[Declined] Turrets gets its own health

[DageLV 940]

Hello! My idea is to make the most strongest turrets have low health and weakest turrets/short range turrets more health.
 
As you can see on these images m0 turrets dont have iron plates and that means... they should get 0 health, 
 
m1 firebird should get around 100 health
m1 freeze should get around 100 health
m1 isida should get around 100 health
m1 freeze should get around 100 health
m1 hammer should get around 80 health
m1 twins should get around 80 health
m1 ricochet should get around 80 health
m1 smoky should get around 60 health
m1 thunder should get around 60 health
m1 vulcan should get around 50 health
m1 thunder should get around 40 health
m1 railgun should get around 40 health

---

m2 firebird should get around 200 health
m2 freeze should get around 200 health
m2 isida should get around 200 health
m2 freeze should get around 200 health
m2 hammer should get around 160 health
m2 twins should get around 160 health
m2 ricochet should get around 160 health
m2 smoky should get around 120 health
m2 thunder should get around 120 health
m2 vulcan should get around 100 health
m2 thunder should get around 80 health
m2 railgun should get around 80 health

---

m3 firebird should get around 300 health
m3 freeze should get around 300 health
m3 isida should get around 300 health
m3 freeze should get around 300 health
m3 hammer should get around 240 health
m3 twins should get around 240 health
m3 ricochet should get around 240 health
m3 smoky should get around 180 health
m3 thunder should get around 180 health
m3 vulcan should get around 150 health
m3 thunder should get around 120 health
m3 railgun should get around 120 health
I must go but i will update later.

[Maf 32,338]

Declined

 

There isn't (or shouldn't be) any "strongest turret" in the game. If you think that one turret is stronger than others, you can suggest for it to be adjusted accordingly in the topic Let's Discuss Game Balance. I don't see a reason for giving each turret its own HP points - seems fine as it is.

[DageLV 940]

^ Then why textures gets more iron plates the same as hulls do?
For hulls iron plates makes sense-increase protection (Hitpoints) but for turrets? Somehow help to shoot stronger ammunition or be heavier to spin faster without giving extra weight or what?
Say me why you think there is iron plates on them.
I splited those turrets in range.
Short range
Medium range
Far range
Self damage (Vulcan)
Infinity

[DESTROYER_13 1,019]

 

I don't really understand what you mean by iron plates or textures, but modules give a percentage of protection against turrets, not extra hp. Paints only give looks, so there is nothing really that increases hp.  

[dan146_tanker 770]

[DageLV 940]

I don't really understand what you mean by iron plates or textures, but modules give a percentage of protection against turrets, not extra hp. Paints only give looks, so there is nothing really that increases hp.  

M0 hull-Hornet.

No iron plates

 

m1 hull-Hornet

Few iron plates on front

 

m2 hull-Hornet

More iron plates on front and back of the hull and above tracks.

 

m3 hull-Hornet

More iron plates on sides and front.

 

So for me it looks like those iron plates give more protection (Hitpoints)

Also i do know what is protection module.

Modifications do increase health.

 

So now lets take look at...  lets say shaft..

 

m0 turret-Shaft 

few iron plates on barrel.

 

m1 turret-Shaft

Few iron plates on barrel and top of turret

 

m2 turret-Shaft

Few iron plates on barrel, on top and on sides of turret.

 

m3 turret-Shaft

Covered in fancy iron plates

---

 

So do you know why turrets are covered in iron plates if those plates doesnt give anything? Like for hulls they make them heavier and power (Mass and good engine makes good power) and also extra protection (HP)

[DageLV 940]

 

Already explained why.

 

the most strongest turrets have low health and weakest turrets/short range turrets more health.

Short range turrets arent used often in big maps cuz they cant reach their target fast enought even with wasp cuz they are being killed while on their way to their target. Aditional HP would make it a little bit easier.

Why infinite range turrets do need less health? Simple! Cuz snipers (in this case railgun/shaft) always need assistant with assault rifle to protect him if someone sneaks up on him. That means sniper alone is less protected than others.

[dan146_tanker 770]

Already explained why.

 

Short range turrets arent used often in big maps cuz they cant reach their target fast enought even with wasp cuz they are being killed while on their way to their target. Aditional HP would make it a little bit easier.

Why infinite range turrets do need less health? Simple! Cuz snipers (in this case railgun/shaft) always need assistant with assault rifle to protect him if someone sneaks up on him. That means sniper alone is less protected than others.

This is just to confusing... You aren't making sense. The ''iron plates'' are there 'cause they show you the next modification of your gun I suppose. I mean why not have a cool design in guns? This would be too confusing, and I doubt it would fit well in with gameplay (no offence btw).

[DageLV 940]

This is just to confusing... You aren't making sense. The ''iron plates'' are there 'cause they show you the next modification of your gun I suppose. I mean why not have a cool design in guns? This would be too confusing, and I doubt it would fit well in with gameplay (no offence btw).

You dont get the point...

Lets say in real life you are planning to add heavy iron plates to... lets say car. (Zombie apocalypse maybe? :D) so what would be the reason? To show you upgraded a car? Not to have more protection?

 

Also what would be confusing?

[dan146_tanker 770]

You dont get the point...

Lets say in real life you are planning to add heavy iron plates to... lets say car. (Zombie apocalypse maybe? :D) so what would be the reason? To show you upgraded a car? Not to have more protection?

 

Also what would be confusing?

First of all. If there was a zombie apocalypse you take whatever car you can get is good. It doesn't need protection, as long as it has windows and a roof. Tip: Don't run zombies over 'cause the car would tip over. Also, when the zombie apocalypse (yeah I said when, it will happen so get prepared :P) happens your weapons need ammo. You need to stay alive. If your weapons are out of ammo, then  no point of keeping it 'cause its as useless as a fly in a hurricane. But you on the other hand. You need to keep yourself safe. So your the Tank, and your gun (ARX-160) is your Tank. (Shot -guns are the worst in zombie apocalypse). So as you need to keep yourself safe you also need ammo, and supplies. You dress up in full army stealth kit. Metal around your arms and legs, goggles to protect you and a helmet. Your set. Same in Tanki. Your Tank needs the HP. Not your gun.  

[DageLV 940]

First of all. If there was a zombie apocalypse you take whatever car you can get is good. It doesn't need protection, as long as it has windows and a roof. Tip: Don't run zombies over 'cause the car would tip over. Also, when the zombie apocalypse (yeah I said when, it will happen so get prepared :P) happens your weapons need ammo. You need to stay alive. If your weapons are out of ammo, then  no point of keeping it 'cause its as useless as a fly in a hurricane. But you on the other hand. You need to keep yourself safe. So your the Tank, and your gun (ARX-160) is your Tank. (Shot -guns are the worst in zombie apocalypse). So as you need to keep yourself safe you also need ammo, and supplies. You dress up in full army stealth kit. Metal around your arms and legs, goggles to protect you and a helmet. Your set. Same in Tanki. Your Tank needs the HP. Not your gun.  

 I said "Maybe" and nothing about guns but heavier armor. Okay if zombie apocalypse isnt enought... Maybe death race?

Does this car seems to have added all those plates just to show others that it has been upgraded or to keep person inside alive?

[DESTROYER_13 1,019]

Does this car seems to have added all those plates just to show others that it has been upgraded or to keep person inside alive?

Yes, this does not happen in real life but since when was Tanki attempting to be completely realistic? It really isn't, and was not intended to be, or our tanks would all be half the speed of Mammoth.  

 

 

Also, enough talk about zombies. It's dark outside and I'm home alone.  

 

 

 

 

[Laser50000 516]

Main Idea of this?

[DageLV 940]

Main Idea of this?

Extra health and reason for iron plates?

[DageLV 940]

Yes, this does not happen in real life but since when was Tanki attempting to be completely realistic? It really isn't, and was not intended to be, or our tanks would all be half the speed of Mammoth.  

 

 

Also, enough talk about zombies. It's dark outside and I'm home alone.  

 

 

 

 

Well yeah i was planning to make idea about tanks riding unicorns wich shoots simmilar to starwar guns. Kile those green/blue/red pew pew's. but then i thinked again, its too realistic right?

[Jwimmer 2,835]

@DageLV, there is a very big reason why turrets get iron plates as they increase in level- it is for aesthetics. If your turret is stronger, it needs to look better. It's just common sense. Also, how would extra hp for turrets even work? What would happen if the hull dies but the turret is still alive, and vice versa? There's a reason this idea was declined- it is confusing, and lacks common sense.

[DageLV 940]

@DageLV, there is a very big reason why turrets get iron plates as they increase in level- it is for aesthetics. If your turret is stronger, it needs to look better. It's just common sense. Also, how would extra hp for turrets even work? What would happen if the hull dies but the turret is still alive, and vice versa? There's a reason this idea was declined- it is confusing, and lacks common sense.

:D turret healty gets merged with hull health. Both of them in 1 bar.

[Maf 32,338]

So do you know why turrets are covered in iron plates if those plates doesnt give anything? Like for hulls they make them heavier and power (Mass and good engine makes good power) and also extra protection (HP)

Jeez, they just make the turret look better. Why do you think everything needs a purpose or explanation??

[Thekillerpenguin 1,731]

Jeez, they just make the turret look better. Why do you think everything needs a purpose or explanation??

+++

 

The purpose of the modifications having metal plates and such is to make them look increasingly more advanced and more cool. Metal plates and futuristic designs are ways to do that without going overboard on detail, and allow the hulls to be easily recognizable in battle so you don't have to look super carefully to tell the difference. In addition, this is done to make the turrets/hulls of the same modification have the same art style, e.g. M2 Smoky has a similar art style to M2 Hunter and meshes well from a visual perspective. It would be weird to have a M0 Smoky with only some lights on top of a M3 Hunter.

 

I see no theoretical problem with the turrets gaining armor plating either. The plating could be made out of advanced material (to make it lighter and thinner or whatever) or could just being visible renovations of the exterior to fit with the modified internal components.

 

The actual idea of turret health would be difficult to balance, since the turrets are meant to be more or less equal. Currently, your health depends on what class of hull you are using. This means that I can feel free to use whatever I want. However, if my choice of turret gave me a health disadvantage compared to other people, I probably wouldn't want to use it, since the increased chances of dying would impact the turret's overall effectiveness. You could try to change the statistics to compensate, but that wouldn't be good for balance; the "powerful" turrets would be extremely powerful in their effective range and then being useless outside of it, e.g. a Shaft destroying absolutely everyone from afar but having no chance of survival against a Railgun at close range. Currently, Shaft is highly effective from afar but can still be used at close range in a pinch. Turning it into a powerful exclusively long range weapon would lead to massive amounts of camping, since snipers will protect themselves by annihilating enemies before they get close. Not fun.

 

Tanki isn't a very realistic game in the first place, so it would be silly to add a whole entire gameplay element just based on how the graphic designers decided what the art styles of higher modifications should be. The appearance has no significant gameplay effects; one could argue that the switching of Dictator and Titan in TX or Viking and Hunter in TO was understandable because of the size differences, but the plating is literally just a texture swap. Introducing such a balance headache over this would not be worth it when a few simple balance tweaks would fix any issues with weapons being overpowered. And I think that we all have bigger things to worry about than turrets being made cool by adding metal plates.

[DageLV 940]

 Why do you think everything needs a purpose or explanation??

Cuz it does need.

The purpose of the modifications having metal plates and such is to make them look increasingly more advanced and more cool. Metal plates and futuristic designs are ways to do that without going overboard on detail, and allow the hulls to be easily recognizable in battle so you don't have to look super carefully to tell the difference. In addition, this is done to make the turrets/hulls of the same modification have the same art style, e.g. M2 Smoky has a similar art style to M2 Hunter and meshes well from a visual perspective. It would be weird to have a M0 Smoky with only some lights on top of a M3 Hunter.

 

Take look at wasp and say me with wich turret art style fits in?

 

I see no theoretical problem with the turrets gaining armor plating either. The plating could be made out of advanced material (to make it lighter and thinner or whatever) or could just being visible renovations of the exterior to fit with the modified internal components.

Doesnt look like that for me...

The actual idea of turret health would be difficult to balance, since the turrets are meant to be more or less equal. Currently, your health depends on what class of hull you are using. This means that I can feel free to use whatever I want. However, if my choice of turret gave me a health disadvantage compared to other people, I probably wouldn't want to use it, since the increased chances of dying would impact the turret's overall effectiveness. You could try to change the statistics to compensate, but that wouldn't be good for balance; the "powerful" turrets would be extremely powerful in their effective range and then being useless outside of it, e.g. a Shaft destroying absolutely everyone from afar but having no chance of survival against a Railgun at close range. Currently, Shaft is highly effective from afar but can still be used at close range in a pinch. Turning it into a powerful exclusively long range weapon would lead to massive amounts of camping, since snipers will protect themselves by annihilating enemies before they get close. Not fun.

I said shaft gets a little bit more health not power...

Also idk if you have noticed but there are battles 10vs10 snipers and none of them coming out from their hiding spots meaning battle ends with 3-5 kills total for both teams.

Also 300 health isnt so much if we take look at how much damage turrets do. Shaft m3 normaly deals 4048 damage.  if mammoth has been spawned then its being 1-shotted cuz it owns only 3376 hp. (If someone has m3 then he druggs more or less meaning he deals 4048 damage...)

so aditional 300 health woulnt be much...

Also, yes shaft in close range is supposed to be useless not 1-shot light hulls with no-scope.

[Thekillerpenguin 1,731]

Cuz it does need.

I suppose we need an explanation for how boxes magically evaporate into thin air and grant your tank superpowers whenever you touch them. Why do tanks become intangible to everything except the terrain for a few seconds when they respawn? Why do tanks respawn? How do the turrets store their infinite ammunition?  No, really, not everything in the game needs explanations.

 

 

Take look at wasp and say me with wich turret art style fits in?

If I remember correctly, you had a problem with M2 Wasp's design, thinking that it doesn't fit into the design style of the other M2 hulls. It doesn't have the metallic panels of the other M2s despite having a more futuristic design, so you have a point there. However, I think it's wrong to point at a single modification of a single turret that doesn't quite match up with the other designs and then think that nothing matches with anything else. Practically anything else does, like M3s/M3s and M0s/M0s.

 

 

Doesnt look like that for me...

The developers haven't released an official statement on what the plating is (and indeed I hope they have more important things to do), so my guess isn't any less valid than yours.

 

 

I said shaft gets a little bit more health not power...

I didn't see Shaft mentioned in your post- you might have made a mistake in the list since each modification of Thunder is repeated twice.

 

 

Also 300 health isnt so much if we take look at how much damage turrets do. Shaft m3 normaly deals 4048 damage.  if mammoth has been spawned then its being 1-shotted cuz it owns only 3376 hp. (If someone has m3 then he druggs more or less meaning he deals 4048 damage...) If you assume that the Shaft player drugs, you can also assume that the Mammoth player will mash the 2 key before spawning (or equip a protective paint) if he/she hasn't already.

so aditional 300 health woulnt be much... An additional 300 does go a long way. About 1.5 years ago, Dictator had an extra 30 health over Viking, which had 300. This was a pretty significant difference and affected the survivability noticeably.

Also, yes shaft in close range is supposed to be useless not 1-shot light hulls with no-scope. I am aware of that. Currently, the arcade mode is pretty good, useful for fighting on the move and capable of dealing with light hulls if you keep your distance and have good aim.

Right now, I'm curious. Do you think that adding health to turrets would make the game more balanced/interesting/fun? Or are only interested in this because of how the turrets look? If it's the second case...

 

Tanki isn't a very realistic game in the first place, so it would be silly to add a whole entire gameplay element just based on how the graphic designers decided what the art styles of higher modifications should be.

[DageLV 940]

Right now, I'm curious. Do you think that adding health to turrets would make the game more balanced/interesting/fun? Or are only interested in this because of how the turrets look? If it's the second case...

Not sure about balance but i might see more light hulls apearing with close range turrets and grinding a bit slower so... (There are a lot of players grinding using fire+its alteration and making firebir last longer it may help to decrease its effectiness).

Also shaft wont be able to noscope light hulls wich has 16% on (I have 16% module from shaft and still being no-scoped using wasp and as wasp has more protection/speed than hornet i dont want to immagine what happens with hornet) and short range turret finaly would have a chance against campers. 

[DESTROYER_13 1,019]

Well yeah i was planning to make idea about tanks riding unicorns wich shoots simmilar to starwar guns. Kile those green/blue/red pew pew's. but then i thinked again, its too realistic right?

Not even close to what I am saying.

[DageLV 940]

Not even close to what I am saying.

Well iron plates even in most games mean protection. You say it would be too realistic so whats about my secod idea about starwar pew pew's and unicorns? Or its too realistic?

[DESTROYER_13 1,019]

Well iron plates even in most games mean protection. You say it would be too realistic so whats about my secod idea about starwar pew pew's and unicorns? Or its too realistic?

No more sarcasm ples.

 

I never said it was too realistic, just that Tanki weren't trying to make this game extremely realistic, so iron plates may not mean more protection, like you may think. 

 

also, unicorns would be nice.  :)