category Let's Discuss Game Balance

[Vektrix 16]

Railgun isn't good for jug. Replace it with no critical smoke :) . or smoke with slower reload . not thunder surely . thunder has self DMG ability that will hut ur tank HP in every shot . why ? Coz everyone will stuck on the jug tank . that would be a nerf stupidis .

Only if they buffed railgun min DMG to make it good for jug and the whole game coz current rail is weak very weak and slow reload vvvvvveeery low DPS , this isn't a gun is it ? Its a junk .

[Tanker-Arthur 2,971]

Make it deal 10000 damage per shot

Give it 2500 hp for M0 players

[GorgoBlesk 831]

Make it deal 10000 damage per shot

Give it 2500 hp for M0 players

2500 is too low. That is like M1 Titan xD

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

Wait, doesn't the power of the jug depend on the modification level of the players in battle? :huh:

[OKDad70 862]

I am seldom (usually) without magnum and isida protection. If you don't have isida protection they just about kill you instantly before you and even fire or run. My third depends, sometimes Rico, sometimes Hammer sometimes Rail. In DM for sure fire. I don't go freeze as much since they nerfed it, although it will still kill you. I rarely go Shaft, Smoky, or Twins.

 

On a slightly different subject, I have seen some strikers lately that are slaughtering players. M4 on M4 Titan is a pretty deadly combo especially for guarding the base. You don't have to lock on and fire the salvo, just one at a time will kill you pretty quick.

 

I play mostly Rail these days because I just got tired of getting the flag and get slaughtered, even with M4 hull, DA, and drone. I support the team by killing from my hide and killing anyone chasing them with the flag, and by dropping mines in the mains lanes. I recently bought M3 Shaft and I have to get it upgraded to M4 but I think it should also be some use for camping. 

Freeze protection is a problem. A freeze with any experience just takes longer to kill you if you have 50% protection. I can never justify dropping a more effective protection to make the freeze take longer to kill me. (Well, if it is a close battle (which never happens) and the opponent team has more than two freezes, then it might be worth it.)

 

Rail is still quite effective (and protection module is indispensable against expert rail gunners). Striker has the advantage of being hard to use, so unpopular. Most players don't equip Striker protection. Many have never bought it for their garage. 

 

Finally, CTF is not the place for snipers, and it is especially ill-suited for defense. CTF = Attack Or Lose

You may be useful if you are good at what you describe, but if all players take such an attitude in CTF, you always lose.

[OKDad70 862]

Striker needs one of the following changes (not both):

1:

Lock-on is lowered by 1s (3.5 - 2.5) from m0  to m4 and missiles explode if they come within 1/3 of splash radius close to a tank.

 

2:

Lock-on is lowered by 1s at all modifications (2.5 - 2.0) from m0 to m4 and reload is lowered by .5s (2.0 - 1.3) from m0 to m4 but damage is between Max of Smoky and min of Thunder (so it cannot 1-shot medium hulls anymore without double damage)

No, striker is just fine.

[gokuMI6 1,290]

No, striker is just fine.

<_<

DMG wise yes 

Aiming wise no

needs some buff on vertical Auto aim 

[OKDad70 862]

Interesting that you don't think Twins is super OP.......

 

I like aggressive close combat. In a match, I want to make you hate me even if I don't kill you. I figured that out early on, and found the twins suited my style and proclivity. I've been playing since the beginning of 2014. I took last year off because the changes got too frustrating. I'm back, and the twins is not as effective as I remember it. I suspect I lost some skill. I'm getting it back, but I've used the twins for over 500 hours of combat. It is in the middle of turrets. It is NOT over powered. If you think it is, you probably just suffer from some of the frustration I (and other twins users) intend. The twins is the persistent pummeler. Stay clear, or kill it.

 

If you recall the great leveling of several months ago, where all the parms of everything were made much more alike, you might know what I mean when I say the Twins-Viking was a fearsome combination. I was only averaging a 1.7 K/D even then, but I could count on jumping three, sometimes four, opponents (when I had full supplies and an available repair kit) and driving off. The turning and reversing of the hull and turret both were so responsive that I was able to build my skills to the point of being able to keep all of them off me long enough to win. It isn't possible anymore. Now, twins is just the pummeler. Twins does well if it can keep balls on a target.

 

Twins used to have significantly more impact. Twins used to have enough recoil to control ones jumps and falls. Not any more.

 

What makes you think twins is OP when it has been so long since it was improved while multiple other turrets have had improvements?

 

Twins is fine the way it is (well, with the expensive alteration they forced me to buy). I have been seeing more twins lately. I don't know why. Some say because it is simple. I doubt it. I suspect it is because recent beefs of the short range turrets have caused frustration, and people fall back to their next best option. Vulcan overheat problem is probably a factor. Vulcan is somewhat of a cross between twins and shaft, a slow motion shaft, and a weapon that requires constant tracking of opponents like twins. Vulcan players have likely shifted to their next best turret, and that might be twins.

 

Twins protection used to be very uncommon. Now, it is somewhat common. 

 

Further, I have five alt accounts. Rico-dic, smoky-hunter, freeze-hornet, rail-wasp, and Vulcan-Viking. Ricosck is practically M4 now, but the others are low, M1s and M2s. I have a good feel across a broad background. I stand by the assessment I gave. Twins is in the middle, not OP.

 

Vulcan really sucks, and I wouldn't play it, but the V-V was a dedicated account made when Vulcan was first introduced. It has no options. To keep the chain up, I play it. It dies a lot now. Loss of gyro made it much less effective (and more frustrating). Overheat results in poor K/D. (The Mosquito dies a lot too, not being able to protect against most turrets, but the rail is still quite effective. Some matches, it does quite well; others are rather embarrassing.)

 

As to freeze, it was dominant with the beef. With the nerf, it is not dominant, but quite effective. It dies a lot too, but kills so much one hardly notices. Skill with freeze and fire make them exceptionally hard to deal with while they are so strong. Opponents beware.

 

To close on a positive note, isida stink!

<_<

DMG wise yes 

Aiming wise no

needs some buff on vertical Auto aim 

Fair enough.

[nemoetnihil 388]

 

I like aggressive close combat. In a match, I want to make you hate me even if I don't kill you. I figured that out early on, and found the twins suited my style and proclivity. I've been playing since the beginning of 2014. I took last year off because the changes got too frustrating. I'm back, and the twins is not as effective as I remember it. I suspect I lost some skill. I'm getting it back, but I've used the twins for over 500 hours of combat. It is in the middle of turrets. It is NOT over powered. If you think it is, you probably just suffer from some of the frustration I (and other twins users) intend. The twins is the persistent pummeler. Stay clear, or kill it.

 

If you recall the great leveling of several months ago, where all the parms of everything were made much more alike, you might know what I mean when I say the Twins-Viking was a fearsome combination. I was only averaging a 1.7 K/D even then, but I could count on jumping three, sometimes four, opponents (when I had full supplies and an available repair kit) and driving off. The turning and reversing of the hull and turret both were so responsive that I was able to build my skills to the point of being able to keep all of them off me long enough to win. It isn't possible anymore. Now, twins is just the pummeler. Twins does well if it can keep balls on a target.

 

Twins used to have significantly more impact. Twins used to have enough recoil to control ones jumps and falls. Not any more.

 

What makes you think twins is OP when it has been so long since it was improved while multiple other turrets have had improvements?

 

Twins is fine the way it is (well, with the expensive alteration they forced me to buy). I have been seeing more twins lately. I don't know why. Some say because it is simple. I doubt it. I suspect it is because recent beefs of the short range turrets have caused frustration, and people fall back to their next best option. Vulcan overheat problem is probably a factor. Vulcan is somewhat of a cross between twins and shaft, a slow motion shaft, and a weapon that requires constant tracking of opponents like twins. Vulcan players have likely shifted to their next best turret, and that might be twins.

 

Twins protection used to be very uncommon. Now, it is somewhat common. 

 

 

I actually am a (mostly) Twins user, and my comment on it being OP was mainly based on the general opinion I see on the forums. I agree with you for the most part, with the exception of needing the alteration ( I assume you mean stable plasma), as I enjoy using the splash damage. I was mainly just surprised that someone other than me didn't find Twins super OP.

 

 

[gokuMI6 1,290]

 

I actually am a (mostly) Twins user, and my comment on it being OP was mainly based on the general opinion I see on the forums. I agree with you for the most part, with the exception of needing the alteration ( I assume you mean stable plasma), as I enjoy using the splash damage. I was mainly just surprised that someone other than me didn't find Twins super OP.

 

 

 

Who said its SUper OP 

it has reduced range so 

IMO

If you are in Twins range it is OP 

not in range , it is like another short range turret , Target for Mid-long ranger's

 

BTW, most of the MM maps are mid sized 

and some have too many props and make them like small ,like Wolfeinstein , Year2042 

And the new small maps , Sandal,Sandbox

On these map's the Twins will be Super OP , a twins on the team will make a good differnce

 

This dosent mean it struggle on MM maps { maybe except Highways never seen a Twins there }

It is a Very good Turret

And what makes it OP is the ability to Damage even with protection's , the protection's dont affect twins as it affects other turrets 

that is what makes Twins OP and a good choice for F2P player's  :)

 

Gota get the m3 ASAP 

[BigCar 80]

I think juggernaut should be able to kill a tank in 1 shot, regarless if it is a light, medium or heavy hull, with higher reload. Right now in low ranks,  the firing rate is too much for low ranks to handle, in medium and high ranks you can just use double armor and repair kit and 1v1 the juggernaut, which seems completely absurd.

 

Do you think this is not true? See, a medium hull for example can withstand 2 shots. Double armor? 4 shots. Repair kit? 6 shots. Alongside with the other tanks attacking jugger, jugger won't stand a chance. And jugger can't even use the striker mode, it takes too long just to TRY to kill 1 enemy, while you can also take huge damage from the explosions.

 

So, I say it again. Let it kill any tank in 1 shot, even if it has double armor, but increase his reload. Fair for both sides.

either this or make it immune to freeze and burn effects.

[TakeAShower 300]

I think juggernaut should be able to kill a tank in 1 shot, regarless if it is a light, medium or heavy hull, with higher reload. Right now in low ranks,  the firing rate is too much for low ranks to handle, in medium and high ranks you can just use double armor and repair kit and 1v1 the juggernaut, which seems completely absurd.

 

Do you think this is not true? See, a medium hull for example can withstand 2 shots. Double armor? 4 shots. Repair kit? 6 shots. Alongside with the other tanks attacking jugger, jugger won't stand a chance. And jugger can't even use the striker mode, it takes too long just to TRY to kill 1 enemy, while you can also take huge damage from the explosions.

 

So, I say it again. Let it kill any tank in 1 shot, even if it has double armor, but increase his reload. Fair for both sides.

Maybe all but Mammoth with Double Armour (and so all without)?

[Tanker-Arthur 2,971]

Fix Vulcan's Self Damage

 

Ok, I don't know if this was accidental or not....but..
Every since Firebird deals 300 damage every second with it's burn, Vulcan deals a self-damage of 300 per second. This makes Vulcan very underpowered against medium hulls, not to mention the heavy hulls.

If this increase in self damage was a programming accident, please fix it.

If the extra self damage was added on purpose, please ignore this post.

[wolverine848 13,097]

 

 

Who said its SUper OP 

it has reduced range so 

IMO

If you are in Twins range it is OP 

not in range , it is like another short range turret , Target for Mid-long ranger's

 

BTW, most of the MM maps are mid sized 

and some have too many props and make them like small ,like Wolfeinstein , Year2042 

And the new small maps , Sandal,Sandbox

On these map's the Twins will be Super OP , a twins on the team will make a good differnce

 

This dosent mean it struggle on MM maps { maybe except Highways never seen a Twins there }

It is a Very good Turret

 

 

 

And what makes it OP is the ability to Damage even with protection's , the protection's dont affect twins as it affects other turrets 

that is what makes Twins OP and a good choice for F2P player's  :)

 

Gota get the m3 ASAP 

While I am of the opinion that M4 Titan Twins is unstoppable on any map that provides lots of cover...

 

I'm not sure what you mean by "protections don't affect twins as it affects other turrets".

In ALL cases a module with 50% protection will reduce damage by... 50%.

 

It will take the twins 2x as long to kill you versus you not equipping the module. 

Just like it will take Thunder 2x as long to destroy a target with 50% Thunder protection.

 

Only difference is that in twins case - the "2x as long" is measured in seconds while Thunder would be measured in shots.

If it takes twins 5 seconds to kill a target without, it will take 10 seconds "with".

Thunder might be 4 shots without... then 8 shots "with".

[GorgoBlesk 831]

Maybe all but Mammoth with Double Armour (and so all without)?

Titan and Mammoth with DA should end with only about 1/10 of HP after getting shot by Juggernaut.

[wolverine848 13,097]

Hardly an issue.

If a player is not adept (me) at Rail there's no point in playing this mode. 

 

Unless you take in freeze and just slaughter everyone else.  Becoming the JUG is actually a handicap for me.

 

JUG has 2 medium to long-range weapons.  Replace Rails with 2 smokys and keep the striker.  With better health JUG might actually get to use the salvos.

[Vektrix 16]

did u notice that people asking on railgun buff often this days ? i hope this continue for ever until hazel hear that railgun needs a buff.

[GorgoBlesk 831]

If a player is not adept (me) at Rail there's no point in playing this mode.

 

Unless you take in freeze and just slaughter everyone else. Becoming the JUG is actually a handicap for me.

 

JUG has 2 medium to long-range weapons. Replace Rails with 2 smokys and keep the striker. With better health JUG might actually get to use the salvos.

Smoky is bad at long range. Thunder is better because it can kill enemies across the map like Rail.

[wolverine848 13,097]

Smoky is bad at long range. Thunder is better because it can kill enemies across the map like Rail.

That's why it still has Striker. 

 

Smoky is for the medium range enemies. Quick-firing keeps the many enemies on their toes.  Double-barrel makes sure it does significant damage.  And if critical goes off... BAM!

[GuidoFawkes 2,361]

While I am of the opinion that M4 Titan Twins is unstoppable on any map that provides lots of cover...

 

I'm not sure what you mean by "protections don't affect twins as it affects other turrets".

In ALL cases a module with 50% protection will reduce damage by... 50%.

 

It will take the twins 2x as long to kill you versus you not equipping the module. 

Just like it will take Thunder 2x as long to destroy a target with 50% Thunder protection.

 

Only difference is that in twins case - the "2x as long" is measured in seconds while Thunder would be measured in shots.

If it takes twins 5 seconds to kill a target without, it will take 10 seconds "with".

Thunder might be 4 shots without... then 8 shots "with".

it's different cause...

 

twins module only reduces damage and not impact... but freeze module reduces both damage and freezing rate

 

ricochet/hammer/isida/etc modules cause enemy to run out of ammo before they can kill you... and they'll have to survive for a long time before they can reload again, but not twins

 

shaft module removes the one shot kill ability, twins doesn't rely on this

Edited August 17, 2018 by GuidoFawkes

[enri_chill 265]

it's different cause...

 

twins module only reduces damage and not impact... but freeze module reduces both damage and freezing rate

 

ricochet/hammer/isida/etc modules cause enemy to run out of ammo before they can kill you... and they'll have to survive for a long time before they can reload again, but not twins

 

shaft module removes the one shot kill ability, twins doesn't rely on this

The modules do NOT reduce impact...just damage.

[wolverine848 13,097]

it's different cause...

 

twins module only reduces damage and not impact... but freeze module reduces both damage and freezing rate

 

ricochet/hammer/isida/etc modules cause enemy to run out of ammo before they can kill you... and they'll have to survive for a long time before they can reload again, but not twins

 

shaft module removes the one shot kill ability, twins doesn't rely on this

Still takes 2x as long for each turret to destroy the target...

 

The energy pool turrets do have issues with heavy hulls that have modules, I'll grant you that.

[gokuMI6 1,290]

IMAO

Every for every non-buyer's Twins is the best option to buy , starting from m1 

[DRAKO523 795]

IMAO

Every for every non-buyer's Twins is the best option to buy , starting from m1 

In my opinion Twins isn't as good as an M2 turret if you don't fully MU it. it's pretty weak once you come in star ranks.

[gokuMI6 1,290]

In my opinion Twins isn't as good as an M2 turret if you don't fully MU it. it's pretty weak once you come in star ranks.

:o

Try playing againsit it in Small or maps with too much props { so you are in its range }  :ph34r:

like Re-alert , polyogn,year2042 ..

i just got wrecked by 2 twins on Red-Alert stock m2 twins  :ph34r:

i had viking though