Declined Cut module protections by half

[wolverine848 13,097]

Even one second easily makes the difference between life and death. So does making the enemy need just one more shot. 

 

 

That is true, yes. But if they have higher equipment then you they deserve to have the advantage... 

 

I don't agree with the way you can be placed in battles with people an entire M level above/below you, but given that this is the case, I think this is the most fair way to have it. 

 

 

Well yes but I've almost never seen this happen. 

You try to brush off all the points except... my post #11...

 

And we could debate this until the cows come home, but it's moot.  It was declined for a reason.

[thesquarerootof2 165]

You try to brush off all the points except... my post #11...

 

And we could debate this until the cows come home, but it's moot.  It was declined for a reason.

Yes, it was declined because the community will get triggered without actually stopping to think. 

Maf basically admitted this when he declined it

And you're right i have not responded to your post #11. I'm taking my time to think of a response to it. 

[thesquarerootof2 165]

You are probably right about it but maybe you're not. idk. 

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

Yes, it was declined because the community will get triggered without actually stopping to think. 

It's not so simple. People have spent so much real money on these things. Compare the guy with a 50% protection module and someone with no module. The difference is huge. Halve protections, and now one has 25% and the other still has 0. The advantage people have paid for is drastically reduced. You can't do that.

[thesquarerootof2 165]

Well technically no because everyone's protection is reduced by the same factor, one-half. 

Since everyone's protection is reduced by one-half the advantages are still maintained

[wolverine848 13,097]

Well technically no because everyone's protection is reduced by the same factor, one-half. 

Since everyone's protection is reduced by one-half the advantages are still maintained

No - the advantages are not maintained.

My example showed (pretty clearly I thought) that advantage of 20% gets reduced to 10%.  20% and 10% are not the same.

But someone who spent crystals on MUs for hull & turret have their advantage maintained, since this proposal does not affect that.

 

I have gone on record stating that a reasonable compromise would be 35% max protection - but - that would have to be combined with allowing 4 modules.  A number of turrets have been introduced since paints with mostly 3 protections were around.  So 3 modules does not do same job now as it did before - covers a lesser proportion of available turrets.

 

But curious why you find 3-modules at 50% so unpalatable.  We can only defend against 3 of 13 turrets.  That's not a lot.

Have you placed all your eggs in one basket?  One M4-combo and not much else?

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

Well technically no because everyone's protection is reduced by the same factor, one-half. 

Since everyone's protection is reduced by one-half the advantages are still maintained

Right, but one half of 0 is still 0. The advantage you have over players with little or no protection gets drastically reduced. Halving someone's 50% protection to 25% is much more damaging than halving someone's 10% protection to 5%.

[thesquarerootof2 165]

But curious why you find 3-modules at 50% so unpalatable.  We can only defend against 3 of 13 turrets.  That's not a lot.

Have you placed all your eggs in one basket?  One M4-combo and not much else?

Well technically I have plenty of money to buy some more turrets. But my favorite turret by far is Railgun. It is the only turret that I really love playing with. And Rail is one of those turrets that gets discriminated against by modules. 

 

In any case, I just feel like it's really wrong how M3 and M4 weapons can be crippled by simple community dislike. Community doesn't like being killed by turret "x", suddenly turret "x" is at a massive disadvantage. 

[thesquarerootof2 165]

i have not forgotten post #11 btw  :)

[wolverine848 13,097]

Well technically I have plenty of money to buy some more turrets. But my favorite turret by far is Railgun. It is the only turret that I really love playing with. And Rail is one of those turrets that gets discriminated against by modules. 

 

In any case, I just feel like it's really wrong how M3 and M4 weapons can be crippled by simple community dislike. Community doesn't like being killed by turret "x", suddenly turret "x" is at a massive disadvantage. 

Well this explains everything. 

 

You just don't like ppl protecting themselves against your fav weapon and refuse to switch if they do.

 

Man-up and spend some crystals on another combo.  This is on you.

[thesquarerootof2 165]

You just don't like ppl protecting themselves against your fav weapon and refuse to switch if they do. 

No that isn't the reason. 

Nice job ignoring the entire other half of the post as well

[thesquarerootof2 165]

Man-up and spend some crystals on another combo.  This is on you.

So it's my fault that some turrets including Railgun are disadvantaged at high ranks? Interesting. 

 

And also you admit that this is true, and in addition that it's OK simply because I can just "use a different turret"? Great game balancing logic you got there. 

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

Well technically I have plenty of money to buy some more turrets. But my favorite turret by far is Railgun. It is the only turret that I really love playing with. And Rail is one of those turrets that gets discriminated against by modules. 

At your rank there shouldn't be any Railgun modules with significant protection (25% and above). Do you have a higher account?

[thesquarerootof2 165]

At your rank there shouldn't be any Railgun modules with significant protection (25% and above). Do you have a higher account?

I did say that this isnt really an issue with M0-M1. No I don't have a higher account. But like I said, I don't want to have to deal with this if i ever become high-rank. 

[thesquarerootof2 165]

I've seen plenty of high-rankers comment about what protections they use so that's how I figure out what modules people use up there. 

 

also 333rd post

[wolverine848 13,097]

No that isn't the reason. 

Nice job ignoring the entire other half of the post as well

What "other half"?  How can you complain about something you've never encountered?

 

Rail is your fav but you have 67 hrs on Shaft m1 and 13 hrs on Rail?

 

You claim modules affect your turrets the most.  How about Freeze or Isida?  They run out of juice before they can kill.

 

Like I said, players can only protect themselves against 3 of 13 turrets.  With Thunder, Magnum, Fire, Freeze and twins all being somewhat OP, not to mention smoky getting a boost, not every player can afford to equip Rail protection all the time.

 

I did say that this isnt really an issue with M0-M1. No I don't have a higher account. But like I said, I don't want to have to deal with this if i ever become high-rank. 

[thesquarerootof2 165]

Rail is your fav but you have 67 hrs on Shaft m1 and 13 hrs on Rail? 

Have you considered that maybe this isn't my Rail account? 

[thesquarerootof2 165]

You claim modules affect your turrets the most.  How about Freeze or Isida?  They run out of juice before they can kill.

 

Like I said, players can only protect themselves against 3 of 13 turrets.  With Thunder, Magnum, Fire, Freeze and twins all being somewhat OP, not to mention smoky getting a boost, not every player can afford to equip Rail protection all the time.

All true. a 50% module would indeed affect a "limited juice" weapon like isida more than it would a not limited juice one like Rail. But it seems that people hate being killed by certain turrets (including rail) much more than others, so there's much more rail or thunder protection than say, isida protection. 

 

Also have you maybe considered that I'm not just thinking about Rail? Maybe I'm actually trying to be fair and also try to balance turrets that aren't my own?  :o

[thesquarerootof2 165]

I've looked into the profiles of everyone who commented here, and also 15 random people from this week's "top 100 experience earned" section in Ratings. 

 

Almost all of you had at least one or more of these turrets (most had 2) in your most used protections (and most used by a long shot, i might point out): 

• Thunder
• Fire
• Magnum
• Twins
• Freeze
• Rail

Almost none of you had these turrets in your most used protections (i found most of them in like last place, many times less used than those above): 

• Striker
• Vulcan
• Isida

Not hard to find bias in your protection choices tbh  :P

[thesquarerootof2 165]

Like I said, players can only protect themselves against 3 of 13 turrets. 

And thus they will choose which ones they hate the most. And there seems to be a trend to which ones those are. 

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

 

Yes, people use protections against the most common / powerful turrets. What are you trying to say?

[thesquarerootof2 165]

Yes, people use protections against the most common / powerful turrets. What are you trying to say?

Those turrets are gonna face a major disadvantage compared to the other turrets

[wolverine848 13,097]

I've looked into the profiles of everyone who commented here, and also 15 random people from this week's "top 100 experience earned" section in Ratings. 

 

Almost all of you had at least one or more of these turrets (most had 2) in your most used protections (and most used by a long shot, i might point out): 

• Thunder
• Fire
• Magnum
• Twins
• Freeze
• Rail

Almost none of you had these turrets in your most used protections (i found most of them in like last place, many times less used than those above): 

• Striker
• Vulcan
• Isida

Not hard to find bias in your protection choices tbh  :P

You do understand Rail & Thunder were/are very common turrets. That's why ppl equip protection against them.

 

And Striker & Vulcan are hardly used at all.

 

Your logic is extremely flawed.

 

Those turrets are gonna face a major disadvantage compared to the other turrets

Then use a different turret or come up with a better tactic.

 

Why would someone continue to use the same turret if everyone defends against it?

Your choice to use it.  Or not.

[thesquarerootof2 165]

You do understand Rail & Thunder were/are very common turrets. That's why ppl equip protection against them.

 

And Striker & Vulcan are hardly used at all.

 

Your logic is extremely flawed. 

Flawed? What mistake am i making in assuming that a more protected weapon is at a disadvantage compared to less protected ones? 

 

 

Then use a different turret or come up with a better tactic.

 

Why would someone continue to use the same turret if everyone defends against it?

Your choice to use it.  Or not.

Ok let's make Railgun OP beyond measure, make every stat 10x better.

 

Oh, you don't like it? Then just use Railgun yourself or come up with a better tactic. I mean, why would someone continue to use not-Railgun if it's obviously inferior to Railgun? Your choice to use it. Or not. 

[wolverine848 13,097]

Flawed? What mistake am i making in assuming that a more protected weapon is at a disadvantage compared to less protected ones? 

 

 

Ok let's make Railgun OP beyond measure, make every stat 10x better.

 

Oh, you don't like it? Then just use Railgun yourself or come up with a better tactic. I mean, why would someone continue to use not-Railgun if it's obviously inferior to Railgun? Your choice to use it. Or not. 

You tried to make a point about what protections are used and not used.  And failed completely.

More ppl use protections against the turret they see in battles the most.  They use protections least against turrets they see the least.

Has nothing to do with bias.  You try to complicate it to suit your needs.

 

Railgun 10x boost...  :blink:    You want to compare giving 1 of 13 turrets a 10x boost to ... everyone being able to equip protections (with exact same limitations) against the turrets of their choice?   :rolleyes:   It's like you've given up and are not even trying.

 

and for post #11 - don't bother.  If could not come up with a response by now, it just doesn't matter.