[Forum] What do you think it would be like if just about every topic wasn't locked instantly?

[r_Damn_Slow0 12,476]

 

Topic merged.

 

Thanks for sharing your concerns.  I'd like to attract your attention to the topic "In response to the forum team..." as well as the 3 previous pages in this very one.

 

Why did our drunk administrators remove the downvote button?

 

And the most ridiculous thing of all? GETTING BANNED ON THE FORUM ALSO GETS YOU BANNED FROM GAME CHAT!

How are they even related?

 

My opinion is you remove the forum rules altogether, an action is taken about a post/topic if it makes sense

Also, I'd like to just point out a general remark about the amusing fact that its pointless to ask "why did drunk people do something" when you're already stating or inferring they were/ are drunk :p

 

As for the bans transferring over to the game and forum in both direction, its been a feature we pretty much always had.  We are not interested in having our players violate the rules in 1 place and still be free to carrying on their violations in another place of the same game.  Banning in 1 place defeats the purpose of banning if the perpetrator can just carry on elsewhere.  

 

Now what makes sense to 1 individual doesn't de facto makes it globally logical.  Now we need rules, cause if we rely on "common sense" you're gonna see moderators do all sorts of weird stuff and trust me you would not like that at all.  So, the rules is there as a safeguard against inconsistent moderation as much as it is a preventive measure for too colourful or completely irrelevant posts in the forum.

[r_Damn_Slow0 12,476]

I agree to this.

Sorry, but the downvote button is never coming back.  There's times when even me it eats me on the inside to have that red button to click on upon seeing certain posts, but, that thing wasn't really bringing any value to the community or the project whatsoever.  In fact it served more to slow down progress, incite flame wars and clans used it to massively dislike other clan pages as some sort of amusing internet TP equivalent  :lol:

---

:lol: = me nostalgic of the days when I used to get a pm each day from a clan leader asking me "can you remove the new 200 dislikes on my clan page?"

[franc3king 33]

Didn't know people could get.. That drunk..

You don't make sense, damn_slow, it's not like the people you see on the forum are the same as the ones you see in-game, it's rare to meet the same person in game, and it's not like people behave the same on forum and in game, some people do not ever use the chat feature, but they do use the forum, how do you assume they'll carry on breaking the rules? I cannot troll in the game like I do on the forums, they're completely two different things.

 

As for the downvote button..

Those flame wars would've happened either way, and those clan leaders whose posts get disliked are completely legit, if some dislikes you, you have to live with it, there's nothing you can do about it, you were meant to be disliked by that specific person, why do clan leaders even care that they got too many dislikes? Are clans made to just impress people?

And please, of course that would happen, that moderators do all sorts of weird stuff..

BECAUSE WE HAVE BAD MODERATORS.

There are no rules in every single forum I go but this, and they seem to run perfectly, if you could, for example, hire just a couple of moderators and train them, rather than too many who have no idea what they're doing, it would work, and everyone would like it.

Do they not understand when to merge? I find it strange here.. Merging should happen when the OP himself posts topics of the same discussion, I'm speaking of other proper forums, other than that, topics aren't merged, and aren't hidden, they either stay or get locked.. Right, why did they stop locking topics? I literally don't see any topic locked these days, which is ridiculous, because the OP of a topic has invested a good amount of his time typing and making it, and most hidden topics actually have a point that shall be seen by the public.

I'm tired from typing, will type more later :)

[You.Have.to.die 519]

Sorry, but the downvote button is never coming back.  There's times when even me it eats me on the inside to have that red button to click on upon seeing certain posts, but, that thing wasn't really bringing any value to the community or the project whatsoever.  In fact it served more to slow down progress, incite flame wars and clans used it to massively dislike other clan pages as some sort of amusing internet TP equivalent  :lol:

---

:lol: = me nostalgic of the days when I used to get a pm each day from a clan leader asking me "can you remove the new 200 dislikes on my clan page?"

I agree with this "statement" that you purposed upon us, but it was also used as a way of creating meaning less topic so people would just get people to down vote topics, i did have the luxury of that synchronising red button  :lol:  but giving a green like means that they're doing something good and beautiful such as the creative section and forum games and is to show encouragement towards the players of tankionline. (Yes, one button can cause so many agreements :P) However, the crazy example is making us as players, sound like a bunch of monkey's in cage.

Edited May 18, 2016 by You.Have.to.die

[Lankbouv 6,347]

The funny thing is that every once in a while players complain about mods locking topics then they get bored/grow up/quit tanki/or just move onto entertaining themselves in clans or others things in TO.  then a new breed comes along and the same happens.  The same complaints have been made time and time over....and what you find is that many topics you thought were cool a while ago now suck badly that's what I found.  I mean when I look back at topics I made years ago I hang my head in shame at how bad they are.....so dead and pointless.

 

Right now my problem is that there are too many trashy topics on forum...the only interesting ones are my clan page, my enemy's clan page and those criticising others as they provide great opportunity for massive wars of words....I wish the forum could be something else.  I no longer have a problem with mods locking the topic, it's only your own fault for getting topics locked.

[You.Have.to.die 519]

The funny thing is that every once in a while players complain about mods locking topics then they get bored/grow up/quit tanki/or just move onto entertaining themselves in clans or others things in TO. then a new breed comes along and the same happens. The same complaints have been made time and time over....and what you find is that many topics you thought were cool a while ago now suck badly that's what I found. I mean when I look back at topics I made years ago I hang my head in shame at how bad they are.....so dead and pointless.

 

Right now my problem is that there are too many trashy topics on forum...the only interesting ones are my clan page, my enemy's clan page and those criticising others as they provide great opportunity for massive wars of words....I wish the forum could be something else. I no longer have a problem with mods locking the topic, it's only your own fault for getting topics locked.

Yes, you have put that to the bone of the true, now close this topic :P

[r_Damn_Slow0 12,476]

Topic renamed from "What do you think these forums would be like if just about every topic wasn't locked instantly?"

[r_Damn_Slow0 12,476]

1)

Didn't know people could get.. That drunk..

You don't make sense, damn_slow,

 

2)

it's not like the people you see on the forum are the same as the ones you see in-game, it's rare to meet the same person in game, and it's not like people behave the same on forum and in game, some people do not ever use the chat feature, but they do use the forum, how do you assume they'll carry on breaking the rules? I cannot troll in the game like I do on the forums, they're completely two different things.

 

3)

As for the downvote button..

Those flame wars would've happened either way, and those clan leaders whose posts get disliked are completely legit, if some dislikes you, you have to live with it, there's nothing you can do about it, you were meant to be disliked by that specific person, why do clan leaders even care that they got too many dislikes? Are clans made to just impress people?

 

4)

And please, of course that would happen, that moderators do all sorts of weird stuff..

BECAUSE WE HAVE BAD MODERATORS.

There are no rules in every single forum I go but this, and they seem to run perfectly, if you could, for example, hire just a couple of moderators and train them, rather than too many who have no idea what they're doing, it would work, and everyone would like it.

 

5)

Do they not understand when to merge? I find it strange here.. Merging should happen when the OP himself posts topics of the same discussion, I'm speaking of other proper forums, other than that, topics aren't merged, and aren't hidden, they either stay or get locked.. Right, why did they stop locking topics? I literally don't see any topic locked these days, which is ridiculous, because the OP of a topic has invested a good amount of his time typing and making it, and most hidden topics actually have a point that shall be seen by the public.

1. That first bit was a humorous observation.  Sorry if you didn't get it.

    

2. No they are not completely different things, they are part of the bigger Tanki experience.  The tanki forum is complementary to the game.  And no, I do not assume they'll keep on breaking rules on all mediums, we see them do it all them time !!  We even have 1 common records (karma) where all violations made whether on forum or in bans are logged and there's a clear pattern there.  The ones who violated the forum rules tend to also be violating the game rules and vice-versa.

    

3. Its not just about clan leaders, that was just an example.  We had other people, who made great topics for the community, but just cause they crossed the wrong person or gang, their topic were massively disliked.  Those dislikes had nothing to do with the topic content, but it set a red stain on the topic nevertheless.  There's quite a few other ways where the red dislike only yielded in more disruption than good.

    

4. If a moderator behaves badly, report him!  Send me a pm with a screenshot or 2 of what the mod did bad and I'll take all the necessary actions.  Its not rocket science.  If they're really bad they'll go.  If they're not so bad but need some tweaking, we'll tweak them.  And your help in that is greatly appreciated.  Making topics saying mods are bad and not providing legitimate reasons for why they are bad doesn't help at all.  It would just be like saying "I don't like him" but without any valid reasons.

    

5. Here's when we merge things : when multiple topics are made to discuss about the same thing.  The reason we merge is to keep all the discussion in 1 place, easy for the concerned people to follow, and easier for them to take actions if/ where/ when necessary.  Having the talks be scattered all over the place = precious feedback get lost + other not so great things.

   About locked topics, some sections are now doing away with them.  The latest in line is the I&S section.  Other sections will follow but nevertheless certain topics will still get locked down for moderating purposes and/or other usual reasons.

[tony990_Superstar 68]

People would get to express their opinion, *************************************************************************

Edited May 19, 2016 by Cedric Debono
I will not tolerate people making unjust blanket statements about a race, country or population in this forum. Do not ever make a statement like that again.

[theFiringHand 21,351]

Sorry, but the downvote button is never coming back. 

Allow me to elaborate on this, and once again explain what we had already stated in the announcement when we removed the down vote button.

 

The down vote button did not serve any real purpose. It actually killed the conversation in a forum. People were simply down voting without taking the time to explain their motivations for disliking a post. And that helped absolutely nobody. It didn't help us do a better job, and it didn't help the original poster, because there was absolutely NO feedback to work with.

 

Additionally, the down vote system was often abused by people who wanted to gang up on and bully a particular person or other, and that is something that is unacceptable, not just in Tanki Online but anywhere.

 

So, as stated, no, the down vote button is not coming back.

 

On a final note, a little bit of decency when addressing each other really wouldn't harm. We're all guests here. Please behave accordingly.

[Lankbouv 6,347]

I agree with the downvote being removed in some ways but I feel that it was massively useful when TO brought out an update and they could gauge what the forum users thought (the more intelligent and committed TO players). Then people still wrote on the comments what they disliked as well. I didn't see a problem. However from the perspective of clan pages and others it was good..in fact I would suggest doing a survey about updates (which ik has been done) and include a simple positive or negative feedback with the option to comment about why it was bad or good. You need to gather numbers... And the best way to do this would be through ingame surveys.

 

Forum users often would be against updatwa such as the rebalance or smart supplies but we put pressure and normal drugging was added to pro battle mode. So you need to understand forum users are different to in game users and to compare a survey or the two would be intriguing.

 

Most people hate change but later turn to enjoy it. as I have done )

[Maf 32,305]

I agree with the downvote being removed in some ways but I feel that it was massively useful when TO brought out an update and they could gauge what the forum users thought (the more intelligent and committed TO players).

The thing is, even if removing the downvotes causes only 10 more people to actually post their opinion instead of just leaving a dislike, it would still be a better feedback that having the likes and dislikes to use as an update's success measure. Besides, having dislikes on a topic had influence on those who came to view it. People would see a lot of downvotes and also downvote the topic just because others did it, often without actually trying out the update or even reading the information.

[franc3king 33]

 

• That first bit was a humorous observation.  Sorry if you didn't get it.

   

• No they are not completely different things, they are part of the bigger Tanki experience.  The tanki forum is complementary to the game.  And no, I do not assume they'll keep on breaking rules on all mediums, we see them do it all them time !!  We even have 1 common records (karma) where all violations made whether on forum or in bans are logged and there's a clear pattern there.  The ones who violated the forum rules tend to also be violating the game rules and vice-versa.

   

• Its not just about clan leaders, that was just an example.  We had other people, who made great topics for the community, but just cause they crossed the wrong person or gang, their topic were massively disliked.  Those dislikes had nothing to do with the topic content, but it set a red stain on the topic nevertheless.  There's quite a few other ways where the red dislike only yielded in more disruption than good.

   

• If a moderator behaves badly, report him!  Send me a pm with a screenshot or 2 of what the mod did bad and I'll take all the necessary actions.  Its not rocket science.  If they're really bad they'll go.  If they're not so bad but need some tweaking, we'll tweak them.  And your help in that is greatly appreciated.  Making topics saying mods are bad and not providing legitimate reasons for why they are bad doesn't help at all.  It would just be like saying "I don't like him" but without any valid reasons.

   

• Here's when we merge things : when multiple topics are made to discuss about the same thing.  The reason we merge is to keep all the discussion in 1 place, easy for the concerned people to follow, and easier for them to take actions if/ where/ when necessary.  Having the talks be scattered all over the place = precious feedback get lost + other not so great things.

  About locked topics, some sections are now doing away with them.  The latest in line is the I&S section.  Other sections will follow but nevertheless certain topics will still get locked down for moderating purposes and/or other usual reasons.

1. I did get it, but there are levels of drunkenness, you know? Yes they're drunk so they do all sorts of weird stuff, but messing with the game is just.. Too drunk.

 

2. I find this bullcrap, the chat feature is a really important one, although I do not use it frequently, there are times when it's a MUST, especially during battles, what's the harm if you ban them on the forum, and then again ban them on the game if they break any more rules? Or are our moderators too lazy for this? There are people like me who might break the rules on the forum but not in-game, why am I not being taken into consideration?

 

3. As for the downvote button, the pros actually outweigh the cons, AND IT'S IRONIC THAT YOU MODERATORS ARE COMPLAINING ABOUT IT, why are our moderators incredibly lazy? Can't you just ban those who start a flame war and then everything's good? I don't understand you people..

 

4. Wow, you think I have plenty of time on my hands? Why don't you watch them? Aren't you an administrator? And funnily enough, even if I report them for like, removing a legit topic, you'll argue that it was the right decision to do, because most of the moderators who do that are in actually big positions, maybe even in bigger positions than you, there's nothing you can do but support him/her, and I actually provide tons of legit reasons why a moderator is wrong, why would I hate them for no reason?

 

5. It does make sense, but our moderators are doing it wrong, and please, as if like 90% of forum topics aren't actually spam? The ones they merge are the most informative, AND I can bet that no OP likes his topic merged with another one, especially if it's in another section, like what the hell? I post a topic in off-topic discussion and they merge it with one in problems and solutions? Even if it doesn't actually belong there? Even moderators don't know where topics belong? This is ridiculous.

 

And one more point, I'm surprised that they actually just remove the topics completely, without giving the OP any reason, I post a legit topic/post and the next day it's gone, why did they stop locking topics and giving a reason, or are they too LAZY for this?

[Lankbouv 6,347]

You make a good point maf :)

[Maf 32,305]

there are times when it's a MUST, especially during battles, what's the harm if you ban them on the forum, and then again ban them on the game if they break any more rules? Or are our moderators too lazy for this? There are people like me who might break the rules on the forum but not in-game, why am I not being taken into consideration?

The game chat and forum are both means of players communicating with one another. If someone is violating rules in one place, then (as DS said) they are likely to do the same in the other place too. And the fact that the two are not the same does not mean that giving out bans in both doesn't make sense. It's a punishment. A punishment is meant to make your life inconvenient so that you rethink your actions and not do the same thing again. And that "inconvenience" does not have to be directly related to the thing you did wrong.

 

It's simple - if you want to use the game chat freely, don't violate rules on the forum.

 

Can't you just ban those who start a flame war and then everything's good? I don't understand you people..

No, we can't. Downvoting a topic does not violate any rules, but it provokes the other user(s) to post flame/insults in response, for which they can get banned. As a result the initiator of the conflict remains untouched, the victim gets banned and the forum is stuck with a messed up topic that has a bunch of downvotes for no reason. It was a loophole in the rules and it had to be removed.

 

because most of the moderators who do that are in actually big positions, maybe even in bigger positions than you, there's nothing you can do but support him/her

What? I mean, WHAT?!?!?! You're saying that the mods somehow have greater influence over their administrator and he can't do anything about it? That is some seriously messed up logic there and I have no idea how you even managed to come to that conclusion. The only way DS would support us and reject your complain is if we actually didn't do anything wrong and you simply misunderstood something about the rules or the particular instance that you were complaining about.

 

And if you actually think that an administrator has made a mistake, then the only option is to complain to the CM, but by that point I can guarantee you that whatever it is you are trying to prove is your own misconception.

 

The ones they merge are the most informative, AND I can bet that no OP likes his topic merged with another one, especially if it's in another section, like what the hell?

And I can bet you that every single OP wants to be "in the spotlight" and have their own topic to discuss an issue, rather than using an already existing topic with an identical, or very similar discussion. It doesn't matter how informative a topic is - if it discusses an issue that has already been raised and explained thoroughly in another topic, then there is no point keeping them separate.

 

And one more point, I'm surprised that they actually just remove the topics completely, without giving the OP any reason, I post a legit topic/post and the next day it's gone, why did they stop locking topics and giving a reason, or are they too LAZY for this?

We remove dozens of topics every day, many of which are complete rubbish and were posted by users, who clearly know why their topic will be removed and just wanted to make our life more difficult. Sending a PM to each one of them will more than double the amount of work we need to do, so we would be wasting our time writing PMs that many players won't even bother to read. It's not a case of laziness, but rather it being an unnecessary waste of time and effort. If someone wants to know the reason for the removal of their topic, they can PM a mod to find out - we never ignore such requests.

[franc3king 33]

That's the only thing you moderators would invest your time in? Arguing?

You keep repeating the same exact points, although you do realize that they don't make sense.

 

All I was suggesting is to lock topics from now on instead of removing them, and for this forum's sake, if you move or merge a topic, SEND THE REASON TO THE OP, and bringing back the downvote button would be nice, and it's not bad in any way IMO, but I can't blame you for this, I blame the players who actually report to you people about getting downvoted a lot, which is stupid, because the downvotes button exists in every single forum, the good and the bad. That's a summary of what I was saying.

 

I find it time consuming and pointless to argue with you guys, because you just won't get it, maybe a mental issue or something, but I gave you plenty of reasons to actually consider what I was saying, but even the administrators can't do their jobs properly, I have no clue how they were promoted, corrupt game..

 

So yeah, that's pretty much it, folks, it's not like I care, but I have been on the forum since like 2011, and I loved it back then, hoping the moderators and administrators would get even better by time, but that's definitely not the case here, the quality of those two keeps decreasing.. Hope Cedric is actually reading this topic.

 

Thank you for your time, and for wasting mine :)

Edited May 20, 2016 by franc3king

[builderb 19]

The only reason they got rid of the downvote button was because of the massive spam of dislikes that plagued the update threads ofc people are gonna downvote updates that highly favour people who buy and people who play for free and tbh the updates to tanki have been really bad. Another problem of tanki is that the developers of tanki have stopped listening to the community especially when a bad update appears they just continue with the bad updates and disregard any comments and have removed the downvote button because of this reason they just ignore us. As franc3king has stated the game is getting really bad and the forum is getting a mess maybe if you guys could actually lock useless topics and such this would decrease the workload of mods so that they can work better and catch people who actually violate the game rules.

[marc.jp_44 20,837]

I think it'd be utter chaos. Tanki has valid reasons to lock Topics. Sami's Topics were destroying the reputation of Tanki, whether it be true or false. If you were a business, wouldn't you not want bad promotions against your name?

[franc3king 33]

It's funny that this topic was made to discuss that too many topics are getting locked, which is not what's happening.

PLEASE LOCK TOPICS, I BEG YOU. Don't hide them..

[Maf 32,305]

That's the only thing you moderators would invest your time in? Arguing?

You keep repeating the same exact points, although you do realize that they don't make sense.

Same vice versa.

You keep repeating the exact same points and pay no attention to our explanations regarding what is wrong with your arguments. Your only reason to bring back downvotes is that they are on all other forums (which isn't actually true). That means nothing. We had downvotes before, they caused a ton of problems, they were removed. Simple as that.

 

All I was suggesting is to lock topics from now on instead of removing them, and for this forum's sake, if you move or merge a topic, SEND THE REASON TO THE OP

We don't remove topics that somewhat make sense. If a user posts a topic that he clearly put some effort into and was serious about (i.e. not posting just to troll), but violates a minor forum rule, such as discussing a specific player, duplicate topic or asking a question, then we would never hide it. The only topics that get hidden (i.e. removed) are ones with major rule violations, such as excessive profanity, explicit material, heavy spam/flood, scam, racism, slander, etc. The contents of these topics are unsuitable for the forum and must not be available for users to view, which is why they need to be hidden instead of locked.

 

Besides, having a bunch of locked topics ruins the look of any forum section, making it unorganised and difficult to browse.

 

If you have any specific topics for which the above logic was not true, I would like you to point them out.

[franc3king 33]

You actually don't?

 

Issho removed my topic which is up there in this post, I had to ask him to actually put it back, only to find it is merged..

How nice of him..

I'm impressed by you guys.

 

And I'M REAPEATING THE SAME POINTS? lol, I clearly keep giving different reasons for something to happen, you don't, and please, there's no "simple as that", the downvote button was the best thing that happened to this forum, players could show that they don't like an update OR downvote decisions made by you guys, and it does exist in every forum, maybe you haven't seen enough?

 

It makes sense to hide topics with major insults, but that's not what you're doing, I post topics myself and I see you locking all of them, despite no major rule violations or any at all.

OK fine, hide all the topics you want.

But the posts? I post like 10 posts and 8 of them are gone, with the 8 being humorous posts that give value to the topic and the remaining two are lame, ordinary posts.

 

Why do forums exist, if I may ask? :)

Edited May 22, 2016 by franc3king

[werty8763 1,483]

Here's a deep thought:

If the mods were to be a little less strict, would the forum become better or worse? :huh:

Edited May 24, 2016 by werty8763

[sonofchrysalis3 3,719]

Here's a deep thought:

If the mods were to be a little less strict, would the forum become better or worse? :huh:

Here's a deep answer:

The forum would be loaded down with flaming and obscene topics if the mods became "less strict." The whole point of the current rules and moderation system is trying to keep this forum safe for young players whose parents trust this game and its forum to not parade immorality before their children.

Edited May 25, 2016 by sonofchrysalis3

[DonCarnage 1,270]

That's the only thing you moderators would invest your time in? Arguing?

You keep repeating the same exact points, although you do realize that they don't make sense.

 

All I was suggesting is to lock topics from now on instead of removing them, and for this forum's sake, if you move or merge a topic, SEND THE REASON TO THE OP.

Our policy is to lock over binning with a post explaining why. Sometimes this doesn't happen if a thread becomes offensive or if it is merged with another thread, but we do leave a message informing the OP that his/her topic has been merged with another thread to keep him from creating another thread again and again.