How bad updates came. What do you think is their point?

[Michael828 816]

Exactly! Instead of burning their resources in the continuous stream of updates that nobody wanted, they could have utilized them to really "develop" the game. Some good games have done this and they're still prevalent in this era. It's all about priority, instead of developing the game Tanki decided to suck whatever there is left.

Well to be fair most of those updates (cosmetics, challenges, wars, containers, limited time offers, etc..) have brought renewed sources of income for tanki, which in turn are used to help keep the game running, and in making the switch from flash to the more optimized engine HTML5.

[Maf 32,300]

Exactly! Instead of burning their resources in the continuous stream of updates that nobody wanted, they could have utilized them to really "develop" the game. Some good games have done this and they're still prevalent in this era. It's all about priority, instead of developing the game Tanki decided to suck whatever there is left.

Now Maf, while mendark27 may have voiced it a bit more forcefully than I would, I have to agree with him. How many years have we been waiting for HTML5? How many updates have they released that they've acknowledged had bugs? How long have we had a client program that is buggy as a dog that hasn't been given a bath in a year? How long have Pony Tail Boy and the Dev's put a low priority on dealing with hackers?  Looks to me like Pony Tail Boy and the Dev crew  really don't care.

 

You have to understand that a careful balance must be maintained between major updates and small changes to keep people interested. AlternativaPlatform are a small team with very little experience of developing actual games. After all, Tanki Online is literally their first major game dev project. They can't just go and do something like converting the game to HTML5 within a couple months. And they also can't just go all hands on deck for this HTML5 task and abandon the game completely in the meantime.

 

If there were no changes in these 2 years while HTML5 is being made, players would really leave and once HTML5 is finally released, it would be met by no more than a couple thousand remaining players. Of course some of those smaller updates ended up being released with bugs, but a bugged update that mostly works is better than no update at all. Devs said it themselves - you can claim all you want about "bad updates making people leave", but the truth remains in numbers - even the most negative and controversial changes in this game resulted in more people playing and improved player retention.

[Dliver 436]

120,000 players or 120,000 accounts? ;)

120,000 peak players online at one time

Edited August 1, 2019 by Dliver

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

120,000 peak players online at one time

It's more accurate to say "accounts" than "players". 

[Dliver 436]

You have to understand that a careful balance must be maintained between major updates and small changes to keep people interested. AlternativaPlatform are a small team with very little experience of developing actual games. After all, Tanki Online is literally their first major game dev project. They can't just go and do something like converting the game to HTML5 within a couple months. And they also can't just go all hands on deck for this HTML5 task and abandon the game completely in the meantime.

 

If there were no changes in these 2 years while HTML5 is being made, players would really leave and once HTML5 is finally released, it would be met by no more than a couple thousand remaining players. Of course some of those smaller updates ended up being released with bugs, but a bugged update that mostly works is better than no update at all. Devs said it themselves - you can claim all you want about "bad updates making people leave", but the truth remains in numbers - even the most negative and controversial changes in this game resulted in more people playing and improved player retention.

1. Game balance is laughable. I do understand the importance to game balance and Pony Tail Boy and the Dev's only give it lip service.

2. You would think that HTML5 would have had a higher priority and an emphasis would have been to hire HTML5 programmers with game experience since it is of such vital importance to the future of the game. But by your own admission they hired a small group of inexperienced game programmers. So it's no wonder It has taken years for even a buggy version to come out.

3. They've had years to make the transition and the only reason they're bringing it out now , with who knows how many bugs, is because of the changes to chrome.

4. The way things are going, there may be only a few thousand players soon.

5. If these buggy updates are helping retain players, then why are the numbers continuing in a downward trend? I mean in every math class I ever attended a smaller number means less of something. So you're absolutely right, the truth is in the numbers and they continue to trend downward.

 

So your arguments are all specious and they have no root in reality.

Edited August 1, 2019 by Dliver

[XxStriker 519]

Player retention is about how many players get past the first few days of play and stay. Nothing about keeping the current players.

[Maf 32,300]

1. Game balance is laughable. I do understand the importance to game balance and Pony Tail Boy and the Dev's only give it lip service.

2. You would think that HTML5 would have had a higher priority and an emphasis would have been to hire HTML5 programmers with game experience since it is of such vital importance to the future of the game. But by your own admission they hired a small group of inexperienced game programmers. So it's no wonder It has taken years for even a buggy version to come out.

3. They've had years to make the transition and the only reason they're bringing it out now , with who knows how many bugs, is because of the changes to chrome.

4. The way things are going, there may be only a few thousand players soon.

5. If these buggy updates are helping retain players, then why are the numbers continuing in a downward trend? I mean in every math class I ever attended a smaller number means less of something. So you're absolutely right, the truth is in the numbers and they continue to trend downward.

 

So your arguments are all specious and they have no root in reality.

I don't know, I feel like balance now is better than ever, especially considering how much more complex it has become compared to years before.

 

You're forgetting about budget. Experienced programmers means employees with a lot of pay. I'm sure if they, as a company, could afford such experts - they'd hire them. But with how small of a business they seem to be, hiring experts doesn't seem to be an option. Also, who's to say that the current devs working in HTML5 are not experts? After all, they are rewriting the game from scratch and there aren't many of them, so that's why it takes a while.

 

The reason they didn't start this earlier (i.e. before 2017) is because back then they were hoping for Unity-based Tanki X to take over from TO. But now that Tanki X didn't turn out to be what they were hoping for and Flash has very quickly started to lose support, they had to start the HTML5 process.

 

When I said that updates help retain players, I didn't mean they stop the loss of players completely. They just help slow it down. To put that in perspective, Tanki was losing popularity fastest during 2015, when there were barely any game updates:

 

[XLG1 67]

When the developer decides to think for the player, these problems are bound to arise.

 

Too many game-nerfing updates to even mention, there should be opinion polls to see if the community likes the update before they occasionally open the test server, and implement it anyway. 

[XLG1 67]

 

 

 the numbers are decreasing "at an expected rate".

Demise of the game is foreshadowed. 

However, as long as the buyer community is consistent, there remains an incentive to keep the game alive. Once the buyer community disappear / the game which was made on the flash engine becomes too hard to maintain, the game will eventually close as they would be unable to cover their costs, i.e making below normal profit. (As Tanki X is a seperate project)

The creation of Tanki X probably meant less development time on the game. In terms of not listening to the players, the same probably can't be said for Tanki X.

 

Not being able to communicate with the devs easily may also be an issue.

 

It appears they have prioritized their own agendas (profit) over user satisfaction, which isn't surprising - I wonder why?...

Edited August 1, 2019 by XLG1

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

Devs said it themselves - you can claim all you want about "bad updates making people leave", but the truth remains in numbers - even the most negative and controversial changes in this game resulted in more people playing and improved player retention.

I wonder why. :huh:  Maybe a psychological thing? :rolleyes:

You're forgetting about budget. Experienced programmers means employees with a lot of pay. I'm sure if they, as a company, could afford such experts - they'd hire them. But with how small of a business they seem to be, hiring experts doesn't seem to be an option. Also, who's to say that the current devs working in HTML5 are not experts? After all, they are rewriting the game from scratch and there aren't many of them, so that's why it takes a while.

 

When I said that updates help retain players, I didn't mean they stop the loss of players completely. They just help slow it down. To put that in perspective, Tanki was losing popularity fastest during 2015, when there were barely any game updates:

Also.... experienced programmers means Alternativa may have to cut down reward we get as F2P to encourage us to throw dollars for them. :(

 

I remember a game named Pixel Gun 3D that was once F2P. However, at one version when the developer updated the game that cuts off almost everything we can get for free. They did this back in 2014 b/c of the country's economy is at stake. At the same time, it backfired them.

 

Pixel Gun almost got shut down until another developer (Cubic. Game) is willing to babysit it. They 1st buffed weapons real hard while severely powercrept the others. This leads to massive # negative reviews until version 15.1.xx, they finally rebalanced weapons, less P2W, more fair battles etc. And nowadays... Cubic finally managed to babysit the game in a healthy manner.

 

Shortly after, the leading game designer admitted that Cubic is no large business just like Alternativa.

[The-Operator219 1,929]

I thought it almost got shut down because it blatantly copied Minecraft's enemies and a few weapons.

[Guest]

I remember a game named Pixel Gun 3D

oof, nostalgia overload. 

 

bring back PGW  :ph34r:

Edited August 2, 2019 by Guest

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

I thought it almost got shut down because it blatantly copied Minecraft's enemies and a few weapons.

Well yes, I play the game back in 2014 and still playing it nowadays. Pixel Gun almost got shutdown TWICE actually.

 

oof, nostalgia overload. 

 

bring back PGW  :ph34r:

LOL. :)

[u812ic 1,629]

You have to understand that a careful balance must be maintained between major updates and small changes to keep people interested. AlternativaPlatform are a small team with very little experience of developing actual games. After all, Tanki Online is literally their first major game dev project. They can't just go and do something like converting the game to HTML5 within a couple months. And they also can't just go all hands on deck for this HTML5 task and abandon the game completely in the meantime.

 

If there were no changes in these 2 years while HTML5 is being made, players would really leave and once HTML5 is finally released, it would be met by no more than a couple thousand remaining players. Of course some of those smaller updates ended up being released with bugs, but a bugged update that mostly works is better than no update at all. Devs said it themselves - you can claim all you want about "bad updates making people leave", but the truth remains in numbers - even the most negative and controversial changes in this game resulted in more people playing and improved player retention.

AlternativaPlatform is not mentioned in the EULA anymore. It's APL Publishing LLC. Are they both the same company?

 

A few months ago, I made a blanket statement and one of the Mods corrected me by saying that there are two different teams working on the game. One team is working on HTML5 and the other team is trying to keep Tanki alive.

[Nimit444 23]

I won't explain it all in detail, because developers' logic and arguments for these updates has been told many times in the past. You're very late with that discussion. But here's a brief summary:

1. Shortening battles - this is to make the game more suitable for mobile phones, which are often used in situations where you don't have 10-15 minutes to sit in one place and concentrate on the game. It's also beneficial for players, since you finish battles faster and therefore get stars more often.

You got this point partially wrong. Mobile users must have a separate list of battles visible only to players playing on mobile. Why would you want to compete with someone playing on PC and has better access to keyboard/mouse, etc. Just like there are two PUBG's. 1. PUBG PC & PUBG Mobile. If developers are actually working to balance the game at its best then how could they have missed this?

 

Developers should start listening to the players. Gone are the days when the game used to hit 30k+ players at working days. I came back in 2019 only to see crap like Matchmaking system where you can't select your own map and that you can't create PRO battles anymore for missions.

 

Tanki was extremely P2P back in 2014-16, though it has now reduced to a minimum, its still P2P. I admit fueling my gameplay by buying Premium membership, but that is not cheap, they must reduce prices slightly specially on Kits & Battle Pass.

 

Fix the game, bring back the nostalgia.

Better late than never.

Edited August 4, 2019 by Nimit444

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

1) You got this point partially wrong. Mobile users must have a separate list of battles visible only to players playing on mobile. Why would you want to compete with someone playing on PC and has better access to keyboard/mouse, etc. Just like there are two PUBG's. 1. PUBG PC & PUBG Mobile. If developers are actually working to balance the game at its best then how could they have missed this?

 

2) Developers should start listening to the players. Gone are the days when the game used to hit 30k+ players at working days. I came back in 2019 only to see crap like Matchmaking system where you can't select your own map and that you can't create PRO battles anymore for missions.

 

3) Tanki was extremely P2P back in 2014-16, though it has now reduced to a minimum, its still P2P. I admit fueling my gameplay by buying Premium membership, but that is not cheap, they must reduce prices slightly specially on Kits & Battle Pass.

 

4) Fix the game, bring back the nostalgia.

Better late than never.

1) I heard they put mobile players in with the PC players because it "reduces waiting times". It's stupid I know but whatever.

 

2) well maybe not all of the players but maybe the most reasonable ones. Also are you sure it was 30k players and not 30k accounts?

 

3) if it was P2P, we would have to pay just to login. And it's definitely not that, might be a bit P2W though. But it pales in comparison to 2014 and maybe before.

 

4) and what kind of nostalgia do you have in mind?

[Maf 32,300]

AlternativaPlatform is not mentioned in the EULA anymore. It's APL Publishing LLC. Are they both the same company?

 

A few months ago, I made a blanket statement and one of the Mods corrected me by saying that there are two different teams working on the game. One team is working on HTML5 and the other team is trying to keep Tanki alive.

I don't know about APL Publishing - first time I hear of it.

 

Sounds about right regarding two teams. I think it's exactly like that.

[Maf 32,300]

You got this point partially wrong. Mobile users must have a separate list of battles visible only to players playing on mobile. Why would you want to compete with someone playing on PC and has better access to keyboard/mouse, etc. Just like there are two PUBG's. 1. PUBG PC & PUBG Mobile.

PUBG can actually allow themselves to do that because they have a large player base. Tanki cannot, because if they divide their players even further into two groups, waiting times for MM will get even longer and some game modes will be completely unplayable at certain times of day.

[wolverine848 13,097]

PUBG can actually allow themselves to do that because they have a large player base. Tanki cannot, because if they divide their players even further into two groups, waiting times for MM will get even longer and some game modes will be completely unplayable at certain times of day.

Move JUG, ASL and RGBY to Pro-Battles and waiting time issue solved.   Those battle-modes are non-core and usually have the lowest amount of players anyway.   Too many battle-modes thins out the player-base too much.

[Maf 32,300]

Move JUG, ASL and RGBY to Pro-Battles and waiting time issue solved.   Those battle-modes are non-core and usually have the lowest amount of players anyway.   Too many battle-modes thins out the player-base too much.

I agree. I think that DM, CTF, CP and maybe TDM should always be available, while the other game modes should be on a rotation basis, switching out every week/month.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

Move JUG, ASL and RGBY to Pro-Battles and waiting time issue solved.   Those battle-modes are non-core and usually have the lowest amount of players anyway.   Too many battle-modes thins out the player-base too much.

  

I agree. I think that DM, CTF, CP and maybe TDM should always be available, while the other game modes should be on a rotation basis, switching out every week/month.

I don't think moving juggernaut, Rugby and Asl to pro battles will have much effect on MM.

 

We need to take it a step further and merge TDM, CTF, CP, Asl, and rugby all into on game mode for MM only. Current version of ASL should be renamed to Attackers VS Defenders (AVD), while this newly merged game mode will be the new ASL.

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

Move JUG, ASL and RGBY to Pro-Battles and waiting time issue solved. 

No.

[Picassoo 134]

I just watched a WoT vs WT video. One guy wrote a comment mentioning Tanki.

Guess what? A lot of people answered there, and pretty much all of them agreed that TO died in 2014/15. Some pointed at 2016.

 

Look at TO reviews on steam, or answers under the announcement regarding MM intriduction. Also removing the option of creating standard battles.

 

There is no way to argue that today's TO is better than it used to be or that updates are keeping it alive. It simply isn't true.

[Picassoo 134]

3) if it was P2P, we would have to pay just to login. And it's definitely not that, might be a bit P2W though. But it pales in comparison to 2014 and maybe before.

The guy mixed up the terms. He meant 'P2W' for sure.

4) and what kind of nostalgia do you have in mind?

Too obvious that what he meant was bringing back old Tanki.

 

Given that noticing this should be easy regardless of how intelligent you are, I assume you are mocking this guy.

 

Why is that? You think all people know good English?

Edited August 6, 2019 by Picassoo

[u812ic 1,629]

 

I just watched a WoT vs WT video. One guy wrote a comment mentioning Tanki.

Guess what? A lot of people answered there, and pretty much all of them agreed that TO died in 2014/15. Some pointed at 2016.

 

Look at TO reviews on steam, or answers under the announcement regarding MM intriduction. Also removing the option of creating standard battles.

 

There is no way to argue that today's TO is better than it used to be or that updates are keeping it alive. It simply isn't true.

 

A few players have said that the only thing keeping them from going over to WoT is respawning. In WoT, once you're dead, you're dead. But you can either watch the rest of the battle in viewer mode or go back to the garage, grab another tank and enter a different battle.

Edited August 6, 2019 by u812ic