Patch Update #449 - Released 16th March 2017

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

Ever been hit by Thunder? It has > impact than smoky at all M-levels.

And Ricco... good luck aiming at it while it's peppering you with 10-12 hits in quick succession.

 

Also keep in mind that Smoky's alteration may give it bigger impact - but the cost is no critical. Becomes (more) useless at long range.

Thunder reloads slower, while Rico has less impact force per shot and I do not need to aim with Freeze.

 

Smoky is still the most annoying in terms of impact force. (Keep in mind "annoying" is a subjective term) It's hard to drive through walls ;)

Edited March 21, 2017 by r_I_already_won0

[CooperO 7,956]

I noticed that all my 10% discounts on hulls and turrets have disappeared. Is that because of this update?

Yes, those discounts are called 'bulk discounts' which have been removed with this update.

 

I got a 25% discount on railgun for 24 hours. I thought those were removed...

Personal discounts are still there. Only bulk discounts were removed and garage sales or personal discounts won't affect kit prices anymore.

[Mofuka 30]

Ever been hit by Thunder? It has > impact than smoky at all M-levels.

And Ricco... good luck aiming at it while it's peppering you with 10-12 hits in quick succession.

 

Also keep in mind that Smoky's alteration may give it bigger impact - but the cost is no critical. Becomes (more) useless at long range.

 

They might have similar impact force, but it feels different way being hit by both. I have no problem with Thunder, while under Smoky fire I can barely move with Viking and they knock off my aim. With Thunder you can't turn tanks the way you do it with Smoky. I'm a Thunder player myself. Smoky has twice faster fire rate too.

 

Ricochet's impact feels awful too.

 

Railgun too. Even playing with Titan i get flipped by railguns.

Edited March 21, 2017 by Mofuka

[r_carlo1234 118]

Smoky's impact force should be cut. It feels annoying. Have in mind that there is also an alteration that increases it. It's ridiculous.

I agree. It may be fun for Smoky and Rico users but it's really annoying for turrets that shoot at a slower rate.

 

They really need to match impact force with recoil force in all turrets for the maximum damage range, then half of that in the minimum damage range if applicable.

 

After that there could be alterations that increases the impact force and recoil force by 50% for Parkour lovers or people that want to use it with Heavy Hulls.that will feel less recoil.

[Pink_Legacy 269]

I agree. It may be fun for Smoky and Rico users but it's really annoying for turrets that shoot at a slower rate.

Just as the high damage per shot of Thunder, Railgun, or Shaft is annoying for turrets that have less powerful shots. That's how this game works, every turret has something that annoys other turrets. The only way in which a turret could annoy nobody would be if it was underpowered.

[Akame 4,578]

Finally a kill event, now i will play temporarily

[Guest]

Same. My WO5 account @NotANewb has 9/10 M1 Smoky currently, but I still feel like I just got ripped off. Cedric, could you ask Hazel and the others about some sort of compensation? Not necessarily crystals, but maybe a pack of drugs. Maybe a discounted kit? Personal discount on any one item in the garage? I mean, I blew everything I had on MUing that thing, and now I only have 3k on it. I'm stuck in an endless pit if I don't get compensation.

Sorry, how were you ripped off? What MU step were you at before it was converted to 9/10? Because to the best of my knowledge, all numbers were rounded up to the next step in the player's advantage.

 

Send me the details via PM so I can follow up though.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

Sorry, how were you ripped off? What MU step were you at before it was converted to 9/10? Because to the best of my knowledge, all numbers were rounded up to the next step in the player's advantage.

 

Send me the details via PM so I can follow up though.

He feels cheated because he spent much more crystals to get to that step than you have to spend now to get that powerful. At least, that's the logic. ;)

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

Just as the high damage per shot of Thunder, Railgun, or Shaft is annoying for turrets that have less powerful shots. That's how this game works, every turret has something that annoys other turrets. The only way in which a turret could annoy nobody would be if it was underpowered.

There are different levels of annoyance. Freeze can be annoying because if it hits you you're most likely dead, but you can prevent that annoyance by being careful and staying aware of your surroundings. So it is not the same.

 

Smoky doesn't need to be underpowered to be effective with less impact force, devs could rise the damages a little bit to compensate.

 

The problem with annoying turrets is that it adds to the dissatisfaction with the game and that is not good because people stop playing.

[Guest]

He feels cheated because he spent much more crystals to get to that step than you have to spend now to get that powerful. At least, that's the logic. ;)

Unfortunately, there's nothing I can do about that. In the real world (not just in the game), things get cheaper. You spend €800 on a computer, and 2 weeks later the price gets slashed in half because there's a new model out. Same for clothes. Same for cars. This happens everywhere, but you don't see people complaining at the car dealer, clothes shop or computer store about it.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

Unfortunately, there's nothing I can do about that. In the real world (not just in the game), things get cheaper. You spend €800 on a computer, and 2 weeks later the price gets slashed in half because there's a new model out. Same for clothes. Same for cars. This happens everywhere, but you don't see people complaining at the car dealer, clothes shop or computer store about it.

I understand, but in real life, if others have that computer, it doesn't affect you.

 

In TO, everything is judged against others. He spent a lot to get a large advantage, and now everyone else can easily catch up to him.  Although there's probably not much to be done now.

 

Anyway, I'm not complaining, otherwise I'd be a hypocrite. I half-hope to see this system implemented for M3s.  But then you guys should probably come up with some sort of crystal or supply compensation for the M4 players, otherwise there will be a massive outcry. ;)

[Pink_Legacy 269]

There are different levels of annoyance. Freeze can be annoying because if it hits you you're most likely dead, but you can prevent that annoyance by being careful and staying aware of your surroundings. So it is not the same.

 

Smoky doesn't need to be underpowered to be effective with less impact force, devs could rise the damages a little bit to compensate.

 

The problem with annoying turrets is that it adds to the dissatisfaction with the game and that is not good because people stop playing.

While I understand what you say and I think that it is reasonable, I don't agree with it.

 

To start with, annoyance is subjective. You find Smoky to be the most annoying turret, I find Vulcan to be the most annoying turret, and my neighbour finds Hammer to be the most annoying turret. There are different levels of annoyance, true, but everybody feels annoyed by different things.

 

Your suggested change to Smoky, while balanced, makes Smoky an even more blah turret.

 

Let me give you a couple of examples:

 

I get really frustrated with Shaft's ability to one-shot me. That's one of the things that I find most annoying in the game. Now, I could ask that they remove Shaft's ability to one-shot people and give it a faster reload in exchange. The change might be balanced, but would it still be fun to play with Shaft? Would Shaft still be distinctive? Not really, it would just be a Railgun with a scope that needs to stand still while aiming.

 

I find turrets that can be constantly shooting at me such as Twins, Ricochet and Vulcan annoying. When they start shooting at me, I can't keep up with their damage rate, most of them knock my aim off, and finding cover is pointless because by the time I have hidden, half of my health bar is gone and the other half will be gone as soon as I get out of my hiding place. My only chance against them as a Smoky user is to knock their aim off before they knock mine. I could ask that their fire rate be reduced and their damage increased in exchange. That would be balanced, but how different than Smoky would those turrets be then?

 

If we start making everything less distinctive, turrets lose their reason to be, and then we had better do away with them.

 

My point is that Smoky's main distinctive feature is its impact force.¹ If you take that away, what is left that makes it a fun turret to play?

 

 

^1- You could argue that its critical hit is also a distinctive feature of Smoky, if not its main one. However, since the rebalance Smoky's critical hit is not any better than a Railgun's or Thunder's strong shot, and therefore not really distinctive. The only thing that the critical hit achieves is to make Smoky not altogether useless at longish distances.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

However, there is a definite problem in that the impact force of most turrets outweighs the stability of most hulls. For example, when I buy an hornet, I do not want a wasp.

 

For a hornet M3 user, the bigger problem is the lack of stability, rather than the amount of hp.  

 

In addition, it does not make sense to give Smoky a lot of impact, Rico I can see.  Smoky also has that alteration.

 

Hornet and Viking are too unstable at the higher ranks, given the disproportional growth of impact force and the second-tier growth of reload times.

 

It all comes back to my idea of hull alterations: one for each hull.

[wolverine848 13,097]

 

Smoky doesn't need to be underpowered to be effective with less impact force, devs could rise the damages a little bit to compensate.

 

And make it more like Thunder?  What's the point then? Might as well buy Thunder and do more damage at long ranges...

 

You dislike Smoky as I dislike Ricco with it's 14 rapid shots that throw off the aim of medium hulls. We need to find a way to deal with it.

[wolverine848 13,097]

In addition, it does not make sense to give Smoky a lot of impact, Rico I can see.  Smoky also has that alteration.

 

Sorry - I disagree here.

 

Smoky had three characteristics that set it apart from many hulls.  Quick fire / Impact / Critical.

Over time they have nerfed the reload so it is not that different from Thunder.

They lowered the Critical considerably, so it's main benefit is to add a bit of avg damage at long range to make it more than just a tickle.

 

And some are suggesting it's impact should be nerfed even more?

It's effect is really less than Ricco (I've had many 1-on-1 vs Ricco) and Thunder now has > impact. Smoky relies on the impact to compete with high-damage turrets like Rail & Thunder.

 

You mention the alteration - but - that comes with a cost - no critical. The avg damage would drop even more. Alteration is mostly used for dueling. Can't imagine anyone using it in something like DM or TDM where time-to-kill is important.

[wolverine848 13,097]

It all comes back to my idea of hull alterations: one for each hull.

I support this.

 

I would give up some speed on my Viking if I could get back some stability. My Smoky needs a stable platform in order to maintain a constant rain of fire on opponents (and annoy them with my impact ;) )

[Pink_Legacy 269]

However, there is a definite problem in that the impact force of most turrets outweighs the stability of most hulls. For example, when I buy an hornet, I do not want a wasp.

 

For a hornet M3 user, the bigger problem is the lack of stability, rather than the amount of hp.  

 

In addition, it does not make sense to give Smoky a lot of impact, Rico I can see.  Smoky also has that alteration.

 

Hornet and Viking are too unstable at the higher ranks, given the disproportional growth of impact force and the second-tier growth of reload times.

 

It all comes back to my idea of hull alterations: one for each hull.

But then the problem is about hull stability, not Smoky's particular impact force. If it is about making hulls more stable, that's another debate, but I really can't see any situation in which it is fair, fun, or desirable to cut down Smoky's impact force and leave Twins' and Railgun's (just to name two) untouched.

[austen_pierce 1,948]

I support this.

 

I would give up some speed on my Viking if I could get back some stability. My Smoky needs a stable platform in order to maintain a constant rain of fire on opponents (and annoy them with my impact ;) )

aaand we're back to spending crystals to repurchase what the designers took away.

 

But in this case I would go ahead and do it. The featherweight M4 Viking is just awful under the out of control impact forces at M3/4.

[GeeVuh 1,647]

Unfortunately, there's nothing I can do about that. In the real world (not just in the game), things get cheaper. You spend €800 on a computer, and 2 weeks later the price gets slashed in half because there's a new model out. Same for clothes. Same for cars. This happens everywhere, but you don't see people complaining at the car dealer, clothes shop or computer store about it.

Ohohoho, actually, that example perfectly fits what my father did back when my sister got her first laptop. He bought it at full price, but when the laptop was discounted roughly 2 weeks later, he returned the laptop, then proceeded to buy the laptop again, at a discount. Thus, he saved perhaps $60 dollars. I concur with the way that your developers were thinking (Okay, the buyers are getting OP, let's give the non-buyers a shot at getting good), but before that update, my account was shining at that rank, but now? There are M2 Thunders, Smokies, and even Shafts everywhere. I'll be leaving that account in the trash except logging in every once in a while to keep the name.

I have no words to say but, "What the hell."

 

[Guest]

The truth is that there are always going to be complaints no matter what we do. If we go one way, buyers will complain, if we go the other way, non-buyer will complain and accuse us that we don't care about them because (according to them) we favor buyers. Honestly, if we had to keep worrying about public opinion, we'd never make a solid decision, and the game would go to hell.

 

It's our job to make decisions that will (in our informed opinion) ultimately bring the most beneficial outcome for the game, its players, and the company, with all three sides benefiting equally. And that's what we'll continue to do. Some will agree with our decision, and some won't, and that's fine (and perfectly normal too).

[GeeVuh 1,647]

The truth is that there are always going to be complaints no matter what we do. If we go one way, buyers will complain, if we go the other way, non-buyer will complain and accuse us that we don't care about them because (according to them) we favor buyers. Honestly, if we had to keep worrying about public opinion, we'd never make a solid decision, and the game would go to hell.

 

It's our job to make decisions that will (in our informed opinion) ultimately bring the most beneficial outcome for the game, its players, and the company, with all three sides benefiting equally. And that's what we'll continue to do. Some will agree with our decision, and some won't, and that's fine (and perfectly normal too).

I suppose. The Tanki staff always have the last word, and I respect that. It was worth a shot though.

 

No hard feelings.  ;) 

[Guest]

No hard feelings.  ;) 

Of course  :)

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

While I understand what you say and I think that it is reasonable, I don't agree with it.

 

To start with, annoyance is subjective. You find Smoky to be the most annoying turret, I find Vulcan to be the most annoying turret, and my neighbour finds Hammer to be the most annoying turret. There are different levels of annoyance, true, but everybody feels annoyed by different things.

 

Your suggested change to Smoky, while balanced, makes Smoky an even more blah turret.

 

Let me give you a couple of examples:

 

I get really frustrated with Shaft's ability to one-shot me. That's one of the things that I find most annoying in the game. Now, I could ask that they remove Shaft's ability to one-shot people and give it a faster reload in exchange. The change might be balanced, but would it still be fun to play with Shaft? Would Shaft still be distinctive? Not really, it would just be a Railgun with a scope that needs to stand still while aiming.

 

I find turrets that can be constantly shooting at me such as Twins, Ricochet and Vulcan annoying. When they start shooting at me, I can't keep up with their damage rate, most of them knock my aim off, and finding cover is pointless because by the time I have hidden, half of my health bar is gone and the other half will be gone as soon as I get out of my hiding place. My only chance against them as a Smoky user is to knock their aim off before they knock mine. I could ask that their fire rate be reduced and their damage increased in exchange. That would be balanced, but how different than Smoky would those turrets be then?

 

If we start making everything less distinctive, turrets lose their reason to be, and then we had better do away with them.

 

My point is that Smoky's main distinctive feature is its impact force.¹ If you take that away, what is left that makes it a fun turret to play?

 

 

^1- You could argue that its critical hit is also a distinctive feature of Smoky, if not its main one. However, since the rebalance Smoky's critical hit is not any better than a Railgun's or Thunder's strong shot, and therefore not really distinctive. The only thing that the critical hit achieves is to make Smoky not altogether useless at longish distances.

The idea of a turret having a distinctive feature, doesn't mean much to me. We should forget about that and focus on effectiveness and balance, because we want turrets that fit our playing style so we can win battles and progress though the game. 

 

If you want Smoky to have a high Impact then the Recoil should also be that high. So you're not only making Rails fail every shot but if you're not careful you may fail shots as well.

 

That's why I'm suggesting to Tanki to match Impact numbers with that of Recoil. Then create alterations that increases both Impact and Recoil by 50%.

 

Let's remember this is not a balanced game and it doesn't try to prevent imbalances like battles where one team outnumbers the other, or that of inactive players/mults in one team. When you find yourself in a loosing team the annoying turrets just add insult to injury. Then people leave.

Edited March 26, 2017 by D.a.n.t.e

[wolverine848 13,097]

Let's remember this is not a balanced game and it doesn't try to prevent imbalances like battles where one team outnumbers the other, or that of inactive players/mults in one team. When you find yourself in a loosing team the annoying turrets just add insult to injury. Then people leave.

Can someone setting up the battle actually turn off that timer - the one that starts when teams are too unbalanced?

Seems I've been in some battles where over 2 min went by and no timer :wacko:

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

Can someone setting up the battle actually turn off that timer - the one that starts when teams are too unbalanced?

Seems I've been in some battles where over 2 min went by and no timer :wacko:

They really need to rethink that, and 6 against 3 shouldn't be considered balanced.