freeze: once fabulous now frigging useless

[sharifsahaf 656]

im going to ask you all a simple question .nowadays,in battles what melee range turrets do you see used the most?in my opinion firebird is the most used (and i can understand that as it is easier to use than freeze which requires skills and experience ).here's the thing after firebird the most used melee turret is isida  .yes yes  you all heard me correctly -isida .but just 2-3 yers ago there were as many freeze users as firebird .what happened ?simply put firebird depends on  it's afterburn to finish tanks off (unless you have incendiary mix) and freeze?it depends on it's freezing ability one which has been rendered almost useless due to the fact that turret slowdown for frozen tanks has been reduced to 10 percent (i'm not sure if that's the correct percentage) .so now even if you use shock freeze ,one just has to stop moving the hull,just rotate the turret and hit u in the face .if it's anything like a rico with plasmatorch or a firebird with compact fuel or incendiary mix ,simply put -don't waste your supplies trying to kill them you're screwed .the turret slowdown should be raised to 50 percent at least .yes-at least .its dps is decent enough and a 50 percent turret slowdown for frozen tanks  would make it quite balanced .do you agree with me or not ?let me know below

[Viking4s 10,791]

Firebird and gaus on the top list, but freeze when it is there is is a pain. It is potent but un-derated, freezing people is less appealing than burning them.

[T879 151]

3 hours ago, Viking4s said:

Firebird and gaus on the top list, but freeze when it is there is is a pain. It is potent but un-derated, freezing people is less appealing than burning them.

Also considering that Cryo Immunity makes Freeze completely not-so-useful, whereas Firebird has Incendiary Mix, which can put a dent into people's HP despite Fire Immunity  And Corrosive Mix is... mhmmm

[Toby 2,938]

Close to no one actually uses Freeze without its immensely overpowering Shock Freeze alt (99% of Freeze users do), so, no, until that gets nerfed, stock Freeze doesn't require any buff (or maybe in general, even).
And I'm speaking from hundreds upon hundreds battles of experience.

It's also worth mentioning that Freeze is one of the only two stock turrets that require you to have 2 different protection types (1 module and 1 hull alt) equipped in order to effectively protect yourself against them, and its counter hull alts are worth either 245 000 crystals or 4 990 tankoins, which isn't little (and to many players, even unavailable at all).

[E_polypterus 2,374]

2 hours ago, ControlledChaos said:

Close to no one actually uses Freeze without its immensely overpowering Shock Freeze alt (99% of Freeze users do), so, no, until that gets nerfed, stock Freeze doesn't require any buff (or maybe in general, even).
And I'm speaking from hundreds upon hundreds battles of experience.

It's also worth mentioning that Freeze is one of the only two stock turrets that require you to have 2 different protection types (1 module and 1 hull alt) equipped in order to effectively protect yourself against them, and its counter hull alts are worth either 245 000 crystals or 4 990 tankoins, which isn't little (and to many players, even unavailable at all).

I don’t think that’s entirely correct. Yes most players use shock freeze(I prefer stock tho) but it still isn’t that effective as the enemies turret can turn easily. Freeze was made to freeze enemies and get away with a flag or things like that not only killing, that’s its speciality.

Nerfing it to just 10% speed loss was too harsh and has made it too easy to counter. 60-70% speed loss would be more preferable unlike before which was 90% I think. Then maybe shock freeze should get a nerf like; 50% dmg decrease or something like that. 

Freeze does need a buff. If not then what about firebird? It’s especially OP with compact fuel tanks. That definitely needs a big nerf.

Edited May 28, 2020 by E_polypterus

[StopChasingMe 50]

Vulcan will be the most used sooner or later unless it gets nerfed

Edited May 28, 2020 by StopChasingMe

[Toby 2,938]

5 hours ago, E_polypterus said:

 

Shock Freezes freeze you rock-solid within a fraction of a second, with a -50% decreased energy consumption (which completely overrides the intended -30% damage nerf (which should be more like -50% by default)), with no effort whatsoever or any major engagement on their part, and are usually used in conjunction with Wasp and its overdrive, basically meaning that if the opponents' team has Shock Freeze(s) in their base, the battle has pretty much ended before it even started. It's definitely not "not that effective" as you believe it to be, and is currently one of the most devastating turret alterations in the game. Even if you manage to destroy a Shock Freeze mid-attack (regardless of its length), you'll be frozen and unable to move so much so that they'll just come back for you for round two after respawning, after which they (or their teammates usually) will easily be able to finish you off with the flag / ball anyway, and no amount of drones and whatnot will help. Getting frozen for even a fraction of a second will inevitably get you destroyed before you'll even be able to think of escaping the enemies' base, with basically zero effort on their part. I play MM battles a ton, and that's just how it objectively is.

[wolverine848 13,097]

5 hours ago, E_polypterus said:

I don’t think that’s entirely correct. Yes most players use shock freeze(I prefer stock tho) but it still isn’t that effective as the enemies turret can turn easily.

Plenty of them in Legend battles lately and they are hard to resist.  They do well in the battles I've played in.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

6 hours ago, ControlledChaos said:

Shock Freezes freeze you rock-solid within a fraction of a second, with a -50% decreased energy consumption (which completely overrides the intended -30% damage nerf (which should be more like -50% by default)), with no effort whatsoever or any major engagement on their part, and are usually used in conjunction with Wasp and its overdrive, basically meaning that if the opponents' team has Shock Freeze(s) in their base, the battle has pretty much ended before it even started. It's definitely not "not that effective" as you believe it to be, and is currently one of the most devastating turret alterations in the game. Even if you manage to destroy a Shock Freeze mid-attack (regardless of its length), you'll be frozen and unable to move so much so that they'll just come back for you for round two after respawning, after which they (or their teammates usually) will easily be able to finish you off with the flag / ball anyway, and no amount of drones and whatnot will help. Getting frozen for even a fraction of a second will inevitably get you destroyed before you'll even be able to think of escaping the enemies' base, with basically zero effort on their part. I play MM battles a ton, and that's just how it objectively is.

Still pales in comparison to what firebird can do. Not to mention that up against immunity alts, freeze has only a weak bypass in the form of corrosive mix, while firebird has an insanely OP bypass called incendiary mix.

Also if you're camping in your teams base, you're frozen by a freeze but it's dead, you can just wait for it to thaw, while firebird can burn you and unless you use a repair kit, it's afterburner will just kill you.

[sharifsahaf 656]

7 hours ago, ControlledChaos said:

Shock Freezes freeze you rock-solid within a fraction of a second, with a -50% decreased energy consumption (which completely overrides the intended -30% damage nerf (which should be more like -50% by default)), with no effort whatsoever or any major engagement on their part, and are usually used in conjunction with Wasp and its overdrive, basically meaning that if the opponents' team has Shock Freeze(s) in their base, the battle has pretty much ended before it even started. It's definitely not "not that effective" as you believe it to be, and is currently one of the most devastating turret alterations in the game. Even if you manage to destroy a Shock Freeze mid-attack (regardless of its length), you'll be frozen and unable to move so much so that they'll just come back for you for round two after respawning, after which they (or their teammates usually) will easily be able to finish you off with the flag / ball anyway, and no amount of drones and whatnot will help. Getting frozen for even a fraction of a second will inevitably get you destroyed before you'll even be able to think of escaping the enemies' base, with basically zero effort on their part. I play MM battles a ton, and that's just how it objectively is.

shock freeze costs 245000 crystals now . i'm talking about stock freeze .if stock freeze was better maybe not all of the freeze players would use shock freeze .even with shock freeze's overpowering freezing ability u can just casually turn the turret around ,face them ,activate dd and wreck them .slowdown should be increased to a minimum of 50 percent cause if u use shock freeze ,leave someone frozen in your base and die and your teammates kill him then why would people even wanna buy freeze let alone spend another 245000 on an alt that can only be used for defense .and shock freeze is the only viable alt for freeze to use .the remaining two are crap

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

1 hour ago, sharifsahaf said:

shock freeze costs 245000 crystals now . i'm talking about stock freeze .if stock freeze was better maybe not all of the freeze players would use shock freeze .even with shock freeze's overpowering freezing ability u can just casually turn the turret around ,face them ,activate dd and wreck them .slowdown should be increased to a minimum of 50 percent cause if u use shock freeze ,leave someone frozen in your base and die and your teammates kill him then why would people even wanna buy freeze let alone spend another 245000 on an alt that can only be used for defense .and shock freeze is the only viable alt for freeze to use .the remaining two are crap

Only thing I disagree with is claiming that high pressure pump for freeze is bad. I would actually rate it even higher than stock freeze. The only alteration for freeze that's really not worth having is the corrosive mix.

[E_polypterus 2,374]

2 hours ago, sharifsahaf said:

shock freeze costs 245000 crystals now . i'm talking about stock freeze .if stock freeze was better maybe not all of the freeze players would use shock freeze .even with shock freeze's overpowering freezing ability u can just casually turn the turret around ,face them ,activate dd and wreck them .slowdown should be increased to a minimum of 50 percent cause if u use shock freeze ,leave someone frozen in your base and die and your teammates kill him then why would people even wanna buy freeze let alone spend another 245000 on an alt that can only be used for defense .and shock freeze is the only viable alt for freeze to use .the remaining two are crap

Ikr. Before the freeze nerf there were hardly any users with shock freeze. 

[E_polypterus 2,374]

1 hour ago, DieselPlatinum said:

Only thing I disagree with is claiming that high pressure pump for freeze is bad. I would actually rate it even higher than stock freeze. The only alteration for freeze that's really not worth having is the corrosive mix.

Yes. I never use shock freeze (tho that’s cuz I don’t have it : / )

And many people say that it’s good for defense. Though it is I would say high pressure pump is more effective cuz of the extra range. Shock and stock freeze sometimes may not be able to reach the enemy to freeze in time.  I’ve tried defending with both in maps like Brest, Serpuhov and Wave and I think high pressure pump is better in defense. Tho in maps like silence shock freeze is good.

Shock freeze would have been better at attacking if not for that nerf. 

 

[sharifsahaf 656]

2 hours ago, DieselPlatinum said:

Only thing I disagree with is claiming that high pressure pump for freeze is bad. I would actually rate it even higher than stock freeze. The only alteration for freeze that's really not worth having is the corrosive mix.

that might be true .personally i like the cone angle but i guess long -range isn't bad .maybe i'll try it out .

[HappyFace 63]

Highly recommend using smoky's cryo-rounds. they're a sleeper on objective gametypes. i've "assisted" on returning flags/balls byfreezing enemies across the map many times 

[TheCongoSpider 8,943]

On 5/28/2020 at 5:10 PM, ControlledChaos said:

 

The only Shock Freezes I see doing well score-wise are the ones that go out capturing flags and rugby balls. The others are either on Viking and providing good support for the attackers and coming in the middle of the team or the ones that are on defence and coming last place. 

 

Whenever there is a Shock Freeze defending and I don't have a relevant mission or another tier in the Challenge to get, I'll give them the flag to capture (or defenders in general because they barely get score if enemies can't even make it to our base). 

 

On 5/28/2020 at 5:10 PM, ControlledChaos said:

Even if you manage to destroy a Shock Freeze mid-attack (regardless of its length), you'll be frozen and unable to move so much so that they'll just come back for you for round two after respawning, after which they (or their teammates usually) will easily be able to finish you off with the flag / ball anyway, and no amount of drones and whatnot will help. 

I had always noticed that before the first Shock Freeze buff, enemies that were frozen by them would defrost faster than enemies frozen by a Stock Freeze. So if you were to kill them before they killed you, you'd be back at maximum speed faster than if a Stock Freeze froze you. I found it weird but kind of fitting at the time. 

 

I agree that Shock Freeze allows for great teamplay. It's taking Freeze's mechanic and upgrading it. Perfect tool for defense, and even solo defense with the damage buff it received. But the thing is, even with the damage buff, it's not that great because enemies can still move at 80% of their turrets speed. More often you'd want more damage to kill the target faster. With less damage, you're allowing the enemy more time to kill you. The same thing with pre-rework SSR. While you get a faster spin-up and spin-down time and allowed to shoot longer before you overheat, your damage was decreased by 15%. It allowed more time for the enemies to kill you and there were situations where Stock Vulcan would have allowed me to survive where SSR couldn't.  

On 5/28/2020 at 5:10 PM, ControlledChaos said:

Getting frozen for even a fraction of a second will inevitably get you destroyed before you'll even be able to think of escaping the enemies' base, with basically zero effort on their part. I play MM battles a ton, and that's just how it objectively is.

I agree if you're in the enemy base. Anywhere else that doesn't have enemies isn't bad unless someone is running away with your team's flag and you can't catch them. 

 

Shock Freeze is one of the fun alterations in my opinion. It was more fun when you could actually freeze enemy turrets. I remember some happenings in the Test Server before the buff where I started freezing someone with 50% Freeze protection and suddenly they self-destructed. And they kept doing that every time I tried to slowly kill them. Very smart move from those two players. I didn't get to do that on the real server since it had gotten buffed and the Shock Freezes I saw would stick to you because they can actually deal good damage now. 

[G-92 104]

On 5/28/2020 at 9:34 AM, sharifsahaf said:

im going to ask you all a simple question .nowadays,in battles what melee range turrets do you see used the most?in my opinion firebird is the most used (and i can understand that as it is easier to use than freeze which requires skills and experience ).here's the thing after firebird the most used melee turret is isida  .yes yes  you all heard me correctly -isida .but just 2-3 yers ago there were as many freeze users as firebird .what happened ?simply put firebird depends on  it's afterburn to finish tanks off (unless you have incendiary mix) and freeze?it depends on it's freezing ability one which has been rendered almost useless due to the fact that turret slowdown for frozen tanks has been reduced to 10 percent (i'm not sure if that's the correct percentage) .so now even if you use shock freeze ,one just has to stop moving the hull,just rotate the turret and hit u in the face .if it's anything like a rico with plasmatorch or a firebird with compact fuel or incendiary mix ,simply put -don't waste your supplies trying to kill them you're screwed .the turret slowdown should be raised to 50 percent at least .yes-at least .its dps is decent enough and a 50 percent turret slowdown for frozen tanks  would make it quite balanced .do you agree with me or not ?let me know below

shock freeze is now null and void its useless. was a waste of time buying the alt for cry. the devs do like to play there games on the players; make a great alt everyone gets it give it a few mnths then nerf the crap out of it. not a bad way to make money i suppose. make a combo great then nerf it and move onto the next one.    

[G-92 104]

On 5/28/2020 at 3:13 PM, ControlledChaos said:

Close to no one actually uses Freeze without its immensely overpowering Shock Freeze alt (99% of Freeze users do), so, no, until that gets nerfed, stock Freeze doesn't require any buff (or maybe in general, even).
And I'm speaking from hundreds upon hundreds battles of experience.

It's also worth mentioning that Freeze is one of the only two stock turrets that require you to have 2 different protection types (1 module and 1 hull alt) equipped in order to effectively protect yourself against them, and its counter hull alts are worth either 245 000 crystals or 4 990 tankoins, which isn't little (and to many players, even unavailable at all).

ahem....shock freeze does not work ive tested it out with a friend and the difference it made was quite pathetic. freeze is now quite redundant and i used freeze for months in hundreds of battles up to the point where they nerfed it and the shock alt so much it was rendered useless. been playing this game for nearly 6 years and freeze viking was my combo of choice. IT DOES NOT DO WHAT IT WAS MEANT TO DO, stop tanks in their tracks. 

[TheCongoSpider 8,943]

4 minutes ago, TARGET-X-ACQUIRED said:

shock freeze is now null and void its useless. was a waste of time buying the alt for cry. the devs do like to play there games on the players; make a great alt everyone gets it give it a few mnths then nerf the crap out of it. not a bad way to make money i suppose. make a combo great then nerf it and move onto the next one.    

This word again. Shock Freeze is not "useless". 

 

4 minutes ago, TARGET-X-ACQUIRED said:

IT DOES NOT DO WHAT IT WAS MEANT TO DO, stop tanks in their tracks. 

Yes, it does, and it does it very well. I hope you didn't take that saying literally...

 

[G-92 104]

On 5/28/2020 at 10:10 PM, ControlledChaos said:

Shock Freezes freeze you rock-solid within a fraction of a second, with a -50% decreased energy consumption (which completely overrides the intended -30% damage nerf (which should be more like -50% by default)), with no effort whatsoever or any major engagement on their part, and are usually used in conjunction with Wasp and its overdrive, basically meaning that if the opponents' team has Shock Freeze(s) in their base, the battle has pretty much ended before it even started. It's definitely not "not that effective" as you believe it to be, and is currently one of the most devastating turret alterations in the game. Even if you manage to destroy a Shock Freeze mid-attack (regardless of its length), you'll be frozen and unable to move so much so that they'll just come back for you for round two after respawning, after which they (or their teammates usually) will easily be able to finish you off with the flag / ball anyway, and no amount of drones and whatnot will help. Getting frozen for even a fraction of a second will inevitably get you destroyed before you'll even be able to think of escaping the enemies' base, with basically zero effort on their part. I play MM battles a ton, and that's just how it objectively is.

ahem again ...your quite wrong SHOCK FREEZE does not work. get your facts right i remember when it did freeze tanks solid and it certainly does not do that anymore.thats why i stopped using it because you yet again nerfed yet another turret as to make it useless.

[G-92 104]

Just now, TheCongoSpider said:

This word again. Shock Freeze is not "useless". 

 

Yes, it does, and it does it very well. I hope you didn't take that saying literally...

 

well i no it is thats why i stopped using it

[TheCongoSpider 8,943]

2 minutes ago, TARGET-X-ACQUIRED said:

well i no it is thats why i stopped using it

...What?

[G-92 104]

tell the truth i dont really care what they nerf are make stronger i have not played my main in months and wont until they get rid of these ridiculous overdrives. all the same to me devs do what is best for them players are secondary always have been. 

[G-92 104]

lol nothing

[G-92 104]

the game is unbalanced in favour of hornet and any turret you pair with it.