Matchmaking is coming May 29th

[DRAKO523 795]

137 pages later and still not the slight regret [...]

The russian forum looks more positive regarding this update to be honest..;p

[ByeByeBye 1,747]

Because the Battle Buttone was in fact not the same thing as MM. You can write a paragraph stating they are teh same thing.  But that is not true.  So much for that.

Ok, you say they weren't the same.  How were they different other than:

 

1.  You would enter a battle that some other players had chosen when you used the Battle Button (like Highways and the Shaft hoard).

2.  Rank brackets were smaller with the Battle Button

3.  No was time spent in queue with the Battle Button.

 

I see no other differences other than these three.  And it would be very difficult to show that point #2 and point #3 are improvements.

 

You contend that MM is so much better because you don't have to take all that time to sort through the Battle List to find a suitable battle.  I contend you NEVER had to sort through the Battle List if you din't want to because you could have just used the Battle Button.

 

And my main point is (if MM doesn't differ much from the Battle Button) that there is no improvement with MM, and MM is, in fact, a downgrade for the game overall.  ...just some devs horribly misguided idea which provided a couple years of "busywork" for the kids in Perm.  I think most players already agree that MM is a crock and pretty much the worst thing that has ever happened to Tanki...so far.  Only a few very verbal proponents of MM seem to exist in cyberspace.

[LittleWillie 3,199]

Ten Proofs Matchmaking Does Not Work

 

Last night it occurred to me to take screenies of my game results as I worked on my missions. So here are 10 games played across four accounts. All games were MM games. I did not exit any game I just played what I got.

 

Now we can prove exactly how terrible is the MM system. Obviously I fool no one who has read my posts for they already know I am being sarcastic.

 

---------------All Games

 

Every game started in less than 1 minute.

Nine of 10 games were new games just underway.

All games were played from about 1 hour after server reboot to 3 hours after server reboot. Not peak times but not the lowest times either.

 

--------------Game 1 

 

8x8 very even team by rank. My team red wins handily. I do not recall much about this game. Obviously I played a less significantrole,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 2 

 

7x8 perfectly balanced team by rank if not player count. My team (with 7 players) wins on 7-0 shutout.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 3 

 

7x8 with slight rank advanatage to the 7 player team.  My team *7 players) wins in a good 7-4 match. Lowest ranked players on winning team finish 1st and 5th.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 4 

 

7x8 with the 8 player team with a noticeable rank advantage. My team gets smoked 7-0 Note the lowest ranking player in the game earned the most Cry.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 5 

 

7x8 wide ranks spread Marshal to CPT with 8 player team having the advantage. My team loses 1-3 in a tight batle.  The CPts on each team finish in the middle of their teams. The highest ranking players on the winners finish 1st and last.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 6 

 

7x7  even teams by rank. My team loses close 79-73 match.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 7 

 

8x8 Wide rank game from Cpt to Marshal and a slight rank edge to red. My team (blue) wins going away 100-21. The Cpt in this game went 0-6. Each team had a Col or LtCol in 2nd place.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 8 

 

8x8 with a ridiculous rank spread from sgt to Marshal on blue.(Has to be a Group effect). But despite that the ranks on the two teams are more or less balanced.  Blue has higher ranks for 7 players then their one super low rank. My team won an extremely vclose game 100-96, just holding off a late charge by blue.  The SGT went 4-24. Why players form groups like this is hard to fathom.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 9

 

8x8 very even teams by rank. My team wins a tough 1-0 game on low-scoring Massacre.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 10

 

8x8 with red having a rank advantage when comparing the bottom 4 tanks on each team. The top 4 are closely balanced. Red wins a 8-0 blowout as three blue tanks are non-factors.  This was the only game I entered that was already underway. So I susyemct some of these blue zero tanks were also late substitutees.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

BOTTOM LINE

 

Out of 10 games one featured the low-ranking group member programming flaw but it led to one of the closest games all night.  

 

One more game featured a bad rank imbalance on the bottom half of the two teams. This was the only game I joined that was not a brand-new match. This was the only really substandard game out of 10.

 

The other 9 games were wither adequately ballancd to EXTREMELY well balanced.  But many balanced teams led to blowout games. 

 

Several low rankers mixed it up with high rankers.  Some did well some did poorly.  The point is they were almost always competitive.

 

I played 10 games one after the other. I got 9 of 10 games were good to very good.

 

I did not wait long for any game even though I had to leave teh queue to save my screenies each game.

 

The gripes expressed here is MM is broken, it never gives a balanced game, it makes you wait 5-10 minutes each time, and it "always" places players in ongoing blowouts not new games. These ten games show these claims to be petulant hyperbole.  

 

I never would have found 9 or 10 quality games so quickly under the old system.

 

Let's face it: MM is a better deal in all regards except for map choice. And if you are that unwilling to play on anything but your pet maps ... well then you are a noob.  Don't be a noob. Challenge yourself.

Edited June 21, 2018 by LittleWillie

[LittleWillie 3,199]

Ok, you say they weren't the same.  How were they different other than:

 

1.  You would enter a battle that some other players had chosen when you used the Battle Button (like Highways and the Shaft hoard).

2.  Rank brackets were smaller with the Battle Button

3.  No was time spent in queue with the Battle Button.

 

I see no other differences other than these three.  And it would be very difficult to show that point #2 and point #3 are improvements.

 

You contend that MM is so much better because you don't have to take all that time to sort through the Battle List to find a suitable battle.  I contend you NEVER had to sort through the Battle List if you din't want to because you could have just used the Battle Button.

 

And my main point is (if MM doesn't differ much from the Battle Button) that there is no improvement with MM, and MM is, in fact, a downgrade for the game overall.  ...just some devs horribly misguided idea which provided a couple years of "busywork" for the kids in Perm.  I think most players already agree that MM is a crock and pretty much the worst thing that has ever happened to Tanki...so far.  Only a few very verbal proponents of MM seem to exist in cyberspace.

If you do not understand why MM is different from the plain battle button that is because  you are determined to insist they are teh same.  Anyone who has read this thread knows how they differ.  So why should I waste my time talking to you, Mister Brick Wall?  B-B-Bye!

The highest ranked player on the other team was 0-kills and 18-deaths - and that does not seem odd to you?

 

-------------------------------------------------

 

And Match-Maker does it again...

 

Places me in a CTF battle with 4 minutes left, 4-0 for other team, and one of their "runners" hitting OD to make off with the 5th flag.

This crappy system does no one any justice. Not me - placed in an unwinnable position, and not the team getting pummeled. Any and all reinforcements will just hit exit as soon as they realize what is going on. Correction - I'm sure the "winning" team loves it as they can pad their bank account.

What a nice cherry you picked.

[ByeByeBye 1,747]

The russian forum looks more positive regarding this update to be honest..;p

I just translated the last four pages of the matchmaking thread in on the Russian forum. ( Матчмейкинг (обновлено 31.05.2018) if you are interested)  There are thousands of posts overall, but the last four pages are mostly just off topic chat.  I wouldn't say that the Russians are looking at MM more positively, they are just talking about unrelated things with a zinger or two thrown in here or there criticizing MM.

[ByeByeBye 1,747]

If you do not understand why MM is different from the plain battle button that is because  you are determined to insist they are teh same.  Anyone who has read this thread knows how they differ.  So why should I waste my time talking to you, Mister Brick Wall?  B-B-Bye!

What a nice cherry you picked.

So, humor me, tell me what is different...other than those three things?  I truly don't see any difference...enlighten me.  Redistribution of battle funds is not a difference because it could have easily been applied before MM or like it was, to MM.  It is not part of MM.  What does MM do that the Battle Button didn't?

[wolverine848 13,097]

 

What a nice cherry you picked.

Hey - it's not my fault the screen-shot you posted did not prove what you think it does.

If you want to believe that was a balanced battle - go ahead.  Maybe it helps you feel good about it, and your performance in the battle.

 

The highest rank player on other team has used less supplies than my Captain account - and that's not because he/she doesn't need them, as evidenced by the crappy score. That player was for all intents-and-purposes a "mult".

 

You've been quite salty with anyone who does not share your opinion on MM or how to play Tanki. Not everyone wants to "get out of their comfort zone" or be "challenged".  Many are just casual players who play a little each day to unwind and have fun.

[Viking4s 10,791]

So, humor me, tell me what is different...other than those three things?  I truly don't see any difference...enlighten me.  Redistribution of battle funds is not a difference because it could have easily been applied before MM or like it was, to MM.  It is not part of MM.  What does MM do that the Battle Button didn't?

If MMS was not implemented, does the redistribution of battle funds would still have been?

Of course the redistribution of battle funds is not specific to MM, but it is a part of it never the less.

And yes it is most likely to have been implemented on purpose jointly with MMS to ease the shift to the new system. Such a drastic change can only be smoothed by such positive addition. Would you shoot in your own foot if you had the opportunity not to?

 

[ByeByeBye 1,747]

 

Ten Proofs Matchmaking Does Not Work

 

Last night it occurred to me to take screenies of my game results as I worked on my missions. So here are 10 games played across four accounts. All games were MM games. I did not exit any game I just played what I got.

 

Wow, lots of work put in on this...and an interesting group of screens with interesting commentary.  Good job.  I'm spoilerizing them only because they take up so much room in a quote.

 

 

 

 

Now we can prove exactly how terrible is the MM system. Obviously I fool no one who has read my posts for they already know I am being sarcastic.

 

---------------All Games

 

Every game started in less than 1 minute.

Nine of 10 games were new games just underway.

All games were played from about 1 hour after server reboot to 3 hours after server reboot. Not peak times but not the lowest times either.

 

--------------Game 1 

 

8x8 very even team by rank. My team red wins handily. I do not recall much about this game. Obviously I played a less significantrole,

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 2 

 

7x8 perfectly balanced team by rank if not player count. My team (with 7 players) wins on 7-0 shutout.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 3 

 

7x8 with slight rank advanatage to the 7 player team.  My team *7 players) wins in a good 7-4 match. Lowest ranked players on winning team finish 1st and 5th.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 4 

 

7x8 with the 8 player team with a noticeable rank advantage. My team gets smoked 7-0 Note the lowest ranking player in the game earned the most Cry.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 5 

 

7x8 wide ranks spread Marshal to CPT with 8 player team having the advantage. My team loses 1-3 in a tight batle.  The CPts on each team finish in the middle of their teams. The highest ranking players on the winners finish 1st and last.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 6 

 

7x7  even teams by rank. My team loses close 79-73 match.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 7 

 

8x8 Wide rank game from Cpt to Marshal and a slight rank edge to red. My team (blue) wins going away 100-21. The Cpt in this game went 0-6. Each team had a Col or LtCol in 2nd place.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 8 

 

8x8 with a ridiculous rank spread from sgt to Marshal on blue.(Has to be a Group effect). But despite that the ranks on the two teams are more or less balanced.  Blue has higher ranks for 7 players then their one super low rank. My team won an extremely vclose game 100-96, just holding off a late charge by blue.  The SGT went 4-24. Why players form groups like this is hard to fathom.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 9

 

8x8 very even teams by rank. My team wins a tough 1-0 game on low-scoring Massacre.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

--------------Game 10

 

8x8 with red having a rank advantage when comparing the bottom 4 tanks on each team. The top 4 are closely balanced. Red wins a 8-0 blowout as three blue tanks are non-factors.  This was the only game I entered that was already underway. So I susyemct some of these blue zero tanks were also late substitutees.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

BOTTOM LINE

 

Out of 10 games one featured the low-ranking group member programming flaw but it led to one of the closest games all night.  

 

One more game featured a bad rank imbalance on the bottom half of the two teams. This was the only game I joined that was not a brand-new match. This was the only really substandard game out of 10.

 

The other 9 games were wither adequately ballancd to EXTREMELY well balanced.  But many balanced teams led to blowout games. 

 

Several low rankers mixed it up with high rankers.  Some did well some did poorly.  The point is they were almost always competitive.

 

I played 10 games one after the other. I got 9 of 10 games were good to very good.

 

I did not wait long for any game even though I had to leave teh queue to save my screenies each game.

 

The gripes expressed here is MM is broken, it never gives a balanced game, it makes you wait 5-10 minutes each time, and it "always" places players in ongoing blowouts not new games. These ten games show these claims to be petulant hyperbole.   

 

 

I never would have found 9 or 10 quality games so quickly under the old system.

 

Let's face it: MM is a better deal in all regards except for map choice. And if you are that unwilling to play on anything but your pet maps ... well then you are a noob.  Don't be a noob. Challenge yourself.

 

You may have or you may not have.  I guarantee that I could have picked ten games from the Battle List that would have tilted things in my favor.  I would bet that with the same amount of time put in I would have come out with a lot more crystal reward from the old system because I could pick battles suitable to me.  That is efficiency.

 

And I still contend that if you didn't want to spend time choosing a battle that would suit you, you could have always just hit the battle button and wouldn't have had the wide rank brackets or the waiting time in queue.  If you wound up on Highways with the Shaft Hoard, you could just leave it.

 

So let's face it, there is NOTHING that MM does better in any regard than the previous system.  I want to play as I wish to play and that is why the previous system was better...if you wanted challenge, you could find it easily, if you wanted comfort and "the same old same old" you could find it.  In fact Tanki was much better before the Battle List because you do so many more things with it.  Control of maps, battle criteria, size of battle, rank limits, on and on...mostly the same thing we have now in Pro-Battles, but it was applicable to Standard Battles where you could even complete Daily Missions!. Wow, nostalgia...the real good old days. 

 

Nope, sorry LittleWillie, your hard work is admirable and I commend your effort, but the argument and conclusion is just way off.  MM is not very good...it may still be playable, but it is inferior in every regard I have heard or seen.

Edited June 21, 2018 by ByeByeBye

[ByeByeBye 1,747]

If MMS was not implemented, does the redistribution of battle funds would still have been?

Of course the redistribution of battle funds is not specific to MM, but it is a part of it never the less.

And yes it is most likely to have been implemented on purpose jointly with MMS to ease the shift to the new system. Such a drastic change can only be smoothed by such positive addition. Would you shoot in your own foot if you had the opportunity not to?

 

OK....uhhh, I think that is my point too.  Redistribution of battle funds is separate from MM but released at the same time as MM.  Hypothetically it could have been implemented without MM.  I only mention the redistribution as kind of preemptive counter to one of the possible things that MM does that the Battle Button didn't.

 

I think another smoothing addition, and a real biggie that I am totally grateful for, is the unchaining from the mission chain.  It could have been implemented along with MM but was done earlier help with the shock of MM.  I think if players were forced to keep up their mission chain under MM the hue and and anguished crys would have been outrageous.  I think it would have decimated the player base.  

 

So MM has brought about some good changes...great changes in fact.  But those changes are not part of MM, they are changes that could have been done anytime.  Tanki is still playable and that is due in large to these two positive changes, but MM itself is awful, disappointing, and a real downgrade in my opinion.

[r_Issimo2 1,495]

LW, even if MM was different from Battle, why didn't you use Battle? Since you are so good, you could have helped even the losing teams.

[GuidoFawkes 2,361]

 

Ten Proofs Matchmaking Does Not Work

I don't understand how they're using ratings to send players to battles.

 

so many of your battles had captains in them... but until now I havn't seen a captain in my battles. There has only been 1 battle where there wasn't any legends, every other battle was with legends... yet funnily enough your ratings are higher than mine.

[DRAKO523 795]

I don't understand how they're using ratings to send players to battles. [...]

I'm as curious as you are when it comes to finding out how exactly they put players in MM battles...Hopefully they can give useful information in tommorows v-log  -_- or in the near future that will turn into months, then a year :-;

Edited June 21, 2018 by DRAKO523

[Viking4s 10,791]

I'm as curious as you are when it comes to finding out how exactly they put players in MM battles...Hopefully they can give useful information in tommorows v-log  -_- or in the near future that will turn into months, then a year :-;

The vlog #172 explained in some details how the MM System work: https://youtu.be/l2W-wRBlfeo?t=164

[DRAKO523 795]

[...]

Gee' really wish they shared much more than just that. But thanks mate :-;.

[r_Issimo2 1,495]

I don't understand how they're using ratings to send players to battles.

 

so many of your battles had captains in them... but until now I havn't seen a captain in my battles. There has only been 1 battle where there wasn't any legends, every other battle was with legends... yet funnily enough your ratings are higher than mine.

I don't know why I'm mostly sent to the noob team.

 

The first few days of MM was good for me, it felt more random, then it got bad. I haven't compared my effectiveness ratings or K/D with others to see if any of those are the problem. I have around 3.0 of K/D with light drugging, I don't know if my rating is good or bad.

 

I can also say it's groups or mults, but who knows. Some say that multing is not possible, but I'm not sure, I don't think the multers from the past didn't try multing and are behaving nice now.

 

There are many hackers now, if you haven't notice that either you're blind or a grinding camper.

[ByeByeBye 1,747]

MM right now...well, just before today's reset:

 

1st game <1 min to enter, TDM losing team, about <7 min duration...OK game

 

2nd game 1st try >2 min to enter, never entered but back to lobby

2nd game 2nd try >2 min to enter, CTF losing team, <1min duration...complete waste of about 10 minutes altogether

 

3rd game >4 min to enter ASL, losing team, >9 minutes duration, I was the granddaddy on my team and I left in <2 min, the churn was awful, players spawned in and quit as soon as they saw the score

 

 

Edited June 22, 2018 by ByeByeBye

[r_Issimo2 1,495]

3rd game >4 min to enter ASL, losing team, >9 minutes duration, I was the granddaddy on my team and I left in <2 min, the churn was awful, players spawned in and quit as soon as they saw the score

 

1. Where you in a group? Some blame groups when they see low ranks in a team.

[The_Pakistani 16,768]

Still open  :o

[TaffyTank 1,890]

I don't know why I'm mostly sent to the noob team.

 

The first few days of MM was good for me, it felt more random, then it got bad. I haven't compared my effectiveness ratings or K/D with others to see if any of those are the problem. I have around 3.0 of K/D with light drugging, I don't know if my rating is good or bad.

 

I can also say it's groups or mults, but who knows. Some say that multing is not possible, but I'm not sure, I don't think the multers from the past didn't try multing and are behaving nice now.

 

There are many hackers now, if you haven't notice that either you're blind or a grinding camper.

Same.....

 

 

  :rolleyes:

Edited June 22, 2018 by TaffyTank

[The_Pakistani 16,768]

Look these skill-less campers and 2 healers were saving butts of campers not attackers

[ByeByeBye 1,747]

1. Where you in a group? Some blame groups when they see low ranks in a team.

nope...no group.    Gosh, I didn't even notice that I was bottom of the rank barrel, I was just focused on the churn.

 

And that brings up a good point.  Tanki has brutalized the game with MM.  WHY in the world do they insist on group capability on top...to add insult to injury?  It is obviously a disaster. 

 

Take a group of players (three now I believe), who have played together, have coordinated equipment and might even be in real time communication with each other then toss them into a battle of individuals.  The side with the group will most likely start to win which starts the churn of the losing team to go into a full fledged exodus.  Then, I have seen it already, you put two sets of three clan members on the same team...the clan may have fun shooting fish in a barrel but the fish are pretty disgruntled.

 

If Tanki insists on having a team function, let teams play against other teams...or better yet, just get rid of the team function altogether.

 

 

...............and another point to highlight from these three battles is that I spent about 15-18 minutes of queuing/loading/waiting to battle about 16 minutes.

Edited June 22, 2018 by ByeByeBye

[GuidoFawkes 2,361]

The vlog #172 explained in some details how the MM System work: https://youtu.be/l2W-wRBlfeo?t=164

yes, but what they explained isn't close to what i see is happening to me.

 

don't get me wrong, i actually like playing with legends... I'm just trying to figure out how exactly are they doing this. why is it that willie gets to fight captains while i get legends all the time despite the fact that my ratings is a lot lower than his.

[Viking4s 10,791]

yes, but what they explained isn't close to what i see is happening to me.

 

don't get me wrong, i actually like playing with legends... I'm just trying to figure out how exactly are they doing this. why is it that willie gets to fight captains while i get legends all the time despite the fact that my ratings is a lot lower than his.

probably bad luck. I get all sort of battles, so I can't relate to your situation.

Not everything will be shared by the developers, but keep asking we never know.

[Benefactor 6,888]

probably bad luck. I get all sort of battles, so I can't relate to your situation.

Not everything will be shared by the developers, but keep asking we never know.

Do they take micro-upgrades and supply usage into account?