under review Battle balance for on-going battles (joining after battle starts)

[Philosopher 24]

What is the situation?
Enemies control most of the map, my team in disarray, score is already against me. Score sometimes is already irreversible (0-6 in JGR, with 7 minutes left).

First suggestion: Once a certain number of players in one team leave, battle should be concluded earlier. For example, 6 players leave (after battle starts), so battle time is reduced to 3 minutes, which is undone if losing team manages to do objectives. But honestly this sounds bad for the game, maybe devs can come up with something better.

Main point: I can't change the outcome when I join at 6 min, I am getting spawn killed/use repair by the time I leave base, and the enemies have fully loaded ODs. The bare minimum when I join an on-going battle, is to get a bonus on my OD - maybe even fully charged. 

The other suggestion is to add a balance mechanism in very unbalanced battles. Spawnkilling is what makes the game unplayable. If the fight is not happening over the objectives, but over one team's base, why even play. So, once the score tilts too hard (let's say 0-3 in ctf), besides the initial shielding when spawning, players of the losing team may get reduced damage taken or increased damage dealt for a short duration (I would imagine 20-30% for 10 seconds). This way it would be possible to push a superior enemy out of the base, without giving a significant advantage over the objectives. 

I would like to hear feedback. 
Thank you!

[Maf 32,300]

Under review

On 6/1/2024 at 4:34 PM, bankas11 said:

First suggestion: Once a certain number of players in one team leave, battle should be concluded earlier.

MM already has a system to mitigate players leaving. In fact, the players that join mid-game are typically stronger than those who just left. Early battle termination used to exist, but was removed as it had unintended negative side effects.

On 6/1/2024 at 4:34 PM, bankas11 said:

The bare minimum when I join an on-going battle, is to get a bonus on my OD - maybe even fully charged. 

This is a decent idea, although I believe we already have it in I&S.

On 6/1/2024 at 4:34 PM, bankas11 said:

So, once the score tilts too hard (let's say 0-3 in ctf), besides the initial shielding when spawning, players of the losing team may get reduced damage taken or increased damage dealt for a short duration (I would imagine 20-30% for 10 seconds). This way it would be possible to push a superior enemy out of the base, without giving a significant advantage over the objectives. 

We've had multiple ideas similar to this (losing team gets stronger supplies, winning team gets longer respawn time, etc.), many of which were suggested as early as 2018. None of them were implemented yet, so I suspect that devs don't think that it's a feature worth adding.

That being said, Tanki Does have catch-up mechanics, albeit only in CP mode. I'm not sure why they haven't added similar mechanics to other modes, since it often makes CP battles really quite interesting.

[Philosopher 24]

On 6/7/2024 at 12:44 PM, Maf said:

MM already has a system to mitigate players leaving

I am aware of that, but in high legend ranks only that many 10k players exist. If you lose, it is probably cause enemy team already has more/stronger 9999 players, so you don't really get reinforcements that can turn it around.

 

 

On 6/7/2024 at 12:44 PM, Maf said:

we already have it in I&S

I admit I didn't check everything. But yeah, either 50% or 100% would be pretty easy to implement, and would give me a reason to stay even if team is losing hard.

 

On 6/7/2024 at 12:44 PM, Maf said:

(losing team gets stronger supplies, winning team gets longer respawn time, etc.

Those ideas sound unfair, and wouldn't work in high legend ranks. To clarify again, the aim of my suggestion is to move the battle from one team's base to the actual objectives (spawn killing is pretty common in my games). It should be a short boost that helps you push enemies back when they get too close. In theory, it would allow non hyperion/crisis users to activate their drugs, get some map control and start fighting - but at this point all players are equal, no advantages to the team losing. 

An adjustment that might be required would be moving the objectives a bit inward, otherwise capturing a flag against superior enemies would be too difficult - but even then, if many spawn at that time it means your team is already hard winning. So I suspect this wouldn't be required after all, would only be annoying sometimes (it's also the reason I recommended ONLY reduced damage taken, and not bonus damage dealt)- Edit: I actually suggested both in the end lol, but was thinking about it.

 

On 6/7/2024 at 12:44 PM, Maf said:

CP battles really quite interesting

But it's also true that CP battles are usually decided in the last 2 minutes. We already get good stars and crystals based on our performances, so overall being able to turn games around isn't that important. What's important is to have the ability/opportunity to do so, influencing the game to the point you don't lose hard anymore. The mechanisms should always revolve around balancing the teams in my opinion, not turning battles around.

Edited June 7, 2024 by bankas11

[Philosopher 24]

On 6/7/2024 at 12:44 PM, Maf said:

In fact, the players that join mid-game are typically stronger than those who just left.

Sorry for coming back to this.

https://prnt.sc/IdCFPwdphwFg

In this battle for example, my losing team (and I already joined at 0-2) got a 7.5k reinforcement, while the winning team (2-3 at that point) got a 10k reinforcement. I was addressing primarily legends battles in the post, as it's practically impossible to determine who is stronger player at such ranks. 

[Maf 32,300]

On 7/6/2024 at 9:22 AM, Philosopher said:

Sorry for coming back to this.

https://prnt.sc/IdCFPwdphwFg

In this battle for example, my losing team (and I already joined at 0-2) got a 7.5k reinforcement, while the winning team (2-3 at that point) got a 10k reinforcement. I was addressing primarily legends battles in the post, as it's practically impossible to determine who is stronger player at such ranks. 

Yeah, that's why I said "typically". The reinforcements system is really stupid sometimes.

[Jeers4U 665]

On 7/6/2024 at 2:27 AM, Maf said:

sometimes.

Pretty much all the time.

Designed that way.

[indyone 22]

On 6/7/2024 at 5:44 AM, Maf said:

Under review

MM already has a system to mitigate players leaving. In fact, the players that join mid-game are typically stronger than those who just left. Early battle termination used to exist, but was removed as it had unintended negative side effects.

This is a decent idea, although I believe we already have it in I&S.

We've had multiple ideas similar to this (losing team gets stronger supplies, winning team gets longer respawn time, etc.), many of which were suggested as early as 2018. None of them were implemented yet, so I suspect that devs don't think that it's a feature worth adding.

That being said, Tanki Does have catch-up mechanics, albeit only in CP mode. I'm not sure why they haven't added similar mechanics to other modes, since it often makes CP battles really quite interesting.

This and all of the past suggestions should be considered and something needs to be implemented.  Too many tanki games now are this way.  As I posted another time, when the score at the end of the game is 12 or more to 0, this is indicative of a major problem.  The mechanics should be there for all modes.  Too many teams take advantage of this situation.  With the lack of mechanics or improvements to reduce this problem, the game is not worth playing.  I encounter these games almost every time I play.  There is not enough enjoyment or compensation for enduring these battles.   This situation is compounded by a lack of balance, OP weapons and lag.  I play this game less and less because of the failure to address any of these issues.

[Maf 32,300]

On 7/13/2024 at 12:18 PM, indyone said:

This and all of the past suggestions should be considered and something needs to be implemented.  Too many tanki games now are this way.  As I posted another time, when the score at the end of the game is 12 or more to 0, this is indicative of a major problem.  The mechanics should be there for all modes.  Too many teams take advantage of this situation.  With the lack of mechanics or improvements to reduce this problem, the game is not worth playing.  I encounter these games almost every time I play.  There is not enough enjoyment or compensation for enduring these battles.   This situation is compounded by a lack of balance, OP weapons and lag.  I play this game less and less because of the failure to address any of these issues.

But maybe it's intentional? What if many people actually prefer quick games?

Personally, I often find myself looking for a quick game (win or loss - doesn't matter), because "finish 3 battles" is the one daily mission that usually takes the longest for me.

[V1K 41]

On 7/13/2024 at 2:43 PM, Maf said:

But maybe it's intentional? What if many people actually prefer quick games?

Personally, I often find myself looking for a quick game (win or loss - doesn't matter), because "finish 3 battles" is the one daily mission that usually takes the longest for me.

Yes, I always and everyday play "Quick battle" tab only nothing else and mostly the battle starts equally but the players keep leaving and it gets unbalanced otherwise often there are 1 sided battles but I still play to finish 3 battles, why to run yeah win-loss doesn't matter.

[indyone 22]

So, you and MAF say that you still play despite the problems.  I am able to do that for a few games.  I play some games when it is easy enough to join and stay in battles.  If you lose enough games, you will not achieve some of the goals.  I cannot ignore the problems with this game that have not been fixed for too long.   There is not enough enjoyment or compensation for enduring these battles.   I play this game less and less because of the failure to address any of these issues.   I have ignored getting logged out when trying to join battles because of the connection issues.  The problem is not at my end.  Should I just log in to enjoy navigating around the shop and other things.  After getting logged out 2 times, I give up that day.  It is still not worth it, even when I can join a game.   More recent, I lost tankcoins in the shop due to annoying popup.  I think the popup has been removed, but the situation is not resolved yet.  So many complaints from users that did not get transactions refunded.  I understand the reasons for not refunding.  This popup is requesting you to confirm an additional purchase that you did not ask for.  That is deceptive.  It may be possible the game is designed this way,  These are still issues to fix and I would rather play some other game that is listening to reasonable requests from players.  Not all requests are unreasonable, especially if you receive too many reports of the same problem.

[FLIPSTIKS 136]

On 8/7/2024 at 8:11 AM, indyone said:

This popup is requesting you to confirm an additional purchase that you did not ask for.  That is deceptive. 

No surprise there then.

 

On 8/7/2024 at 8:11 AM, indyone said:

It may be possible the game is designed this way

Without question.

 

On 8/7/2024 at 8:11 AM, indyone said:

Not all requests are unreasonable, especially if you receive too many reports of the same problem.

Here, here.

[indyone 22]

Thank you for your reply. 

[OFF 38]

On 8/7/2024 at 8:11 AM, indyone said:

So, you and MAF say that you still play despite the problems.  I am able to do that for a few games.  I play some games when it is easy enough to join and stay in battles.  If you lose enough games, you will not achieve some of the goals.  I cannot ignore the problems with this game that have not been fixed for too long.   There is not enough enjoyment or compensation for enduring these battles.   I play this game less and less because of the failure to address any of these issues.   I have ignored getting logged out when trying to join battles because of the connection issues.  The problem is not at my end.  Should I just log in to enjoy navigating around the shop and other things.  After getting logged out 2 times, I give up that day.  It is still not worth it, even when I can join a game.   More recent, I lost tankcoins in the shop due to annoying popup.  I think the popup has been removed, but the situation is not resolved yet.  So many complaints from users that did not get transactions refunded.  I understand the reasons for not refunding.  This popup is requesting you to confirm an additional purchase that you did not ask for.  That is deceptive.  It may be possible the game is designed this way,  These are still issues to fix and I would rather play some other game that is listening to reasonable requests from players.  Not all requests are unreasonable, especially if you receive too many reports of the same problem.

The connection issues everyone is experiencing are extremely frustrating. Whilst the game remains playable, lags and glitches are far more frequent, on some days, logging in is impossible, though since the CrowdStrike crash, the game has been working for the most part. Occasional lags and connection issues are still present and the problem should be dealt with.

As for the missing tankoins, they don't just disappear from your account. You've likely spent them on an upgrade. If you have no crystals left and attempt to upgrade an item in the garage, a pop-up bar would appear for tankoins instead. This can happen quickly,  even by accidentlly pressing 'Enter' in the garage shop, triggering a pop-up that upgrades your items. This is likely why you see some of your tankoins missing.