Interview [Issue 45] A Discussion of Micro Upgrades

[Night-Sisters 2,139]

 
 
Hello Tankers! To round off and as an accompaniment article to The Pathological MUer, I conducted an interview with Wiki Administrator @Issho_Fujitora on the subject of Micro Upgrades, focusing in particular on the latest, somewhat controversial MU update. (Which, for your reading benefit, can be found here.) It was definitely an interesting and thought-provoking talk, so enough of this introductory blather. Without further ado, allow me to welcome...Issho_Fujitora.
 
@Issho_Fujitora: Hello!
 
@Night-Sisters: Hey there. Jumping right into the thick of things, what is your opinion of Micro Upgrading in general?
 
@Issho_Fujitora: In my opinion, Micro-upgrades have been a great addition to the Game features' list. Previously, users had only "standard" items to play with so, at a certain point of their career (top-rank, Generalissimo), they found themselves playing in battles against pretty much the same equipment they owned: M3 Hornet + M3 Isida, M3 Mammoth + M3 Freeze, etc..
Basically, battles were kind of boring since, at first glance, you could immediately identify and define how strong your enemy was and simply try to avoid the fight, if possible.
The implementation of MUs brought diversity, something that was missing in the game. It made the game more challenging, different in every battle you would play and also give you that feeling of "uncertainty" when fighting against other users: now, you can't immediately define how strong your enemy is, you have to analyze his/her gameplay and evaluate his/her strength carefully.
So, for example, facing a M3 Hornet + M3 Isida is not so easy as it was before MUs were implemented: you have to think twice about when and how to attack that combination  since it could be a "Fully Micro-upgraded (M4 or M3+)" one, but you cannot know that before facing it directly by actually PLAYING the fight
Each enemy you may fight in future will be different from the previous one, even just for one upgraded parameter, but still different; rushing into a fight thoughtlessly is not a good strategy anymore, you need to outsmart your enemies since they may even own upgraded equipment, but using a good strategy against them could still place you on the winning side of a fight.
 
@Night-Sisters: Do you like the latest update?
 
@Issho_Fujitora: Yes, I do.Even thought that some users call me "biased" due to me being an Admin and working for TO, I'm still firmly convinced that this update was great and necessary. Even if I was a user and not a Helper, I would have stated the same.
 
@Night-Sisters: And why do you think it was so necessary?
 
@Issho_Fujitora: I think that it was necessary due to the fact that the game is played in three different ways by its users:
 
- casual gameplay (few times a week / month and a general focus on the game)
- regular gameplay (many times a week / almost every day and a pretty deep focus on the game and its community)
- hardcore gameplay (every day, many hours a day and with a deep focus on the game, its community and events such as eSports)
 
So, if we analyze those categories, it is clear that each of them has its own needings (generally speaking): casual gamers and regular players could possibly find the previous system more complex than the current one due to their "low" amount of time spent in the game, they did not pay attention to all the existing variables and possibilities existing at that time.
hardcore games found the previous system better than the current one due to the high level of customization and planning involved in it.
The current system is found in the middle of all the above needings: it is easy and immediate to use, but still pretty customizable and detailed: random and regular users can upgrade the items they want with few clicks while hardcore users can evaluate and decide how many upgrades they should do to reach the best performance they are searching for a certain item.
 
@Night-Sisters: Do you think this update has improved the upgrading process?
 
@Issho_Fujitora: Yes, I do, but with some reservations that will be explained further below.
 
The previous system was more complex and not completely user friendly. When working on a world-wide product such as Tanki Online, the main aim for its Developers is to release something that users may use immediately, in a direct way, but that would still be fundamental to the product.
The previous system, at first glance, was too complex: firstly, users had to understand which parameter they should have updated to improve their item and, sometimes, it would take them some time (a clear example is the understanding of "Power" parameter for hulls, something that I had to explain thousands of times); secondly, users had to evaluate and decide how many upgrades they should have done to obtain what they needed and doing so was a pretty challenging task due to all the variables and possibilities existing back then. (Some items like Shaft, for example, have 6 different parameters and each of them deeply influence Shaft gameplay).
The current system is easier, direct and user-friendly: users have to decide if they should or should not upgrade an item and then evaluate how many upgrades they should do to obtain what they need, nothing else.
The "reservations" I have are related to the fact that the previous system, despite being more complex, let the users customize their items in a deeper and more accurate way, something that the current system does not allow since all parameters are upgraded at the same time.
 
@Night-Sisters: Has the cost of MUing changed with this update? How about the overall time required?
 
@Issho_Fujitora: After carefully analyzing the current system and comparing it to the previous one, my reply is a straight "NO". The cost of MUing did not change with this update, even if it seems so.
Even if the price did not change, the time needed to MU an item did change: upgrading an item now requires more time than before.
In exclusive for this article, I took some time to prepare a detailed list of comparisons between the previous system and the current one: below, you can find the list of turrets in the game right now and, in the spoilers under each of them, you can find specific information regarding Micro-upgrades with the two different systems.
 

 
THUNDER M3 - from M3 to M4

 

Old system time: 109633 minutes (76 days)
Current system time: 114875 minutes (80 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 765'805
Current system price (crystals): 765'750

 
FIREBIRD M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 62723 minutes (44 days)
Current system time: 147688 minutes (103 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 984'604
Current system price (crystals): 984'500

 

 
FREEZE M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 102864 minutes (71 days)
Current system time: 120'350 minutes (84 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 802'394
Current system price (crystals): 802'250

 
ISIDA M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 104155 minutes (72 days)
Current system time: 114875 minutes (80 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 727'512
Current system price (crystals): 765'750

 
TWINS M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 80060 minutes (56 days)
Current system time: 136775 minutes (95 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 911'802
Current system price (crystals): 911'750

 
RICOCHET M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 62724 minutes (44 days)
Current system time: 147688 minutes (103 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 984'599
Current system price (crystals): 984'500

 
SMOKY M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 80054 minutes (56 days)
Current system time: 136775 minutes (95 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 911’802
Current system price (crystals): 911750

 
RAILGUN M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 88083 minutes (61 days)
Current system time: 131263 minutes (91 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 875’203
Current system price (crystals): 875’000

 
SHAFT M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 102864 minutes (71 days)
Current system time: 120350 minutes (84 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 802’402
Current system price (crystals): 802’250

 
HAMMER M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 95683 minutes (66 days)
Current system time: 131263 minutes (91 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 838’801
Current system price (crystals): 875’000

 
VULCAN M3 - from M3 to M4

Old system time: 71610 minutes (50 days)
Current system time: 142213 minutes (99 days)
 
Old system price (crystals): 948’202
Current system price (crystals): 948’000

 

 

 
"Old system time" - total time needed to fully micro-upgrade a certain item (the previous system considered items' parameters singularly and users could upgrade specific parameters separately, so each parameter had its own MUing time - the "old system time" value is the sum of all those MUing times, related to their specific turrets)
"Old system price (crystals)" - total amount of crystals needed to fully micro-upgrade a certain item (the previous system considered items' parameters singularly and users could upgrade specific parameters separately, so each parameter had its own MUing price - the "old system price (crystals)" value is the sum of all those MUing prices, related to their specific turrets)
 
As you can clearly see, the cost of upgrading an item from its "standard" M3 version to its "elite" M4 (or M3+) version costs you the same amount of crystals it used to be before, except for a couple of them: do not believe to those users claiming that the current system is a rip-off and that it costs you more, the stats below were taken directly from the game by myself.
 
@Night-Sisters: How much work did this update create for you, as a Wiki Administrator?
 
@Issho_Fujitora: It took me around 6 hours of straight editing. It could have taken less, maybe 2 or 3 hours, but the task was difficult to be done in a single shot: I needed to completely re-work all the existing pages regarding Micro-upgrades.
As I stated before during this interview, the previous system considered items' parameters singularly, so each item MUs' page held a list of item's modifications (M0, M1, M2 and M3) and each modification had its own parameters, split in specific tables.
 

 
The new system unified all parameters: now, pages hold only a list of item's modifications (M0, M1, M2 and M3) and each modification has its own specific MUs' tables.
 

 
As you can imagine, editing each page (turrets, hulls and paints) was not something that could be done in a single shot: I assure you that I had to drink a couple of cups of coffee and take some rest for my eyes, but I managed to update the last page exactly 21 hours after the update was in the game.
I am really glad of how I managed to do this since I granted to all the users seeking for information about this revolutionary upgrade all what they needed to know, in the shortest time possible, which is what I usually care the most when working for TO
 
@Night-Sisters: Can you speak a bit on the conversion of old MUs to reflect the new system? That was a pretty big deal...anyone with even a single fully-upgraded parameter suddenly owned the next full "M".
 
@Issho_Fujitora: Basically, the previous system's parameters had different amount of steps while the current system standardized that amount to 50 steps for each item (apart for paints, were the amount of steps is not fixed for all of them - some have 20, some have 5, etc..). Converting from the previous system to the current one could have caused a loss on the users' side since parameters were unified and stats were completely changed and re-assigned in an improved mathematical distribution than the one being used before and this is why, if some users completely micro-upgraded one single parameter with the old system, they received a M4 (or M3+) item when the new system was implemented.
In short, to prevent possible losses on the users' side, the Devs evaluated that it was better to assign to users the highest upgrade possible for an item all based on how far they upgraded that item with the old system: users' obtained the same upgraded item (so, if they upgraded Isida up to a certain point, with the new system they obtained Isida upgraded AT LEAST at the same level as it was before) and not less, or that would be equal to a loss for the users.
 
@Night-Sisters: Was this a wise choice on Tanki's part? Do you think it created any imbalance in the game?
 
@Issho_Fujitora: It almost was a forced choice on TO's part for the reasons I mentioned above, but it was not aimed at creating any game-imbalance: just as it went for all the other updates happened in the past, the time heals all possible imbalances and, were the "time" can't do anything, the Devs will immediately release some fixes or tweaks to the system to make it more balanced.
The Devs carefully and closely monitor all the stats and aspects of this Game, so do not think that they may not be immediately aware of possible imbalances, they just need time to elaborate a fair solution to them, solutions that may not cause losses on users' sides and still prevent further and unexpected, consequent imbalances.
 
Keeping a perfect balance in a MMO like Tanki Online is not easy: trying to fix "some parameters" to heal an imbalance may cause other imbalances over other aspects of the game, so each decision and update has to be deeply thought off before being released
 

@Night-Sisters: And that's it. Thank you so much for your time!
 
@Issho_Fujitora: Thank you for calling me in to answer such questions and for letting me explain this argument. :)

Edited July 29, 2017 by Hexed

[The.Skilled.Legend 1,459]

Nooo, someone makes better Interviews than me now ((

 

Great Job nonetheless. 

[SHOAIB.ZAFAR 402]

Thanks @Issho_Fujitora for your hard work. Really appreciate it. Keep it up! :)

[Quarks 2,255]

The things I learned from this article'

1. Wiki editor is hard, but I still want to be one.
2. I might mu a little more.
3. Don't m4 hammer.

[lukey0 27,543]

Very nice, I'm sure this cleaned up any false rumours.

[ConcealedMarksmen 0]

Thanks for the article. You're right. The developers needed to simplify the system. I like that everything is a uniform amount of upgrades (50) and that speed-ups are also uniform. But for me, I don't, like the system because it doesn't make sense for me to spend all the extra cash to upgrade hornet's weight and power because i will not make my money back before it is time to buy hornet m2! For m3 equipment, this new system is fine because micro upgrades are the only way to upgrade your tank period. But for lower ranked tanks, it only makes sense to upgrade the big micro-upgrades like armor, damage, maybe penetration power on rail and turning speed on shaft. You cannot however make your money back anymore if you upgrade your tank because you have to spend a lot of money to upgrade your speed 0.01. +0.01 speed does not make enough of a difference.

 

Maybe the devs could let tankers be able to split up the microupgrade. That way, Warrant Officer 4 tankers would only have to upgrade titan's armor while Generalissimos could upgrade all of vulcan's parameters.

 

P.S. Thank you so much for maintaining the Wiki.It is SO helpful

Edited December 18, 2015 by ConcealedMarksmen

[DarthMaul667 18]

Great Article! Lets have a round of applause for Night-Sisters as well as Issho_Fujitora! I have to say, I liked the old system better, But I am completely grateful for the explanation of the new one. Good to know I'm saving 203 crystals when I M4 my rail!

[Xenophobia 457]

I agree that the price from M3 to M4 didn't really change but now you have to MU every paramater. Let's take hornet for example. Personally, I would fully MU protection and speed but now I have to fully MU every paramater, something that will cost me much more.

[Guest]

I agree that the price from M3 to M4 didn't really change but now you have to MU every paramater. Let's take hornet for example. Personally, I would fully MU protection and speed but now I have to fully MU every paramater, something that will cost me much more.

No, it will not. The cost is the same, equal to the previous MUs' system.

 

Example: if you needed 100'000 crystals to upgrade 5 parameters or Railgun to the max, now you need 100'000 to do the same, but you will not have to upgrade them singularly, one by one: you will upgrade them all in a click.

[Xenophobia 457]

No, it will not. The cost is the same, equal to the previous MUs' system.

 

Example: if you needed 100'000 crystals to upgrade 5 parameters or Railgun to the max, now you need 100'000 to do the same, but you will not have to upgrade them singularly, one by one: you will upgrade them all in a click.

No no, I mean at hornet for example, I would fully MU only protection and speed and I wouldn't upgrade weight, power or turning speed. But now, it's impossible to MU just those two and I'll have to fully MU everything. In that case, it will cost me more because I have to fully MU hornet while with the old system I would just MU those two paramaters and ignore the other three.

[Night-Sisters 2,139]

No no, I mean at hornet for example, I would fully MU only protection and speed and I wouldn't upgrade weight, power or turning speed. But now, it's impossible to MU just those two and I'll have to fully MU everything. In that case, it will cost me more because I have to fully MU hornet while with the old system I would just MU those two paramaters and ignore the other three.

+ IMO this is one of the major problems with the new MU system. It's all or nothing now, with no in-between. 

[Guest]

No no, I mean at hornet for example, I would fully MU only protection and speed and I wouldn't upgrade weight, power or turning speed. But now, it's impossible to MU just those two and I'll have to fully MU everything. In that case, it will cost me more because I have to fully MU hornet while with the old system I would just MU those two paramaters and ignore the other three.

+ IMO this is one of the major problems with the new MU system. It's all or nothing now, with no in-between. 

Ah, understood :) It costs more than what you planned, that is something I need to agree with!

 

As I stated in the interview above, the current system is less customizable than the previous one and that leads to things like the one you just stated.

[Torben_BoS 1,496]

long text :mellow:

I have not read all (its to much for a german player :D )

But I liked the parts i read.

I like the new "mu" system too, but i don't thik it's necessary :)

Edited December 21, 2015 by Torben_BoS

[Bass08x 4]

Let's imagine I had fully MUed the damages of my M3 Railgun(before the update). With the update I would now have an M4 Railgun. But if today YOU buy an M3 Railgun, MU it all the way up to M4 will cost you far more than it cost me.

This results in an imbalance between equipments bought/MUed before and after the update.

Not that I'm complaining about paying for parameters I don't mind of (as Xenopobia said), but the real issue is that for the same amount of crystals spent, an item will be weaker/stonger (I'm talking about the main parameters such as protection or damages) depending on if it has been upgraded after/before the update.

 

PS: feel free to ask me to reformulate if you don't find my post clear enough.

Edited December 21, 2015 by Bass08x

[BSG-62 512]

Oh yeah, i'm totally spending 2000 hard-earned crystals to get an extra 0.01 speed.

[Bugs.meeny 1,013]

MUs arent worth it until M3

[allani5 0]

S