Matchmaking fixes, changes to PRO-battles

[cyborg11b 95]

You want to waste your time - that's your decision. Some might call it foolish.

 

When MM places me on a team that...

- has 2-3 of my players doing more talking than playing, I leave.

- has 3 or more players with no score after 3 minutes - I leave.  That's not 8 vs 8 - it's 8 vs 4.

- has a player on my team 8 ranks below me - I leave,  "Battle groups" should be Pro-battles only.  I don't care if someone's friend wants to play with Legends - it handi-caps my team.

 

Since Match-Maker can't actually make the players assigned on my team play, I reserve the right to say adios to these "team" players.

I agree with you to a certain extent, but still consider Tanki as a Team-effort.

And to make it clear, I don't wish or ask to be dropped into battles with much higher ranked players. The MM does that. It's no fun for me and no fun for them.

[austen_pierce 1,948]

MM seems to be dropping me into a lot more half over battles lately.

[QuicKK 975]

 see all week after the war was done my battles I went into were normal regular rank battles . but when war and even this weekend events are on the ranks are mixed up . is anyone else having   this happen . i'm curious to see .

found 2 ppl with warrant officer ranks with legends

[OKDad70 862]

Look at it from my 'noob'-perspective (Lieutenant General) too. Do you think it's much fun to be dropped into a battle with all Legends or Generalissimo's ? With my few M2s and 2 M3s I am no match for those high ranks with MU'd M3 or M4 equipment. I never last longer than 15 seconds, every opponent overpowers me, especially since heavy drugging seems to be the rule rather than the exception lately.

I appreciate your comments, Cyborg. I drive a full M3+ Viking or Titan with full M3+ Twins, or a 16MU Vulcan (bad idea if they don't fix the overheat). I respawn two to five times per minute. The competition is tough most of the time at the high ranks.

 

Yes, supplies are the norm. There is skill required if you plan to only use what you earn. (The War helped.) Supplies are part of the game. I don't understand the aversion to drugging, at least not past the midranks. By then, you should know how to use the supplies where they count. You shouldn't be running out. (Don't ask if I ever run out. I just live with it.)

 

Ranks issues are only problematic some of the time. Equipment M can be problematic, but there are times things just don't seem to be working.

 

MM needs to compare players team effectiveness for team play. I'm not sure how to do so, but I don't see signs that they try.

 

MM for DM should only be trying to match equipment level. Again, it doesn't seem they try to do that.

 

And, if you haven't noticed, in most DM, an isida is almost always in first place. (Freeze was for a little while, but they have freeze only slightly OP now.) Twins has always been about the middle of middle, never OP. Yet, I see lots of twins right now. Not sure why. I use it because it suits my close combat preference. There are at least five better turrets.

[EternalGlory 84]

omg guys are you kidding me?

this firebird is too op in low ranks

dmg from burning effect is always 300 per second-m3 or m0...

in low ranks this is very op, what you balanced?

[OKDad70 862]

You want to waste your time - that's your decision. Some might call it foolish.

 

When MM places me on a team that...

- has 2-3 of my players doing more talking than playing, I leave.

- has 3 or more players with no score after 3 minutes - I leave.  That's not 8 vs 8 - it's 8 vs 4.

- has a player on my team 8 ranks below me - I leave,  "Battle groups" should be Pro-battles only.  I don't care if someone's friend wants to play with Legends - it handi-caps my team.

 

Since Match-Maker can't actually make the players assigned on my team play, I reserve the right to say adios to these "team" players.

I appreciate your points, valid, but I consider such as secondary considerations most of the time.

 

The fact that players leave early from battles is a significant factor in team mismatch and overall unbalance.

 

It is not possible to force a fix on that. Therefore, I do what I can and live the example. I almost never leave a battle early.

 

Besides, taking two minutes to join a battle, playing two minutes, then dropping out and taking two minutes to get into the next one, well that can add up to an unacceptable amount of time in queue. I'd rather stick out a bad battle than waste the time in more MM queues.

[a7x_Pedro48 13,999]

Going through the pro battles list is kinda confusing now. Half of the battles are actually the map in russian. It made it harder to look for a specific map. Especially if the map is in space mode, the thumbnail is the same, no matter what the map is.

[wolverine848 13,097]

I appreciate your points, valid, but I consider such as secondary considerations most of the time.

 

The fact that players leave early from battles is a significant factor in team mismatch and overall unbalance.

 

It is not possible to force a fix on that. Therefore, I do what I can and live the example. I almost never leave a battle early.

 

Besides, taking two minutes to join a battle, playing two minutes, then dropping out and taking two minutes to get into the next one, well that can add up to an unacceptable amount of time in queue. I'd rather stick out a bad battle than waste the time in more MM queues.

If they fix the issues with MM than I suspect more players will stay in battles and fewer players will find themselves joining half-finished battles.

[Ninja 10,468]

omg guys are you kidding me?

this firebird is too op in low ranks

dmg from burning effect is always 300 per second-m3 or m0...

in low ranks this is very op, what you balanced?

Did not realise it was 300 at all modifications, thats pretty hilarious :lol:

[blutakix 81]

MatchMaker

 

If you can't fix the problems... TELL A BIGGER LIE!

 

 

END MATCHMAKER NOW!

[SwiftSmoky 8,445]

END MATCHMAKER NOW!

If you really wanna do that you need to somehow convince most players to play only pro battles, good luck with that  :lol:

[blutakix 81]

MM dropped me in a battle that proved to be two minutes of being spawn-killed, and I wrote the note above about that.

 

Now, just got out of another. Dropped into a spawn-kill fest with the match at 6-0. WTH?!?! Why would your system allow that?

 

I'm not sure if the four teammates still in when we were drubbed 7-0 simply hadn't had time to get out, or if they are rather averse to leaving early, like me.

 

What the hell? Three in a row? I only had time to die twice before the other team scored the seventh goal. 7-0. Why was I dropped into such a hopeless battle? Is it punishment for pointing out how crappy the match making system is?

 

Is it rugby? Fourth in a row ended 7-0. I lead my team. Had more score than half the clods on the other team, but, of course, four of them had more than twice my score. I got in at the beginning of this one. It seemed we had only one starting player leave. We looked evenly matched for the first minute, then they scored at will. Why? The match making system has to figure that out and not let such mismatches happen.

 

Fifth times a charm, I suppose. This time I was on the winning team. Sad, 7-0 still. They made two good runs, but we stopped them. They threw the ball off the map a few times, too. WUWT?

 

The fact remains: MM makes for very lopsided battles, very uneven teams.

 

It's only going to get worse.  I predicted this when MatchMaker first came out.  If you take away the choice of battle, you take away one incentive to stay.  After all, YOU didn't choose the battle.  MatchMaker ASSIGNED you a battle.  If the battle SUCKS, you have NO REASON TO STAY.

 

If you get dumped on a map you don't want to play... leave the game.

If you get dumped in a game that's already in progress, but you have a "Top 3" mission... leave the game.

If youR team is losing... why stick around?   Leave the game!

 

What effect does this have?

 

Well, there are several.  I've written before about the effect of being a man down.  If you have two teams of 10, with everyone on both teams having all M3 equipment, when one team loses a player, it's the same as having a full team - but with all M2 equipment.  That's the difference it makes.  I did the math.

 

But with MatchMaker, it's even WORSE because there's a time-lag bringing a new player into a game in progress.  That's prime-time for enemy scoring. So the game gets more imbalanced and then a new player is dropped in.  If they're a noob, don't know what they're doing, they may stick around and play.  But if it's someone with some skills who sees the setup for what it is - massive spawn kill and nobody on his team who can play for crap - he leaves.  This is like a one-way filter with all the best players getting out.

 

MatchMaker is a stupid idea with even worse execution.  There are lots of reasons why it should be killed:

 

1. It takes away choice of games.
2. It dumps people into half-finished battles.
3. It wastes time - oh SO MUCH TIME - just getting into a battle.
4. It's introduced lag in browsers.  (I see less lag in the client).
5. The battles are anything but balanced.
6. MatchMaker always wants to cram the maximum number of players into every battle.  Remember when sometimes the battles WEREN'T jammed so full?  Back when strategy was part of the game?
7. Now strategy is gone.  It's just who has the best armor, biggest gun, can shoot the fastest, and blast away.  It's a brain-dead game.
8. It makes it harder to complete missions.  If I'm dumped in a battle with just two repair boxes on the entire map, and my mission is "Get 3 Repair Boxes" - I quit and try another battle.  No point in fighting 19 other people over two boxes.
9. Rematches are gone.  Used to be if there was a really EXCELLENT battle, the two sides would hang around and play again.  And again.  And again.  I've been in battles where pretty much the same two teams played 5 or more battles in a row and everyone was having a blast.  That's all gone now, because MatchMaker rips people out of the battle, off the map and shuffles them all up to produce crappy, unbalanced battles.

The devs aren't fixing MatchMaker.  It's like a dead skunk.  You cannot fix it.  You can only bury it.

 

END MATCHMAKER NOW!

[blutakix 81]

If you really wanna do that you need to somehow convince most players to play only pro battles, good luck with that  :lol:

We had non-pro battles LONG before MatchMaker.  Let's go back to that.  It wasn't perfect, but it was a HELLUVA lot better than MatchMaker.

 

END MATCHMAKER NOW!

Edited August 13, 2018 by blutakix

[Guest]

We had non-pro battles LONG before MatchMaker.  Let's go back to that.  It wasn't perfect, but it was a HELLUVA lot better than MatchMaker.

 

 

I object. We would go back to 99% blowout battles and that one battle that everyone wants to get in to because it's a tie. Also, are you one of those mults who don't do anything but collect boxes for those stupid missions?  :rolleyes:

 

Edit: Found the real reason why you hate MM... you're a camper!  :lol: You just want an easy Noise, Highways, or Brest game to lazily lob Magnum shells and rack up a high K/D without putting any effort into it.

Edited August 13, 2018 by Guest

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

 

Edit: Found the real reason why you hate MM... you're a camper!  :lol: You just want an easy Noise, Highways, or Brest game to lazily lob Magnum shells and rack up a high K/D without putting any effort into it.

 

Hey, no one has the right to be lazy but me. :ph34r: B)

[r_Issimo2 1,495]

Playing a lot less now, only two battles today with a trow away account, then some parkour to be honest. The battles MM puts you in are frustrating, then Drones, Overdrives, and balance updates like the one of Freeze and now Fire.

[Meco2011 0]

I do like the updates to the game, however; there are missing a lot of changes to make this game better.

 

The over power on the Freeze, its ridiculous how fast the freeze destroy a Mammoth or a full upgraded Viking even using the protection 

 

The option to report players during battles is very helpful, but what about on the chat? its annoying read a lot of players cursing against other veterans players; just because we cant reply to there questions fast or just because they are World of Tanks players and think that its the same crap of game and Tanki its not like that. Not only against other players, some of those RAT KIDS curse against moderators and its hard to them to stop that behavior because when one player start a lot more continue with that behavior. We need more bans without warnings, warnings dont stop the behavior. 

Edited August 13, 2018 by Meco2011

[blutakix 81]

 

I object. We would go back to 99% blowout battles and that one battle that everyone wants to get in to because it's a tie. Also, are you one of those mults who don't do anything but collect boxes for those stupid missions? :rolleyes:

 

Edit: Found the real reason why you hate MM... you're a camper! :lol: You just want an easy Noise, Highways, or Brest game to lazily lob Magnum shells and rack up a high K/D without putting any effort into it.

Why don't you try sticking to facts? I've given you 9 good reasons to get rid of MatchMaker.

 

All you can do is call me names and tell lies. (Nothing on Tanki is "99%").

 

Do you have a brain? Use it. What we have now in terms of blowouts is no better (actually, I think it's worse) than what we had before. So on balance, we've gained NOTHING. And we have something WORSE than mults. Mults were little people with desperation and no skills. But there were relatively few of them. What we have now is thousands of "quitters", which are just as bad as mults. Whether someone is sitting doing nothing, or looking at the map, the team, the score or the situation and saying, "I'm outa here" doesn't matter. One team is still down a man, and that makes about an 11% difference. Because MatchMaker drives MORE people to quit MORE battles, it's the same effect as a lot MORE mults.

 

END MATCHMAKER NOW!

 

 

I do like the updates to the game, however; there are missing a lot of changes to make this game better.

 

The over power on the Freeze, its ridiculous how fast the freeze destroy a Mammoth or a full upgraded Viking even using the protection

 

The option to report players during battles is very helpful, but what about on the chat? its annoying read a lot of players cursing against other veterans players; just because we cant reply to there questions fast or just because they are World of Tanks players and think that its the same crap of game and Tanki its not like that. Not only against other players, some of those RAT KIDS curse against moderators and its hard to them to stop that behavior because when one player start a lot more continue with that behavior. We need more bans without warnings, warnings dont stop the behavior.

What are you? A Stasi-wannabe?

 

I've seen people banned for NOTHING. No rules broken. No cursing. If anyone needs banning it's the moderators!

 

As for kids cursing... if that irritates your sensitive little eyeballs, there's fix for that which doesn't involve spinning up the thought police: "IGNORE". Yep, just "ignore" the offender and they'll never bother you again. If you're too damned lazy to do that, or too stupid, then you deserve all the ocular irritation we can dish out - tear gas levels!

 

END MATCHMAKER NOW!

 

If they fix the issues with MM than I suspect more players will stay in battles and fewer players will find themselves joining half-finished battles.

The issue IS MatchMaker. The only way to FIX it is to get rid of it.

 

END MATCHMAKER NOW!

Edited August 13, 2018 by CooperO
Posts merged, kindly refrain from flooding.

[cyborg11b 95]

I appreciate your comments, Cyborg. I drive a full M3+ Viking or Titan with full M3+ Twins, or a 16MU Vulcan (bad idea if they don't fix the overheat). I respawn two to five times per minute. The competition is tough most of the time at the high ranks.

 

Yes, supplies are the norm. There is skill required if you plan to only use what you earn. (The War helped.) Supplies are part of the game. I don't understand the aversion to drugging, at least not past the midranks. By then, you should know how to use the supplies where they count. You shouldn't be running out. (Don't ask if I ever run out. I just live with it.)

 

Ranks issues are only problematic some of the time. Equipment M can be problematic, but there are times things just don't seem to be working.

 

MM needs to compare players team effectiveness for team play. I'm not sure how to do so, but I don't see signs that they try.

 

MM for DM should only be trying to match equipment level. Again, it doesn't seem they try to do that.

 

And, if you haven't noticed, in most DM, an isida is almost always in first place. (Freeze was for a little while, but they have freeze only slightly OP now.) Twins has always been about the middle of middle, never OP. Yet, I see lots of twins right now. Not sure why. I use it because it suits my close combat preference. There are at least five better turrets.

Maybe I should finally start using all the drugs I saved over the last few years wisely :

2060 RC

7940 DA

8280 DD

8690 SB

7428 mines

209 batt

Aversion ?  Not really. I just never got into the habit of using them (constantly).

With a lot of players I see them spawning and as they do a DA or DD appears. That's not the way I play, but maybe I am wrong and thus ranking slower than most of the others.

 

I'll have a look at your comment concerning isida and DM.

I have an M2 with 10/10 MU (= M3) but still have to wait 2 rank up to be able to buy it as a full M3 and further upgrade it.

[wolverine848 13,097]

The issue IS MatchMaker.  The only way to FIX it is to get rid of it.

 

I'm not a fan of MM, but TO has invested too much in it so MM is not going anywhere.

 

The best solution is to fix some of the issues. Hopefully sooner than later.

 

If Devs think it is fine as-is players will eventually get so frustrated with it they will...

1) Switch to Pro-battles, even if they lose out on missions (easier for those with full garage)

      OR

2) Play less or

      OR

3) Just leave game entirely

[splitterpoint 10,986]

It just takes way too long sometimes to get into a desired game mode.

And the longer the waiting time, the higher the chance you'll be put in an absolute worthless blowout match.

 

At those moments I just quit the game for the day or skip missions for crystals because I know the mode is dead and there's no profit to be made.

This is the worst thing about matchmaking for me. I hope one day we'll get some better algorithm that doesn't make you wait like 4 minutes only to get spawnkilled the hell over.

[blutakix 81]

I'm not a fan of MM, but TO has invested too much in it so MM is not going anywhere.

 

The best solution is to fix some of the issues. Hopefully sooner than later.

 

If Devs think it is fine as-is players will eventually get so frustrated with it they will...

1) Switch to Pro-battles, even if they lose out on missions (easier for those with full garage)

      OR

2) Play less or

      OR

3) Just leave game entirely

Actually, you are partly correct.  Tanki has doubtless put much time and effort into MatchMaker.  But at some point they have to admit, it's a DISASTER.  One can put a lot of time an effort into something that turns out to be entirely WRONG - and that's what Tanki has done.   There have been some incredibly stupid decisions throughout history:

1. The French government spent $15 BILLION on trains that are too wide for 1300 of the platforms in their system.  
2. Decca Records turned down signing the Beatles because they were "unsellable".  
3. Napoleon and Hitler both tried to invade Russia in winter.  
4. The Russians sold Alaska to the U.S. for 2 cents an acre.  
5. The Dutch discovered Australia 100 years before the British - but ignored it because they thought it was useless desert.
6. Tanki installed "MatchMaker".

[cyborg11b 95]

 

 

I do like the updates to the game, however; there are missing a lot of changes to make this game better.

 

The over power on the Freeze, its ridiculous how fast the freeze destroy a Mammoth or a full upgraded Viking even using the protection

 

The option to report players during battles is very helpful, but what about on the chat? its annoying read a lot of players cursing against other veterans players; just because we cant reply to there questions fast or just because they are World of Tanks players and think that its the same crap of game and Tanki its not like that. Not only against other players, some of those RAT KIDS curse against moderators and its hard to them to stop that behavior because when one player start a lot more continue with that behavior. We need more bans without warnings, warnings dont stop the behavior.

The chat-problem is quite easy to stop, no ? Make sure you have enough chat-mods and instruct them to be severe with that kind of behaviour. No respect = minimum 1 day ban. When other rat-kids, as u call them, see that they will stop soon enough. Also multi-lingual mods (yes, those ppl exist) could be helpfull.
Btw, I applied for chat-mod a while ago, didn't even get an answer... So I suppose there are more than enough of them (according to TO).

 

Question about this topic/forum.
Quite a few are raging about MM, some are making suggestions to improve it, ... Fact is that there is a lot of commotion going on about this.
Do the devs read/know this ? Are they (in their ivory towers ?) aware of the fact that the plebs is grumbling ?

 

 

 

 

MatchMaker

 

 

 

If you can't fix the problems... TELL A BIGGER LIE!

 

 

 

 

 

 

END MATCHMAKER NOW!

I've seen worse ...
:blush: Edited August 13, 2018 by CooperO
Posts merged, kindly refrain from flooding.

[wolverine848 13,097]

 

Actually, you are partly correct.  Tanki has doubtless put much time and effort into MatchMaker.  But at some point they have to admit, it's a DISASTER.  One can put a lot of time an effort into something that turns out to be entirely WRONG - and that's what Tanki has done.   There have been some incredibly stupid decisions throughout history:

1. The French government spent $15 BILLION on trains that are too wide for 1300 of the platforms in their system.  
2. Decca Records turned down signing the Beatles because they were "unsellable".  
3. Napoleon and Hitler both tried to invade Russia in winter.  
4. The Russians sold Alaska to the U.S. for 2 cents an acre.  
5. The Dutch discovered Australia 100 years before the British - but ignored it because they thought it was useless desert.
6. Tanki installed "MatchMaker".

 

Your font is ... <_<

 

In any event.. examples 1-5 are moot - they were all "fait accompli" and not fixable.

And example 3 not quite correct. Operation Barbarossa started in June of 1941.  Hitler was just too optimistic and his decision-making during the Operation ensured it stretched out into winter.

 

MatchMaker, though riddled with issues, can be fixed to some degree.  Won't be easy, but is possible to reduce the bad effects.

[ByeByeBye 1,747]

 

 

Now that the War is over, please bring back the "bonus" column in the end readout screen. And, get rid of the nuclear signs on every map and replace them with their normal supply drop (usually a repair kit).

It is frustrating to see gigantic scores and crystal pay-outs for players that have under-performed you. Please bring back the "bonus" column to make scoring/rewards more clear. Why not get rid of K/D...it serves zero function where the bonus column was useful.

 

Also get rid of the nuclear symbol or tell it what it is going to be used for. It has tanke the place of some drop boxes on certain maps...Tribute is the only one tht I can think of right off the top of my head, but it has removed one repair kit drop...bad trade...for a pointless symbol.

 

 

 

Your font is ... <_<

 

In any event.. examples 1-5 are moot - they were all "fait accompli" and not fixable.
And example 3 not quite correct. Operation Barbarossa started in June of 1941. Hitler was just too optimistic and his decision-making during the Operation ensured it stretched out into winter.

 

MatchMaker, though riddled with issues, can be fixed to some degree. Won't be easy, but is possible to reduce the bad effects.

Yes, I agree....gotta get the font to normal size please...use large or color for emphasis.

 

It is a shame to have to try to fix a system that is inferior, only because Tanki spent 18 months generating a poor system. There is no advantage that MM has brought to the table that the Battle Button didn't already employ...and almost no one used the Battle Button because they preferred "choice".

 

MM is inferior, but it is what Tanki has decided on so we are stuck with it and like any physical disability, it can be worked around.

 

One of the first issues is the waiting time. (I love how they changes the bogus "average waiting time" to a matter of a few seconds now...so pathetic.) Anyway we have several computers in our home and me and my kids all got on a separate computer. We all had equal rank accounts with about the same equipment and efficiency ratings. One of us would intentionally pull out of a battle while the other two were waiting in queue. Another would stay in the battle to monitor the number of players. In every single trial, MM never sent anyone to the battle where the was an appropriate vacancy....NEVER! We saw battles go for several minutes with no players being replaced, but we had two appropriate players waiting in queue! When someone was replaced it was usually with a much lower rank. The algorithm does not work very well or anywhere nearly as well as advertised by the Tanki spin doctors.

 

The next issue for me is that rank brackets are much too wide. Our experiment showed that equivalent ranks are not given priority...it's anyone in queue which makes for some very lopsided battles.

 

The problem of mass exoduses from the losing side and too much time waiting in queue just to be put into the last few minutes of a battle could be greatly reduced if the rank brackets were tighter. Who wants to fight someone six, seven, or eight ranks above them? Reduce the rank brackets, give priority to equivalent ranks in queue, and the amount of quitters will lessen.

 

There are other issues with MM, but these are thee three worst for me. If they could be resolved or implemented, I would be OK with MM...now it is something to be endured.