Supplies experiment #2 this weekend

[Redlinezak_EN 83]

If this gets implemented, I can see tanki dying down into forgotten land. Have you lost your minds, stop these lame experiments, the supplies are balanced the way they are, not including the experiment, and to those players who say it's not, then give me a very good reason other than buyers can be 8 times stronger than free players.

 

 

You are basically giving the players who have been supporting you financially for years now the middle finger and telling them take a hike <_<

 

 

Stop listening to the 8 year old kids that whine and complain becuase they want to win every one of their battles and start listening to us more mature players.

 

And if the players that have been financially supporting you for years want to be OP, then let them. They paid their hard earned real cash to buy it because they have a job, so they should be given those advantages.

 

Free players have egos while the buyers do not. The only exception is that I'm a free player but I don't have an ego. So yes, I'm supporting buyers in what they do, because once you lose them, then the game shuts down, simple :/

Hi Killer

 

Some valid points there but i would like to suggest some counter's to them.

 

I have no proof so I am guessing - i would think that the number of free players outnumbers the buyers by some way so I am not sure tanki would die if a change to the supplies structure was implemented - especially if it evened the odds some way.

 

Secondly although i agree that a lot of the comments come from younger players - that is the majority of Tanki's customers.  I myself am very much of the older generation of players and i too think there is a big issue with drugs.

I am happy to win or lose in a good game but almost all the time in a drug enabled battle it is the team with the most / willingness to use drugs that wins regardless of skill.

 

Drugs in themselves are a great addition to the gameplay it is purely the method of implementation that i have issue with.

 

I fully agree that buyers should have advantages it is just that right now those are too great.

 

The way the game is structured right now in my opinion is that if you dont wish to buy then you have a few choices:

Play with 1 kit only and use your crystal earnings to buy drugs for a lot more than a buyer can get them for with real cash.

This means you can compete in a battle but you will not have the funds to MU or buy stronger equipment to allow you compete with buyers who didn't have to spend all their CRY on drugs like you.

This means that (if not immediately) at some point you will be faced with players who have the next level of equipment (say M3) but when you rank you will not have the crystals to buy it so cant compete again even with drugs (because you now face stronger equipment and drugs.

 

Alternatively you don't buy drugs and use supplies wisely and save for new gear.  This means you will not be as competitive in battles so will take longer to rank and earn crystals and your battle time may be more demoralizing / frustrating as you a re losing more heavily but at least you should be able to afford new equipment at the relevant rank up time.

 

Even at M3 ranks or even Gissmo level as i am i find that i need huge amounts of drugs to compete well meaning i struggle to MU my equipment which again means i am not as competitive.

 

The frustration when facing an opponent who you have outplayed and know you are more skillful than (even though they are M4) only to see them popping endless drugs and destroying you is huge especially in in DM mode.

 

I would just like to see drugs be more skillful / tactical rather than just button mashing repeatedly.

 

Also the Ego comment i think is totally irrelevant and in my opinion / experience i have found it to be vastly the other way around where extreme druggers / buyers etc regardless of whether they are skillful or not have by far the biggest Ego's when they destroy you in a confrontation.

 

Thanks

[Dliver 436]

Yo people. I got a question about one particular mechanic.

 

.... so there was a need to create respawn-trough cooldowns. After respawn every supply is still on cooldown rather than being ready momentarily. We carried it to second experiment, but it feels like an overkill as there is already SCD in place to limit starting at full power. Though it does create some interesting variations in how players bahave after respawn. Removing respawn-trough cooldowns might result in fixed behavior after respawn (you always need to use DA->N->DD->FA->M after every respawn only in this particular order) which is dull.

 

Can anyone describe as honest as possible what situations did he end up in regarding this particular mechanic?

That is the whole problem with both of these experiments. Re-spawning totally helpless. Don't you even read the posts in the forums on this topic. It is the single most hated thing in both of these experiments. Yes people have set behavior when re-spawning. They do it that way because of experience. I'll tell you this dying immediately after re-spawning is infinitely more boring and frustrating than hitting the DD or DA button and being able to survive and fight and enjoy the game.

 

I'll give you honest situations - Death match everyone immediately targets the guy re-spawning because they know he's helpless. Capture the flag  and team death match. Other team gets to the re-spawn points and sits on them with drugs activated and just kills everyone as they re-spawn. Just read the experiences for yourself all through this forum and the forum for the last experiment.

 

This is just plain a bad idea. Just do the simple solution give the regular games the option to use or not use drugs. It's a win win situation. The people who like using supplies will be happy and those who don't like using supplies will be happy. It's what everyone is begging for.

[Bydo 20,127]

How can players get these free supplies?

 

Developers can add special daily missions on "supplies experiment" days.

For example.

 

 

"mission"

reward   20 X all supplies

wow , from a player who only plays non-drug battles and want drugs ..and yet you agree to this experiment .. interesting ..best advise to give you SIr is stick to pro pass non battles .. or change to tanki X which is fully in the future NO DRUG game..Which in the future is the way this game is heading  over to join..

Edited March 13, 2017 by Bydo

[misafeco 713]

 

Sometimes your team is full of noobs and mults. You need to be able to use supplies whenever you want, specially to counter druggers.

 

I use Repair Kits just to counter druggers and sometimes to annoy them, so they think twice in coming after me.

If your team is full of noobs/mults, you should lose. It's a TEAM game.

 

One of the best battles I ever fought was a drugs-off Monte Carlo CTF 6v6 (everyone had M1s). It was crazy fun. It was impossible to take a flag and return to the base. If you were lucky you were able to make the jump over the cliff, then you died. There was at least 10 flag owners before we were able to return it. The better TEAM won. It's sad that there are very few drugs-off battles in the pro section apart from the usual Poly CPs. I always have to create one and wait for others to join.

RK just irritates me. It makes the drugger super OP and a one man team win possible. Another good option would be if we were able to turn only RK off.

 

Edit: I also play normal battles and I use my drugs too. In fact it's way easier for me to win a normal battle.

Edited March 13, 2017 by misafeco

[r_Im_New5 0]

I think this Supply Change was nescessary(by my opinion),but i think that it made the game more fair.For those who want to cheat,fraud,etc. with supplies,then leave,because the Tanki crew has Solved the problem! :D
-But Tanki Team(im saying this ONLY for the Tanki Team)you will lose some of your players that know this game before the update,because they wanna cheat.

 

 

 

Best of luck Tanki,and i am willing that you take my advice.

 

Im_New

 

Accualy,i think that they should ONLY remove shaft,but heavys not.Also,i think everyone wants more hulls in their garage. ;)

 

I hope you take my advice,and best of luck bro!

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

See, the carry-over cooldowns do create a problem with spawn-killing.

 

Because, if the cooldowns didn't carry over, the heavy hulls would be at a disadvantage. The light and medium hulls would always have drugs activated because of the nerfed smart cooldowns, and then die, and then have drugs activated again. So they are playing basically with perma-drugs.

 

But the heavy hulls, if the duration is DECREASED, go long periods of time without being able to use supplies.  You can't just ask them to kill themselves so they can use all three supplies again and be OP like the players who die and kill fast enough.

 

I think the solution is to enable users to activate all three supplies at the beginning if they want, depending on the situation.

 

This experiment also puts users who regularly use only one type of supply at a disadvantage. They aren't able to drug as fast as the rest of the people with their one supply, but they have no use for DA or Nitro. Many people forget that snipers only need DD and RK, with some mines, and want to be able to use those 2-3 as fast as everyone uses all the rest.

 

So, maybe it would be better to make cooldowns RESET upon spawning, and ABOLISH smart cooldowns, while leaving the individual cooldowns as they are.  However, here's where the interesting part kicks in. Each usage of another supply, DOUBLES the individual cooldowns of all the other supplies, but you can only do it once, so at most, the cooldowns are doubled.

 

In this way players would spawn and have the option to activate all three supplies, one, or none. However, they would have to be smart about it, since if they activated a supply in the wrong situation, it would not be able to be used for a long time.

 

How would this work? Lets say you spawn and find yourself surrounded by many enemies. You can activate ALL 3 supplies at once and take them all on. Or, if you spawned and found yourself a long way from the action, you would not press anything, only activating specific supplies for specific enemies along the way.  

 

However, this would also consider people who use only one type of supply.. Lets say the Shaft or Railgun who mainly uses DD and has no use for DA or SB. Then, they would be able to use DD faster than normal, because they aren't touching anything else.

[racer22_online 206]

It's probably correct, that while the game had large numbers of players TO could afford to 'lose' many of them and happily take the money from sales of 'supplies kits' (just like cannabis dealers try to get you hooked).  TO to it's credit has done a lot to diversify the options a buyer can buy - the only problem is: everyone knows that buying a 'supplies kit' is still the best value for money (bang per buck).

 

What we probably have remaining is a core of players who love TO because we still get some good fun out of it - but we know the imbalance on the battlefield is causing too many poor games (=one sided games or in DM only the druggers dominate).

 

So we have Pro Mode and this has become more popular and we get some good games from that, but it still lacks enough Pro players to give us a decent variety.

 

Hence, standard mode is still important to get the full range of play and occasionally the big 'needle', 'fire fight' battles that I enjoy the most.

 

It's relatively easy for TO to experiment with the smart cool down settings etc. - these are only 'parameters'.

However, adjusting these parameters does not fix the imbalance problems (e.g. where one side uses 4 times more garage drugs than the other).

All good games must have some 'team' balance otherwise there's no 'sport' in it.  Of course by chance we do get some good battles where the non-druggers defeat a team full of druggers - but this is of course is not the norm.

 

 

With this weekend experiment, using both my main tanks, I saw much more garage drug use on Saturday and then garage drugs appeared to be 'running out' on Sunday and many battles 'improved' (more balanced - looking at the points gained on each side.)

This is proof that when the quantity of garage drugs in use goes down - this is a good thing. Players have to became more tactical.

 

Note the effect on Saturday was very bad for FTP (Free To Play) players, because your meager stock of supplies effectively became 'devalued' and you had to use them up faster to keep up.

 

I think the simplest technique (without much programming) to slow down garage drug use is to make the supplies kits very expensive.  Consider if supplies kits were 4 times more expensive, then buying MU would start to look better value (or someone could do the maths and find where this point is?)

 

The means the supplies provided via daily missions become more valuable and using them would be more 'considered' because they effectively cost so much more.  This will again reduce the amount used per battle.

Only the buyers with deep pockets (making up maybe less then 10% of players per battle) could afford heavy use.

I.e. we get a better balance and we still get to keep the buyers happy.

 

I.e. those of us with skills (most of us), can deal with 1 or 2 heavy druggers (except for the small number of very skilled heavy druggers.)

With reduced garage drug use, most of us will see improved game play because teams will be more evenly matched.

 

Please stop the situation of allowing the next player to join the team that is already ahead on points.

At present any Tanker knows that joining a winning team is the best way to gain crystals.  By allowing players to be added to the winning team hurts the losing team.

 

e.g. we have a 10 per side game.

We have 8 per side at present and the score is 4 flags to 2.

It's a 'no brainer' (especially for Neanderthals) to join the side that already has 4 flags!

So the leading team now has 9 players v 8.

Any player looking at this match will put off joining the losing side because it's not a good use of time.

Hence, the losing team now has less players and loses by an  even bigger margin!

Had the incoming player been forced to join the losing side - this would have helped the losing side catch up.  (Obviously some players will use 'Mult' accounts to cheat this - but that's why we need 'Kick2' to help get rid of low scoring tanks).

 

 

In DM the top 10% of players should be prevented from using garage drugs - this way the top players 'really' have to earn the top slots (and funny to see all the gold hunters try and stay out of the top slots so they can use drugs at gold box time!)

 

It's now a stronger case to provide the count of garage drugs used per player on the scoreboard - this way in drug battles you can see who has not been trying hard enough.  Conversely in DM and team battles we can see why some players have the top spots and which team gained too much 'unfair' advantage.   When you see one side use 400 garage drugs per 15 minutes and the other side only use 100 - are you surprised by the result (disgusting, I call it).  By not providing this 'stat' you are concealing the truth - this is 'censorship' - why not ask some buyers if providing this information would really hurt their feelings and cause them to stop spending?  I suspect many will simply buy MU instead. (and Paint protection should never have been allowed over 35%).  Even Gismo's don't have enough equipment to adjust to outflank such target(s).

 

Please try this experiment:

'Program' each player to only have 10 garage drugs (of 'any' kind) per 15 minutes per tank - this makes the game fairer and affordable for all of us (even for FTP players).

The smart cool down times are fine as they are.

 

And please give us better and more spawn points (i.e. not on sniper alleys or camping points.)  Shafts on DD have become way too powerful both for long range and arcade mode (especially against my Wasp!)

 

Sorry for repeating many of my pleas, but I would like more people to support the idea of balancing out the power in each 'team' - then we get a better 'sport', (esport :0)

Edited March 13, 2017 by racer22_online

[r_carlo1234 118]

I still think halving the power of supplies will solve many issues, make them last a little longer to compensate:

 

Repair kit - 100 crystals - 2000 HP

Armor Boost - 50 crystals - 60% for Light Hulls / 50% for Medium Hulls / 40% for Heavy Hulls - 45 or 50 seconds

Damage Boost - 50 crystals - 50% - 45 or 50 seconds

Speed Boost - 50 crystals - 40% for Light Hulls / 50% for Medium Hulls / 60% for Heavy Hulls - 45 or 50 seconds

Mines - 50 crystals - 2000 HP

A simpler, faster Smart Cooldown system.

An option for Double Power in PRO Battles.

And give free PRO Pass to buyers of the 1500 Drug Kit.

 

Do it at least for an experiment.

Edited March 13, 2017 by r_carlo1234

[MercuryS0 67]

Lol, I have 49% protction against shaft, because shafter's are lame as hell, and always use fat hulls, i wasted ton of crystals just to avoid that one shot kill from nowhere  :D 

 

if you want 50% protection to be removed, well, sir, i want shaft removed, and Titan and mamouth, just think of how Tanki would be awesome with just medium & small hulls everywhere, we would had soooo much funds, but you wanna kill and not get killed, so we have this slow Sumo & non dynamic battles in high ranks, all are using Titan these days.  <_< 

First off, not all Shafts use heavy hulls, so you're wrong there, which is pretty sad (helps if you get your facts right, makes you seem less mentally deficient) Second of all, love how you think you're relevant, sit the hell back down. Thirdly, tough that you hate shafts, it's part of the game's dynamic if you haven't noticed. Shaft's role is that of a sniper, if you wish to whine and cry over the fact that you can get one shotted, go ahead but no one is remotely interested in your bias opinion, so as I said earlier, sit the hell back down. A sniper is able to take out an enemy in a single shot... From what I can see, you're are unable to grasp basic concepts so I just had to spell it out for you, understand the idea now little boy? So next time you wish to express an opinion that is as invalid as yourself, just don't, you're wasting your time.

[Desty 275]

Sit the hell back down. 

Relax dude, that's Riddlers alt account. One of these people you should never take seriously :)

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

 that's Riddlers alt account.

It's not really. Riddler talks very differently and likes supplies.

[Desty 275]

It's not really. Riddler talks very differently and likes supplies.

Really?

 

I just figured that due to Hazel:

 

Hi there again TotallyNotRiddler.

[r_carlo1234 118]

It's not really. Riddler talks very differently and likes supplies.

Also, Apex likes Anna and Riddler likes Cedric.

[Phoenix.Raised 5,992]

Also, Apex likes Anna and Riddler likes Cedric.

No, Riddler only likes Riddler.

Edited March 13, 2017 by Phoenix.Raised

[a7x_Pedro48 13,999]

For those who want to cheat,fraud,etc. with supplies,then leave

Cheat? Fraud? Supplies are part of the game.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

Hi Killer

 

Some valid points there but i would like to suggest some counter's to them.

 

I have no proof so I am guessing - i would think that the number of free players outnumbers the buyers by some way so I am not sure tanki would die if a change to the supplies structure was implemented - especially if it evened the odds some way.

 

Secondly although i agree that a lot of the comments come from younger players - that is the majority of Tanki's customers.  I myself am very much of the older generation of players and i too think there is a big issue with drugs.

I am happy to win or lose in a good game but almost all the time in a drug enabled battle it is the team with the most / willingness to use drugs that wins regardless of skill.

 

Drugs in themselves are a great addition to the gameplay it is purely the method of implementation that i have issue with.

 

I fully agree that buyers should have advantages it is just that right now those are too great.

 

The way the game is structured right now in my opinion is that if you dont wish to buy then you have a few choices:

Play with 1 kit only and use your crystal earnings to buy drugs for a lot more than a buyer can get them for with real cash.

This means you can compete in a battle but you will not have the funds to MU or buy stronger equipment to allow you compete with buyers who didn't have to spend all their CRY on drugs like you.

This means that (if not immediately) at some point you will be faced with players who have the next level of equipment (say M3) but when you rank you will not have the crystals to buy it so cant compete again even with drugs (because you now face stronger equipment and drugs.

 

Alternatively you don't buy drugs and use supplies wisely and save for new gear.  This means you will not be as competitive in battles so will take longer to rank and earn crystals and your battle time may be more demoralizing / frustrating as you a re losing more heavily but at least you should be able to afford new equipment at the relevant rank up time.

 

Even at M3 ranks or even Gissmo level as i am i find that i need huge amounts of drugs to compete well meaning i struggle to MU my equipment which again means i am not as competitive.

 

The frustration when facing an opponent who you have outplayed and know you are more skillful than (even though they are M4) only to see them popping endless drugs and destroying you is huge especially in in DM mode.

 

I would just like to see drugs be more skillful / tactical rather than just button mashing repeatedly.

 

Also the Ego comment i think is totally irrelevant and in my opinion / experience i have found it to be vastly the other way around where extreme druggers / buyers etc regardless of whether they are skillful or not have by far the biggest Ego's when they destroy you in a confrontation.

 

Thanks

I'm just going to dismiss this entire essay that you wrote in just a few sentences sentence.

 

Log in, do and complete your missions and weekly chains, log off, repeat.

 

I earned over 100k crystals before I ranked up, with this process. So yeah, I used these funds to get new things on sales, and I have quite a few supplies, like over 200 of each except for Repair and gold, and yeah I use them to finish my missions more quickly if they are exp or kills. And then I keep battling until the battle is over and I leave.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

I think this Supply Change was nescessary(by my opinion),but i think that it made the game more fair.For those who want to cheat,fraud,etc. with supplies,then leave,because the Tanki crew has Solved the problem! :D

-But Tanki Team(im saying this ONLY for the Tanki Team)you will lose some of your players that know this game before the update,because they wanna cheat. 

 

 

Best of luck Tanki,and i am willing that you take my advice. 

 

Im_New 

 

Accualy,i think that they should ONLY remove shaft,but heavys not.Also,i think everyone wants more hulls in their garage. ;) 

I hope you take my advice,and best of luck bro!

 

Using supplies isn't cheating, because if it was, then why are there supplies in the game? Huh? Explain that to me now!

[OKDad70 862]

I understand the need for changing how supplies have been working, but this experiment had nothing good.

 

This experiment had me trying nearly 100% of the time to do things I just couldn't do. The changes relative to normal were too drastic. These parameters do NOT work. Hazel-Rah commented that supplies settings like the first experiment were boring. I agree, reservedly. Still, the last experiment had merit. Tweaks and something closer to current settings could work well. This experiment had nothing to offer. Perhaps it is good for developmental data, but it was not good for me. It lowered the fun-level dramatically for me. Frustration was constant. It forced me to try to change my tactics. It forced me to alter playing style in ways I did not like, in ways I will not get used to.

 

My total experience for all six of my accounts is at four-million now. I only still play because of that investment. My level of commitment was very high. It is now only just keeping me playing and hoping for improvements. Your recent changes have mostly been detrimental to me. If you go to supplies like this last experiment, I'll probably give up.

[Redlinezak_EN 83]

I'm just going to dismiss this entire essay that you wrote in just a few sentences sentence.

 

Log in, do and complete your missions and weekly chains, log off, repeat.

 

I earned over 100k crystals before I ranked up, with this process. So yeah, I used these funds to get new things on sales, and I have quite a few supplies, like over 200 of each except for Repair and gold, and yeah I use them to finish my missions more quickly if they are exp or kills. And then I keep battling until the battle is over and I leave.

My apologies for the 'essay'.  I mistook you for someone that was capable of reasonable debate.

[Heroic 53]

 

bad :/ :o

[Allview_Viper_V2 0]

Add new supplies please! Add "Spider Mines" and "Invisibility", because I want to play Tanki Online, not Tanki X. Hope you will read this and make my dream came true! :)

Edited March 14, 2017 by Allview_Viper_V2

[RustyNail 1,538]

There is a limit of crap one can stand, over a good concept (that for a long time has been destroyed by the supplies boosting policies).

We are too close to this limit.

Maybe I need a week off Tanki, so that I forget some of the crap.

See you next week. :mellow:

 

 

^ consider it constructive criticism from clients.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

idea 1:

what if you could only enable two supplies max.

 

Even a drop box would only prolong an already quipped supply, and would not activate a 3rd supply (but ar least you stole it from the enemy).

The gameplay would be more tactical, tanks would not be 8x as powerfull; and the effect would still kick your gameplay forward..

Maybe this sounds weak.. but as your enemies have only 2 supplies as well, it is kind of fair.

 

--

 

idea 2:

SCDs stay as they used to be + supplie's effects wear down over time: a DP starts with +100% and cools linear down to 75%, 50%, 25% and finally to 0% and is off again.

This preserves the whoooHoo effect while it would make gameplay in supply mode battles much more fair.

 

---

 

I still think that the +100% philosophy is truely a frustration-generator in higher tiers.

50% modules make gameplay boring if you play without supplies. If you play with supplies, then a DA+DP is a singe-handed-teamkiller..

If supplies + RK's + protection modules would be capped at half of their todays effect, the game would be much more enjoyable.

Edited March 14, 2017 by BlackWasp777

[Cortana 4,601]

Obviously we are not complaining hard enough...

 

We don't wont it.

 

Let's start complaining then?

 

#DumbUpdate

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

Just leave the supplies alone and fix things that really need it: parkour, pro battle settings, and our hulls :/