Let's Discuss Drones!

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

11 minutes ago, DaringDeer said:

Yeah, the time shown on profiles for drones is not a reliable source of information.  Unfortunately that's the only source of information available.  Different drones track time different ways.  I think Maf explained it to me a while back but I can't find the old message.  

Could it be this? 

 

 

[Akame 4,578]

That information I do not understand yet, active time of drone, but crisis has no downtime in actuality, bit of a sticky one

[wolverine848 13,097]

1 hour ago, TheCongoSpider said:

Could it be this? 

 

 

If true that's kinda dumb.

They should just figure usage based on batteries used.

[Akame 4,578]

Or just keep it simple, i mean a certain combo is equipped, give it the stats it gets, when its changed or removed, simply stop giving it exp. Feels simple enough, i.e using smoky hunter modules and defender, give it all exp/time values, when u change modules, ensure those are aligned for new items to get the values, same with drones. Pretty sure it can be as simple as that.

[yellowghetto 3,206]

Defender needs a super nerf.

[DaringDeer 656]

7 hours ago, TheCongoSpider said:

Could it be this? 

That was it.  It didn't make any sense.  I agree with Akame that it should have just been kept simple.  

I never got any clarification from Maf or anyone else while I was a helper.  The profiles are not a priority for devs so don't expect any changes.  There is definitely an audience for the profiles and statistics be it people just looking at profiles to my stuff to all the discord bots that report this info.

I investigated a bit against my jslifer account because it is a pretty good test case.  I only use Defender and use it 100% of the time in MM and I rarely play pro battles/parkour/etc. These are my snapshots since the beginning of the month.  You can see only part of my total time and total score earned were credited to Defender.  It is really unclear how the time and XP is attributed to the drone, and I can't understand why such a wide range of percentage of time was attributed.  

[MRL-Missoula 96]

What are yalls thoughts on the crisis drone? I won 1 yesterday in a container. Is there a upgrade chart for the drones like there is for turrets and hulls?

[Tokamak 1,021]

9 minutes ago, cmirotomill said:

What are yalls thoughts on the crisis drone? I won 1 yesterday in a container. Is there a upgrade chart for the drones like there is for turrets and hulls?

Micro upgrade chart is available here: https://en.tankiwiki.com/Micro-upgrades_of_Drones#Micro-upgrades_of_.22Crisis_Drone.22

Edited December 13, 2020 by Tokamak

[MRL-Missoula 96]

2 minutes ago, At_Shin said:

  Reveal hidden contents

Micro-upgrades of "Crisis Drone"

 Additional armor: (50 → 100) %
 Additional damage: (25 → 50) %
 Additional speed: (20 → 70) %
 Cooldown between switching modes: (2 → 0.5) s

Step	Additional armor	Additional damage	Additional speed	Cooldown between switching modes	Step Cost	Delay Time	Speed-up Cost
0	50	25	20	2	1000	5h	2000
1	52.5	26.3	22.5	1.9	6160	1d 6h 48m	12320
2	55	27.5	25	1.9	11320	2d 8h 36m	22640
3	57.5	28.8	27.5	1.8	16470	3d 10h 21m	32940
4	60	30	30	1.7	21630	4d 12h 9m	43260
5	62.5	31.3	32.5	1.6	26790	5d 13h 57m	53580
6	65	32.5	35	1.6	31950	6d 15h 45m	63900
7	67.5	33.8	37.5	1.5	37110	7d 17h 33m	74220
8	70	35	40	1.4	42260	8d 19h 18m	84520
9	72.5	36.3	42.5	1.3	47420	9d 21h 6m	94840
10	75	37.5	45	1.3	52580	10d 22h 54m	105160
11	77.5	38.8	47.5	1.2	57740	12d 42m	115480
12	80	40	50	1.1	62890	13d 2h 27m	125780
13	82.5	41.3	52.5	1	68050	14d 4h 15m	136100
14	85	42.5	55	0.9	73210	15d 6h 3m	146420
15	87.5	43.8	57.5	0.9	78370	16d 7h 51m	156740
16	90	45	60	0.8	83530	17d 9h 39m	167060
17	92.5	46.3	62.5	0.7	88680	18d 11h 24m	177360
18	95	47.5	65	0.7	93840	19d 13h 12m	187680
19	97.5	48.8	67.5	0.6	99000	20d 15h	198000
20	100	50	70	0.5	-	-	-
Total:	+50	+25	+50	-1.5	1000000	208d 8h	2000000

The micro upgrades chart for crisis. 

Congrats, you got a super rare reward. Keep in mind that it exhausts 3 supplies of the type enhanced every activation. Your supplies might run out very easily. 

 

3 minutes ago, Tokamak said:

Micro upgrade chart is available here: https://en.tankiwiki.com/Micro-upgrades_of_Drones#Micro-upgrades_of_.22Crisis_Drone.22

Thank you fer the chart.   

 

 

Now is the crisis drone better than the hyperion drone?

[LONDON.ENGLAND 302]

Congrats. I’ve been trying to get that drone for a long time and opened god knows how many containers. 
personally, I think it’s way better than Hyperion. Probably one of the most OP drones at the moment, as mentioned above though it does use a lot of supplies so make sure you have enough 

[Maf 32,300]

From what I can tell, the only cool feature of crisis is increased speed. But the fact that you can use only one supply at a time is a massive disadvantage. I rarely have much trouble playing against Crisis users, with exception of specific combinations of maps, equipment and game modes. A couple days ago had a guy with Hopper + Crisis playing against me in Skylark CTF. He did cap two flags and we lost, but we also killed him a bunch of times and he had a K/D of 2/15. It's just not the kind of gameplay most people would enjoy.

Oh and it eats your supplies like crazy. You can easily end up spending 500 or more supplies in a single MM battle with active use of the drone.

[MRL-Missoula 96]

1 hour ago, Maf said:

From what I can tell, the only cool feature of crisis is increased speed. But the fact that you can use only one supply at a time is a massive disadvantage. I rarely have much trouble playing against Crisis users, with exception of specific combinations of maps, equipment and game modes. A couple days ago had a guy with Hopper + Crisis playing against me in Skylark CTF. He did cap two flags and we lost, but we also killed him a bunch of times and he had a K/D of 2/15. It's just not the kind of gameplay most people would enjoy.

Oh and it eats your supplies like crazy. You can easily end up spending 500 or more supplies in a single MM battle with active use of the drone.

i agree with you

 

[wolverine848 13,097]

1 hour ago, Maf said:

A couple days ago had a guy with Hopper + Crisis playing against me in Skylark CTF. He did cap two flags and we lost, but we also killed him a bunch of times and he had a K/D of 2/15.

Who cares how many times you killed him and what his KD was. If was worried about KD he would use Defender.

He accomplished his goals - capping - and his team won.  That's EXACTLY what it was designed to do.  And he did this vs many defenders.  Imagine how often he can cap with half that many.

 

[Maf 32,300]

35 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

He accomplished his goals - capping - and his team won.  That's EXACTLY what it was designed to do.  And he did this vs many defenders.  Imagine how often he can cap with half that many.

True, but while the drone is good for these large maps, I feel like its performance is worse due to the number of enemies. Moving with DA is too slow, but the instant you activate DD or speed, there's a very good chance an enemy will shoot and kill you.

The drone is more effective with standard 8v8 settings, but I still believe it's not as powerful as other drones.

42 minutes ago, cmirotomill said:

i agree with you

 

There's a very useful new reaction called "agree", which you can use to agree with my post without leaving an unnecessary reply 

[Spy 14,687]

4 hours ago, cmirotomill said:

 

Topic merged.

[wolverine848 13,097]

1 hour ago, Maf said:

True, but while the drone is good for these large maps, I feel like its performance is worse due to the number of enemies. Moving with DA is too slow, but the instant you activate DD or speed, there's a very good chance an enemy will shoot and kill you.

The drone is more effective with standard 8v8 settings, but I still believe it's not as powerful as other drones.

There's a very useful new reaction called "agree", which you can use to agree with my post without leaving an unnecessary reply 

May not have SB, but as a light hull Hopper has good speed and great acceleration.

And even when it does not have SB, that is offset by fact the Armor gets a 50%-100% boost on top of the DA boost of 100%.  Will often survive long enough to get under cover.

[Akame 4,578]

4 hours ago, LONDON.ENGLAND said:

Congrats. I’ve been trying to get that drone for a long time and opened god knows how many containers. 
personally, I think it’s way better than Hyperion. Probably one of the most OP drones at the moment, as mentioned above though it does use a lot of supplies so make sure you have enough 

Well both have their uses, I personally usually use Hyperion when I don't use Crisis, since at maxed, Hyperion is essentially 24/7 supplies, now say you get EMP'd, if you hide or outlast 5s, you can simply fully supply up again.

Here's a chart of max potential values, I have ignored drone's passive bonus here for simplicity:

Now, yes certain game modes do exist, and many combo set's do exist. But if we talk 9999GS player vs 9999 GS player, if the non crisis is smarter, the crisis will ALWAYS LOSE in a battle to the death scenario.

Currently in the 16v16, effectiveness of Crisis depends on how well the team can distract the enemy, or vice versa, it is not easy to steal off a flag due to having to collect it and come back and capture, requires a long distance of running, and if not even a few of the 16 can shoot you, man they must be bad, or very distracted. If it was 8v8, the crisis has more options, more routes to go through, less unknown damage from behind/left/right taken.

RGB mode however, is pretty doable alone at times in 16v16 if you can drive and avoid damage, since you only need to travel 1 way assuming you get the ball without being damaged. But why would you not start taking damage, does enemy team want to wait? A crisis's main advantage is upon battle join, then the element of surprise or with team backup.

Yes against a player with 1 supply (and a speed boost), a crisis player will do much harm, but against a player with all supplies, a crisis player is killable if played smartly. Most Hopper Crisis players use freeze/emp gauss, so avoid proximity fights or letting one lock you one, and make sure you damage them as much as you can when they are on 'Maximum speed' mode or looking in another direction with 'Maximum damage' mode, to force them to go slow and tank with 'Maximum armor', and that is a deadlock if your team is with you. They are not hard to face if your team works with you, doesn't need to have good chemistry, just be at the right place, in the right time, be at the key points where the crisis players move into.

.........

Meanwhile back to drones; again most of us know that defender is annoying to face, but for a defender, a booster who has a high enough dps for 3s is a pain to deal with, but for only those 3s of active bonus time. Getting hit by AP (assuming AP immunity not hit), is a defender players nightmare, most defender players use emp immunity so they'll change to AP immunity when facing an AP player, (part crisis nightmare, forcing you to play with only max speed/damage). Saboteur is only mainly seen in CTF/RGB games.Whilst SGE may have common mechanic/suppliers on isida dics for score farming. Not been seeing many other drones tbh, the rare trickster/miner drones.

I'd still say it's safe to assume, defender drone is probably the most used in matchmaking, then Booster. Each of these drones does sometimes come with specific sets of combo's to maximise effectiveness, hence why changing the stats for these drones should be thought through thoroughly.

[Maf 32,300]

3 minutes ago, Akame said:

Here's a chart of max potential values, I have ignored drone's passive bonus here for simplicity:

The real advantage of Crisis in a 1v1 cannot be easily measured on paper. Crisis really shines in duels against long reload turrets, because you can take advantage of both MA and MD. Best example is Railgun: equip MA just before he's about to shoot, then switch to MD while he's reloading, and back to MA when he's about to shoot again.

With other turrets speed might be the best choice. If you have a hypothetical scenario where you're fighting a Twins in a huge empty field, all it takes to win is to circle him with MS active and dodge all his shots.

I'd say the other big use of Crisis is for campers. You can simply activate MD, and you effectively have infinite boosted damage, which you can use to snipe people from afar. It's not as powerful as booster, but is not limited to being active just 10% of the time (3s every 30s).

[wolverine848 13,097]

8 minutes ago, Akame said:

Well both have their uses, I personally usually use Hyperion when I don't use Crisis, since at maxed, Hyperion is essentially 24/7 supplies, now say you get EMP'd, if you hide or outlast 5s, you can simply fully supply up again.

Here's a chart of max potential values, I have ignored drone's passive bonus here for simplicity:

Now, yes certain game modes do exist, and many combo set's do exist. But if we talk 9999GS player vs 9999 GS player, if the non crisis is smarter, the crisis will ALWAYS LOSE in a battle to the death scenario.

Currently in the 16v16, effectiveness of Crisis depends on how well the team can distract the enemy, or vice versa, it is not easy to steal off a flag due to having to collect it and come back and capture, requires a long distance of running, and if not even a few of the 16 can shoot you, man they must be bad, or very distracted. If it was 8v8, the crisis has more options, more routes to go through, less unknown damage from behind/left/right taken.

RGB mode however, is pretty doable alone at times in 16v16 if you can drive and avoid damage, since you only need to travel 1 way assuming you get the ball without being damaged. But why would you not start taking damage, does enemy team want to wait? A crisis's main advantage is upon battle join, then the element of surprise or with team backup.

Yes against a player with 1 supply (and a speed boost), a crisis player will do much harm, but against a player with all supplies, a crisis player is killable if played smartly. Most Hopper Crisis players use freeze/emp gauss, so avoid proximity fights or letting one lock you one, and make sure you damage them as much as you can when they are on 'Maximum speed' mode or looking in another direction with 'Maximum damage' mode, to force them to go slow and tank with 'Maximum armor', and that is a deadlock if your team is with you. They are not hard to face if your team works with you, doesn't need to have good chemistry, just be at the right place, in the right time, be at the key points where the crisis players move into.

.........

Meanwhile back to drones; again most of us know that defender is annoying to face, but for a defender, a booster who has a high enough dps for 3s is a pain to deal with, but for only those 3s of active bonus time. Getting hit by AP (assuming AP immunity not hit), is a defender players nightmare, most defender players use emp immunity so they'll change to AP immunity when facing an AP player, (part crisis nightmare, forcing you to play with only max speed/damage). Saboteur is only mainly seen in CTF/RGB games.Whilst SGE may have common mechanic/suppliers on isida dics for score farming. Not been seeing many other drones tbh, the rare trickster/miner drones.

I'd still say it's safe to assume, defender drone is probably the most used in matchmaking, then Booster. Each of these drones does sometimes come with specific sets of combo's to maximise effectiveness, hence why changing the stats for these drones should be thought through thoroughly.

That chart misses the whole point of Crisis.  It is not designed to "stand up and fight".  It is designed for capping, which it does very well - especially in the early stages of a battle where no ODs exist and the extra speed allows it to get to a possibly undefended flag.

[Akame 4,578]

3 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

That chart misses the whole point of Crisis.  It is not designed to "stand up and fight".  It is designed for capping, which it does very well - especially in the early stages of a battle where no ODs exist and the extra speed allows it to get to a possibly undefended flag.

Then stick to playing SGE/TJR/CP, that way you won't have to worry about facing crisis players speeding away from you. I've been grinding CP mode with crusader mainly, ain't no crisis player in my sights but a rare few, but they still die to me.

Also the conclusion does say it's statistically better for a crisis player to evade and escape. Hence me acknowledging that it isn't meant to stand up and fight, yet I mainly used it to stand up and fight.

Edited December 13, 2020 by Akame

[wolverine848 13,097]

4 minutes ago, Akame said:

Then stick to playing SGE/TJR/CP, that way you won't have to worry about facing crisis players speeding away from you. I've been grinding CP mode with crusader mainly, ain't no crisis player in my sights but a rare few, but they still die to me.

Well that sounds like soooo much fun...

I happen to like CTF mode.  The fact TO introduced a broken hull/OD should not mean I have to avoid it.

 

It's not Crisis per say that is the biggest problem.  It Crisis combined with Hopper.  Crisis on wasp or hornet is still formidable.  But on Hopper it's a different level altogether.

Edited December 13, 2020 by wolverine848

[MRL-Missoula 96]

Well, i use the crisis to stand up and fight. As usual i have to carry the team i am with. Yes i have used it to get flags early in the battle. To me, im still experimenting with it

[Akame 4,578]

8 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

Well that sounds like soooo much fun...

I happen to like CTF mode.  The fact TO introduced a broken hull/OD should not mean I have to avoid it.

 

It's not Crisis per say that is the biggest problem.  It Crisis combined with Hopper.  Crisis on wasp or hornet is still formidable.  But on Hopper it's a different level altogether.

Yeah, hopper has a sweet spot, with also having Stun, which is annoying to face, which is why I personally use stun immunity in those games to deal with hoppers, but many players do not have this. But again, the issues in this game mainly boil down on combinations made available to us, making it hard to balance the issue at hand.

But for certain, I believe they can reduce crisis' speed bonus from 70 to 40, I would like to see how it fairs with 30% less speed.
Since changing the mechanics for hovering hulls isn't easy, since there are 2 distinct modes for driving, the html mouse, which has strafing, and the 'ZXC' which doesn't have strafing.

[Akame 4,578]

4 minutes ago, cmirotomill said:

Well, i use the crisis to stand up and fight. As usual i have to carry the team i am with. Yes i have used it to get flags early in the battle. To me, im still experimenting with it

You may be able to sneak early flags if the team doesn't have a designated defence, but after 1 flag, which currently may be a deciding factor in win or lose, getting a 2nd one, past a team which understands, is virtually impossible if they play well. If you manage to keep getting flags, I'm going to be honest here, the enemy clearly has nothing good enough to face you with, or just is playing in a bad manner. Just remember, 2k hp, now many railgun players exist, a couple shafts, so many annoying autocanon/cryo smokies, thunder, magnums, etc and Mines also exist. If an enemy can't even damage you with their ranged players, I just don't know what I can say for the playerbase.

 

Aside from that, It is generally difficult to play proactively with crisis on mobile, I have tried it, it isn't the best for CTF/RGB, I would stick to a defender drone instead.

[wolverine848 13,097]

20 minutes ago, cmirotomill said:

Well, i use the crisis to stand up and fight. As usual i have to carry the team i am with. Yes i have used it to get flags early in the battle. To me, im still experimenting with it

Stand up and fight - Defender IS better.

I put it on my Titan with smoky-incendiary and more often than not place in top-3. And that's me usually getting to mid-field and chewing away at defenders and attackers in Rugby and CTF.

17 minutes ago, Akame said:

Yeah, hopper has a sweet spot, with also having Stun, which is annoying to face, which is why I personally use stun immunity in those games to deal with hoppers, but many players do not have this. But again, the issues in this game mainly boil down on combinations made available to us, making it hard to balance the issue at hand.

But for certain, I believe they can reduce crisis' speed bonus from 70 to 40, I would like to see how it fairs with 30% less speed.
Since changing the mechanics for hovering hulls isn't easy, since there are 2 distinct modes for driving, the html mouse, which has strafing, and the 'ZXC' which doesn't have strafing.

True - not many have stun immunity.  I only have 1 immunity - EMP on my other account.

I don't think you can reduce Crisis SB to 40%.  That's a stock SB, and part of attraction of Crisis is that it gets a boost to whichever supply it has active to compensate for having no ther supplies active.