category Let's Discuss Game Balance

[erppi 91]

Viking must be nerfed to the ground.

 

The game is infested by these insects, eating the game balance with their od like it never exisited. it has taken over the hole game, no battle is played without that hull. It has no comparison in the game, and there is nothing which could even imagine to counter this od. only another viking can compete with this. I have no idea, why this was even never invented, but here is the fix for it.

Reduce the ability damage to 50%. thats a half what booster can do, but booster is balanced, because it has so high cost of using it. viking does not. Also reduce the lenght of od to 3 seconds. Like this, it is comparable to other medium hull strenght. Also, viking should have a warmup time for its od, same kind of a mechanic which hunter and crusader has. This could be maybe a good start.

[LambSauce 1,884]

1 hour ago, erppi said:

Viking must be nerfed to the ground.

 

The game is infested by these insects, eating the game balance with their od like it never exisited. it has taken over the hole game, no battle is played without that hull. It has no comparison in the game, and there is nothing which could even imagine to counter this od. only another viking can compete with this. I have no idea, why this was even never invented, but here is the fix for it.

Reduce the ability damage to 50%. thats a half what booster can do, but booster is balanced, because it has so high cost of using it. viking does not. Also reduce the lenght of od to 3 seconds. Like this, it is comparable to other medium hull strenght. Also, viking should have a warmup time for its od, same kind of a mechanic which hunter and crusader has. This could be maybe a good start.

Viking main here. I agree that the OD is unbalanced, and I believe that the devs' solution to this is the new 'Jammer' status effect, although whether I think this is a good idea is another story altogether.

[wolverine848 13,097]

2 hours ago, erppi said:

but booster is balanced, because it has so high cost of using it.

If by "high cost" you mean extra supplies, I disagree that is balanced.

Players with thousands of supplies will gladly pay the price and keep racking up the kills.  Making something cost more does not make it balanced.

[erppi 91]

11 hours ago, wolverine848 said:

If by "high cost" you mean extra supplies, I disagree that is balanced.

Players with thousands of supplies will gladly pay the price and keep racking up the kills.  Making something cost more does not make it balanced.

It last 3 seconds. Thats almost 7 times less than what defender gives its damage reduction, and 10 less than what crisis can do. If we would say, that booster would be op, we'd all be blinded from the truth.

Btw... viking od last more than twice longer than boosters damage boost. And vikings od doesent cost you a penny.

[wolverine848 13,097]

5 hours ago, erppi said:

It last 3 seconds. Thats almost 7 times less than what defender gives its damage reduction, and 10 less than what crisis can do. If we would say, that booster would be op, we'd all be blinded from the truth.

Btw... viking od last more than twice longer than boosters damage boost. And vikings od doesent cost you a penny.

1) Booster trumps Defender.  The length of time does not matter when you can one-shot the player using Defender in 1 second.

2) How often can you get Booster vs how often can you get Viking OD.

Plus you side-stepped my rebuttal about "high cost".  When a player has 20000+ of the supply, it is NOT a high cost.  I've been using Defender for 6 straight months and still have 23000 DA.  And I'm a F2P tanker.  Using up free supplies we get from daily/weekly missions and containers from Challenges is not really a "cost" at all.

[erppi 91]

On 5/22/2021 at 6:01 PM, wolverine848 said:

1) Booster trumps Defender.  The length of time does not matter when you can one-shot the player using Defender in 1 second.

2) How often can you get Booster vs how often can you get Viking OD.

Plus you side-stepped my rebuttal about "high cost".  When a player has 20000+ of the supply, it is NOT a high cost.  I've been using Defender for 6 straight months and still have 23000 DA.  And I'm a F2P tanker.  Using up free supplies we get from daily/weekly missions and containers from Challenges is not really a "cost" at all.

Abd how often do u have to save your douple damage, to wait for an enemy to show up, while meantime you activate all other supplies, and end up after 30 seconds without any supplies? 

And im using many drones, which all consume supplies. If u have played 6 montsh without ur supplies drained, u are not an active player. I consume 20k supplies in a month.

And all the other od's has  multiple downsides. Viking has one: time. And yet, if player plays well, he can have 4 overdrives per battle.

Every other od needs strategy and careful planning to be effective. All viking has to do, is to presd 2 buttons: shift and fire. Instant godmode activated.

[erppi 91]

On 5/22/2021 at 6:01 PM, wolverine848 said:

1) Booster trumps Defender.  The length of time does not matter when you can one-shot the player using Defender in 1 second.

2) How often can you get Booster vs how often can you get Viking OD.

Plus you side-stepped my rebuttal about "high cost".  When a player has 20000+ of the supply, it is NOT a high cost.  I've been using Defender for 6 straight months and still have 23000 DA.  And I'm a F2P tanker.  Using up free supplies we get from daily/weekly missions and containers from Challenges is not really a "cost" at all.

And what comes to your first arqument, defense provided by defender is 100%. Booster gives 100% damage boost. All you need is protection module to save you from "one shot". Well, quess what. 

Viking od last 7 seconds, and it also boost rate of fire by 100%. No matter what, youre done. No amount of protection, skill or strategy will save you from that (exept, if your opponent is a absolute noob, or you get impossibly lucky, which doesent happen. Ever.)

[wolverine848 13,097]

38 minutes ago, erppi said:

And what comes to your first arqument, defense provided by defender is 100%. Booster gives 100% damage boost. All you need is protection module to save you from "one shot". Well, quess what. 

Viking od last 7 seconds, and it also boost rate of fire by 100%. No matter what, youre done. No amount of protection, skill or strategy will save you from that (exept, if your opponent is a absolute noob, or you get impossibly lucky, which doesent happen. Ever.)

You need to do better research.

Booster is not +100%.  It's +200% and Defender is +150%.  Even with a fully upgraded module the Defender loses.

No amount of protection?  Titan dome will certainly help.  And the viking can be killed during that 7 seconds by another tank - it's not 1vs1 dueling you know.  If Viking dies after 2 seconds it loses OD retention.

Viking only gets 4 ODs per battle with help.   With help other ODs happen a lot more than that.

As for your supplies... you must hit 2-3-4 the moment you spawn.  Try to at exhibit at least some management. Maybe you need to learn to play even a little bit of the battle without that crutch.  I stand by my comment that using up supplies does not make an OP item "balanced".

[Akame 4,578]

Let us balance Booster, Defender, Trickster and Crisis with 1 easy trick:

Booster provides 50% extra damage for the whole duration

Defender Provides an extra 50 armor for the whole duration

Trickster remains the same. Feels balanced

Crisis; Max damage 50% extra damage with max armor, extra 50 armor with max speed, retain speed, it's essentially a big armor nerf regardless. Increase switch speed cooldown x4, 2s min at max. The switch cooldown is the main thing that is needed to be higher than it currently is to make it feel like a real penalty when switching modes.

 

This way, at least Booster will cancel a defender, 250% damage vs 250 armor, however it also means a crisis who can switch effectively can become smart with both roles.

 

Aside from that, yes people, Booster is OP, but easy to get 3rd partied due to lack of armor. However Defender allows you to have a spectrum 33.3333% module for any prot that you have not equipped and any prot that you have equipped, assuming 50% becomes 66.666%. To reduce all potential 3rd party damage, is pretty powerful. Since MM contains a huge part of 3rd party damage too in many large maps. 

As ugly has booster may be, defender is uglier, at least in my eyes, I would rather a random enemy from afar have a nice chance of killing me than not. But everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

 

Let me remind the facts;

Booster, 3s of 400% damage.

Defender 20s of +100 armor. (66.666% damage reduction instead for 20s then reverts to 50% damage reduction)

Edited May 25, 2021 by Akame

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

On 5/24/2021 at 5:20 PM, Akame said:

Crisis; Max damage 50% extra damage with max armor, extra 50 armor with max speed, retain speed, it's essentially a big armor nerf regardless. Increase switch speed cooldown x4, 2s min at max. The switch cooldown is the main thing that is needed to be higher than it currently is to make it feel like a real penalty when switching modes.

I would get rid of switching mode in exchange of consuming only one additional manual supply when activating certain effect. 

 

[wolverine848 13,097]

2 hours ago, FrozenRailgun said:

I would get rid of switching mode in exchange of consuming only one additional manual supply when activating certain effect. 

Then you might as well change the name of the drone as you are creating a new one.

And how do you "activate a certain effect" if there's no switching mode?  That's the entire premis of Crisis.

[Sir_Lagsalot 2]

So, i askek some questions before and all i got was ambiguous copy pasta pro forma dodging issue pseudo answers, but, let's try one more honest question, and it would be nice to have some honest answers.

So, what is the point playing a game, when after so much time and effort spent, with several MK7 combos, nice Drone, Alts and Mods at this rank, when every single MM battle i am still nothing but target practice, and even with a Viking  i can hardly moove on any battle? All i get is 9999 legend adversaries, and even when their GS and rank is lower they somehow end up being more like a MK 1000 combo,  and that is weird becaus random MM is not so random when this is 90'% of the times, like set up to be sloughtered, so what is the point playing such a game?

The only thing worth playing used to be Pro Battles, but those are now almost inexisting, just AI made useless parkour, that look more like a BOT training camp. And the very phew that we can still play are allways infested with a  group of players that somehow are allowed to use cheats with total impunity, big accounts, Legends, full garages, same ones every day, kind of odd.

So, Honestly, what is the point of playing such a game when in the 2 modes of playing we are faced with this?

PS. No i am not a skilless noob...here since the beggining of this game, seen it all, including all the manipulation,excuses and decay.

[Spy 14,687]

10 minutes ago, Sir_Lagsalot said:

 

Topic merged.

[Okami 3,041]

16 hours ago, Sir_Lagsalot said:

So, i askek some questions before and all i got was ambiguous copy pasta pro forma dodging issue pseudo answers, but, let's try one more honest question, and it would be nice to have some honest answers.

So, what is the point playing a game, when after so much time and effort spent, with several MK7 combos, nice Drone, Alts and Mods at this rank, when every single MM battle i am still nothing but target practice, and even with a Viking  i can hardly moove on any battle? All i get is 9999 legend adversaries, and even when their GS and rank is lower they somehow end up being more like a MK 1000 combo,  and that is weird becaus random MM is not so random when this is 90'% of the times, like set up to be sloughtered, so what is the point playing such a game?

The only thing worth playing used to be Pro Battles, but those are now almost inexisting, just AI made useless parkour, that look more like a BOT training camp. And the very phew that we can still play are allways infested with a  group of players that somehow are allowed to use cheats with total impunity, big accounts, Legends, full garages, same ones every day, kind of odd.

So, Honestly, what is the point of playing such a game when in the 2 modes of playing we are faced with this?

PS. No i am not a skilless noob...here since the beggining of this game, seen it all, including all the manipulation,excuses and decay.

How are your Micro-upgrades? I found out the hard way that Mk7 items with a few Micro-upgrades aren't enough to fight against Legends who have Mk7-20 turrets and hulls. If you only have a few Micro-upgrades on your Mk7 items, that means you're equipped to play with people who are closer to Marshal (Lieutenant General-Commander or so. This range isn't set in stone of course). I used to struggle with fighting Legends when I was a Commander with a GS in the mid 7000s but it became easier as I got more and more MUs. I can't say exactly when I stopped getting killed easily, but Micro-upgrading my stuff definitely remedied my problems. 

[Sir_Lagsalot 2]

11 hours ago, GrayWolf8733 said:

How are your Micro-upgrades? I found out the hard way that Mk7 items with a few Micro-upgrades aren't enough to fight against Legends who have Mk7-20 turrets and hulls. If you only have a few Micro-upgrades on your Mk7 items, that means you're equipped to play with people who are closer to Marshal (Lieutenant General-Commander or so. This range isn't set in stone of course). I used to struggle with fighting Legends when I was a Commander with a GS in the mid 7000s but it became easier as I got more and more MUs. I can't say exactly when I stopped getting killed easily, but Micro-upgrading my stuff definitely remedied my problems. 

Go check it, and if you doubt it then you are doubting the large majority of the last remaining and constantly decreasing number of players of this game. I have 2 other account, one with a 18 mu Titan and 4 diferent turrets above 10, and exactly the same, i stoped playing MM with that account, something very wrong with Tanki, and everybody is saying the same things so, maybe that large majority with the same opinion and experience as me are all wrong.

My guess is that the only people playing Tanki now are those that invested small fortunes in the game, and those weird 12 plus hrs a day players, so there are very phew "normal" players left, aka the 99% of all games and only the 1% remains and that is all the enemy one can get, but odd enough this 1% NEVER, EVER lands on your team, MM they are 100% of the times....the enemy team, kind of odd hum?

And the BOTS is probably to keep the game going since there are less players everyday and the game Reputation is so bad and so many bad reviews that new players are only new accounts of existing players.

So go ahed, doubt all you want, FACTS will not change with your doubts, Facts are Facts.

Cheers.

 

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

1 hour ago, Unleash said:

This game dont have balance, 5k tankoins for basic feature explain everything about devs.

I do agree with your point here, but at the same time I figure that Alternativa did this to discourage module use (and to those want to use 4th slot with no drawback, pay that 5 grands of Tankoins). Again, not saying that you are wrong.

2 hours ago, Unleash said:

Someone will say that they need money to keep this "game" running, true but they shouldn't start doing p2w updates in first place from 2015. Now wonder where did all players go? Yes they quit.

We can't completely blame on Dev either but yes....

2 hours ago, Unleash said:

Some new graphics and shiny P2W augments won't change fact that this "game" is rip in terms of balance and fair gameplay.

Let's see those OP stuffs: EMP Gauss, Vampire Isida, superpowered Crisis, Blunderbuss and so on...

2 hours ago, Unleash said:

We told you so many times what is wrong with this game yet you don't listen, I won't call fixed HI-IB abuse that you are finally listening and actually care.

They say they do listen to players. But the question is: Who exactly?

3 hours ago, Unleash said:

Why does gauss emp spash can emp tanks?

Why does some pixel shop bundle with mk1 cost 200 euros?

Sometime Alternativa decided to let P2W go brrrrrrrr.

3 hours ago, Unleash said:

Why you dont remove xp boost? and why you dont fix matchmaking ranks spread? right, you dont have enough players.

Again, when they try to fix things up, things went worse.

[Akame 4,578]

Tanki Players views in 2021:
 

Spoiler

Let's discuss game balance;
sorry can't discuss what doesn't exist.

Not gonna lie, as much as it pains me, I can not really find anything balanced aside from Thunder realistically looking at a tank perspective.

[Frylock 1,617]

Okay I feel like viking needs to be balanced out, and please dont give me the "but viking is a tracked hull" or "But the charging rate of the OD is extremely slow".... Here is what I propose, nerf the OD time from 7 seconds to 3 seconds, but I would like the charging rate to speed up to compensate for the reduced time. Secondly, nerf the acceleration from 13.50 to 12. And lastly, Nerf the reverse acceleration from 20 to 18. Let the rotting tomatoes commence. (From the 85-90% of the tanki community that use this mostly used annoying unbalanced hull)

[Spy 14,687]

That can also solve the problem with Viking being extremely overpowered in Team Juggernaut. 

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

I would keep its durrent duration but get rid off its damage boost and soup up the charging rate (as fast as a Dictator).

[Frylock 1,617]

7 minutes ago, FrozenRailgun said:

I would keep its durrent duration but get rid off its damage boost and soup up the charging rate (as fast as a Dictator).

Then again it would still be just as annoying.but it could work.

Edited June 17, 2021 by MysticBlood

[Crossbone 516]

44 minutes ago, MysticBlood said:

Okay I feel like viking needs to be balanced out, and please dont give me the "but viking is a tracked hull" or "But the charging rate of the OD is extremely slow".... Here is what I propose, nerf the OD time from 7 seconds to 3 seconds, but I would like the charging rate to speed up to compensate for the reduced time.

I think the real problem lies with some of the turrets. So to fix alot of the problems, all turrets should be reverted back to their default state during the OD. Next, some of the turrets should have their firing rate reduced, which are magnum (high ranks), railgun, ricochet, and smoky.

Aside from that, I honestly think that Viking OD needs a buff.

 

56 minutes ago, MysticBlood said:

Secondly, nerf the acceleration from 13.50 to 12. And lastly, Nerf the reverse acceleration from 20 to 18.

Without the OD, the acceleration is the only thing that makes Viking perform good anymore.

[mjmj5558 2,346]

1 hour ago, MysticBlood said:

. Secondly, nerf the acceleration from 13.50 to 12. And lastly, Nerf the reverse acceleration from 20 to 18. Let the rotting tomatoes commence.

This is useless. Viking, as a hull, is balanced.

 

1 hour ago, MysticBlood said:

nerf the OD time from 7 seconds to 3 seconds, but I would like the charging rate to speed up to compensate for the reduced time.

You mean double the charging speed (passive) and make the duration 3.5 seconds. Because then, sure. Also, the %/15 points could be increased to 10 from 7, but that's not necesarry, for the first move.

Edited June 17, 2021 by mjmj5558

[Arjun24 156]

I'm telling you viking od should not be nerfed. Each od is very very useful myb except hornet's od to guarentee kills. If you nerf viking's od then it won't be that much of a force like it is now.

[mjmj5558 2,346]

1 minute ago, Arjun24 said:

I'm telling you viking od should not be nerfed. Each od is very very useful myb except hornet's od to guarentee kills. If you nerf viking's od then it won't be that much of a force like it is now.

Viking OD is not overpowered, bzt overused due to certain factors i'm what not gonna explain now. However, when the 70-80% of the hulls are viking, we can feel that something needs to be down. Not a bug nerf, rather a change.