Let's Discuss Firebird!

[caiosilvac 567]

It technically was never strong to begin with...

it was stronger than Compact Tanks when it came out, I faced plenty of them back then. it dealt so much extra damage it was impossible to defeat it. A week later its release it got secretly nerfed.

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

it was stronger than Compact Tanks when it came out, I faced plenty of them back then. it dealt so much extra damage it was impossible to defeat it. A week later its release it got secretly nerfed.

So they nerfed it behind our backs? Wow. 

 

What sense did it make? As far as we're concerned, if Compact Tanks and Incendiary Mix changed places, it would make soooooo much sense. If they were trying to hide this and hoped that no one noticed...then my trust for them has declined a good bit. 

 

If this was some kind of mix up, they would have no excuse as to not seeing the gameplay and statistics that have occurred because of it. Worst of all, it's centred around a currently controversial turret. 

[caiosilvac 567]

So they nerfed it behind our backs? Wow. 

 

What sense did it make? As far as we're concerned, if Compact Tanks and Incendiary Mix changed places, it would make soooooo much sense. If they were trying to hide this and hoped that no one noticed...then my trust for them has declined a good bit. 

 

If this was some kind of mix up, they would have no excuse as to not seeing the gameplay and statistics that have occurred because of it. Worst of all, it's centred around a currently controversial turret. 

 

That's exactly what happened, devs released an OP alteration but nerfed it soon after it came out. And they only informed us when someone pointed it out.

 

On my other posts I was rather lazy to share the details but here they are:

 

According to the original wiki description for Incendiary Mix (now updated) this alteration would remove Afterburn but add an extra 50% damage, totaling 1035 if your Firebird is fully upgraded (M3 20/20) I knew it would be OP from the start, just imagine having the same damage output as an Isida but with a shorter reload and the ability to destroy multiple tanks at once. Yet they went ahead and released it as OP as it was.

 

I'd seen many IM users going 33-0 in many battles, even in bigger maps such as Solikamsk. I befriended one such person and seen him finish a battle with 42 kills, 1 death.

 

A few days later this guy told me the alteration was brutally changed, it no longer dealt +50% damage but only +10% now. BUT, here's the thing, they nerfed the alteration, but didn't update EN wiki so it led people to buy it thinking it was super OP when it fact it had been nerfed soon after release. Someone posted here on the forum that he was misled by the false info on EN wiki, and only then EN wiki was updated and then we were informed about the nerf. Shady...

 

I agree they should switch places because matchmaking allows M2's to play against M1's so a Compact Tanks user can face M1s, which is the biggest mismatch in this game. Agree with everything else too.

[enri_chill 265]

That's exactly what happened, devs released an OP alteration but nerfed it soon after it came out. And they only informed us when someone pointed it out.

 

On my other posts I was rather lazy to share the details but here they are:

 

According to the original wiki description for Incendiary Mix (now updated) this alteration would remove Afterburn but add an extra 50% damage, totaling 1035 if your Firebird is fully upgraded (M3 20/20) I knew it would be OP from the start, just imagine having the same damage output as an Isida but with a shorter reload and the ability to destroy multiple tanks at once. Yet they went ahead and released it as OP as it was.

 

I'd seen many IM users going 33-0 in many battles, even in bigger maps such as Solikamsk. I befriended one such person and seen him finish a battle with 42 kills, 1 death.

 

A few days later this guy told me the alteration was brutally changed, it no longer dealt +50% damage but only +10% now. BUT, here's the thing, they nerfed the alteration, but didn't update EN wiki so it led people to buy it thinking it was super OP when it fact it had been nerfed soon after release. Someone posted here on the forum that he was misled by the false info on EN wiki, and only then EN wiki was updated and then we were informed about the nerf. Shady...

 

I agree they should switch places because matchmaking allows M2's to play against M1's so a Compact Tanks user can face M1s, which is the biggest mismatch in this game. Agree with everything else too.

This happened to me! Totally ripped off. I could have purchased autocannon but went for the OP firebird alt. No apologies or refunds.

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

This happened to me! Totally ripped off. I could have purchased autocannon but went for the OP firebird alt. No apologies or refunds.

I'm too willing to believe that all of this was intentional. They had enough time to stop it and make an announcement but noooo, "We gotta stay as opaque as we can be, transparency is a curse". 

 

The damage has already been done. Everyone is running around with an inexpensive alteration on their probably max upgraded Firebird. They don't seem like they're listening to us either. 

 

I hope Alternativa isn't doing this just to earn extra revenue. The only way I would tolerate this is if Tanki is actually making losses. 

[Guest]

I'm too willing to believe that all of this was intentional. They had enough time to stop it and make an announcement but noooo, "We gotta stay as opaque as we can be, transparency is a curse". 

 

The damage has already been done. Everyone is running around with an inexpensive alteration on their probably max upgraded Firebird. They don't seem like they're listening to us either. 

 

I hope Alternativa isn't doing this just to earn extra revenue. The only way I would tolerate this is if Tanki is actually making losses. 

Tanki Online isn't.... but the money black hole called Tanki X is. They're just trying to keep TX afloat a bit longer for it dies.

Edited January 6, 2019 by Guest

[ghost-guns 1,486]

Compact Fuel Tanks is the only useful alteration for Firebird. it's ridiculously OP to be honest. Incendiary Mix was changed recently so it's no longer strong.

I've had compact tanks for about 2 years (?) since it first came out. It used to be stronger as it had a 300% heating rate. Then tanki brought out overdrives which weakened the afterburn effect.

[wolverine848 13,097]

I've had compact tanks for about 2 years (?) since it first came out. It used to be stronger as it had a 300% heating rate. Then tanki brought out overdrives which weakened the afterburn effect.

How do overdrives affect afterburn?

[ghost-guns 1,486]

How do overdrives affect afterburn?

You burn them and then they use an overdrive which removes the burn (or someone else gives them an overdrive).

[wolverine848 13,097]

You burn them and then they use an overdrive which removes the burn (or someone else gives them an overdrive).

So basically one extra RK... (periodically).     it's dicey to use OD at that moment though... timed incorrectly and OD wasted and gone.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

So basically one extra RK... (periodically).     it's dicey to use OD at that moment though... timed incorrectly and OD wasted and gone.

And who says that firebird can't also have an OD ready?

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

Ok, as we all know, Firebird's Compact Tanks alteration states that it Increases the energy consumption by 50%. When I first saw this, my brain immediately thought, "Ok, regular Firebird could shoot for 5 seconds, that means Compact tanks Firebird could shoot for 2.5 seconds." I remember renting the alteration a few times on my currently Brigadier account. When I rented it, for comfort measures, I counted how long it took for the energy to finish. I counted 2.5 seconds. I even went on google to get a timer and it matched. 

 

Recently though, I've been observing them (because they're so prominent) and I noticed they shoot longer than 2.5 seconds. Only Friday did it hit me to check the Wiki for the Energy Consumption non-upgradable parameter. I assumed that it was 1000 and 1000 divided by 5 is 200 but I went to make sure. It was that. After applying the 50% increase in energy consumption, Firebird could currently shoot for 3.33 seconds when the alteration is equipped. That is almost a 1-second increase. What the heck? 3 seconds of Firebird damage is enough to kill unprotected medium hulls of the same modification as the Firebird. They're adding a faster heating rate and a higher temperature limit to it while letting it kill a medium hull right before its energy is depleted.

By the time they turn around to face another enemy within range, they have enough energy to get that enemy to the maximum temperature because of Firebird's unnecessarily short reload time. 

 

Why couldn't you just say that the "Energy per second = 300"? I bet that would've encouraged players to find the Wiki to see what they're talking about but no, keep them in the dark I guess. 
 

Make the Firebird shoot for 2.5 seconds. The afterburn is already extreme. The alteration is for the fans of hitting and running away but why run away when you can finish off your enemy and then have enough energy to take down another one because your reload time is so short?

[ZloyDanuJI 409]

 

because firebird's burning damage doesn't increase with double damage but get's reduced by modules and double armour. so in a standard drug battle where everyone almost always has all drugs equipped, firebird won't be able to kill a medium hull within that 3,33 seconds from just direct damage

[ghost-guns 1,486]

Firebird is too frustrating to use! Everyone has protection and in DM people just steal your kills...

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

Firebird is too frustrating to use! Everyone has protection and in DM people just steal your kills...

Maybe not in the high ranks but in the mid-ranks, it's pretty OP, especially with Compact Tanks. 

 

With every turret, you run the risk of your kills getting stolen so that isn't a problem.

[Truthteller 4,204]

Firebird is too frustrating to use! Everyone has protection and in DM people just steal your kills...

Yes it is, I find it useful in certain situations where I can get multi kills but the protections, repairs are annoying

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

Firebird is too frustrating to use! Everyone has protection and in DM people just steal your kills...

Because there's at least 3 or 4 firebird in each battle.

[wolverine848 13,097]

Because there's at least 3 or 4 firebird in each battle.

When a team has 4 of them on the larger maps for CTF... you know it's OP.

[Michael828 816]

I use a 12/20 upgraded twins and get K/Ds around 0.8 to 1.2 after spamming supplies like crazy... then I switch to a 6/20 upgraded firebird and suddenly I'm doing fine again in battles, my mood is much better, I'm consuming less supplies, and it's more comfortable to use.

 

The afterburn damage may need a nerf, but I hope fire doesn't become useless after that, because this is the only turret I have so far which doesn't give me a hard time. I don't mind the kill stealing that happens in deathmatch, but it does get annoying in team battles.

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

Oh...my...god. I have an idea as to why the maximum temperature limit is increased by 100% for the Compact Tanks alteration. If it's for what I think it's for, then it's stupidly unbalanced. I have to experiment a bit to confirm this though. 

[cocer_FX 7]

firebrid m0 is useless after update hope devs return it to its original value its too less the max temp

it deals afterburn but its way too low i stopped having the fun

Edited March 1, 2019 by cocer_FX

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

firebrid m0 is useless after update hope devs return it to its original value its too less the max temp

it deals afterburn but its way too low i stopped having the fun

Stopping you from having the fun was kinda the point. You felt rewarded because you dominated. 

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

I am appalled by the devs actions with Firebird and its respective alterations. 

 

Incendiary Mix originally dealt 50% more damage with the afterburn effect being removed and the energy consumption reduced. Then they suddenly changed it to 10%. In Patch Note 547, it stated that the energy consumption would be decreased again. They said nothing about the damage. I watched WoundedWarrior's video on Incendiary Mix saying that it was OP. I knew what 110% of 700 damage (M4 Firebird's direct damage) was. 110% of 700 is 770. 

 

 

770/4 is 192.5. With double damage, it's supposed to deal 385 per tick at most. In the video, he clearly states that it deals 525 damage per tick (shot).

 

What's 525*4? 1050.

 

What's 150% of 700? 1050

 

What was the % increase of the damage that Incendiary Mix originally had when it first came out? 50% 

 

 

 

I didn't want to believe Tanki would ever flop like this again after their ignorance of allowing the Compact Tanks alteration to be as cheap as it was and clearly seeing what was happening but I went on the Test Server just now to take a closer look at Incendiary Mix just to make sure. I politely asked a player in a Parkour battle who didn't have protection against Firebird if I could shoot him for a bit. He gave me permission and I shot. I did 262 damage per tick to him. What's 262 *4? 1048 which is very close to 1050. 

 

So basically, Tanki is being very opaque about the mechanics of an expensive alteration of a very controversial turret. Tanki, why? 

 

I'm so fed up of them doing this. What is their plan? The Russian Wiki says that it's a 10% increase. Even the Russian Wiki got it wrong. What does that have to say about the game? It was 50%, then you silently change to 10% You buffed the energy consumption and now you silently put it to 50% again. What the f'ing hell Tanki. Stop being so opaque. We can't even trust that you'd make stuff balanced for us. You went and made something overpowered behind our backs. 

 

 

I just felt to punch my computer screen after I saw 262 damage per tick in the Parkour battle. I wanted to badly. I want to keep a slither of hope that Tanki is listening to us in this forum. Everyone seems to say otherwise but I give people the benefit of the doubt, even if they don't deserve it.  They made the change to "Death Herald" Compulsator and it was a bad change because it makes sense to use that instead of Stock Railgun. Death Heral is basically Stock Railgun but with the ability to instantly reload after a kill. Was that to attract players to the alteration? I don't know. I called Cedric out about it but he hasn't answered since. I wonder why. Is it a case where CMs aren't allowed to answer questions like why the devs made a change? It just doesn't make any sense. Hopefully more players catch onto their BS in the near future because I'm tired of being in the dark, especially if it's something that concerns alterations that are supposed to be BALANCED but are BROKEN. 

[ZloyDanuJI 409]

 

wait, it's back to +50% damage again!? woohoo!!!!

 

so compared to isida it has 4 more seconds of damage time and slightly higher dps

Edited March 13, 2019 by ZloyDanuJI

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

wait, it's back to +50% damage again!? woohoo!!!!

 

so compared to isida it has 4 more seconds of damage time and slightly higher dps

And a faster reload...and a wider cone angle...and has the ability to hit multiple tanks at once...