on the overpowered side.


Twins
Well, twins has definitely got a lot stronger in this update. Perhaps a little underused before, Twins now has potential for a huge amount of damage. It's DPS has increased from a mediocre 56 to 72. That's just about as strong as Rico now, allowing it to really hurt enemies. This is accompanied by an increase in its already monstrous impact force.

The range decrease has been significant however, as Twins only deals maximum damage at 15 metres compared to the original 40.

Overall, Twins has been buffed up hugely, especially so at short range. Twins will now become a very strong turret, especially in defence, and I think this turret will be used more now. A good change in my opinion, and this now separates Rico and Twins more in terms of their usability. Twins is now much better at short range but a little weaker at longer ranges.


Ricochet
Ricochet was always strong, and now this update has allowed it to be used in a greater range of situations. The actual damage rate of the turret has only been increased slightly, and hurts almost as much as a Freeze, however the range at which this turret will be effective at is the main change. Projectile speed has been given a 33% boost, and the range at which this turret will deal damage on has been extended, making Rico usable at an even longer range. The impact force has been increased too. At short ranges, Rico will be stronger, able to effectively knock off enemy aim much more easily.

Personally, I'm unsure about this change. Ricochet, although perhaps a little underused before the update, might be on the stronger side, being an extremely strong and extremely versatile weapon now.


Smoky
Smoky critical hit mechanics haven't changed, so if you would like a detailed explanation of the mechanics, click here. Doing some sums, we can see that Smoky's damage rate has increased slightly from about 42 DPS to 43 DPS. Not a significant change, although the consistency of the turret has increased. Each shot deals slightly more damage, and each critical deals slightly less. Each critical shot now deals double the damage of a normal shot. In general, this consistency is a good thing. It means there is less chance of "wasting damage", whereby a shot deals far more damage than necessary to take out an enemy.

However, it's range has been decreased slightly, making Smoky now really a strictly medium range specialist, not nearly as effective at longer ranges. Note that this change is slight. 30% to 10% minimum damage sounds like a lot, but Smoky will still be dealing maximum damage within 60% metres, and this difference will only increase to a noticeable amount at long range.

Overall, I feel Smoky users may feel unhappy that the versatility of this turret has been decreased. I can absolutely understand why, but I think it should just be understood that Smoky is a short to medium range specialist now, rather than a turret that can play at any range.


Thunder
As a keen Thunder user, I was a little disappointed when I first saw the update. The damage rate has not changed in fact, but the slower reloading has taken the dynamic nature and pace from this weapon, and it feels sluggish. The splash ability to deal damage has also been crippled. Thunder will deal less damage from splash now, overall.

However, dealing more damage per shot actually has its advantages as I have discovered. It makes peek-a-boo tactics much easier to perform, and the nice round 100 damage per shot is very nice. Even a fully micro-upgraded Wasp will now be taken in just two shots (one shot with a double power), as well as all but the top-microupgraded Hornets. With a double damage, Vikings, Hunters and even Dictators can be taken in just two shots. That's a time-frame of 2.5 seconds.

Having played with the new Thunder, I believe it has, overall, become slightly stronger. At longer ranges, it is very strong as it should be.


Railgun
The main change worth mentioning is the reduced reload for this turret. The extra impact force is nice, but somewhat balanced out by the increased weight of the hulls.

Railgun with its now much shorter reload, now has become extremely strong on the long range maps. I think this is a good update. Previously, even on the largest maps, weapons like Smoky, or Thunder could easily do as well as Railgun. Now Railgun is established as one of the strongest turrets at long range, giving it an established place in the game.


Shaft
Shaft's arcade mode has been increased slightly, and I think this is the main change. The damage the shot deals is now 73 rather than 50. The energy per shot, reloading, and rotation speed have been reduced slightly too. Overall, these changes will mean Shaft users will be relying more and more on arcade shots.

I'm not a Shaft user, but personally I think these changes are interesting. I think this will reduce the amount of players who just camp with Shaft, and forces Shaft users to be more on their feet and think about their shots more rather than scoping all the time. I don't play enough with or use Shaft enough to come to a proper conclusion.


Hulls
There's not too much to say about the hulls, so I will not make a separate subheading for each one.

Wasp and Hornet have both been given some extra weight, which, for a light hull, is always welcome. It means the user is less prone to being flipped or affected by enemy impact force. However, it must not be forgotten that the impact force for many of the weapons with impact has also been increased, so the overall effect might be small.

Wasp also has that slight acceleration boost, which will make the user more nimble in battle.

Hunter and Viking have, interestingly, swapped weight again. This is definitely noticeable. As a Viking user, it is harder to manoeuvre yourself while in flight using recoil. The increased resistance to enemy weapon fire I really haven't noticed. I think this is because, as mentioned, the impact of many of the weapons has increased as well.

Hunter and Viking, as well as the heavier hulls, have also been given a boost in maneuverability, by increases in turning speed, and acceleration. I think this will help to make the game even more dynamic, so I welcome these changes too.

All in all, I think Tanki has done a great job in this update. Shifting the balance of weapons within reasonable margins keeps the game fluid and exciting, and as far as I can see, there is no severely underpowered or overpowered weapon or hull.

Note that these are just my personal opinions. They are by no means the law, and for different people, using different weapons and hulls, they will have varying views on the update.

I look forward to see what Tanki plans next! And of course, I'd love to hear your thoughts on the update below, as well as anything I may have missed!

Edited by Hexed
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"Smoky critical hit mechanics haven't changed, so if you would like a detailed explanation of the mechanics, click here"

You messed up the url link.

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No, game just hasnt been balanced. Ricochet is OP, thunders dominate and hammer is still OP.

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No, game just hasnt been balanced. Ricochet is OP, thunders dominate and hammer is still OP.

I have to agree Ricochet was already OP to begin with, but the update only improved it.

 

Next re-balance will probably see ricochet getting nerfed. 

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I have to agree Ricochet was already OP to begin with, but the update only improved it.

 

Next re-balance will probably see ricochet getting nerfed.

 

I hope so.....

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I think that they shouldn't have buffed Rico.

Vulcan I think is a tad underpowered now.

Thunder I really don't like when I'm against it.

Firebird has actually been nerved, IMO. With the higher normal damage rate, you could receive less damage before killing your enemy since they would die sooner. Not to mention the decrease of the effective range. I believe this nerd was well needed though.

And I think that's mainly where my opinions differ from yours.

 

Good summary ;)

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Ricochet is OP now (my next M4) Hammer, there isn't much difference here, besides the reload. Hammer feels more balanced now for others, not so much for the people that have it. :P 

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Range of firebird has been significantly DE-creased. This is not mentioned. But this is PRECICELY the fact that firebird has been significantlty downgraded in this so-called rebalance. Also, Hammer has not been effected at all. Hammer was and still is the main game ruiner.

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Fire, freez, isida, shaft, twins, smokey had fine rebalance.

Hamer and Vulcan are still OP

Rico and Thunder becamed OP (thunder maybe not so much)

Rail-Others were to buffed so this is just an equalizer

 

 

So the most powerful is still  hammer and then vulcan and rico.

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Isida

For Isida, damage has increased by a small margin to match healing rate which is 66 per second.

The shooting rate has been improved by a noticeable margin.

Isida now shoots for 7 seconds rather than 6, and reloads in a quick 9 seconds.

The slight increase in range but slight decrease in cone angle makes Isida slightly better on flat maps

Overall, I think Tanki has made a good change here.

 

I disagree.

 

As Isida is my weapon of choice - my opinion is that decreasing the cone angle was the worst idea.

My beam loses connection to any enemy all the time. Doesn't matter if I attack or heal - logging on has become a pain, not a challenge.

I don't understand how you could not notice how bad this is.

 

Take back your extended range, take back the longer duration - I want to get back my old cone angle or preferably a slightly extended one.

 

I don't enjoy playing Tanki the same way, like I did before this ever so stupid update.

 

No, game balance has not improved for me.

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Ok, unfortunately, I think my post will be just vanished, but I do want to write what happens with this rebalance.

.

I have feeling that TO game designers really do not care about players and just want to get to some World that they like (with bright great balance according to the design rules). I know A LOT good players that do not want come back to TO after this rebalance. Nothing can force them to come back.

So what was driving our TO game designers:

There are many people that play light hulls – it looks like light hulls are too good – let’s make rebalance! Let’s make them much worth! – Let’s increase HP of big hulls (yes people like increase in HP, so it should go fine). But it is not the end of story! Let’s make all weapons stronger (yes people like increase in DPS, so it should go fine)! So, as result light hulls now become dead muuuch faster!!! Great rebalance! Try to play wasp now! All wasp players become really sad! Really!

Dear TO game designers, it is not rebalance at all. A lot of people play light hulls just because they LIKE to run! Not because it is super power, but because they like to do this! They just can’t stand on one place! You can’t force people to stop like to run, but you definitely could make people to hate TO! Well done dear designers! Well done!

.

So, it is sad story on light hulls, when some people think that statistics could say something about balance….

.

Weapons. I really like the last post… Let’s have a look on isida for example. In order to shoot by isida you should lock on a target. How you could lock something NOW? When everybody run and ALL maps are layered! Now players just can’t heal or shoot opponent that are on other layer! At ALL!!! You just can’t lock isida on him. There are maps where isida is just totally useless now. It is not like any other shoot weapon that you could force to shoot up or down… it does not shoot – you need to lock! And you just can’t! So quote from prev post “I want to get back my old cone angle”. Terrible change.

But it is not the end of story. In all these changes, there were carefully hidden the main change! Isida ALWAYS was THE most close range weapon! Right? So people choose this weapon because they LIKE close range combat! But it is not the case now! I just cry here… Now isida is middle range weapon! Because firebird and freeze are now close range weapon! Firebird and freeze just kill isida in close range combat sooo easily now…. Again, you can’t change what people like to do, but you definitely could make people to hate TO. I am sure all isida players are in frustration now.

And a few words aside: do you think that Hummer, Vulcan and Rick are more balanced now – try to kill them with isida on some light hulls. Just try… Actually, the same problem is present for twinse, but it was true forever. But now we have 4 weapons where isida is useless.

Well, IMHO, it is terrible rebalance that just goes against what people LIKE in the world that TO game designers want to see. End of story.

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I have to agree Ricochet was already OP to begin with, but the update only improved it.

 

Next re-balance will probably see ricochet getting nerfed. 

Nuuuuu. Ricochet is my favorite turret. I don't want Tanki to make my favorite turret weaker. 

Edited by JamesLewisTX

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Ok, unfortunately, I think my post will be just vanished, but I do want to write what happens with this rebalance.

.

I have feeling that TO game designers really do not care about players and just want to get to some World that they like (with bright great balance according to the design rules). I know A LOT good players that do not want come back to TO after this rebalance. Nothing can force them to come back.

So what was driving our TO game designers:

There are many people that play light hulls – it looks like light hulls are too good – let’s make rebalance! Let’s make them much worth! – Let’s increase HP of big hulls (yes people like increase in HP, so it should go fine). But it is not the end of story! Let’s make all weapons stronger (yes people like increase in DPS, so it should go fine)! So, as result light hulls now become dead muuuch faster!!! Great rebalance! Try to play wasp now! All wasp players become really sad! Really!

Dear TO game designers, it is not rebalance at all. A lot of people play light hulls just because they LIKE to run! Not because it is super power, but because they like to do this! They just can’t stand on one place! You can’t force people to stop like to run, but you definitely could make people to hate TO! Well done dear designers! Well done!

.

So, it is sad story on light hulls, when some people think that statistics could say something about balance….

.

Weapons. I really like the last post… Let’s have a look on isida for example. In order to shoot by isida you should lock on a target. How you could lock something NOW? When everybody run and ALL maps are layered! Now players just can’t heal or shoot opponent that are on other layer! At ALL!!! You just can’t lock isida on him. There are maps where isida is just totally useless now. It is not like any other shoot weapon that you could force to shoot up or down… it does not shoot – you need to lock! And you just can’t! So quote from prev post “I want to get back my old cone angle”. Terrible change.

But it is not the end of story. In all these changes, there were carefully hidden the main change! Isida ALWAYS was THE most close range weapon! Right? So people choose this weapon because they LIKE close range combat! But it is not the case now! I just cry here… Now isida is middle range weapon! Because firebird and freeze are now close range weapon! Firebird and freeze just kill isida in close range combat sooo easily now…. Again, you can’t change what people like to do, but you definitely could make people to hate TO. I am sure all isida players are in frustration now.

And a few words aside: do you think that Hummer, Vulcan and Rick are more balanced now – try to kill them with isida on some light hulls. Just try… Actually, the same problem is present for twinse, but it was true forever. But now we have 4 weapons where isida is useless.

Well, IMHO, it is terrible rebalance that just goes against what people LIKE in the world that TO game designers want to see. End of story.

I understand why the isida players arent happy with the Update its so diffucult to heal or kill you cant get a good grip  -_-

But luckily for me I dont use isida.. I bought freeze m2 instead of it at first I regretted it cause isida m2 was good then but now I think im lucky I got freeze..  I feel sorry for the isida players. 

Edited by Truthteller
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I understand why the isida players arent happy with the Update its so diffucult to heal or kill you cant get a good grip -_-

But luckily for me I dont use isida.. I bought freeze m2 instead of it at first I regretted it cause isida m2 was good then but now I think im lucky I got freeze.. I feel sorry for the isida players.

 

As an isida user myself, I agree, and isida has become a much more difficult turret to use at short range. But personally, overall, with the increased range and shooting time, isida has definitely not become weaker. It just needs to be used slightly differently, at a slightly longer range than before, and can take on firebird and freeze easily if you keep range :) Edited by Pathfinder
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...  isida has definitely not become weaker. It just needs to be used slightly differently, at a slightly longer range than before, and can take on firebird and freeze easily if you keep range :)

 

Isida need to be used slightly differently?

Maybe you try to explain to us what we Isida fans have to do in oder for our beam to not lose connection. To "take" Firebird and Freeze or heal someone, it takes a solid connection, but I get disconnected all the time and we all know why.

 

You can turn and twist as much as you like - the update is a deterioration for Isida. This turret was not really strong before the update anyway, but now all I can do is following team mates for them to be healed, resulting in ending up on the bottom of the score tables frequently. But it's not so much the scores for me, it's that I enjpoyed using Isida. 90% of that joy has gone now.

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Wow, I am impressed my post is still here and even somebody read it! Great news!
I want to add a few points:
My main point was: IMHO it is totally wrong from the side of TO game designers to say to TO players “Isida now “just needs to be used slightly differently”! It is WRONG. People choose turret because they like to use it in specific way. If I want something else, I choose other turret of OTHER game. You can’t force people to like something else. And you could clearly see this in post of C8o. It is hard to relearn how to use your turret in new way. It is harder than to learn how to use it from the beginning! That’s why a lot of old players now hate TO. They do not LIKE “slightly differently” style.
I have took isida just as example. I could write similar story about other weapons… But I strongly disagree with statement “isida has definitely not become weaker”. It does! For sure! And in order to understand this, I recommend to try it on some layered map – try this – and come back.
And I see no comments on changing isida from the closest range weapon to middle range. Or, no, there is – “Isida now “just needs to be used slightly differently”  .
But there are no comments on how to fight with isida vs Hummer, Vulcan, Rick and Twinse…… And why TO game designers try to kill light hulls.

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I was just playing for a while and have decided, if Tanki does not reverse the decrease of cone angle soon, I won't use Isida much anymore.

Every single weapon here, other than Isida, has a significant better angle - while I'm even unable to lock on to someone, when he is just 5 to 10 degrees located higher or lower than me. Was that your intention, Tanki Online? Are you happy now?

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Kirby2008's analysis of Freeze is wrong. At M4 freeze does more DPS than Firebird. Also, decrease the length of the freeze effect. It shouldn't take half the game to thaw.

 

Vulan is trash now. I'm so disappointed. The overheat, turret speed, and impact force okay. The damage ??? NO !!!

 

C8o has it right. Isida has been weakened. I used to love to play it. Now I can't keep my beam on enemy tanks unless they just stand there. Reverse the rebalance to the way it was before.

 

Firebird's 60 seconds of afterburn is ridiculous! 900 total damage? It needs to be reduced to maybe 10 seconds of afterburn and also at a reduced rate of damage.

 

Ricochet needed no improvments. It was already a great turret.

 

Shaft is still too weak in arcade mode.

 

Thunder is better now. It's better to do more damage all at once.

 

Rail was a pain in the you know what to deal with before the rebalance. It needed no improvements.

Edited by Raytank7
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Kirby2008's analysis of Freeze is wrong. At M4 freeze does more DPS than Firebird. Also, decrease the length of the freeze effect. It shouldn't take half the game to thaw.

 

Vulan is trash now. I'm so disappointed. The overheat, turret speed, and impact force okay. The damage ??? NO !!!

 

C8o has it right. Isida has been weakened. I used to love to play it. Now I can't keep my beam on enemy tanks unless they just stand there. Reverse the rebalance to the way it was before.

 

Firebird's 60 seconds of afterburn is ridiculous! 900 total damage? It needs to be reduced to maybe 10 seconds of afterburn and also at a reduced rate of damage.

 

Ricochet needed no improvments. It was already a great turret.

 

Shaft is still too weak in arcade mode.

 

Thunder is better now. It's better to do more damage all at once.

 

Rail was a pain in the you know what to deal with before the rebalance. It needed no improvements.

Don't forget that as firebird shoots, afterburn stacks on top of base damage. You're right about base, but Firebird does greater damage then freeze, with afterburn of course!

 

Vulcan still does 60DPS and can fire indefinitely, and still has that awesome impact force, so I think it's defitniely not trash! We'll see though its defintiely much weaker than before.

 

Isida just needs to be used differently, and with a bit more skill. I'm an isida user myself, and it's still very strong, especially with the increased shooting time. If anything it's stronger. Just keep your distance a bit more, it doesn't lose damage with range like the other shot range weapons.

 

60 seconds is a long time, but rarely do tanks ever burn for that long, especially if your team has an Isida or Freeze. Besides, when do you usually last more than 60 seconds anyway :p

 

Agree with Rico, it was strong before and still is now.

 

It's not necessarily better to deal damage all at once. True you get the bit shot preloaded with the extra what, 20 damage. But, it's slower to use, less dynamic, and more wasted damage, and I preferred the splash before. I think you're right, maybe, but I preferred it before personally anyway!

Edited by Pathfinder

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