New balance changes and other features

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

1 already won

 

Of course I would like to be more OP than everyone else. Isn't that the point? We struggle through all the ranks, conserve crystals like crazy, so we can buy some OP equipment and get it upgraded as much as possible. So we can KILL.  And, no, smoky is not that similar to rail to me. I just hate the autoaim feature of rail and have always thought it was a little unfair. I have to aim my smoky or thunder or even the Vulcan in order to hit something.

Of course. There's nothing wrong with wanting to have better equipment than everyone else, in fact it is this motivation that keeps the game going.  I was just pointing out that you shouldn't want a turret to be nerfed just because you don't like it.  

 

I know how annoying it is when Railguns miss you and still do damage, but other guns have stuff like that too.  Vulcan follows you around corners.  Ricochet projectiles can pass by you and still do damage.  And seeing as you use Smoky m4 a lot, I'm surprised Railguns give you that much trouble.  And thunder has the splash, so you don't have to hit them exactly.

 

I personally like being equal in equipment to everyone else, but that's just one mindset and one of many acceptable ones...

Edited November 15, 2016 by r_I_already_won0

[RIDDLER_8 5,552]

We now need to have four protection modules for only Legend players, because the re-balance update has made all the turrets and hulls weaker than before.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

We now need to have four protection modules for only Legend players, because the re-balance update has made all the turrets and hulls weaker than before.

Developers aren't planning on introducing quadruple modules.

[Tani_S 736]

The problem is if tanki did come out with more quad protection modules they would want 500K for them.

I thought one of the major changes of the paint/module separation update was to remove all quadruple protection, as it "had a negative effect on the game balance" like they said. But if they would introduce with a 35% protection vs all 4 turrets, I would place the quadruple module at a price tag of around 400k together with 1,400k crystals for all the MUs, if you want to align it to the figures of all the other M3 modules. The thing is that this module would then have a protection in sum of 200% when fully equipped.

Edited November 16, 2016 by Tani_S

[wolverine848 13,097]

MY SELF HEAL IS GONE!!!! :angry:  :angry:  :angry:

And it won't get any better. Stays at 10% at all M-levels.  Good luck.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

I thought one of the major changes of the paint/module separation update was to remove all quadruple protection, as it "had a negative effect on the game balance" like they said. But if they would introduce with a 35% protection vs all 4 turrets, I would place the quadruple module at a price tag of around 400k together with 1,400k crystals for all the MUs, if you want to align it to the figures of all the other M3 modules. The thing is that this module would then have a protection in sum of 200% when fully equipped.

Well a fully upgraded module has to fill two requirements:

 

-It has to have protection that adds up to AT MOST 150%

 

-It has to have NO MORE than 50% per turret.

 

So if we were to introduce quad modules, then each fully upgraded parameter would protect 37%.  And I think it should cost 350k, not 400k, since the overall protection is not any better.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

the thing that has a negative impact on the game balance, is that it's possible to have more then 33% protection of a single turret

Edited November 16, 2016 by BlackWasp777

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

the thing that has a negative impact on the game balance, is that it's possible to have more then 33% protection of a single turret

hhh Just mad because everyone has Rail protection xD :D :D :D

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

no, it's not about my turret.

 

It is about all the hulls:

a protection of 33% gives you +50% lifetime

a protection of 50% gives you +100% lifetime

 

The last updates shifted the "usefullness" of hulls -> and it shifted it again towards mediums and heavies.

In your ranks the hornets are still awesome, but the higher you rank the more vikings and hunter and Titans you will see.

That's the result of the last couple of balance changes.. the light hulls become more and more obsolete, except you fight on really large maps

 

I stepped though a couple of battles today, and what I saw was about 30% heavies (mainly Titans), 60% mediums (Vikings + Hunters, no Dictators) and 5..10% light hulls (most of them Hornets, almost no Wasps) on maps like Kungur, Serpuchov, Barda.

The only point where I saw Wasps was on Stadium CTF. And of course in that one Kungur, that was hopelessly lost.. so that it didnt matter if the enemy drove around wiht Wasp Smoky M4 + DD.

 

I don't like it.

I own a Viking myself.. and I know why (but since the rebalance I wished I had a hunter -.-)

[Tani_S 736]

-It has to have protection that adds up to AT MOST 150%

Hmm... then we either have to break the standard, that all m3 modules have a 35 % protection or we break the standard maximum protection sum of 150%. If the module would only have 150% at most, it wouldn't make sense to have a 400k price. 300k price suits to me more (assuming a standard protection sum of ~105), because it is the same protection amount like triple modules, but just more dispersed. The MUs price will then be at 900k, because the output is the same like the other modules. The equal protection for every turret would result in a standard protection of 26% and go up to 38%.

 

But I think it is very probably that TO won't introduce them, since it would make it less standardized and eventually less balanced.

Edited November 16, 2016 by Tani_S

[klatoink 0]

that sucks. Without official announcement they started Tanki X. Good game well played devs. Now i dont even feel like registering there

No worries, been there, you are not missing anything ...

[klatoink 0]

no, it's not about my turret.

 

It is about all the hulls:

a protection of 33% gives you +50% lifetime

a protection of 50% gives you +100% lifetime

 

The last updates shifted the "usefullness" of hulls -> and it shifted it again towards mediums and heavies.

In your ranks the hornets are still awesome, but the higher you rank the more vikings and hunter and Titans you will see.

That's the result of the last couple of balance changes.. the light hulls become more and more obsolete, except you fight on really large maps

 

I stepped though a couple of battles today, and what I saw was about 30% heavies (mainly Titans), 60% mediums (Vikings + Hunters, no Dictators) and 5..10% light hulls (most of them Hornets, almost no Wasps) on maps like Kungur, Serpuchov, Barda.

The only point where I saw Wasps was on Stadium CTF. And of course in that one Kungur, that was hopelessly lost.. so that it didnt matter if the enemy drove around wiht Wasp Smoky M4 + DD.

 

I don't like it.

I own a Viking myself.. and I know why (but since the rebalance I wished I had a hunter -.-)

I agree and I liked playing wasp but not anymore you just get blown away. Much more 1,2,3,4,5 play, increse of thunders and one shot near your wasp blows.

 

looking at the specs in the garage, viking M3 is now just as strong as dicator m3 and hunter m3 and viking is faster, or am I not understanding the specs? In wiki the specs and micro upgrades are old. i thought only viking now counts. Surprised you regret not having hunter.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

You do understand the specs right, but Speed is not all.

 

Think about the battlefield.. you just drive from one cover to the next towards the enemies flag. You are exposed for maybe 3..4 seconds in between.

 

The speed difference between Hunter M3 and Viking M3 is 0,5m/second.

So if they race next to each other for 3 seconds, the Viking has gained 1,5 meter more. Well ... a Wasp is 5m long.. you can truely forget about an advantage of 1,5 meters.

 

If the speed difference is so small, then the next imporant things are drift+cornering, acceleration and weight.

 

 

Drift & cornering: Hunter drifts a lot less then a Viking. Precise driving is king when you have to move through enemies or teammates fast. On Nitro the drivet becomes even stronger. Point for Hunter.

Acceleration: Needed soooo often in close combat, as it enables you to dodge. Also usefull for playing peek-a-boh behind obstancles. Point for Hunter

Weight: your enemies throw your aim off less easily. Higher ranked players have no troubles to aim at the _right_ corners of your tank, to make you spin away from them and miss them. Point for Hunter.

 

Besides the turret on hunter is slightly backwards -better for peek-a-boh; and the hull is shorter, which hides better behind small obstacles.

The lower profile of the Viking let it hide better at ramps if you shoot from the side (think of the ramps on Sandbox).

 

 

In the past the Viking had all those advantages (ok, not the formfactor).

Overall I consider Hunter as the way better ride at the moment.

[LittleWillie 3,199]

Tanki's announcement on this Battle button is, at least, encouraging. Small differences between turrets and hulls is not the problem with this game. Finding a good game is the problem.

 

I just went through the two biggest EN servers and cannot find a non-poly non-Noise game at my Rank level. I don't feel like spending 5-10 minutes going thru every server like I have to do all to often.

 

Let's hope the Battle Button helps.

[LittleWillie 3,199]

Forgive me for going back to Isida but there's something I'd like to be sure of regarding the self-heal.

 

As I've posted I am having a good time with my new Stinger kit. And I freely admit having m2 gear puts me at a matchup advantage if I make sure to enter games at my rank level or lower. Anyway I've had some good runs with the Isida, killing 4-5 enemies in rapid order each time and of course yes heavy drug use was involved.

 

Let's say there is a case like this. The Isida drops into an enemy pair with DD active and carnage ensues.  Assume the Isida gets surprise on the first victim who does not have much time to fight back. But his friend does after a moment. So the first few seconds of self-heal do nothing because our heroic Isida is still un-wounded. Then the enemy shells start landing as the Isida destroys them one by one until one side is left.

 

Assume every tank has 1000 hit points. The Isisda of course has a 10% self heal. I hope I am right when I say that means 10% of the hit points dealt out are used to repair any existing damage to the Isida hull. So we have

 

Surprise! Isida has Enemy 1 down to 500 HP before the counter-attacks start landing.

 

Enemy 1 and 2 both pop a DA at this point and start shooting back Tank 1 now has 1000 HP left and Tank 2 2000 HP.

 

Tank 1 dies after 1,000 more damage. Isida has added back 100 HP the counter-attacks did.

 

Tank 2 dies after the Isida does  2000 more damage. Isida has added back a total of 300 HP

 

300 HP have been earned back, or 30% of the Isida's total health. That's a third of a Repair Kit. The Isida lives on with < 100 HP remaining. The difference is that small 10% kept it alive. For that battle, the Isda hull had 1300 HP not 1000. That is the advantage in head to head combat no other turret gives - the hull is stronger than advertised.

 

So that small 10% actually adds up to a sizable portion of the hull's total strength. The percentage effect is more noticeable with a small Isida killing a large enemy. 

 

Say a 1600 HP m3 light Isida kills a 4000 HP m4 heavy. The m4 heavy pops a DA giving it 8,000 HP. In killing the heavy the light Isida gains back 800 HP which is 800/1600= 50% of the entire hull strength. 

 

I know these are really special examples. Most times the effect will be a smaller percentage than 50%, but OTOH almost always it will be greater than 10%. Self-heal it is still there and in some battles it still tips the contest to the Isida.

 

DM might not be the strongest mode ofr an Idida but they are not helpless. Every hull and turret is going to have a mission type they like least of all. Everyone will have one missoin type they are happy to trade in for a different one.

Edited November 17, 2016 by LittleWillie

[Devin_The_Armageddon 30]

What in actual hell

 

 

1. M3 and M3+ hulls within the same category (light, mid, heavy) have the same protection;

This is absurd. Now wasp completely outclasses hornet, viking outclasses hunter and dictator, and titan outclasses mammoth.

 

Nice balance update, tanki.

 

At least turret balance was good.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

^  get M3 and you will see, how crippled the Wasp M3 is today.

Speed is not everyhing.. the turning accleration is so sluggish that if feels like driving with half a second of delay

 

This hull makes no fun any more.

[newrohan 1,040]

What in actual hell

 

 

This is absurd. Now wasp completely outclasses hornet, viking outclasses hunter and dictator, and titan outclasses mammoth.

 

Nice balance update, tanki.

 

At least turret balance was good.

Umm....why did you just quote my post and change what I wrote there?

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

Forgive me for going back to Isida but there's something I'd like to be sure of regarding the self-heal.

 

 

As I've posted I am having a good time with my new Stinger kit. And I freely admit having m2 gear puts me at a matchup advantage if I make sure to enter games at my rank level or lower. Anyway I've had some good runs with the Isida, killing 4-5 enemies in rapid order each time and of course yes heavy drug use was involved.

 

Let's say there is a case like this. The Isida drops into an enemy pair with DD active and carnage ensues.  Assume the Isida gets surprise on the first victim who does not have much time to fight back. But his friend does after a moment. So the first few seconds of self-heal do nothing because our heroic Isida is still un-wounded. Then the enemy shells start landing as the Isida destroys them one by one until one side is left.

 

Assume every tank has 1000 hit points. The Isisda of course has a 10% self heal. I hope I am right when I say that means 10% of the hit points dealt out are used to repair any existing damage to the Isida hull. So we have

 

Surprise! Isida has Enemy 1 down to 500 HP before the counter-attacks start landing.

 

Enemy 1 and 2 both pop a DA at this point and start shooting back Tank 1 now has 1000 HP left and Tank 2 2000 HP.

 

Tank 1 dies after 1,000 more damage. Isida has added back 100 HP the counter-attacks did.

 

Tank 2 dies after the Isida does  2000 more damage. Isida has added back a total of 300 HP

 

300 HP have been earned back, or 30% of the Isida's total health. That's a third of a Repair Kit. The Isida lives on with < 100 HP remaining. The difference is that small 10% kept it alive. For that battle, the Isda hull had 1300 HP not 1000. That is the advantage in head to head combat no other turret gives - the hull is stronger than advertised.

 

So that small 10% actually adds up to a sizable portion of the hull's total strength. The percentage effect is more noticeable with a small Isida killing a large enemy. 

 

Say a 1600 HP m3 light Isida kills a 4000 HP m4 heavy. The m4 heavy pops a DA giving it 8,000 HP. In killing the heavy the light Isida gains back 800 HP which is 800/1600= 50% of the entire hull strength. 

 

I know these are really special examples. Most times the effect will be a smaller percentage than 50%, but OTOH almost always it will be greater than 10%. Self-heal it is still there and in some battles it still tips the contest to the Isida.

 

DM might not be the strongest mode ofr an Idida but they are not helpless. Every hull and turret is going to have a mission type they like least of all. Everyone will have one missoin type they are happy to trade in for a different one.

 

 

I have to admit I did not read it in full deatil, as it's late :)

Please consider this:

At M3/M4 your damage gets higher but the enemy hull does get stronger - which cancels each other out.

But at M3 the turrets spin faster as well as the hulls. You run into the same problem as Freeze, which freezing rate is ok at M2, but too low or  barely enough M3/M4: when you surprise someone, he still turns around and takes you under heavy fire.

 

As suprises require a light hull usually, you will have some troubles as they are all fast spinning mediums in higher ranks: they stand longer. Even the heavies spin fast, and what their hull can not do is compensated by fast turning turrets. And you can hardly suprise well experienced tankers in team modes.. in DM it works only if they are busy with 1..2 others. Else their trained battlefield awareness spots you early, and their well aim harms you early.

 

Sure you can fight them, but it will not not work, to pile up kill streaks of 4..5 tanks that you suck out _all_by_yourself_ in order to pile up health.

 

So I belive you that 10% may be enough in the battles you fight and with your skill; but you can not translate that into higher ranks.

It's a little bit different, vs Gismos that have 2x the experience you fight against today.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

I posted this because the first piece of m2 equipment unlocks at the rank of warrant officer 5. And there are two pro less with that:

 

- it's too early to be getting m2 at that rank.

 

- And it's a bit too OP at that rank.

 

 

The best solution to this problem is to make all m2 equipment available at the rank of major. And besides it's a good rank to get m2s at.

[wolverine848 13,097]

 

You run into the same problem as Freeze, which freezing rate is ok at M2, but too low or  barely enough M3/M4: when you surprise someone, he still turns around and takes you under heavy fire.

 

This I have not experienced.  My M3 Viking still gets turned into an ice block. Turning hull and turret barely help. Still a popsickle.

[wolverine848 13,097]

What in actual hell

 

 

This is absurd. Now wasp completely outclasses hornet, viking outclasses hunter and dictator, and titan outclasses mammoth.

 

Nice balance update, tanki.

 

At least turret balance was good.

I don't find that Viking outclasses Hunter.  Slightly faster but... less acceleration, less pushing power, less stable and now handles like a drunken sow. It's a larger hornet when turning.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

This I have not experienced.  My M3 Viking still gets turned into an ice block. Turning hull and turret barely help. Still a popsickle.

which is actually white nice :)

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

This I have not experienced.  My M3 Viking still gets turned into an ice block. Turning hull and turret barely help. Still a popsickle.

You're just not used to it.  This is what freeze is like at medium ranks and how it should be.

[LittleWillie 3,199]

What in actual hell

 

 

This is absurd. Now wasp completely outclasses hornet, viking outclasses hunter and dictator, and titan outclasses mammoth.

 

Nice balance update, tanki.

 

At least turret balance was good.

Yes, by moving all m3 gear to the same rank they merely pushed the same quality mis-match problem down to the lower ranks. As a lower-ranker, I plan to spend the rest of my Tanki career exploiting those mis-matches.  :unsure: