[Special Review] Tanki Versus Supplies: Round Two

[Crip 4,735]

    

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Hello Tankers! We've seen the First Supplies Experiment come and go, and many surely thought that after its resounding failure Tanki would surely not persist further into this subject. But now, another live testing has just taken place. In this article we'll take a look at the Second Supply Experiment and see if the Tanki Developers corrected their errors from the first experiment. Player opinions will also be sought.

 

 

Introduction

 

Many buyers must have breathed sighs of relief when Supply Experiment #1 was deemed unsuccessful. However, their newly-founded solace did not last long. hinted another tweak for Supplies in the Livestream, only a week after the testing for #1 came to a close. Just a few weeks later, #2 has left it's mark.

 

We acquired some details for #2 in the 125th Vlog, which unsurprisingly started many discussions. When the Official Announcement was released on the forum on the 10th of March, its details sparked exclamations of disgust from most sides, especially upon the realization that the Supply Active Time had been reduced by 10 seconds from its original length of 40.

 

The second Official Supplies Test took place between 0200 UTC on the 11th of March to the equivalent time on the 13th. The feedback is still rolling in, and almost all of it is negative. When Hazel, the Chief Developer, ventured to suggest that the experiment was going well, many outraged tankers went on the warpath.

 

Regardless, here is what was altered for the duration of the weekend.

 

 

Comparison with Experiment #1

 

You might be thinking "So what actually were the differences between this newer experiment and the first one?" Well, never fear! We will be looking at exactly that in this section; the changes that were made to #1 to create #2, as well as the features that remained for both.

 

 

Experiment #1 vs #2: The Changes

 

The largest difference between the experiments was the fact that PRO Battles did not feature the experimental changes, so tankers who did not wish to go anywhere near supply changes did not have to participate.

 

Smart Cooldowns were removed for experiment #1, whereas they were present in the recent one; albeit with a 50% reduction in the regular time length. Many tankers complained that gameplay without SCs was extremely boring and slow paced, as tankers simply activated every supply before retreating to hide for a minute while their supplies cooled down.

 

Experiment #1 vs #2: Similar Features

 

There were restrictions on supply usage as soon as a tanker entered a battle, and there were also heavy cooldowns attached to each supply, though they were massively reduced in experiment #2 compared to #1.

 

Of course, the special feature for both experiments was that being destroyed did not reset any supply cooldowns, which (as stated earlier) was implemented for tactical reasons.

 

And then we had the same active time reduction for all supplies in both experiments. It is clear that Tanki did not like the lengthy active duration of supplies and are keen to reduce them.

 

 

Round Two: What was New?

 

After realizing that several main problems were uncovered in the experiment #1, test #2 attempted to bring moderate change, as opposed to being completely drastic or leaving it untouched. Durations, Smart Cooldowns and Standard Cooldowns were all altered again, and the exact surgery performed on them is shown below.

 

Cooldowns

 

Of course, there are currently no Cooldowns for any supplies. One can simply join a battle and activate any supply immediately, with no hindrance. However, for the duration of the weekend, there were some cooldowns imposed on all supplies; meaning that it was not possible to use any supplies until the cooldown had been completed. The cooldowns and their respective lengths for each supply are listed below. When you entered a battle, the cooldown for each supply would be two-thirds of the the respective value below.

• Repair Kit: 60 seconds
• Double Damage: 30 seconds
• Double Armor: 30 seconds
• Speed Boost: 30 seconds
• Mine: 45 seconds

These times also applied to the Smart Cooldown between activating supplies of the same type (ei, once you've activated a Double Armor you'd have to wait 30 seconds after it had expired before you were able to reactivate).

 

Smart Cooldowns

 

These are actually present in the game right now and were introduced on the 29th of September, 2014. Before that date, players could simply activate all 3 supplies (Damage, Armor and Speed) and tear apart the battlefield. Using supplies was less tactical back then, as there were simply two brands of players: those with supplies and those without.

 

For the weekend, however, Smart Cooldowns on all supplies were halved. This meant that the "rainbow" of supplies would be much easier to acquire, seeing as the time before a second supply could be activated was reduced. In the table below, the temporary Smart Cooldown times are shown.

 

 

Note: Red/Green numbers indicate a change in the time value for the Supplies Experiment #2.

 

Active Times

 

Of course, with Smart Cooldowns being reduced, the Active Time of the supply had to be reduced as well. Prior to experiment #2, all the Primary (Armor and Damage) and Secondary (Speed) supplies lasted for 40 seconds (and of course Repairs have their own unique Active Times).

 

Over the weekend, these times were altered. The Active Times that were tested are shown below.

• Repair Kit: Unchanged
• Double Damage: 30 seconds
• Double Armor: 30 seconds
• Speed Boost: 30 seconds 

Other Changes

 

Along with the changes listed above, there was another small, but important change.

 

Cooldowns on garage supplies would not be reset when a player respawned. Instead, the cooldowns would carry over (ei, if a player had activated a Double Damage shortly before he died, that supply would be on cooldown when he respawned).

 

This was added with the intention of making supply usage more tactical, meaning a player had to use his head more to "drug" effectively.

 

 

Opinion Corner: Players

 

Now, it's finally time to hear some thoughts from several experienced players and forumers, selected from the ones who originally featured in the Opinion Section Article about Experiment #1 . Each were asked several questions regarding the second Supplies Experiment, and their responses (along with the questions) are shown below.

 

 

Question 1: Did you like/dislike the second Supply Experiment and why?

 

Question 2: Was the second better than the first?

 

Question 3: Does the way that supplies function need changing and if so, is it a priority?

 

 

 

@Oufa

 

Answer 1: To be completely honest, this experiment was good and bad at the same time. Good because it was easy to use supplies in a fast way (short Smart Cooldowns); Bad because it takes so long to reload again. The cooldowns are too long in my opinion.

 

Answer 2: Yes. The first one wasn't good because it didn't give you the right to use the supplies after you join the battle directly (meaning more danger of being camped), it took a lot of time. But the second one was better because it was faster than the first one, and I preferred this.

 

Answer 3: No, the current version of supplies is pretty good. It doesn't need to be changed.

 

 

@lukey0

 

Answer 1: The second experiment wasn't too bad, but its not like it accomplished anything anyway. It just had carry-on cooldowns which I personally don't like. Druggers/Buyers could still win by having an endless amount of drugs and non-druggers still complained about druggers. So it really did nothing other than make supplies expensive for the 30 seconds of active time and make you always looking at your supplies and loosing focus on the battle.

 

Answer 2: The second test was a massive improvement on the first. The first test was just horrendous while this one was withstand-able but still unliked. Tanki is known for it fast paced, edge of your toes, dynamic gameplay, and these test's just don't deliver that. They make it slower, and cooldowns often lead with you having no supplies versing someone with full supplies. That puts you in a situation worse than before.

 

Answer 3: Personally supplies are fine the way they are. You can counteract others supplies with your own and they add a dynamic effect to Tanki. The only supply that could need changing would be the Repair Kit. That supply would be the problem causer. Maybe if they made the active time a little bit longer but reduced the amount of HP per second it was be more balanced. So you could actually kill the player using it if they are not careful.

 

 

 

@X.Z.F

 

Answer 1: I personally did not like the experiment. Not having supplies when respawning is definitely something I am against.

 

Answer 2: It was definitely better than the last one. If this experiment was eventually was added into the game as an option in the Pro Battle Menu I would not be frustrated with the Tanki Developers.

 

Answer 3: No. I feel the way supplies are right now is balanced. Since the death of Light Format and Starladder tournaments, most high tier clans have turned to drugs and if they do add this update into Tanki, this game will lose a lot of its veteran players. Me? Personally enjoy playing 8v8 and 10v10 against other drug clans, its fair and balanced because both teams are constantly drugging against each other and winning relies more on working as a team to block or flip your opponent.

 

 

@Jwimmer

 

Answer 1: I didn't play a whole lot, but from what I could tell, it was good. The main feature I liked is not resetting cooldowns every time you die, and also the longer cooldown on repair kits was great. I feel like I was able to drug heavily and not go through as many supplies as has been in the past. This means drugging will be set on a more even playing field, not just 25% of people being able to heavily drug all of the time.

 

Answer 2: It was definitely better than the first. The first did not fit in with the game much, but this one seemed very much to mesh into gameplay. It was more natural, and I definitely prefer this one over the first one. The main reason is that this one had smart cooldowns, which is super important to have in whatever system gets implemented.

 

Answer 3: They definitely do. The main reason most bad games are bad is because of supplies. I'm not saying that supplies themselves are bad, but I am saying that it is too easy for 2-3 heavy druggers on 1 team to completely over run the other team. Because supplies are the main reason most games are not as fun for light druggers like myself, they are right up there with fixing lag as a priority.

 

 

 

@RIDDLER_8

 

Answer 1: Yes. I liked the second Supply Experiment. My suggestion is that if there is a third supply experiment, it would be nice to have the cooldowns of repair kits last 1 minute to make play indestructible for 1 minute.

 

Answer 2: No. To me there were no difference. The only thing is that during the first experiment, I did not have any supplies left for me to experiment with.

 

Answer 3: Yes. Supplies cooldowns are too short and they don't last enough. My suggestion is that the cooldown effect of double armor, double damage and speed boost must last for 1 minute, not 40 seconds. Repair kits must have their cooldowns increased from 2 seconds to 4 seconds. Mines must have their cooldowns decreased from 30 seconds to 10 seconds. All the supplies cooldowns must be independent from each other.

 

 

Conclusion

 

And here, we will bring this article to an end. We've had two very interesting, if slightly painful, experiments. We have also read some player reviews in both articles, and I hope you have found them interesting to read. Tanki is still persistent on modifying of the supplies system, though it is definitely not clear-cut whether the majority of the Tanki Community want supplies to be altered or not.

 

 

What does the future hold for supplies? What do you think about the Supplies Experiments?

We want to hear your opinions!

 

      

That's all from me.

✯ @Savage ✯

Edited March 17, 2017 by Savage

[Crip 4,735]

Slightly belated review on the 2nd Supply Experiment. Many thanks to the forumers who answered my questions.

[r_GaIaxy2 8,611]

Riddler will find any way to get his ideas heard, won't he :P

 

Well written lad, keep it up :)

[Crip 4,735]

Riddler will find any way to get his ideas heard, won't he :P

I like a bit of variety in responses, and Riddler usually has some uniquely drastic ideas :P

[lukey0 27,543]

I like a bit of variety in responses, and Riddler usually has some uniquely drastic ideas :P

But not too drastic. What he mention was pretty much how supplies were in 2012, or before SCD's were implanted. They just didn't last 1 minute, but 50 seconds instead.  :ph34r:

 

Nice article. ;)

[BISSBEST 4]

Hmm, I s'pose that the supplies updates won't do any good cuz we like how things are and don't like the changes, so why not leave it be?

[oOo.INDIAN-TANKI.oOo 9]

Respected Developers, 

                               

                                   I want to say something but my english is little bad so sorry if you have to dificult  understand. I dont know what  actually going to happen in future with supplies, but must need to balance between huge buyers and non buyers in this game battle . I said " in game battle" because I ( nonbuyer ) have no objection on any game content like garage turrets , hulls , microupdates and crystals and also game physics . If you want to give us low battle fund in future that will be not a problem coz we will update hull and turret slowly But the biggest problem is in normal battle for supplies. I personaly think this thing  need to change.

 

When a m1  combo (hulls and turrets together) uses supplies in battle. He acts like a m4  combo. So it's impossible to face him with my same combo . So it needs to balance, now the question is 'how many need changes the supplies then it can be a  fair battle?'. Guess in island TDM battle when play  1 vs 1 (a hard drugger and a nondrugger but both have same skill and same combo) then drugger must be win  . Now if there a battle in island map 1 hard drugger vs 2 non druggers with same skills and same combos , then must not be win the drugger .That I think it will be balance between druggers and nondruggers.     [Note: Nondrugger means a player who are not using a single drugs in battle]. 

 

  Today I played a 12 vs 12 full battle, there I had some nondrugger  skillful friends also and we were winning. When  6 minutes to go the game end . some enemies left   and 3 druggers enterd . They randomly drugging,but they were not very good skillful players. Then we also fight them but atlast we lost. They took all battle funds. My question is 'How 3 players change the game ? , How 3 players controlled the battle over 12 players? I call in a single sentense "They buy win" , is it a fair system in the game battle? after years after it would happend. But  I think now the time it needs  to change. I hope now what you (Developers) will do we all nonbuyers will gain something and what  you will do we all players (druggers and nondruggers) will be happy.  :)

Edited March 18, 2017 by oOo.INDIAN-TANKI.oOo

[dfoofnik 341]

It is ridiculously easy to sum up the use of supplies (drugs) to anyone who has played a battle completely without them, where the dominance of the stronger players (e.g. who spent more) is absolute.

If you are going to have only "free supplies", then again only those powerful or fast enough already will dominate!

If you are going to SELL SUPPLIES, randomly placing new restrictions or tweaking them is unfair to those who use them (free or bought) because they have predicated their ability to play against others on the existing parameters of supply use.

Who here with a brain would actually think that entering a battle without being able to use supplies when the enemies there already have them, is a good idea???

 

These were more time-wasting experiments that do nothing to help disadvantaged players, who are least experienced in the use of supplies. It is incredible to me that someone could be deluded enough to assume that any of these were good ideas.

Edited March 19, 2017 by dfoofnik

[Jwimmer 2,835]

These were more time-wasting experiments that do nothing to help disadvantaged players, who are least experienced in the use of supplies. It is incredible to me that someone could be deluded enough to assume that any of these were good ideas.

First sentence: completely incorrect. I am an occasional supply user, and I found that 100 supplies went farther with the most recent experiment than the past in-game model.

 

Second of all, I am not deluded.

 

Third, I did not assume anything that I said in my responses in the article (I am assuming you are talking about me, the only respondent in favor)

 

Fourth, "time-wasting experiment" is an oxymoron when talking about a game. It was 48 hours of slightly altered gameplay.

[Allview_Viper_V2 0]

When adding the "Magnum" turret in all garages??? :(  The populars Youtubers has got "Magnum"! :(

[racer22_online 206]

It's not really fair on the login banner to say the feedback from the majority of the responder tankers "don't want any change" - what is true is that with the 2 recent experiments, most tankers said it made things worse (especially when spawning).  Note, if you did a simple pole asking all tankers do you think garage supplies are causing an imbalance in the standard games: Yes / No, what do you think the result will be?  My best guess is that over 80% will say Yes.  Go and speak to the new 'Steam' users, most of whom are already confirming TO is an imbalanced pay to win game in standard mode (and most will probably never discover Pro Mode).  This is causing players to leave.

 

For the die hard players like me, we already know that Pro Mode battles are the best way to get a good battle 'right now'.  The drugs imbalance in standard battles these days is very painful.

I do note, if all tankers used Pro Mode then sales of supplies kits would go right down and this would  hurt TO finances.

 

Hence, we need either a way to get TO more money (e.g. advertising on the bill boards) or a way to balance the supplies usage so that sales of 'supply kits' are not lost.

 

I actually think using a max of 10 garage supplies per 15 minutes per tank would solve the problem in both Pro Mode and Standard Mode (and keep the smart cool down process and timings as is.)  This amount would suit me as a Free To Play player.  In fact if TO made this change I would spend real money on a paint job! and because I believe in paying for my entertainment.  At present I cannot recommend TO to anyone unless you have superhuman skills or masochistic tendencies.

 

At present the 'main' imbalance in team games is caused by one side using e.g. 400 garage drugs per 15 minutes and the other side only using 100.  The reason this happens is because the winning side fights amongst its-self to get the top spot which gets the most crystals - also the losing side cannot get at most of the air drop sites and so they die more often, plus lack of reward for losing means it's not worth using garage drugs.  Hence, a massive imbalance and many 'rubbish' battles win or lose.

 

We clearly need a 'control' that makes sure both sides have access to equal amounts of garage drugs.  At present both sides would need to burn about 40 garage drugs per 15 minutes to do this.  The Free To Play tankers cannot afford this (i.e. 80% of the players).

 

New IDEA!

Another method to consider is to say that the leading side can only use a max of 10 garage drugs per player more than the losing side.  E.g. a battle of 8 V 8 - would mean when the leading side has used 80 more garage drugs than the losing side the leading side can no longer use garage drugs until the losing side uses more garage drugs.   This way the leading side is prevented from going into 'annihilation mode'.  It will also mean massive amounts of drugs used in the first few minutes until the leading side has the 'handcuffs' put on.  The losing side will have no such limits (apart from normal smart cool downs), this will encourage the druggers to join the losing side and help balance the battle!  (When the score is 'even', 'no handcuffs'.) 

 

This would also work in DM.  I.e. the tankers in the top 20% of the leader board would be prevented from using garage drugs if they have used 10 more than the average drug use per 15 minutes.  Thus in a 10 player DM, the leading 2 need to take care not to over drug or they will be 'handcuffed' by the average drug use of the other players. Obviously the existing garage drug 'availability indicator' will have to 'grey out' when they have been 'handcuffed'.

 

Mines:

Players who do not like these balancing handcuffs can still use full drugs via Pro Mode if they wish.

(I did once see a Viking Izzy lay out a beautiful 'pattern' of mines around the flag, all precisely laid!  This person must have used about 50 mines - it was a shame to end the game.  Since my proposal would prevent this - I think a random drop box on both sides should allow the catcher unrestricted mine usage for that battle (although still subject to normal smart cool downs).

 

More on Mines:

By the way my M3.8 Wasp and even an M2 Wasp cannot 'see' mines especially when on Nitro.

I have to play with no sound because I have to be alert to outside real world 'interruptions' so I cannot hear the 'mines'.

I know it feels like fun to destroy a Wasp with mines - but my opinion is that TO should provide a better 'sight' of the mine so I get a chance to drive around it or hit the brakes.  At present it's just a 'major bummer' and another reason why I get more fun from no drugs Pro Mode battles.

Edited March 20, 2017 by racer22_online

[Bloodrush 60]

Tanki Online should take notes from TankiX with handling supplies...

 

I really got sick to join a battle and get insta-killed by hammers on full drugs that just spawn-kill everyone in our base. Nor do I feel enjoyment to be amongst those "hammers" just to end battle quickly because almost all enemy team left. Honestly I don't play regular Tanki anymore, clan wars and trainings are the only fun I can get in this game.(Yes, without supplies)

 

If you look at Tanki Online objectively, it's the worst case of pay 2 win I ever saw in my 14 years of gaming.

Supplies need to be taken care of, drastically. These minor changes do nothing.