Let's discuss Random Battles (Matchmaking system)

[LittleWillie 3,199]

Point 1:  I thought the matchmaking system would let players find the Pro battles with the settings they want. For example, "find me CTF battles with no user supplies and no map supplies". If it is just a fancier Battle Button with no ability to choose a specific battle ... well not only will that not fix the need it will create new shortcomings.

 

Point 2: I am not particularly worried despite this because I do not think this will ever happen. I've learned Tanki announces a lot of things that never appear.

 

Two active threads on this should probably merge.

Any-hoo, the argument of making Tanki more like other casual games falls flat. It's not a casual game. The length of the "What To Buy - Which Is Better" thread demonstrates far better than I can just how complex and nuanced this game truly is, despite the 'arcade' label.

To make Tanki 'casual' remove alterations, MUs, and protection modules (maybe a lot of other stuff too).

But it's not. Continuing to take away player choice is leaving players frustrated at just how they are going to complete missions and win battles. Not a good thing to do to your customers.

IMO all the huff and puff about Tanki being a "casual" game is just justification to keep the badly designed DA/DD power-up system. As in "Oh we can't have sophisticated power-ups in the game. Tanki is for the casual player." Whereas the real motivation behind the public relations is Tanki sells too many drug kits. They do ot want to annoy those customers by redesigning the power-up system. 

[Doctor.Noob 3,270]

Today I watched in developers diary ( version v-log in Tanki X ) about machtmaking system in Tanki X, and one thing stuck to my eye, " In Tanki X when it comes matchmaking system, you'll have the option to create custom battle ( In the future in Tanki online PRO battles it will be called custom ) but what is the most interesting thing, when you play custom battle you will not earn any experience or rewards.

 

I hope this will not happen in Tanki online when it comes matchmaking system. Probably this custom battle in Tanki X will be more similar to parkour mode in Tanki online then today version of PRO battles in TO. 

 

I hope I'm right about it, or otherwise such a update it would be a big blow for the players in TO.      

 

P.S

I only wrote this because I remembered when I watched this developers diary, how is one reporter write in one post a month ago, that this might happen to TO. 

 

 

 

 

I found that post :

 

 

Edited June 22, 2017 by Doctor.Noob

[WaspShaft98 114]

Today I watched in developers diary ( version v-log in Tanki X ) about machtmaking system in Tanki X, and one thing stuck to my eye, " In Tanki X when it comes matchmaking system, you'll have the option to create custom battle ( In the future in Tanki online PRO battles it will be called custom ) but what is the most interesting thing, when you play custom battle you will not earn any experience or rewards.

 

I hope this will not happen in Tanki online when it comes matchmaking system. Probably this custom battle in Tanki X will be more similar to parkour mode in Tanki online then today version of PRO battles in TO. 

 

I hope I'm right about it, or otherwise such a update it would be a big blow for the players in TO.      

 

P.S

I only wrote this because I remembered when I watched this developers diary, how is one reporter write in one post a month ago, that this might happen to TO. 

 

 

 

 

I found that post :

 

 

well in a way that would be nice, because we can quit the game forever.

maybe thats part of their grand plan to make players move to tanki x

 

they will definitely lose players, in thousands too if they don't give cry or exp for pro battles

 

just removing missions from pro battles cause 80+ pages of pure hate, this will be even more.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

I curious though how they are going to measure and grade players "skill".

 

And...

 

Will it be a combination of M-lvl + skill?   One might be an awesomely skilled but... an M1 vs M3 still would be too much of a handicap to overcome.

if you rate the battle efficiency in comparism to others in the same situation, you end up with a system that does not need to evaluate the M-level. But with battle efficiency I mean some other number, then what is measured today.

 

A proposal that should work:

 

 

1) proposal for battle efficiency rating

2) simulation run about self-adapting of the rating

3) it has to exist for different gamemodes (no big deal..)

4) some answers on raised questions

 

5) Hazel's answer in another thread

 

 

but as said.. we've got to find another place to go in deep on that

[wolverine848 13,097]

if you rate the battle efficiency in comparism to others in the same situation, you end up with a system that does not need to evaluate the M-level. But with battle efficiency I mean some other number, then what is measured today.

Not sure I agree on this ^ part...

 

Two people, wide gap in ranks (<> equipment) can have same "efficiency" as it is really a comparator.

 

So... there must be another factor that does not put these two tankers in same battle... that's what I meant by M-lvl.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

Not sure I agree on this ^ part...

 

Two people, wide gap in ranks (<> equipment) can have same "efficiency" as it is really a comparator.

 

So... there must be another factor that does not put these two tankers in same battle... that's what I meant by M-lvl.

 

The point is that you don't have to take much care about that, if you measure the efficiency all the time.

Please not in advance, that I do not talk about that efficiency rating that you can see in the profile today.

 

Have you ever met an M2 player that is (obviously an alt) and has so much skills, that he can easily compete with M3s? I've met some, and imho they need to have the same battle efficiency rating as those M3 players they can compete with.

So if you meassure the efficiency of a player by comparing how he performs (in [score per time spent in a certain battle]) and compare it to the others of his team when one leaves (filtering out extreme underperformers = people on pause or mults) you get a pretty decent picture who is capable of aiding his team with points - and who is not.

 

After a while the large blob of players will find their place on the scale of battle efficiency.

Lets assume that scale starts at 100 (default value for a new starter) and ends at 1000 (max possible value)

Then you will find average m2 players around 500, outstanding M2/low skilled M3 at around 600, average M3 players at around 700, outstanding M3/low skilled M4 at around 800, outstanding M4s ar around 900 and esport pros at 1000.

If a player with a battle efficiency rating (BER) of 600 owns an M2 and competes fine vs. other players with BER-600, then he will stay at this BER value. If he later on purchases an M3 gear, he will be able to get more score in those battles he is placed in, and so his BER will raise above 600. So he will face harder opponents.. and so on.

 

In short terms, you always play vs player with a simmilar BER, and if you outperform them (in score per minute on the same team in the same battle) then your BER will rise while theirs might drop (gradually).

This is a self adjusting system, that adjusts to the players performance over time. Gear will help you to improve your BER, but only if you can make use of it. An M3 player that misses 60% of his shots, has a lower BER then an M2 that hits 90%, as he simply can not score as much per time (in the same battle, on the same team).

 

That are the basics in a nutshell.

[M-axis 589]

According to skill..

 

Ever though the matchmaking system might go by personel ratings? Now that I think of it, Im convinced thats whats going to happen.

[WaspShaft98 114]

I curious though how they are going to measure and grade players "skill".

 

And...

 

Will it be a combination of M-lvl + skill?   One might be an awesomely skilled but... an M1 vs M3 still would be too much of a handicap to overcome.

I'm guessing it will be based on effectiveness rating, whose formula they refuse to reveal, but its pretty much rank based, so m1 vs m3 still very much possible, since rank has the biggest impact on effectiveness rating.

[wolverine848 13,097]

The point is that you don't have to take much care about that, if you measure the efficiency all the time.

Please not in advance, that I do not talk about that efficiency rating that you can see in the profile today.

 

After a while the large blob of players will find their place on the scale of battle efficiency.

Lets assume that scale starts at 100 (default value for a new starter) and ends at 1000 (max possible value)

Then you will find average m2 players around 500, outstanding M2/low skilled M3 at around 600, average M3 players at around 700, outstanding M3/low skilled M4 at around 800, outstanding M4s ar around 900 and esport pros at 1000.

If a player with a battle efficiency rating (BER) of 600 owns an M2 and competes fine vs. other players with BER-600, then he will stay at this BER value. If he later on purchases an M3 gear, he will be able to get more score in those battles he is placed in, and so his BER will raise above 600. So he will face harder opponents.. and so on.

I understand the concept of BER (I think)...

but we still may be talking about diff things.  Why in your example would a M3/low-skilled player have a higher BER than a skilled M2 player?

It is rating vs peers... so I can't imagine the low-skilled M3 player will have the higher rating. Might actually be opposite.

 

Since BER is apparently calculated vs the ones you are playing against... is it possible that a player at M1 ranks could have BER of 500 and a player of M3 ranks also have a BER of 500?

 

If so, the matchmaking could put them in the same battle due to ~ BER.

I am saying that should not happen.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

I understand the concept of BER (I think)...

but we still may be talking about diff things.  Why in your example would a M3/low-skilled player have a higher BER than a skilled M2 player?

It is rating vs peers... so I can't imagine the low-skilled M3 player will have the higher rating. Might actually be opposite.

Actually my example was ment in a way, that a low skilled M3 can have the same rating as a high skilled M2.

 

I write it again in separate lines to clear it up:

• average m2 players = around 500
• outstanding M2/low skilled M3 = around 600
• average M3 players = around 700
• outstanding M3/low skilled M4 = around 800
• outstanding M4s = around 900
• esport pros = 1000.

Since BER is apparently calculated vs the ones you are playing against... is it possible that a player at M1 ranks could have BER of 500 and a player of M3 ranks also have a BER of 500?

 

If so, the matchmaking could put them in the same battle due to ~ BER.

I am saying that should not happen.

I actually preffer to have the BER calculated vs the ones you play with (!), and not the ones you play against.

Because the people in your team face the same issues, the same enemies, the same side of the map, the same magnum that pounds your heads.

 

About M1s fighting M3s.. how can that happen with a BER system?

 

It could only be, if

- the M1 player (player_A_M1) beats all the M2 players he ever meets (player_group_M2)

- AND at the same time our poor M3 player (player_C_M3) with the welded turret and low camera looses to all the M2 players he ever meets (player_group_M2).

 

This would mean that in terms of BER:

player_A_M1 = player_group_M2 = player_C_M3

 

So if this players_C_M3 would play vs player_A_M1, he would find a fair match.

 

 

 

 

I think it will work,  and if ever an M3 will play vs an M1, then

- in the starting time of such a feature when the system is not balanced and tweaked yet

 

- if a player voluntarily downsize his BER, accepting that his rewards will suck during that time

- during account sharing (account does not match player any more)

- if truely outstanding M1s beat the .. aehm.. gasoline out of all M2s, while some M3s can't hit a house.

[Bydo 20,121]

ok these might help explain more on the new system and how it will works in tanki , seeing this is how this game is looking. the last link is to the diary or as we call it here V-Logs.. it will clear it up better for players or you can go to tanki X forum and search out the open chat rooms on other talking about the game..

 

 

https://help.tankix.com/en/tanki-x/articles/basics/ranks

https://help.tankix.com/en/tanki-x/articles/basics/Hull-upgrade

 https://en.wiki.tankix.com/Mastery

https://help.tankix.com/en/tanki-x/articles/basics/Supplies

https://www.tankix.com/en/news/

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

The Favorite System

 

I propose this idea to be used with the Matchmaking System to have more battles that we like.

 

It will allow you to select up to 5 favorite turrets, 5 hulls, 5 modules, 5 paints and 10 of your favorite maps (or at least your favorite map sizes)

 

Matchmaking should only use the information of what type of equipment you have as favorite and not the equipment modification or MUs, because if otherwise, some will trick the system to get to easy battles then switch to the best not-listed equipment they have.

 

The same system would be used to have our favorite equipment listed first in our garages, like this:

 

 

Thanks.

[Bydo 20,121]

get ready it will soon be here .. it could even start this week ? .. what i'm chatting about is the match making system.. It's just been launched in tanki X today..

[Crimson_Tank 285]

From V-log 141 I understand now the matchmaking system will be good for Tanki. It means PRO battles are now free and you can create battles as you wish like before except with PRO battle options. And normal battles using match making system. I like it. 

[SmellThis 117]

this proposed system will favor greatly the player and his/ her friends who make the battle. they can invite their friends full m4 and heavy druggers and the poor saps who join will not be able to invite their friends to join to help out all that will happen is one team gets to win time after time when they create the battle senario... you say it will stop sabs .. maybe but it will be just as bad full maxed tanks vs randoms hmmm whos gunna win ....

[Lightning78 285]

We will also get to deal with all the players who just want to finish their daily mission rather then doing a real battle. Right now those people can open or join small battles on some remote server and collect their boxes. Won't be possible with matchmaking 10 vs 10 battles. Expect a lot of fluctuation on the players present, and a lot of frustration for players not part of a battle group..

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

this proposed system will favor greatly the player and his/ her friends who make the battle. they can invite their friends full m4 and heavy druggers and the poor saps who join will not be able to invite their friends to join to help out all that will happen is one team gets to win time after time when they create the battle senario... you say it will stop sabs .. maybe but it will be just as bad full maxed tanks vs randoms hmmm whos gunna win ....

That's my concern too, but some say that groups of friends will only play against groups of friends, I hope that's the case and the same for Clans.

 

All people form the same friend lists shouldn't be put together, nor in opposing teams, but in different battles or unrelated groups vs unrelated groups.

 

We will also get to deal with all the players who just want to finish their daily mission rather then doing a real battle. Right now those people can open or join small battles on some remote server and collect their boxes. Won't be possible with matchmaking 10 vs 10 battles. Expect a lot of fluctuation on the players present, and a lot of frustration for players not part of a battle group..

We'll see what happens with all the pro missioners, will they just focus on mission and then leave, thus crating unbalanced battles, or will the participate and help?

 

Devs need to remove Crystal missions, Finish 1st missions and maybe supply missions as well.

[I-Hate-Druggers 192]

 

Devs need to remove Crystal missions, Finish 1st missions and maybe supply missions as well.

Yeah.

[austen_pierce 1,948]

That's my concern too, but some say that groups of friends will only play against groups of friends, I hope that's the case and the same for Clans.

 

All people form the same friend lists shouldn't be put together, nor in opposing teams, but in different battles or unrelated groups vs unrelated groups.

 

We'll see what happens with all the pro missioners, will they just focus on mission and then leave, thus crating unbalanced battles, or will the participate and help?

 

Devs need to remove Crystal missions, Finish 1st missions and maybe supply missions as well.

You're talking about me. I only do missions in Standard, then go PRO to play with skill not drugs.

 

I often stay in the Standard battle, IF the battle is interesting. Most of the time, the battle is a one sided slaughter, so I get what I need and go PRO.

 

Matchmaking has the potential to solve this, but I am anxious about this concept of 'groups of friends'. If this ends up enabling clans and structured organization of teams within Matchmaking battles, devs will have accomplished nothing.

 

.

Edited August 6, 2017 by austen_pierce

[Flaw.Less 0]

well tanki is going downhill pretty fast and for the most i would like to argue that the matchmaker is not at all working for me if i want to complete my missions.

moreover i wish the annual test goes horrible and some devs are seeing that there is a riot going on in the chat channel and people are being sent to completely random servers then a plugin appears on my pc showing that the connection has failed again and again and now i cant have the same fun i always used to have #BringBackOldTanki

[Lightning78 285]

So glad we can finally enjoy balanced battles, now that the matchmaking system is taking care of that. Some screens from today's test:

 

 

 

 

 

Epic fail..

:lol:

[sammillionaire 655]

#remove_matchmaking

[toe_cutter 4]

Its all about profits for the game designers.  I get that.  Updates and changes are done so it forces us to buy more crystals so you can stay competitive with the overdrive drug craze.  And now with matchmaking, everyone hates the random battles, but there will still be the ability to choose battles but you will have to buy a pro pass, right?  The changes will force out the more casual players and the ones who are willing to spend a lot of money will stay

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

Its all about profits for the game designers.  I get that.  Updates and changes are done so it forces us to buy more crystals so you can stay competitive with the overdrive drug craze.  And now with matchmaking, everyone hates the random battles, but there will still be the ability to choose battles but you will have to buy a pro pass, right?  The changes will force out the more casual players and the ones who are willing to spend a lot of money will stay

Hazel said PRO Passes will be free, they'll also rework Missions, because some will be hard to accomplish with 10vs10 random battles. The big problem is rank brackets that are longer and longer because few players are using Matchmaking, while others are in the Battle Lists, many doing parkour.

[T-34-3m 360]

How will battles be created? I don't trust robots.