What to buy? Which is better?

[smarty147 171]

:P how long was the battle?

15 min. the enemy was made up of m0 wasps and hornets. i also got 61 or 62 kils in a desert DM with my lower account.

[gabriele02 3,813]

First of all, the freeze effect is practically useless against fast-turning turrets like twins and firebird.  If you turn your turret and hull, you can keep up with the freeze easily.  m3 turrets and hulls turn so fast...

 

Also, 840 damage is the exact same as firebird.  And twins does 880 per second, which is even more than freeze.

 

And the range is 25 meters at m4, not 48. The alteration doesn't increase the total range, only the max damage range, which is something different.

 

Firebird is better in attacking, freeze is better in defending.

dont forget that freeze can steal fire's kills

also you can beat twins with freeze easly. You just need to hav a skill :ph34r:

[inthehouse81 34]

So, should I get Hornet M2 and buy Railgun M2 later on or save up for a kit? I think this is the best time for Hornet M2 as I can use it with Isida M2. But, Isida sucks and I want to get either M2 XP or a good kit like Northerner or Firebolt.

 

I am stupid.

Trust me get M2 XP or M2 BP, at my rank and higher there are a ton of druggers, now the best drug kit in the game costs money, so buyers get an advantage, and you can't earn 17,500 crystals with only 100 of each drug, so you won't profit from buying that kit. XP/BP is the only place in Tanki where you need skill, not your credit/debit card. And you have a better chance of joining a clan.

 

So recap:

 

• Get M2 XP/BP if you don't plan to get an M2 turret and an M2 hull.

 

• If you do get an M2 turret and an M2 hull then save for the M3 XP/BP.

 

Ok I'll probably get the XP M3, see my profile, I'll see yours to get a better understanding of you.

Edited October 26, 2016 by inthehouse81

[inthehouse81 34]

i think you mean tsunami OR fighter because i cant get them both..

thanks for your answers, looking for other answers too

probably going to buy tsunami if they put it in game

Sorry if I confused you but I meant / as "or"

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

dont forget that freeze can steal fire's kills

also you can beat twins with freeze easly. You just need to hav a skill :ph34r:

Everything you said is true, but

 

Fire can steal freeze's kills.  In fact freeze is the easiest gun to killsteal because they have to stay close to their enemy, making them both vulnerable.  Also, freeze makes the opponenet immobile and an easy target.

 

And twins can beat freeze easily too.  You just need to have skill :P

[NoobTanker18 63]

Did you try m3 freeze after rebalance? 

its freezes 4 times faster now and at m4 it deals whooping 84 dmg with alteration it can have range of 48 meters

it's more like attack turret now

I prefer to have mini mapping on. The sharpness kinda messes with me

[gabriele02 3,813]

Everything you said is true, but

 

Fire can steal freeze's kills.  In fact freeze is the easiest gun to killsteal because they have to stay close to their enemy, making them both vulnerable.  Also, freeze makes the opponenet immobile and an easy target.

 

And twins can beat freeze easily too.  You just need to have skill :P

True,fire can steal freeze's kill. But now when fire and freeze (both at same time) fires at enemy tank,freeze wins! (gets kill).

[sm0ky 92]

True,fire can steal freeze's kill. But now when fire and freeze (both at same time) fires at enemy tank,freeze wins! (gets kill).

And then the burn time comes into effect....

[gabriele02 3,813]

And then the burn time comes into effect....

it is not.. cuz freeze steals fires burn effect.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

True,fire can steal freeze's kill. But now when fire and freeze (both at same time) fires at enemy tank,freeze wins! (gets kill).

There's no reason why a freeze would always get the kill. It's probably due to your individual experience with freeze and fire. Who gets the kill out of the short range turrets is kind of random...

Edited October 26, 2016 by r_I_already_won0

[sm0ky 92]

There's no reason why a freeze would always get the kill. It's probably due to your individual experience with freeze and fire. Who gets the kill out of the short range turrets is kind of random...

Like my shots.

[T.O.R_Vlad 8]

huh... since tsunami isnt in the game, i will buy firefly... thank for all who answered to my question, see you when i need the next kit! :D

[Prince.Of.Life 85]

Should I buy some more M3s or should I save up for an XT (XT Rail)  :D  :)  ;)  :P

 

Feel free to look at my garage.

Edited October 27, 2016 by Prince.Of.Life

[Phoenix.Rising 2,519]

When MUing triple module (Twins-Fire-Freeze), is +5 MUs enough? (40-all) Or best MU to all the way to 50?

Edited October 27, 2016 by Phoenix.Rising

[DageLV 940]

Thunder m3 with alt is good or bad?

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

Thunder m3 with alt is good or bad?

I would save your crystals for when the m3 alterations come out.. You never know, there may be something really good there...

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

When MUing triple module (Twins-Fire-Freeze), is +5 MUs enough? (40-all) Or best MU to all the way to 50?

Instead of "protection and HP" think about the additional time, that the protection allows you to survive. That's the only thing that counts, as you need that time to fight back, reload, keep a point guarded, run with a flag, ...

Let's check how your survival time changes with protections:

 

For turrets that deal "gradual" damage..like Isida, Fire, Freeze, Twins and Vulcan:

 

 

• surival time with    0% protection = 100%
• survival time with 36% protection = 156%............100% / (1 - 0,36) = 156%
• survival time with 40% protection = 166%............100% / (1 - 0,40) = 166%
• survival time with 45% protection = 182%...
• survival time with 50% protection = 200%...
• (and if you have a DA equipped, it doubles all those times again)

   

• If you have 40% now and think of icereasing to 50% -> [200/166=1,205=120,5%] -> your felt survival time now will go up by +20,5%

 

 

 

 

For turrets that deal damage in larger portions (Hammer, Thunder, Rail, Shaft) ..

..it is unfortunately more complicated -.-

 

 

Why? Example Thunder-Protection: 

if 40% make you able to survive 3 shots with 20 hitpoints left, and die by the 4th shot, then additional MUing to 50% will still not help you to survive the 4th shot. The damage per shot is so high, that a loooot more % would be needed to make up for it.

 

So vs turrets that deam damage in larger portions:

1) you have to calculate how many hits you survive with the protection you have now

2) how much protection you would need to survive +1 more shot

Often there is simply a limit that makes sense; while more % stop to give you an advantage.

But this limit depends on the hull you use and the turrets that you want to protect yourself from.

 

 

 

So then you know what you gain.. then you can more easily say, if this is worth your crystals.

 

The alternative is always to make yor turret and hull more competative, which works vs all turrets and not just vs. some of them. Taking your hull from M3 to M4 makes a Titan gain about 20% survival time -> vs all turrets -> plus gaining speed and agility.

Same for a Thunder.

 

As higher MUs get ridiculously expensive.. it is most likely better to upgrade protection, turret and hull simultaniously - instead of taking one after the other to full M4. So if you use your TitanThunder just for poly CP; and there you use only 2 modules (like Twin,Fire,Freez; Twins;Vulcan;thunder), then spread your crystals equally over all those four things (Titan, Thunder, ModuleA and Module B ) and you should get the most advantage in survival time for your spendings.

Edited October 27, 2016 by BlackWasp777

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

Instead of "protection and HP" think about the additional time, that the protection allows you to survive. That's the only thing that counts, as you need that time to fight back, reload, keep a point guarded, run with a flag, ...

Let's check how your survival time changes with protections:

 

For turrets that deal "gradual" damage..like Isida, Fire, Freeze, Twins and Vulcan:

 

 

• surival time with    0% protection = 100%
• survival time with 36% protection = 156%............100% / (1 - 0,36) = 156%
• survival time with 40% protection = 166%............100% / (1 - 0,40) = 166%
• survival time with 45% protection = 182%...
• survival time with 50% protection = 200%...
• (and if you have a DA equipped, it doubles all those times again)

   

• If you have 40% now and think of icereasing to 50% -> [200/166=1,205=120,5%] -> your felt survival time now will go up by +20,5%

 

 

 

 

For turrets that deal damage in larger portions (Hammer, Thunder, Rail, Shaft) ..

..it is unfortunately more complicated -.-

 

 

Why? Example Thunder-Protection: 

if 40% make you able to survive 3 shots with 20 hitpoints left, and die by the 4th shot, then additional MUing to 50% will still not help you to survive the 4th shot. The damage per shot is so high, that a loooot more % would be needed to make up for it.

 

So vs turrets that deam damage in larger portions:

1) you have to calculate how many hits you survive with the protection you have now

2) how much protection you would need to survive +1 more shot

Often there is simply a limit that makes sense; while more % stop to give you an advantage.

But this limit depends on the hull you use and the turrets that you want to protect yourself from.

 

 

 

So then you know what you gain.. then you can more easily say, if this is worth your crystals.

 

The alternative is always to make yor turret and hull more competative, which works vs all turrets and not just vs. some of them. Taking your hull from M3 to M4 makes a Titan gain about 20% survival time -> vs all turrets -> plus gaining speed and agility.

Same for a Thunder.

 

As higher MUs get ridiculously expensive.. it is most likely better to upgrade protection, turret and hull simultaniously - instead of taking one after the other to full M4. So if you use your TitanThunder just for poly CP; and there you use only 2 modules (like Twin,Fire,Freez; Twins;Vulcan;thunder), then spread your crystals equally over all those four things (Titan, Thunder, ModuleA and Module B ) and you should get the most advantage in survival time for your spendings.

Great job with this.  But with the long range turrets you aren't always full on hp when you  encounter them.  For example, you might be fighting a smoky After  you fought a firebird.  So you can't just judge the worth of the modules by how many shots you survive.  Sure, with 30% protection you might die in 3 shots of thunder.  With 35% you still only survive 3 shots with thunder.  But that extra 5% might help you not die in two shots after you got hit by a passing hunter-twins.

[Phoenix.Rising 2,519]

Instead of "protection and HP" think about the additional time, that the protection allows you to survive. That's the only thing that counts, as you need that time to fight back, reload, keep a point guarded, run with a flag, ...

Let's check how your survival time changes with protections:

 

For turrets that deal "gradual" damage..like Isida, Fire, Freeze, Twins and Vulcan:

 

 

• surival time with    0% protection = 100%
• survival time with 36% protection = 156%............100% / (1 - 0,36) = 156%
• survival time with 40% protection = 166%............100% / (1 - 0,40) = 166%
• survival time with 45% protection = 182%...
• survival time with 50% protection = 200%...
• (and if you have a DA equipped, it doubles all those times again)

   

• If you have 40% now and think of icereasing to 50% -> [200/166=1,205=120,5%] -> your felt survival time now will go up by +20,5%

 

 

 

 

For turrets that deal damage in larger portions (Hammer, Thunder, Rail, Shaft) ..

..it is unfortunately more complicated -.-

 

 

Why? Example Thunder-Protection: 

if 40% make you able to survive 3 shots with 20 hitpoints left, and die by the 4th shot, then additional MUing to 50% will still not help you to survive the 4th shot. The damage per shot is so high, that a loooot more % would be needed to make up for it.

 

So vs turrets that deam damage in larger portions:

1) you have to calculate how many hits you survive with the protection you have now

2) how much protection you would need to survive +1 more shot

Often there is simply a limit that makes sense; while more % stop to give you an advantage.

But this limit depends on the hull you use and the turrets that you want to protect yourself from.

 

 

 

So then you know what you gain.. then you can more easily say, if this is worth your crystals.

 

The alternative is always to make yor turret and hull more competative, which works vs all turrets and not just vs. some of them. Taking your hull from M3 to M4 makes a Titan gain about 20% survival time -> vs all turrets -> plus gaining speed and agility.

Same for a Thunder.

 

As higher MUs get ridiculously expensive.. it is most likely better to upgrade protection, turret and hull simultaniously - instead of taking one after the other to full M4. So if you use your TitanThunder just for poly CP; and there you use only 2 modules (like Twin,Fire,Freez; Twins;Vulcan;thunder), then spread your crystals equally over all those four things (Titan, Thunder, ModuleA and Module B ) and you should get the most advantage in survival time for your spendings.

Both my turrets and hulls (Titan/Viking) are M4.That's not a problem. :ph34r: That's why I was wonder if I upgrade further this module (Twins/Fire/Freeze) to control the point from 40% to 50% will help, it's just 10% more & costly.

 

Usually when I use my Titan/Thunder M4, I use Max Africa Module... but it seems little difference from a 50% prot from a 40% one. :ph34r:

[wolverine848 13,097]

Both my turrets and hulls (Titan/Viking) are M4.That's not a problem. :ph34r: That's why I was wonder if I upgrade further this module (Twins/Fire/Freeze) to control the point from 40% to 50% will help, it's just 10% more & costly.

 

Usually when I use my Titan/Thunder M4, I use Max Africa Module... but it seems little difference from a 50% prot from a 40% one. :ph34r:

It takes a bit of work but setting up the spreadsheet crossing your hulls health vs % protection against weapons will allow you to work out how many shots it takes that weapon to kill you for each increment of MU.  Base is 40% (current) and have a column for each increase of 1%.

Then u can decide if upgrading further has a good ROI = increasing number of shots needed to kill you.

 

In some cases spending enough on MUs to get (say 1-5 %) more protection will make a diff = do it.

Other cases you might need MUs for 6-10% more protection to reduce it by one more shot. Worth it? maybe.

Other cases no matter how much u MU it the module will not make a difference in number of shots it takes to kill you.

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

But it still helps as the short-range turrets do damage in small increments..so if you are under fire from one of them you still want to survive two or 1 shots of a long range turret, for example.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

Great job with this.  But with the long range turrets you aren't always full on hp when you  encounter them.  For example, you might be fighting a smoky After  you fought a firebird.  So you can't just judge the worth of the modules by how many shots you survive.  Sure, with 30% protection you might die in 3 shots of thunder.  With 35% you still only survive 3 shots with thunder.  But that extra 5% might help you not die in two shots after you got hit by a passing hunter-twins.

Thnx - and I knew someone will raise this aspect ;)

 

It is no doubt, that any percent you get might help you.. but as those have to be paid are certain levels you can think off. The first level a player should achieve in terms of protection (IMHO) is to survive longer against his main threats. Later, once you achieved that, you can spend crystals on upgrading the rest.

It is a game with humans acting random according to their spawn points. You can't model everything.. but you can try to model some things.

 

 

Both my turrets and hulls (Titan/Viking) are M4.That's not a problem. :ph34r: That's why I was wonder if I upgrade further this module (Twins/Fire/Freeze) to control the point from 40% to 50% will help, it's just 10% more & costly.

 

Usually when I use my Titan/Thunder M4, I use Max Africa Module... but it seems little difference from a 50% prot from a 40% one. :ph34r:

So for this module (twins/Fire/Freeze @40%) you will gain +20% more survival time if you upgrade it to 50%.

 

If you feel it's not worth it, save your crystals for the M3 alternations that will come (one day.. :p ).

Thee is fore sure a reason why those are secret at the moment.. ;)

[r_I_already_won0 2,339]

Twins/fire/freeze sounds too narrow of a module for me.  By that I mean it's only good for small maps.  I would go for another more map-friendly module.  

 

The reason the m3 alterations are secret:

 

1.  The devs don't know themselves.

 

2. If they tell us in advance everyone will quit b/c they are so bad...

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

It takes a bit of work but setting up the spreadsheet crossing your hulls health vs % protection against weapons..

:) :) :) :)

your post made me smile, as I had exactly _this_ for the pre-balance values; for Wasp-vs-Thunder/Rail/Hammer/Smoky :)

It truely payd off, as I knew how much I would need.

[BlackWasp777 4,498]

Twins/fire/freeze sounds too narrow of a module for me.  By that I mean it's only good for small maps.  I would go for another more map-friendly module.

Princess is a polygon player.. therefore I chose that example. Lucky it was also that example that she had in mind :P