CP + CTF = TDM?

[Mentosis 63]

Why is it many battles start out as TDM, end up as TDM but is not a TDM battle?

 

CP: Players will go right by a control point belonging to the enemy and not stop to change its color. Instead, they go after an enemy tank that's no where near a control point.

 

CTF: A team will capture one flag and never try for another. Why is that? I've also seen teams not ever leave the base and never try for a flag.

 

They must know that its the team with the most flags or the most control points that wins the battle and the most crystals. They can't all have kill missions. Sometimes, in team chat, I'll ask if this is (CTF/CP) or TDM? They come back with the right answer.

 

In one recent CTF battle on Noise, no one had tried for the flag. I tried several times to grab the flag. Three times I was successful and almost made it out of their base each time. Had I had help, we would have made those 3 flags. I mentioned that in team chat. One of my team mates said, "Good for you. Keep trying, you may get one." I left. I checked on the score and our team was slaughtered. Top scorer didn't have very many kills, I doubt that he even got 100 crystals.

 

So, tell me, why do teams do that? What is wrong with the team mentality?

 

 

 

 

[Tofu 6,773]

Because they can

[Heles 9,220]

I enjoy playing in Noise.

But in my view. 
Its a place either team to camp for kills 

Edited January 20, 2017 by Heles

[Bpega 111]

Why is it many battles start out as TDM, end up as TDM but is not a TDM battle?

 

CP: Players will go right by a control point belonging to the enemy and not stop to change its color. Instead, they go after an enemy tank that's no where near a control point.

 

CTF: A team will capture one flag and never try for another. Why is that? I've also seen teams not ever leave the base and never try for a flag.

 

They must know that its the team with the most flags or the most control points that wins the battle and the most crystals. They can't all have kill missions. Sometimes, in team chat, I'll ask if this is (CTF/CP) or TDM? They come back with the right answer.

 

In one recent CTF battle on Noise, no one had tried for the flag. I tried several times to grab the flag. Three times I was successful and almost made it out of their base each time. Had I had help, we would have made those 3 flags. I mentioned that in team chat. One of my team mates said, "Good for you. Keep trying, you may get one." I left. I checked on the score and our team was slaughtered. Top scorer didn't have very many kills, I doubt that he even got 100 crystals.

 

So, tell me, why do teams do that? What is wrong with the team mentality?

 

You should have noticed that TO now is not quite the game it was 5-6 years ago.

Back then we had much more adequacy here, it was common to see players over 30-40 years of age ... but gradually the game became noobs-friendly, this attracted more and more juveniles .. and we have what we have - a once captivating project has turned into kids playground with no idea for teamwork, strategy and even no basic integrity.

 

Just ... don't have too high expectations from the current TO inhabitants ... some of them are not even teenagers ... for them the gameplay is all about parkouring, lingering around, shooting sporadically ... and yes - they love hunting for the Gold )))

Edited January 19, 2017 by Bpega

[vvfoo 30]

You should have noticed that TO now is not quite the game it was 5-6 years ago.

Back then we had much more adequacy here, it was common to see players over 30-40 years of age ... but gradually the game became noobs-friendly, this attracted more and more juveniles .. and we have what we have - a once captivating project has turned into kids playground with no idea for teamwork, strategy and even no basic integrity.

 

Just ... don't have too high expectations from the current TO inhabitants ... some of them are not even teenagers ... for them the gameplay is all about parkouring, lingering around, shooting sporadically ... and yes - they love hunting for the Gold )))

I had a battle yesterday that was probably the best battle i ever had in tanks...It was a noise battle without any drugs.Both teams worked so hard,no one camped,and we used tactics such as me using titan m2,waiting for people to spawn and they would go inside me,then i would slowly travel to the red side with 5-6 people inside me.When i would reach the red base they would all come out and the isidas would leave with the flag carrier and we would just back them up until we died.This was so fun but at the same time challenging.

[fordmustang12345 3,910]

I haven't been in many battles like that but he few I have where really annoying being the only actual player on our team

[Truthteller 4,204]

Random battles in which teamwork is played are rare

[Mentosis 63]

You should have noticed that TO now is not quite the game it was 5-6 years ago.

Back then we had much more adequacy here, it was common to see players over 30-40 years of age ... but gradually the game became noobs-friendly, this attracted more and more juveniles .. and we have what we have - a once captivating project has turned into kids playground with no idea for teamwork, strategy and even no basic integrity.

 

Just ... don't have too high expectations from the current TO inhabitants ... some of them are not even teenagers ... for them the gameplay is all about parkouring, lingering around, shooting sporadically ... and yes - they love hunting for the Gold )))

Ya know, you're right. When I first started playing (on my main) it was around 2008, I think. When you signed up, there was a box that had to be checked stating you were over 13 years old. But of course we all know that didn't stop anyone under 13 from checking the box. It was either in the game rules or the EULA which stated that the game concept was too complicated for younger children.

 

I think TO was right then and is still right. You have to be flexible. Strategy can change from moment to moment and you have to be ready to change with it. Prioritizing is a must. Which is more important? Covering your team mate's 6 to make sure the enemy flag makes back to your base or veering off course to pick up a speed box when the one you are following is a lumbering Titan or Mammoth with little health left? 

 

Younger kids don't have the ability to problem solve on a larger scale at short notice. Yes, this is a game. But games can be teachers, too, but only if you have the foundation to build on. For instance, team work. Does an 8 year old have the ability to conceive the concept of team work? If you sit back and watch how a losing team works, all you can say is...It's no wonder they are losing. It's every man for himself. They are individuals who happen to be on a team, but are working as individuals. So often I see the mentality of, "Me, me, me. Not you...ME. It's all about Me. The solar system revolves around ME. I'm the only one that counts around here. I'M the important one."

 

Yes, the game has changed and so has the mentality.

Edited January 20, 2017 by Mentosis

[Bpega 111]

Ya know, you're right. When I first started playing (on my main) it was around 2008, I think. When you signed up, there was a box that had to be checked stating you were over 13 years old.

...

 

 

the forum was +16 !

[wolverine848 13,097]

 

CTF: A team will capture one flag and never try for another. Why is that? I've also seen teams not ever leave the base and never try for a flag.

 

They must know that its the team with the most flags or the most control points that wins the battle and the most crystals. They can't all have kill missions. Sometimes, in team chat, I'll ask if this is (CTF/CP) or TDM? They come back with the right answer.

 

Game economics.

 

Winning a battle is the single most important factor to getting the lions share of the battle-fund.

 

Once a team has the lead, and in the proper map - they try to defend.  Set up a nice kill-zone and let the attackers break themselves against the defense. Red Noise is perfect for this. It is very hard for blue to get up the ramps if 2nd level is well defended. The battle fund keeps going up because Red is killing the Blue tanks. All you need is a 1-0 win to grab a bunch of crystals.

 

Does not always work - but works often.

[jdc20181 213]

its a war game, while the target is to do what the  mode says killing is just a equallly important. 

[Kurt_KurtDGreat 2,259]

The reason is actually TO's messed up point system, in my opinion. Let's take a Camp CTF 5v5:

 

4 team members camp the whole game and rack up points like crazy due to their kills. Each get 50 kills and die 5 times.

1 team member decides to play the game, by actually taking the flag and trying to cap it. He dies 50 times and kills 5. When he finally wins the game, what is the scoreboard?

 

The guy who capped all the flags is probably last, since flags give very limited amount of points since they don't take into consideration how long it was since the last cap. (Aka how hard it is to cap). This guy also ends up with a very bad D/L on his profile.

 

So why would anyone not camp?

[Mentosis 63]

The reason is actually TO's messed up point system, in my opinion. Let's take a Camp CTF 5v5:

 

4 team members camp the whole game and rack up points like crazy due to their kills. Each get 50 kills and die 5 times.

1 team member decides to play the game, by actually taking the flag and trying to cap it. He dies 50 times and kills 5. When he finally wins the game, what is the scoreboard?

 

The guy who capped all the flags is probably last, since flags give very limited amount of points since they don't take into consideration how long it was since the last cap. (Aka how hard it is to cap). This guy also ends up with a very bad D/L on his profile.

 

So why would anyone not camp?

I understand Camp map. The opposing team's flag is in your base. If you are holding the flag and make some kills you get a few extra points, while the one that kills the flag bearer will get extra points. It's difficult to cap a flag without the help of your team. Usually 3 or 4 members will try to out flank the opposing team and take off with the flag.

 

That's different strategy from, say, Noise, Silence, Parma or any of the other maps. Game mechanics are different. I'm talking about the other maps. such as mentioned above. In my given example: This happened a few days ago. When the battle started, we were blue, I immediately went up to grab the flag. Almost made it. Got as far as the long fall and was killed just before jumping. That's when I realized my entire team was still camping. I camped awhile, waiting for my team to make a move, they never did. The other two times were similar to the first try. Killed just before making the jump. With the comment the team mate made, I knew my team was not interested in winning the  battle. So, I left.

 

That's what I don't understand. Why wouldn't a team be interested in winning? Why are they satisfied with losing? Is <100 crystals really worth the effort? Makes me wonder if these very players are the ones on other maps with other teams, are the ones who camp at the base without sniper weapons and lets the others do all the work, while they do the bare minimum or nothing at all. They don't even defend the flag. They sit there and wait for the enemy to come to them. It's as if they don't understand the concept of the battle mode.

[Kurt_KurtDGreat 2,259]

I understand Camp map. The opposing team's flag is in your base. If you are holding the flag and make some kills you get a few extra points, while the one that kills the flag bearer will get extra points. It's difficult to cap a flag without the help of your team. Usually 3 or 4 members will try to out flank the opposing team and take off with the flag.

 

That's different strategy from, say, Noise, Silence, Parma or any of the other maps. Game mechanics are different. I'm talking about the other maps. such as mentioned above. In my given example: This happened a few days ago. When the battle started, we were blue, I immediately went up to grab the flag. Almost made it. Got as far as the long fall and was killed just before jumping. That's when I realized my entire team was still camping. I camped awhile, waiting for my team to make a move, they never did. The other two times were similar to the first try. Killed just before making the jump. With the comment the team mate made, I knew my team was not interested in winning the  battle. So, I left.

 

That's what I don't understand. Why wouldn't a team be interested in winning? Why are they satisfied with losing? Is <100 crystals really worth the effort? Makes me wonder if these very players are the ones on other maps with other teams, are the ones who camp at the base without sniper weapons and lets the others do all the work, while they do the bare minimum or nothing at all. They don't even defend the flag. They sit there and wait for the enemy to come to them. It's as if they don't understand the concept of the battle mode.

Hmm, although you have a point, I hate being the only one to try to cap, as it's quite impossible without cover and even if my team somehow wins, the campers have more than double my score... ehh..

 

Tho Ye similar situation with noise, tho it's not as common as camp CTF :p

[MLG_Quick_Scoper 41]

CTF - They only cap 1 more flag than the other so they can wait the battle out, not take a risk, and defend

 

CP - I actually don't know :/

[MLG_Quick_Scoper 41]

You should have noticed that TO now is not quite the game it was 5-6 years ago.

Back then we had much more adequacy here, it was common to see players over 30-40 years of age ... but gradually the game became noobs-friendly, this attracted more and more juveniles .. and we have what we have - a once captivating project has turned into kids playground with no idea for teamwork, strategy and even no basic integrity.

 

Just ... don't have too high expectations from the current TO inhabitants ... some of them are not even teenagers ... for them the gameplay is all about parkouring, lingering around, shooting sporadically ... and yes - they love hunting for the Gold )))

I don't think 30-40 yr olds should be playing a game where you constantly shoot blue balls to destroy a tank, but the kid part - yes, I buy my self so all of you 5 yr olds that have their moms credit card with them and buy but cant turn a turret cant call me a pleb, this game used to have regular, skilled buyers, now its filled with speds that forgot where the z.x. and c keys are

[Amon166 90]

Sometimes I try, sometimes I don't. I don't have that many drugs to try to grab the flag and I find it boring to try so hard while everyone else is slacking.

[a7x_Pedro48 13,999]

CP: Players will go right by a control point belonging to the enemy and not stop to change its color. Instead, they go after an enemy tank that's no where near a control point.

Why? Because mods are doing nothing about it. Shaft in Arena Cp for example, it's dumb, right? But it seems that it is allowed by mods.

 

http://en.tankiforum.com/index.php?showtopic=346866&do=findComment&comment=5969070

 

[Mentosis 63]

CTF - They only cap 1 more flag than the other so they can wait the battle out, not take a risk, and defend

 

CP - I actually don't know :/

I'm not talking about capping one more flag than the other team. I'm saying that once they get one flag, they quit trying. If they manage to get one cap at the beginning of the battle, then they spend the rest of the time at the base and don't try for another. I call it "Defending something they ain't got." 'Which is capture points.

 

Today, I saw another example of loser mentality. I think it was Barda. A Wasp came into our base (red and the losing team) stole the flag, loaded speed and sped away.While he was grabbing the flag, a railgun /dictator wounded the Wasp. The route the Wasp took made him an open target for the railgun and the Dictator could have easily killed him. But he made no attempt to stop the Wasp. Instead, he just sat there behind a building looking for another tank to shoot at. I was nearby in my Firebird/Hornet. Had the railgun killed the Wasp, I could have loaded speed and saved the flag. The Wasp made the cap.

 

Later, the same Wasp was headed for our base. I saw him take a hit. I loaded speed in hopes of meeting the Wasp. But he was faster than I was, but I did block his escape route. Instead of tangling with me, he went around the same Railgun/Dictator, even crossed his line of sight. The Railgun made no attempt to shoot at the Wasp. Instead, he shot at a Mammoth on the other side of the map.

 

He was playing TDM and not CTF...as is my point. But he wasn't the only one. The entire team was at or close to our base. I think other team mates could have gotten that Wasp.

 

Blue team was spread around the map and had all the routes covered. After seeing how easily the Wasp got through, Blue raided our base and Red quit.

[Truthteller 4,204]

How frustrating the railgun was also horrible for the map but he still capped, this is why you should never play long battles in random.