Pair freeze and firebird buffs with Hull Alts Update

[sensei_tanker 3,098]

Well, now hull alts are going to be in the game, firebird and freeze are getting nerfed hard in the form of burning and freezing resistance. Are the developers going to release a counterbalance to the nerf against these two turrets specifically? 

[featwasath 267]

I think it's too early to predict that. Developers might (or might not) increase the damage of these 2 turrets as a counter. Let's consider the 2 possibilities. 

1st possibility - Majority of the players won't waste their crystals on these 2 alterations. So, the number of OP players are very less, so developers will just keep things as they are without changing anything of these2 turrets.

2nd possibility - Majority of the players will buy these 2 alterations & they'll become OP. So, developers will increase the damage of these 2 turrets to balance this.

It's also possible that about 50% of active players buy these 2 alterations, making things more complex 

[Gauss-Hornet 489]

1 minute ago, featwasath said:

Majority of the players won't waste their crystals on these 2 alterations.

Going with the flow, this is a great presumption. We don't even know whether these alts will be available for crystals.

[Maf 32,300]

You know, since it's an alteration,  then maybe it will have a disadvantage to it as well? But on the other hand, it might actually be fine because right now a single Firebird module protects from both raw damage and burning, while after the update it will only protect from damage, so they will still burn well unless they also have the fire resistance/immunity alt.

[coconuttree 519]

12 hours ago, Gauss-Hornet said:

Going with the flow, this is a great presumption. We don't even know whether these alts will be available for crystals.

I think they confirmed it would be for crystals.

 

Also, this stuff is still under development, so maybe we should wait until it gets closer to release before we make demands like this. I'm pretty sure they are not gonna release immunity alterations with out a drawback.

[fishFAST 24]

i personally don't believe melee turrets should even be in the game, so minimalizing them better than nothing

[E_polypterus 2,374]

1 hour ago, fishFAST said:

i personally don't believe melee turrets should even be in the game, so minimalizing them better than nothing

And why is that? 

[sensei_tanker 3,098]

11 hours ago, fishFAST said:

i personally don't believe melee turrets should even be in the game, so minimalizing them better than nothing

i personally don't believe that shaft or magnum or gauss should even be in the game (anything that can easily one shot... and I use two of them). Your point is?

[wolverine848 13,097]

On 4/17/2020 at 3:46 PM, Maf said:

You know, since it's an alteration,  then maybe it will have a disadvantage to it as well? But on the other hand, it might actually be fine because right now a single Firebird module protects from both raw damage and burning, while after the update it will only protect from damage, so they will still burn well unless they also have the fire resistance/immunity alt.

So this would be a nerf to those modules then.  Hardly seems fair to players who have invested in them.

[fishFAST 24]

16 hours ago, fishFAST said:

i personally don't believe melee turrets should even be in the game, so minimalizing them better than nothing

they have a time to kill that is way too low and their effective range is way too high. running into a firebird that's less than 5 wasp tanks away for 2 seconds guarantees death. there is no way to run away. the only option is to avoid being on their side of the map.

a healing turret shouldn't be in the game. if there are more than 1 on one team, they are almost impossible to take down. there shouldn't even be repair kits. healing is no fun when the time to kill is already high like it is in tanki.

don't you wonder why they're not in pro play?

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

17 minutes ago, fishFAST said:

they have a time to kill that is way too low and their effective range is way too high. running into a firebird that's less than 5 wasp tanks away for 2 seconds guarantees death. there is no way to run away. the only option is to avoid being on their side of the map.

A turret that has melee range has too much effective range? 

 

They have to get near their face to deal good damage, while other turrets can destroy them from a distance. 

 

19 minutes ago, fishFAST said:

a healing turret shouldn't be in the game. if there are more than 1 on one team, they are almost impossible to take down. there shouldn't even be repair kits. healing is no fun when the time to kill is already high like it is in tanki.

You just took the rationale for nerfing Isida's healing and boosted it lol. 

[wolverine848 13,097]

22 minutes ago, fishFAST said:

they have a time to kill that is way too low and their effective range is way too high. running into a firebird that's less than 5 wasp tanks away for 2 seconds guarantees death. there is no way to run away. the only option is to avoid being on their side of the map.

a healing turret shouldn't be in the game. if there are more than 1 on one team, they are almost impossible to take down. there shouldn't even be repair kits. healing is no fun when the time to kill is already high like it is in tanki.

don't you wonder why they're not in pro play?

How do you run away from a Hornet equipped with Gauss or Magnum or Rail or Vulcan?    (you wouldn't happen to have any of those.. would you?)

[sensei_tanker 3,098]

3 hours ago, fishFAST said:

they have a time to kill that is way too low and their effective range is way too high. running into a firebird that's less than 5 wasp tanks away for 2 seconds guarantees death. there is no way to run away. the only option is to avoid being on their side of the map.

a healing turret shouldn't be in the game. if there are more than 1 on one team, they are almost impossible to take down. there shouldn't even be repair kits. healing is no fun when the time to kill is already high like it is in tanki.

don't you wonder why they're not in pro play?

 

[Guest]

Please tell me this is an out of season april fools joke.

[fishFAST 24]

1 hour ago, sensei_tanker said:

 

 

[sensei_tanker 3,098]

3 hours ago, SamGamgee55 said:

Please tell me this is an out of season april fools joke.

Well... it's not.

[aqwzsxedc 699]

On 4/17/2020 at 5:08 PM, sensei_tanker said:

Well, now hull alts are going to be in the game, firebird and freeze are getting nerfed hard in the form of burning and freezing resistance. Are the developers going to release a counterbalance to the nerf against these two turrets specifically? 

For immunity, i think it'll be good counter for freeze mostly (juggernaut mode to be more specific with those Wasp freeze aftershock that i hate the most in that mode); not much for firebird tho since one of the most effective ways to use it is with the incendiary mix alteration and hornet that melts you before you realize what happened anyways.

For resistance, you got a point there honestly; if those alterations are for all Hulls and not just wasp then it is just matter of time before everyone gets to buy them on their frequent hulls (you guessed it, hornet & titan ) and literally have 4 protection modules, pushing Vulcan and other turret to outperform freeze and firebird even more. And NO i'm not saying Vulcan is OP, it's doing great just because of the two hulls with their infamous overdrives.

Unless, they're planning to make resistances against all turrets... this will be a total different thing

PS: hopefully they'd make them sooo expensive that i won't have to see them any time soon after their release

[wolverine848 13,097]

38 minutes ago, aqwzsxedc said:

S: hopefully they'd make them sooo expensive that i won't have to see them any time soon after their release

So... increased P2W since only buyers would be able to afford them.

[aqwzsxedc 699]

6 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

So... increased P2W since only buyers would be able to afford them.

Nice try but no. If the alterations cost is with crystals, then it's not P2W. We're talking about a fourth protection module that can go to 50%, if you wanted it at the cost of 100 crystals then i'm sorry but that's illogical.

[Gauss-Hornet 489]

1 hour ago, aqwzsxedc said:

We're talking about a fourth protection module that can go to 50%.

No we're not. Hull alterations only provide immunity to status effects, they don't decrease standard damage from the turrets and are thus not the "fourth protection module".

Heck, the developers test out the working of Hull alterations providing status effect resistance along with 50% protection (most probably to check whether they're able to work separately and 'cuz current modules already provide a percentage of protection against status effects), and they do so only on Wasp; and then people start theorizing about 4th modules and Wasp-only resistance alterations. 

[aqwzsxedc 699]

22 minutes ago, Gauss-Hornet said:

No we're not. Hull alterations only provide immunity to status effects, they don't decrease standard damage from the turrets and are thus not the "fourth protection module".

If you're willing to scroll up just a little, you'd find me speaking about the immunity that you mentioned

[wolverine848 13,097]

2 hours ago, aqwzsxedc said:

Nice try but no. If the alterations cost is with crystals, then it's not P2W. We're talking about a fourth protection module that can go to 50%, if you wanted it at the cost of 100 crystals then i'm sorry but that's illogical.

I never said anything about 100 crystals.

But the more expensive you make it, the harder it is for F2P tankers to get it - they are on "fixed budgets".  Introduce more and more items that affect gameplay (like drones) and the F2P tankers can't buy it all.  They have to choose.  MU current items or buy new module or buy drone or MU drone or ... buy new hull alteration.

Buyers do not have to choose - they can have all of the above.  + / + / + / + is  >>>  than or / or / or / or

Drones are available for crystals - but buyers have more drones, better drones and higher-ugraded drones because the good drones are priced at higher end of spectrum.  Will be the same thing with your suggestion to price hull alterations that way. Realistically the only ones to afford that are buyers.

[Reddkuest 48]

On 4/17/2020 at 1:35 PM, featwasath said:

I think it's too early to predict that. Developers might (or might not) increase the damage of these 2 turrets as a counter. Let's consider the 2 possibilities. 

1st possibility - Majority of the players won't waste their crystals on these 2 alterations. So, the number of OP players are very less, so developers will just keep things as they are without changing anything of these2 turrets.

2nd possibility - Majority of the players will buy these 2 alterations & they'll become OP. So, developers will increase the damage of these 2 turrets to balance this.

It's also possible that about 50% of active players buy these 2 alterations, making things more complex 

Smart, competitive players will jump like a plague of locusts on any alteration and/or combo that can be made OP (they do it already) and use it.

[aqwzsxedc 699]

2 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

I never said anything about 100 crystals.

But the more expensive you make it, the harder it is for F2P tankers to get it - they are on "fixed budgets".  Introduce more and more items that affect gameplay (like drones) and the F2P tankers can't buy it all.  They have to choose.  MU current items or buy new module or buy drone or MU drone or ... buy new hull alteration.

Buyers do not have to choose - they can have all of the above.  + / + / + / + is  >>>  than or / or / or / or

Drones are available for crystals - but buyers have more drones, better drones and higher-ugraded drones because the good drones are priced at higher end of spectrum.  Will be the same thing with your suggestion to price hull alterations that way. Realistically the only ones to afford that are buyers.

Yeah make no mistake, I do indeed understand your point. The problem here is that the term "P2W" is just misused so much in this game it's insane...

If you CANT AT ALL buy it unless you spend real money, then yes sure I'd agree. Earning crystals is waaaay easier now than before and believe it or not i'm not kidding.

Yes there may be some balance issues at the moment, but that's every game's issue. Back to your point, you do not need all drones, one and max it is way sufficient, i don't understand why would you try getting all of them... By the way, just between the two of us and please answer this honestly: What is the average player would be planning to do once his garage is fully Micro upgraded? At first he'd just play for fun and buy tons of supplies, go parkour etc... But without a goal (a hull to max, a drone to look for etc..), he'll eventually get bored and leave.

You can not expect a game to even exist without buyers on it, and don't forget they are spending real money and expecting something from it; What buyers can buy and non-buyers can't (practically speaking) are the skins (XT, legacy etc...). I know they are on containers, but the chance of getting them is just too small.

To conclude my text wall, there is a paradox in games which is: If developers update the game very often, some players might find it hard to keep up and would just complain. But if the developers don't update the game very often, the players complain "the game is dead, developers don't care"...

I'm not saying every single update TO has made is great, but not saying bad either; I just want you to look at the terms "P2W" and "F2P" differently

[wolverine848 13,097]

Just now, aqwzsxedc said:

Yeah make no mistake, I do indeed understand your point. The problem here is that the term "P2W" is just misused so much in this game it's insane...

If you CANT AT ALL buy it unless you spend real money, then yes sure I'd agree. Earning crystals is waaaay easier now than before and believe it or not i'm not kidding.

Yes there may be some balance issues at the moment, but that's every game's issue. Back to your point, you do not need all drones, one and max it is way sufficient, i don't understand why would you try getting all of them... By the way, just between the two of us and please answer this honestly: What is the average player would be planning to do once his garage is fully Micro upgraded? At first he'd just play for fun and buy tons of supplies, go parkour etc... But without a goal (a hull to max, a drone to look for etc..), he'll eventually get bored and leave.

You can not expect a game to even exist without buyers on it, and don't forget they are spending real money and expecting something from it; What buyers can buy and non-buyers can't (practically speaking) are the skins (XT, legacy etc...). I know they are on containers, but the chance of getting them is just too small.

To conclude my text wall, there is a paradox in games which is: If developers update the game very often, some players might find it hard to keep up and would just complain. But if the developers don't update the game very often, the players complain "the game is dead, developers don't care"...

I'm not saying every single update TO has made is great, but not saying bad either; I just want you to look at the terms "P2W" and "F2P" differently

Don't misunderstand me - I don't expect the game to exist without buyers either.

But to suggest something that will have a drastic effect on the game (immunity to freeze effect) should be priced very high will indeed "price it out of the market" for F2P tankers.

When you do that, you are creating a bigger gap between buers and non-buyers.  The more new items introduced - that affect gameplay - the bigger the gap.

I really think items like immunity are a huge mistake.  Could create a huge imbalance on par with the m2.1o-to-mk7.0 coversion.  Big difference is that conversion was  one-time-thing.  These hull alterations would be perpetual.  Not to mention the frustration from players who have invested in Freez turret or Hunter (if EMP immunity applies to that)

 

Maxed garage for "average player"?  Is average player non-buyer?

Once I hit Legend I started a new account with mostly different items.  So I'm still working up my Legend account garage while my 2nd account just ranked to General.

Takes years just to get 1 account with 3-4 combos close to max level.  I started in 2015 and I'm still working on it.