Reduce power of garage supplies

[Brubook 1,161]

I think the op should summarize all the suggestions made by the community in the first post in a spoiler ...

The topic has reached it's 36th page now and it's very hard to follow up with the suggestions.

37th .... lol

 

I agree. A "sum up" of ideas would be useful. As soon as I have some time I will try to do it.

 

Also because I read very interesting points of view and ideas. Apart my personal point of view, I found them interesting, useful both for players and for Tanki balance!

[kayitsiz 621]

I am, as long as I got my own ways.

 

Limiting supply stack for duration of a round is not working, but it is you who need to realize why. Your suggestions might become a little better if you solve this 'puzzle'.

Do you really want a solution?

Delete heal drug, remove supply boxes, and give less drug to non-buyers.

 

Or just delete heal drug! It is enough.  :)  ;) 

If you delete heal drug, druggers will die anyway, so they will a team games, and they won't survive for DMs.

But they will still will be stronger. 

 

Even before Smart Cooldowns, I was suggesting that. This would work even before.

 

You are clever than all of us. Imagine how would teamgames be without heal drug?

 

After, you can give a bit more advantage to them. For example, give less drug to non-buyers.

[Flexoo 6,980]

This will not change, as buying supllies is probably a big income to owners from money spending part of tankers. Even though smart supplies system is in game the problem was not the fact that all the supplies could be used at the same time. The problem is the major increase in power they represent.

 

+ 100% boost in armor and damage is quite enough not to mention that lot of times you spend a whole bar and attacking power of your gun and the supply user just smiles at you and use 400 HP recovery repair kit.

 

Another problem is that soo many free users think they can face other players in  games with supplies allowed. They come with like 20 of each supply and think they can beat someone with 2k supplies. Probably still a majority of players are free users, but they somehow stay on normal battles. from like 50 servers only like 2 of them are mostly filled with pro battles. I dont know why ppl just dont buy pro pass and go play a pro when they want a game based on skill. I think its still worth on higher ranks to buy it for 5k. The only problem with pro passes might be they price on low rank  and also the  gameplay (sometimes gets boring to  play just  sandbox xp and polygon cp all around). 

 

So go to pro, and leave this drug bullies to kill free users that still not realized its better to spend 5k on pro pass than having  nerves cause of unsolvable situations in drug battles.

[opidude 437]

Do you really want a solution?

Delete heal drug, remove supply boxes, and give less drug to non-buyers.

 

Or just delete heal drug! It is enough.  :)  ;) 

If you delete heal drug, druggers will die anyway, so they will a team games, and they won't survive for DMs.

But they will still will be stronger. 

 

Even before Smart Cooldowns, I was suggesting that. This would work even before.

 

You are clever than all of us. Imagine how would teamgames be without heal drug?

 

After, you can give a bit more advantage to them. For example, give less drug to non-buyers.

godmode on will hate that idea xD

[creeperskelly 1,281]

LOL I can agree that the Hammer/Viking combo is a bit of a challenge, even for me! But what you claim as counter-action? I disagree totally.

I have tried every turret and hull combination I have in my garage (most are M2) and even with double damage I can't take one of them out. A single blast up close from one of those with double damage is an instant kill every time. It usually takes half the team in Rio just to take one out, and, that's if we are lucky and the owner of that tank hasn't pressed "1" quickly enough.

[creeperskelly 1,281]

This will not change, as buying supllies is probably a big income to owners from money spending part of tankers. Even though smart supplies system is in game the problem was not the fact that all the supplies could be used at the same time. The problem is the major increase in power they represent.

People buy supplies for one reason and one reason only: the cost of "buying" a hull or turret is outrageous.

 

Supplies are a cheap and temporary way to get the power or speed of a higher level hull or turret for 45 seconds.

 

If someone actually buys an M3 combination from M2 it is over $100 USD.

 

Here's what a fully upgraded Hammer and Viking would cost all the way to maximum power and armor:

 

 

That's far too much to pay for any game. Buy a tank for $700 USD or buy supplies? The answer is obvious.

[Pathfinder 1,690]

Dear kirby2008

Thank you for comment

 

I am used to talk with numbers. Please explain me your point with numbers.

 

Anyway, firing rate is valid only before blowing a tank. Many drugged turret can blow a tank in one shot, so no fire rate involved! Also, a double firing power even with reduced fire rate of the greater M, lead to an advantage greater than just the next M turret. Maybe it is not 27 ranks higher, but not a comparable next M upgrade only either.

Fire rate is also mainly a comparative value between different turrets.

 

Also, DD for example, could give a proportional decrease in fire rate too, but only if the added damage do not exceed +25-30% (same for fire rate, of course). Could be an idea!

 

No issue with drug shortage? So you don't sell any drug kit then? Are you sure of that? So why there are drug kit offers always on?

If you do the maths, smoky does 600DPM, M2 does 1400 DPM, a smoky m0 on a double power does not deal nearly as much damage as m2. A double damage single smoky does not take out one whole tank. Yes the first shot gets the extra damage buff, but this is not to the extent that you are saying it is "as strong as m3" because it really is not. In fact, there are other benefits of faster fire rate other than just damage dealing, including impact force for example.

 

Yeah I think you're right, I to be honest agree the 100% increase is a bit too much maybe... I agree even though I do drug frequently and am part of a takeover team :)

 

Yeah, I have never bought drugs ever, and I have a few hundred in the bag, and thousands of nitros and mines, which I use liberally. But I can see your point - I don't play an enormous amount, and I take my daily bonus every day (I think it's about 60+ drugs which is quite a lot)

[creeperskelly 1,281]

What if the effect of the supplies was reduced as the items using them progresses from M0>M3?

 

Based on other parameters of M3 already being superior to M0 does a person at M3 really need double damage as well?

[FatalError 336]

People buy supplies for one reason and one reason only: the cost of "buying" a hull or turret is outrageous.

 

Supplies are a cheap and temporary way to get the power or speed of a higher level hull or turret for 45 seconds.

 

If someone actually buys an M3 combination from M2 it is over $100 USD.

 

Here's what a fully upgraded Hammer and Viking would cost all the way to maximum power and armor:

 

 

That's far too much to pay for any game. Buy a tank for $700 USD or buy supplies? The answer is obvious.

OMG !!!

[creeperskelly 1,281]

Of course if you don't buy crystals at all I calculate it would take about 1700 hours of game play to earn that much (assuming you can always get on winning teams).

[RustyNail 1,538]

Of course if you don't buy crystals at all I calculate it would take about 1700 hours of game play to earn that much (assuming you can always get on winning teams).

 

Which practically means, NEVER.

 

(some generalissimos claim to have reached that rank without ever spending real money. Assuming they don't lie, I remind them that Tanki isn't what it used to be two years ago)

[beaku 2,656]

Which practically means, NEVER.

 

(some generalissimos claim to have reached that rank without ever spending real money. Assuming they don't lie, I remind them that Tanki isn't what it used to be two years ago)

Ask Peace-Keeper. He joined Tanki in 2014 and now has M3's and probably M4's too. It is true that you can't earn all that by just playing. But there are other ways to earn, like taking part in contests.

[Brubook 1,161]

If you do the maths, smoky does 600DPM, M2 does 1400 DPM, a smoky m0 on a double power does not deal nearly as much damage as m2. A double damage single smoky does not take out one whole tank. Yes the first shot gets the extra damage buff, but this is not to the extent that you are saying it is "as strong as m3" because it really is not. In fact, there are other benefits of faster fire rate other than just damage dealing, including impact force for example.

 

Yeah I think you're right, I to be honest agree the 100% increase is a bit too much maybe... I agree even though I do drug frequently and am part of a takeover team :)

 

Yeah, I have never bought drugs ever, and I have a few hundred in the bag, and thousands of nitros and mines, which I use liberally. But I can see your point - I don't play an enormous amount, and I take my daily bonus every day (I think it's about 60+ drugs which is quite a lot)

Thank you for your answer

 

Let me ask you what unit is DPM please, as on turret spec I haven't seen any 600 or 1400 (so I can't understand or compare). And yes, I am at quite a good level on math ... numbers often tells us more than thousands words :)

 

Also, we have to consider both a damage per unit time and damage per clip (where applicable).

 

You agreed that a drugged smoky M0 deal damage more or less like a smoky M2. ok ... smoky M2 can be bought at Colonel rank, which is 20 ranks higher than the M0 (recruit rank). That seems quite exaggerated for me!

 

Anyway we both agree that the increase is quite too much, that is why I proposed a reduction on drug incremental effect. That can also be done gradually, over a period of time of maybe one or two months (so players will hardly notice it).

 

I never bought drugs either, and I have some 2-3 thousands per kind.

 

B.

[creeperskelly 1,281]

Which practically means, NEVER.

 

(some generalissimos claim to have reached that rank without ever spending real money. Assuming they don't lie, I remind them that Tanki isn't what it used to be two years ago)

Many evenings it is a total waste of time. Get some of these Hammerking raiders that drop in and suddenly you are earning 50-100 crystals per round if you are lucky. Many nights I end up spending more time leaving battles than playing. Now that Serpukhov is broken for me I can't even play that now.

[FogOfWar_XXX 793]

So Played last during the 70 crystal "rave" pass.  Bought mine, went to town.  No surprises as it were.  I ROCK in a shaft with nearly constant DP, arcade or snipe.  Racking them up baby, body bags galore.  Imagien that, drugs = more kills.  ANYWAYS . . . what I took from the drug party was this, skills in the end are what should count, and yeah, I got skills.  After coming down from the high, ie when the pass expired, I was really starting to feel the difference between shooting, hitting, and killing and shooting, hitting, and then lamenting that there was no kill.  The pass proved the point, players with skills will be beat if they play players with less skill on drugs.  Sure every oncei na while, if you're up to the task, no longer the fun, but the task, of just winning to provea point against druggers, you can sometimes, but it's hard work, not fun, and becomes tedious.

[anshi_bringitup 16]

I rarely use drugs that's why I have like 600 of each drug..!!!

[kayitsiz 621]

So Played last during the 70 crystal "rave" pass.  Bought mine, went to town.  No surprises as it were.  I ROCK in a shaft with nearly constant DP, arcade or snipe.  Racking them up baby, body bags galore.  Imagien that, drugs = more kills.  ANYWAYS . . . what I took from the drug party was this, skills in the end are what should count, and yeah, I got skills.  After coming down from the high, ie when the pass expired, I was really starting to feel the difference between shooting, hitting, and killing and shooting, hitting, and then lamenting that there was no kill.  The pass proved the point, players with skills will be beat if they play players with less skill on drugs.  Sure every oncei na while, if you're up to the task, no longer the fun, but the task, of just winning to provea point against druggers, you can sometimes, but it's hard work, not fun, and becomes tedious.

This feels like that. But I think you haven't seen the main point.

http://en.tankiforum.com/index.php?showtopic=261572&page=4&do=findComment&comment=4620753

http://en.tankiforum.com/index.php?showtopic=177137&page=236&do=findComment&comment=4620236

 

Look, maybe you are very skilled, but actually this card gived the biggest advantage to shaft

[creeperskelly 1,281]

That pass totally made Isida useless. I saw them just sitting around doing nothing because everyone was repairing themselves. I actually felt bad and tried to let people on my team with Isida to heal me if I had damage.

[kayitsiz 621]

That pass totally made Isida useless. I saw them just sitting around doing nothing because everyone was repairing themselves. I actually felt bad and tried to let people on my team with Isida to heal me if I had damage.

Yes, this pass just worked for shafters and railgunners.

[beaku 2,656]

That pass totally made Isida useless. I saw them just sitting around doing nothing because everyone was repairing themselves. I actually felt bad and tried to let people on my team with Isida to heal me if I had damage.

Isida has already become useless after the update. Can't get a lock on anyone. Cone angle feels negligible.. -_-

[Legolover3 91]

Yes, this pass just worked for shafters and railgunners.

And Hammers. I had a blast. Add to that the sale where I got M1 Hammer and Viking....I was unstoppable.

[FogOfWar_XXX 793]

This feels like that. But I think you haven't seen the main point.

http://en.tankiforum.com/index.php?showtopic=261572&page=4&do=findComment&comment=4620753

http://en.tankiforum.com/index.php?showtopic=177137&page=236&do=findComment&comment=4620236

 

Look, maybe you are very skilled, but actually this card gived the biggest advantage to shaft

No doubt, I enjoyed it a lot.  Like I said, the body count was high.  That said, the drug issue remains.  I really think I'm going to try to play pro pass from now on, if I can make some credit on them.  I'm gonn a to buy one and see if a months worth of play can yield enough games to justify the expense.  Be done with all this foolishness once and for all.

[creeperskelly 1,281]

Isida has already become useless after the update. Can't get a lock on anyone. Cone angle feels negligible.. -_-

I don't know about that. There was a "Medic Kit" available which was M3 Isida with M3 Viking - I have seen some of those mow down opponents quite well when drugged. While the cone angle was ruined they did increase the range of Isida - essentially a Firebird and Freeze cannot harm an attacking Isida now. Same with Twins.

 

In all the recent matches I have seen the most successful flag capping combos were Viking with Hammer or Isida when drugged.

[Panther756 39]

I have just finished a battle in which our team had a comfortable lead, until the other team drugged like hell. Wow, how fantastic (I mean from the land of phantasy) they were: totally incapable, but drugged. If this is the only way winning nowadays, then those doing so should feel ashamed. They are not superior, all they are is being very poor.

 

I suggest that time has come for some more radical means against this sub-culture. Either leaving tanki online or not paying them anymore money, until this is stopped. It cannot be that a Hornet hull, even if it is an M3, takes a dozen M3 Thunder and Railgun shots, is additionally attacked by an Isida and still drives away with the flag.

 

That simply is ridiculous. Appaling behaviour and bad spirit, too.

[creeperskelly 1,281]

I have just finished a battle in which our team had a comfortable lead, until the other team drugged like hell. Wow, how fantastic (I mean from the land of phantasy) they were: totally incapable, but drugged. If this is the only way winning nowadays, then those doing so should feel ashamed. They are not superior, all they are is being very poor.

 

I suggest that time has come for some more radical means against this sub-culture. Either leaving tanki online or not paying them anymore money, until this is stopped. It cannot be that a Hornet hull, even if it is an M3, takes a dozen M3 Thunder and Railgun shots, is additionally attacked by an Isida and still drives away with the flag.

 

That simply is ridiculous. Appaling behaviour and bad spirit, too.

What's even more appalling is:

 

1. The druggers usually use no skills. Often times the drugging Hammerkings I see don't even turn their turrets. It's straight ahead, turn, continue. The turret faces wherever the tank faces and because of drugging it wipes out any people in their path due to Hammer's dispersion cone. Defending a flag is useless when one of these people arrive (and when it is two or three forget about attempting to stop it).

2. Once they start winning then they camp out near your spawn points drugging while one of the Hammerkings continues to capture flags. With red base usually one parks on the each street so all spawn points are within range. With blue base you get two or three in the base along with a drugging Thunder on the hill. This runs up the battle fund further. This prevents your team from even fighting back because you get blown away by some drugging jerks before you can do anything about it.

3. While doing so they start spamming chat about how bad your team is "Look at the blue n00bz can't play Tanki"

 

Repeat, rinse, repeat until end of battle.

 

The thing that stinks about this is that by being allowed to run up the battle fund in this way Tanki is actually giving them the crystals they need to buy more supplies. So it becomes a self-perpetuating takeover.