Let's discuss the other Overdrives devs want to implement

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

That's up to you. The devs are the ones with the actual data...

People lie, it's business.

 

Remember the Hammer and Railgun alteration lies?

[Maf 32,300]

People lie, it's business.

 

Remember the Hammer and Railgun alteration lies?

Not really. Remind me please?

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

Not really. Remind me please?

The Rail lie is a big one, they nerf it because they said it was OP, but then they add the old stats in the form of an alteration, which are supposed to be balanced to the stock stats. The Hammer lie is a bit hard to explain, and it was somehow corrected with its last tweak.

 

The Isida lie, where they reduced the cone angle according to them to make it aim better, when in reality they made it hard to aim.

 

There more example but I don't want to go off topic.

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

The Rail lie is a big one, they nerf it because they said it was OP, but then they add the old stats in the form of an alteration, which are supposed to be balanced to the stock stats. The Hammer lie is a bit hard to explain, and it was somehow corrected with its last tweak.

 

The Isida lie, where they reduced the cone angle according to them to make it aim better, when in reality they made it hard to aim.

 

There more example but I don't want to go off topic.

First of all, Rail was "nerfed" because they wanted to make it easier to use for new players, not because it was OP. Second, you actually have to pay for the alteration. So it's not just "adding back." How many players do you see with old Railgun stats?

 

What is this Isida alteration you are talking about? There is no alteration that reduces cone angle, at least not for Isida. Broadband emitters increases cone angle.

[Pink_Legacy 269]

First of all, Rail was "nerfed" because they wanted to make it easier to use for new players, not because it was OP. Second, you actually have to pay for the alteration. So it's not just "adding back." How many players do you see with old Railgun stats?

 

What is this Isida alteration you are talking about? There is no alteration that reduces cone angle, at least not for Isida. Broadband emitters increases cone angle.

It's no alteration. It's a change that developers made to stock Isida a while ago.

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

It's no alteration. It's a change that developers made to stock Isida a while ago.

My bad. In any case, it was not a lie. Nerfing Isida's cone angle made it more precise, meaning that if there were two tanks in front of you, you would no longer accidentally heal the one that had full HP because of the cone angle. Note D.a.n.t.e's choice of words. He said that the change was intended to make Isida aim better but made it harder to aim. Aiming better means being more accurate. An Isida that is accurate is one that goes exactly where you point the ray at, meaning if you miss a tank by a millimeter it won't register. An Isida that is easy to aim is one that will "snap on" to a tank if you are slightly off. These are two completely different meanings. An accurate Isida cannot be an easy to aim Isida and vice versa. So I am not sure why this is a lie. Maybe at best it's a poor choice of words.

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

My bad. In any case, it was not a lie. Nerfing Isida's cone angle made it more precise, meaning that if there were two tanks in front of you, you would no longer accidentally heal the one that had full HP because of the cone angle. Note D.a.n.t.e's choice of words. He said that the change was intended to make Isida aim better but made it harder to aim. Aiming better means being more accurate. An Isida that is accurate is one that goes exactly where you point the ray at, meaning if you miss a tank by a millimeter it won't register. An Isida that is easy to aim is one that will "snap on" to a tank if you are slightly off. These are two completely different meanings. An accurate Isida cannot be an easy to aim Isida and vice versa. So I am not sure why this is a lie. Maybe at best it's a poor choice of words.

Did you just said 'nerfing Isida's cone angle' and then that it made it 'more precise'? What is it then, a nerf or a buff? Is this what they call a 'Freudian slip'?

 

That is similar with the Railgun lie, they said the whole thing was for balance, the update was called "global balance update", then they introduce a Rail alteration with the old stats, what does it mean now? That alterations are not balanced or that it wasn't about balance at all?

 

With the updates and the decline in number of players, they are not going to admit that the updates are causing the problem, so they tell a lie, and it is understandable because otherwise people will be like "I told you so".

 

Sometimes it is very hard to be honest.

Edited August 19, 2017 by D.a.n.t.e

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

Did you just said 'nerfing Isida's cone angle' and then that it made it 'more precise'? What is it then, a nerf or a buff? Is this what they call a 'Freudian slip'?

 

That is similar with the Railgun lie, they said the whole thing was for balance, the update was called "global balance update", then they introduce a Rail alteration with the old stats, what does it mean now? That alterations are not balanced or that it wasn't about balance at all?

 

With the updates and the decline in number of players, they are not going to admit that the updates are causing the problem, so they tell a lie, and it is understandable because otherwise people will be like "I told you so".

 

Sometimes it is very hard to be honest.

By "nerfing cone angle" I meant reducing cone angle. And yes, I think this was a nerf. But it wasn't a lie, since what was communicated by the devs was exactly what happened. 

 

On the subject of Railgun, consider two things:

A. Rail alteration is available starting at M2 only.

B. Rail alteration costs crystals.

What is the conclusion?

The number of Rails with "old stats" is less than the number of Rails with "new stats." Pretty much every single turret that was changed during the big re-balance received an alteration that made it more similar to it's original state. Why was this done? In my opinion two reasons: to make money, and not to anger old players who hated the new changes (like myself. I intend to buy the Railgun alteration when I have enough to do so). Alterations do not affect the balance significantly, since the majority of players do not have alterations.

Edited August 20, 2017 by ThirdOnion

[TakeAShower 300]

In my opinion, here are the overdrives I think each hull will get.

Wasp - Bomb (very confindent)

Hornet - Current overdrive (just a guess)

Viking - Better Turret Stats (pretty confident)

Hunter - See enemies through walls, see enemy HP (very confident)

Dictator - Invunerability (pretty confident)

Titan - Remove supplies and overdrives from nearby opponents (just a guess)

Mammoth - Sheild (very confident)

[GuidoFawkes 2,361]

This would just make the game even more pay to win. Buyers would be able to use the hull with the overdrive most suitable for a particular map or game mode. what if my only m3 is vulcan and my only m3 hull gets the overdrive which decreases reload speed? if they do implement this they should at least give us the chance to trade 1 of our hulls for another 1 with the same modification amd micro upgrade level, we did not spend so much time saving up for something only to have you turn it into sometjing we dont like

Edited August 21, 2017 by GuidoFawkes

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

I would much rather have Viking get back it's stability and pushing power and lose that speed, and get the least OP overdrive there is than for it to keep its current stats and be given an OP overdrive.

[wolverine848 13,097]

This would just make the game even more pay to win. Buyers would be able to use the hull with the overdrive most suitable for a particular map or game mode. what if my only m3 is vulcan and my only m3 hull gets the overdrive which decreases reload speed? if they do implement this they should at least give us the chance to trade 1 of our hulls for another 1 with the same modification amd micro upgrade level, we did not spend so much time saving up for something only to have you turn it into sometjing we dont like

My understanding of "decrease re-load speed" is this...

 

If you have a shot re-load (Thunder, Ricco, Hammer. Smoky, Rail , Shaft, Magnum, Striker) then time between shots goes down.

 

If you have a continuous fire weapon (Freeze, Firebird, Isida, Vulcan) then you can fire for a longer period before needing to stop. So Vulcan will still benefit.

 

Not sure how twins will be affected... it does have a very small pause between shots.

[GuidoFawkes 2,361]

My understanding of "decrease re-load speed" is this...

 

If you have a shot re-load (Thunder, Ricco, Hammer. Smoky, Rail , Shaft, Magnum, Striker) then time between shots goes down.

 

If you have a continuous fire weapon (Freeze, Firebird, Isida, Vulcan) then you can fire for a longer period before needing to stop. So Vulcan will still benefit.

 

Not sure how twins will be affected... it does have a very small pause between shots.

I hope that'd be the case. because in the wiki the definition of reload speed is time inbetween shots. but yeah, what you say does make sense

Edited August 22, 2017 by GuidoFawkes

[wolverine848 13,097]

I hope that'd be the case. because in the wiki the definition of reload speed is time inbetween shots. but yeah, what you say does make sense

The wording is odd.

 

Should be decrease re-load time  or...

 

Increase re-load speed.

 

Either way I think it just means "shoot faster". Or in case of Fire/freeze etc... "shoot for longer time".

[Tani_S 736]

The wording is odd.

 

Should be decrease re-load time  or...

 

Increase re-load speed.

 

Either way I think it just means "shoot faster". Or in case of Fire/freeze etc... "shoot for longer time".

Yes, imho talking about reload speed is irritating to a lot of people. Better talk about a lower reload time or a higher fire rate. As for Twins I am pretty sure that you can expect the same like for Smoky or Thunder, so it will shoot even faster  :D

 

For this OD they said

• higher rate for normal turrets
• unlimited energy and higher range for energy turrets

For Vulcan I'd expect that you will have no energy limitation and by this no self-burning damage, as well as a higher range, but i'm not 100% sure. I'm curious what they will do about Ricochet, because from its mechanics it is a turret of both types. It has a reload parameter (measured by time) and is also an energy turret (energy limitation).

[GuidoFawkes 2,361]

Yes, imho talking about reload speed is irritating to a lot of people. Better talk about a lower reload time or a higher fire rate. As for Twins I am pretty sure that you can expect the same like for Smoky or Thunder, so it will shoot even faster  :D

 

For this OD they said

• higher rate for normal turrets
• unlimited energy and higher range for energy turrets

For Vulcan I'd expect that you will have no energy limitation and by this no self-burning damage, as well as a higher range, but i'm not 100% sure. I'm curious what they will do about Ricochet, because from its mechanics it is a turret of both types. It has a reload parameter (measured by time) and is also an energy turret (energy limitation).

well stopping over heating doesn't really help much. other turrets can even fire after shooting for too long... and it's range is already high enough to shoot across large maps... i havent tried it on lost temple but i know it can shoot across other maps nearly as big.

Edited August 23, 2017 by GuidoFawkes

[wolverine848 13,097]

well stopping over heating doesn't really help much. other turrets can even fire after shooting for too long... and it's range is already high enough to shoot across large maps... i havent tried it on lost temple but i know it can shoot across other maps nearly as big.

But Vulcan overheats relatively quickly no?  8-10 seconds? That is limit placed on turret because while firing continuously it does damager per second.  That is potent.  So being able to fire for much long i think would be a good benefit.

 

As for range... that might be all the ranges increased (max damage range / min damage range ). freeze and Fire suffer this.  So IF Vulcan falls into this category doing Max damage at greater distance would also be a benefit.

[GuidoFawkes 2,361]

But Vulcan overheats relatively quickly no? 8-10 seconds? That is limit placed on turret because while firing continuously it does damager per second. That is potent. So being able to fire for much long i think would be a good benefit.

 

As for range... that might be all the ranges increased (max damage range / min damage range ). freeze and Fire suffer this. So IF Vulcan falls into this category doing Max damage at greater distance would also be a benefit.

yes it'd probably still benefit, but not as much as shaft/railgun on their m2 alterations would.(for railgun it'd be the one which trades reload speed for damage increase). What is a m4 vulcan with higher max damage compared to turrets firing up to 3900 damage shots both with impacts second only to hammer at close range at nearly vulcan's fire rate? i'm just saying some overdrives like this one could better benefit or at least be more practical when paired with certain turrets over others. it woldnt matter for those who have all 7 hulls or beginners but what about those of us who have spent so much time saving up for and MUing our 1 and only main hull? and also, those who can afford alterations like smoke m2, shaft m2 or railgun m2 would benefit from this more than those without, because that increase reload time wouldnt matter when this overdrive gets activated but the damage increase would still apply. Edited August 23, 2017 by GuidoFawkes

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

By "nerfing cone angle" I meant reducing cone angle. And yes, I think this was a nerf. But it wasn't a lie, since what was communicated by the devs was exactly what happened. 

 

On the subject of Railgun, consider two things:

A. Rail alteration is available starting at M2 only.

B. Rail alteration costs crystals.

What is the conclusion?

The number of Rails with "old stats" is less than the number of Rails with "new stats." Pretty much every single turret that was changed during the big re-balance received an alteration that made it more similar to it's original state. Why was this done? In my opinion two reasons: to make money, and not to anger old players who hated the new changes (like myself. I intend to buy the Railgun alteration when I have enough to do so). Alterations do not affect the balance significantly, since the majority of players do not have alterations.

In the Isida case, they talked as if they were buffing it.

 

They say alterations are balanced to stock equipment, but they are not, Rail, Fire and Hammer for example. And those only benefit buyers who can buy the alterations.

[D.a.n.t.e 475]

I'm gonna love to have the Transparency Overdrive in Sandbox.

[wolverine848 13,097]

yes it'd probably still benefit, but not as much as shaft/railgun on their m2 alterations would.(for railgun it'd be the one which trades reload speed for damage increase). What is a m4 vulcan with higher max damage compared to turrets firing up to 3900 damage shots both with impacts second only to hammer at close range at nearly vulcan's fire rate? i'm just saying some overdrives like this one could better benefit or at least be more practical when paired with certain turrets over others. it woldnt matter for those who have all 7 hulls or beginners but what about those of us who have spent so much time saving up for and MUing our 1 and only main hull? and also, those who can afford alterations like smoke m2, shaft m2 or railgun m2 would benefit from this more than those without, because that increase reload time wouldnt matter when this overdrive gets activated but the damage increase would still apply.

I agree - roll of the dice.

 

Once my Super-mission is complete I'm going to stick to "custom battles" or whatever they call them when MM comes back.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

I thought this over, and realized that overdrives alone won't make hulls unique. So the hulls stats should be switched back to what they used to have before the rebalance update of October 2016, with a few tweaks.

 

Wasp - m0 can have 850 hp and top speed of 12. M4 should have maybe around 1700 hp and top speed of 14.

 

Hornet - m0 can have 1000 hp and a top speed of 10. M4 with 2000 hp and top speed of 12.

 

Hunter - m0 gets 1350 hp, a top speed of 8, weight of 1300, and power of 900. M4 gets 2700 hp, a top speed of 10, weight of 2600, and power of 1400.

 

Viking - m0 gets 1500 hp, a top speed of 7.3, weight of 1750, and power of 1100. M4 can have 3000 hp, a top speed of 9, weight of 3500, and power of 1800.

 

Dictator - m0 gets 1650 hp, a top speed of 7.6, weight of 1550, and power of 950. M4 gets 3300 hp, a top speed of 9.5, weight of 3100, and power of 1500.

 

Titan - m0 gets 2000 hp, top speed of 5.5, and power of 1000. M4 gets 4000 hp, top speed of 7, and power of 1600.

 

Mammoth - m0 gets 2150 hp, top speed of 5.2, and power of 1050. M4 gets 4300 hp, top speed of 6.5, and power of 1700.

 

Also for over drives, I have an idea of which hull gets which OD.

 

Wasp - can get an extra speed boost overdrive that can be stacked on to a speed boost supply and vice versa, or an ability to jump that can only be used once per overdrive activated.

 

Hornet - would either get the bombs or an electrical cloud that can temporarily paralyze and damage enemy tanks.

 

Hunter - should get the faster reload overdrive.

Viking - would get an overdrive that lets it move props of the map which can only be done once per overdrive and it can also push an enemy heavy hull with extreme ease.

Dictator - can get a drone overdrive, which works when the moment it's activated, the drone will be high up, which allows you to view the map for 45-60 seconds, when those seconds are up, you will lose the view of it until the next overdrive.

 

Titan - should get the invulnerability overdrive.

Mammoth - will get the shield overdrive.

 

I think that this will not only make hulls unique, but will also make them much more balanced.

Edited August 29, 2017 by DieselPlatinum

[wolverine848 13,097]

Hunter - m0 gets 1450 hp, a top speed of 8, weight of 1300, and power of 900. M4 gets 2900 hp, a top speed of 10, weight of 2600, and power of 1400.

 

Viking - m0 gets 1500 hp, a top speed of 7.3, weight of 1550, and power of 1100. M4 can have 3000 hp, a top speed of 9, weight of 3100, and power of 1800.

 

Dictator - m0 gets 1550 hp, a top speed of 7.6, weight of 1750, and power of 950. M4 gets 3050 hp, a top speed of 9.5, weight of 3500, and power of 1500.

 

If you are giving Dictator more health and weight, why is it faster than Viking?

 

If only advantage Viking has is power, I don't see many people buying it.

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

Wasp - m0 can have 950 hp and top speed of 11. M4 should have maybe around 1900 hp and top speed of 13.

 

Hornet - m0 can have 1000 hp and a top speed of 10. M4 with 2000 hp and top speed of 12.

 

Hunter - m0 gets 1450 hp, a top speed of 8, weight of 1300, and power of 900. M4 gets 2900 hp, a top speed of 10, weight of 2600, and power of 1400.

 

Viking - m0 gets 1500 hp, a top speed of 7.3, weight of 1550, and power of 1100. M4 can have 3000 hp, a top speed of 9, weight of 3100, and power of 1800.

 

Dictator - m0 gets 1550 hp, a top speed of 7.6, weight of 1750, and power of 950. M4 gets 3050 hp, a top speed of 9.5, weight of 3500, and power of 1500.

 

Titan - m0 gets 1950 hp, top speed of 5.5, and power of 1000. M4 gets 3950 hp, top speed of 7, and power of 1600.

 

Mammoth - m0 gets 2000 hp, top speed of 5.2, and power of 1050. M4 gets 4000 hp, top speed of 6.5, and power of 1700.

 

The HP difference between hulls of the same class is negligible. It needs to be at least several hundred to make a difference. What you wrote is more or less what we currently have, just some parameters shuffled around between hulls.

[NamesAreForNoobs 324]

Overdrives are going to be a good feature