category Let's Discuss Game Balance

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

 

 

You know you can try to play with lower ranks as well so that you are the strong guy? 

50 % protection? You can somewhat counter that if you have multiple turrets. In time you'll expand your garage and you'll have many turrets and modules to choose from. 

M4 gear? MUs now don't make as much of a difference as they used too and there are also battles with MUs disabled

Drugs? if you complete your daily missions every single day you should be able to drug as much as you need for your missions and maybe a bit more from time to time. You have M2 XP so you could try having some fun in XP/BP after you're done with your missions so that you don't need to use more supplies and have some fun at the same time.  Btw, I've seen many complaining about battles being filled with druggers. It's not that bad. Actually in the battles I enter only half of the players drug constantly. The better you are at using supplies that drop, the more efficient you'll be in battles.

That critical thinking and stuff comes in handy outside of the battle. It's all about making the right decisions. It's about choosing the right battles, buying the right things...

 

I'm not saying it's easy for a f2p users. It's actually really difficult for them to compete, but it's achievable.

 

 

 

 

 I get roughly 300 supplies a week and I usually use 20-30 supplies to complete all my missions (in 1 day) because there are still ways of exploiting the system. If one of my friends need help in a battle with supplies enable I will spam 234 and use RK from time to time. I can't relly afford entering drug wars too often because I'll run out of supplies but friends are friends and I still somehow manage to keep 7-8k drugs in my garage so I'm fine with that. After doing my missions I usually go and have some fun in XP/BP. That's my regular day in TO and for me it's going fine.

Not only that, but the critical thinking applies also in deciding which equipment to buy. The common sense is basically another way of saying "basics" and also what not to do. And the creative planning, well it's another way of saying "figure out a creative way to not die in the hole".

[MAD.GEN1US 38]

Yes, he did exactly that. The lead game developer doesn't have any access to detailed statistics of the turrets' usage, so the only way he can determine how powerful something is is by using an M4 version of it in battles against M3 and M2.

 

Oh yeah, I almost forgot to add....

 

 

#TankiOnlineIsGoingDownhill

#TankiIsPay2Win

 

 

Did you seriously type that in the spoiler? I can't believe a mod stated the true facts ("Tanki is going downhill"), although I don't agree with your second point that "Tanki is pay 2 win".

[Maf 32,300]

Did you seriously type that in the spoiler? I can't believe a mod stated the true facts ("Tanki is going downhill"), although I don't agree with your second point that "Tanki is pay 2 win".

Do you know the meaning of sarcasm?  <_>

[MAD.GEN1US 38]

Do you know the meaning of sarcasm?  <_<

I knew you would use that excuse; I should have stated it in the original post. I know you pretended to be sarcastic to get the facts out  -_-

[Maf 32,300]

I knew you would use that excuse; I should have stated it in the original post. I know you pretended to be sarcastic to get the facts out   -_-

OK, if you want my honest point of view (which is not, by any means, an actual fact), here it is:

• Yes, Tanki is "going downhill", i.e. losing popularity. But this is not because of bad updates, but because the game is 8 years old and is losing its player base to better, more advanced games of the same type.
• This game is not a failure. It's has been an amazing success, if you consider the fact that this was originally meant to be a simple demo to showcase possibilities of Flash game engine, yet it outlived most online MMO browser games and gained massive popularity.
• Yes, developers are adding a lot of stuff to encourage players to spend money. This is because AlternativaPlatform (the publisher) is a profit organisation and Tanki is their main project and main source of income.
• Yes, the game is somewhat "Pay2Win", but definitely not as much as some other games. It's still completely possible to compete against heavy buyers without investing any real money. It's just very difficult and time consuming, which is why most free players tend to be weaker than buyers since they don't have the patience to maximise their income.

Now please send any replies on the above points to me in PM, since this topic is for the discussion about the game's balance.

[Sasori_Deidara 0]

I'm sure many of you have noticed as well. I don't know WHAT tanki did to the firebird, but it is rediculously over powered now. I can't even play on DM anymore cause it's nothing but FIREBIRDS. De-op the firebird! In the tanki v-log once, they said that the Hornet was every-other-hull. Well now the firebird is every-other-turret!! Idk what it's like for you liuetenants and Generallisimo's, but it is MURDER for warrant officers, and lower. Sorry if this goes to as a rant, but it is a rant. I am so sick of the firebird, I just wanna break it in half. What do you guys think?

I totally agree.There is no game where there r not firebirds

[NashEquilibrium 44]

I totally agree.There is no game where there r not firebirds

LOL you agree to a post made 2 years back.

Firebird has changed a lot since then. It still does well in DMs though, with that m2 alteration.

[TheBlackChick 319]

I've just played a battle in Noise CTF after a long time and I have to say that Magnum needs to be changed. I don't think it's causing unbalance, but the problem I have is with the change in gameplay. In Noise we used to have 2 (maybe 3) dedicated defenders and the rest of the team was attacking. Now I have seen a red team that had 6 defenders (4 of them were magnums) and a blue team that had 3 Magnums as well. People are using this turret too much. Isn't this something that shows things need to be adjusted a little bit?

[tankidaddy_the_cool 6]

Interested in whether any analysis has been done on game balance - ie stats on average difference between win and lose score in battles? I'm not good at maths, so not really sure what it would be.

 

 

I see many battles where a team is winning 7-0, and so why would I join? And if I'm already in a battle where that's happening (often because of over-drugging by a team) I often exit.But that's my perception - would love to see some proof from a number-cruncher...

[Tani_S 736]

Interested in whether any analysis has been done on game balance - ie stats on average difference between win and lose score in battles? I'm not good at maths, so not really sure what it would be.

 

 

I see many battles where a team is winning 7-0, and so why would I join? And if I'm already in a battle where that's happening (often because of over-drugging by a team) I often exit. But that's my perception - would love to see some proof from a number-cruncher...

From where should we get the data? My perception is the same, I think there are more unbalanced game ends now compared to 6 or 8 months ago.

[ThomasTheDankEngine2 141]

I've just played a battle in Noise CTF after a long time and I have to say that Magnum needs to be changed. I don't think it's causing unbalance, but the problem I have is with the change in gameplay. In Noise we used to have 2 (maybe 3) dedicated defenders and the rest of the team was attacking. Now I have seen a red team that had 6 defenders (4 of them were magnums) and a blue team that had 3 Magnums as well. People are using this turret too much. Isn't this something that shows things need to be adjusted a little bit?

Magnum players are mostly playing only in Noise and Polygon. That would be sad if they nerf it because it's pretty underpowered in other maps because it needs a lot of skill and math

[TheBlackChick 319]

Magnum players are mostly playing only in Noise and Polygon. That would be sad if they nerf it because it's pretty underpowered in other maps because it needs a lot of skill and math

I didn't suggest nerfing it...But I think a change of some sort would make battles in small maps more enjoyable. The problem is that I don't know what should be changed to make everyone happy...

[ThomasTheDankEngine2 141]

I've just played a battle in Noise CTF after a long time and I have to say that Magnum needs to be changed. I don't think it's causing unbalance, but the problem I have is with the change in gameplay. In Noise we used to have 2 (maybe 3) dedicated defenders and the rest of the team was attacking. Now I have seen a red team that had 6 defenders (4 of them were magnums) and a blue team that had 3 Magnums as well. People are using this turret too much. Isn't this something that shows things need to be adjusted a little bit?

Talking about Noise map balance, it's not balanced map. Upper (team red?) team wins with Magnum or without

[Tani_S 736]

I didn't suggest nerfing it...But I think a change of some sort would make battles in small maps more enjoyable. The problem is that I don't know what should be changed to make everyone happy...

Actually you can pretty much forget small maps as they are in general no battle button maps. And if they are battle button maps, you can expect these maps to get bigger in size.

Edited June 7, 2017 by Tani_S

[TheBlackChick 319]

Talking about Noise map balance, it's not balanced map. Upper (team red?) team wins with Magnum or without

Not really true.I usually join blue side (down) and actually win most of the times. However I'd say it's rather unpleasant to play for the blue team because you get killed again and again and again.

[LittleWillie 3,199]

Magnum players are mostly playing only in Noise and Polygon. That would be sad if they nerf it because it's pretty underpowered in other maps because it needs a lot of skill and math

Every point made is untrue. I see a Magnum on most every team now. They are not underpowered in fact they distort game play. They hide in a corner and rack up the kills. I routinely see 20+ kills and fewer than 5 deaths form these things. That constant damage to the other side forces them to stop going for the flag and going to knockj out the magnum ... the mangum team has already won the game at this stage. 

 

As for lots of skill and math Bull to the sheet. You hide in a corner, you take a few shots to get the range, then you just repeat it over and over. Once you've played a map a few times you do not even need the first few shots to get the range. It is the EASIEST turret in the game to play - not even close.

 

 

I didn't suggest nerfing it...But I think a change of some sort would make battles in small maps more enjoyable. The problem is that I don't know what should be changed to make everyone happy...

The problem is Tanki has dozens of maps which were built for LOS (line of sight) fire. You had to see your enemy to shoot it and objects in the way would block the shot.

 

Now the devs throw in an indirect fire weapon that oh by the way does the most damage per shot in the entire game. then they throw in a massive splash radius. Who could have predicted this would be massively overpowered?  Just anyone who thought about it is all.

 

So to answer your question what needs to be done is:redesign if not all at least most of the maps, Redesign them with stuff that blocks lobbed shells but not LOS weapons for instance.  But this is a mssive project that would consume far too many manhours so it will not be done.  So we are stuck with this piece of shinola turret.

 

Talking about Noise map balance, it's not balanced map. Upper (team red?) team wins with Magnum or without

All maps that give the high ground to one team are definitely unbalanced at least to a certain extent. "Occupy the high ground" is about the oldest maxim in combat.

[wolverine848 13,097]

Not really true.I usually join blue side (down) and actually win most of the times. However I'd say it's rather unpleasant to play for the blue team because you get killed again and again and again.

Hmmm... if you are getting killed again and again - you can't be "doing" much over time. So that suggests there is imbalance.

 

The thing is, higher ground does give an advantage, even in an arcade game like this.

It's easier to drop down to middle level than it is to drive up one of three ramps that can easily be blocked or become a kill zone.

 

If a team controls 2-out-of-3 levels they have control of the map and will likely win.  There are exceptions of course, but with teams fairly balanced in power and numbers, Blue will lose more than it will win.

[TheBlackChick 319]

 

There may be an imbalance that adds to the already spoiled gameplay but I'm not really sure since I don't play this map anymore. Players from the blue side attack and attack and they get killed over and over because reds are mostly camping. Not fun. And if you play for the red team it's a bit better as you don't get killed so often, but I wouldn't call the gameplay actually fun.

Edited June 7, 2017 by TheBlackChick

[wolverine848 13,097]

There may be an imbalance that adds to the already spoiled gameplay but I'm not really sure since I don't play this map anymore. Players from the blue side attack and attack and they get killed over and over because reds are mostly camping. Not fun. And if you play for the red team it's a bit better as you don't get killed so often, but I wouldn't call the gameplay actually fun.

It's a map that...

 

- generates kills for red

- generates crystals for red

- generates experience for isida (more-so on blue)

- can help Isida (on blue) finish first

 

2 vs 2 or 3 vs 3 CP has been fun on this map.  Any more tanks than that - yes - it's just a grind. kinda like polygon.

[tankidaddy_the_cool 6]

From where should we get the data? My perception is the same, I think there are more unbalanced game ends now compared to 6 or 8 months ago.

I was thinking that Tanki devs have access to all sorts of stats (ie does every games final score get saved?) - but maybe not. 

[Tani_S 736]

I was thinking that Tanki devs have access to all sorts of stats (ie does every games final score get saved?) - but maybe not. 

Surely they have access to all the data you mentioned. You asked the valid question why you should join an unbalanced game. And yes a lot of battles are unbalanced. The upcoming concept is that you won't be able to join a game while a game is already running. On the longterm perspective there maybe might be a server kick system of mults in a special type of battles, but that remains to be seen. At the moment I don't see or can't remember of much more countermeasures from the devs to balance out the development of the battles. What other things should they do in your opinion?

[wolverine848 13,097]

The upcoming concept is that you won't be able to join a game while a game is already running.

How would you join a game then?

 

The game won't start until it's full (10 vs 10)? 

Wonder how long that might take...  6 vs 6 sitting there and cant get 8 more tanks to join...

 

And... what happens when someone drops out - stays 10 vs 9 until over?  maybe even 10 vs 6 until over? :blink:

[Tani_S 736]

How would you join a game then?

 

The game won't start until it's full (10 vs 10)? 

Wonder how long that might take...  6 vs 6 sitting there and cant get 8 more tanks to join...

 

And... what happens when someone drops out - stays 10 vs 9 until over?  maybe even 10 vs 6 until over? :blink:

The matchmaking will let you go together with all the other players in a battle. Once everyone has loaded the battle, it starts. Yes, the aim is to have a game full with 10v10, but that might not be necessary all the time. Hazel talked about the optimal number of players that will play in the battle. So then there they have to implement a decision design into the system for the trade-off between higher number of players and longer waiting time.

 

Yes, the thing about players leaving the battle is also a big question to me. The hope is to have more balanced games - equal number of players at start, everybody joined in, aim is that not fitting equipment is less of a problem (standardized maps), less lag kicks by html5, no raid joiners, no mult joiners, no winning team joiners while game is on-going, less strong pay2win effects through hull characteristics - so that less people are leaving. But if they do leave ...  -_- :unsure:

 

The biggest problem I see is still the drugging issue in those battles  :(

Edited June 10, 2017 by Tani_S

[ScoobyDew 11]

This game will never be balanced as long as ScoobyDew continues to be so awesome.  Can game developers please make a mega tank robot to destroy him?

 

Signed,

Tired of ScoobyDew's awesomeness

 

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

^ :mellow: