Buff - Nerf - Buff another

[fire199 267]

12 minutes ago, Mr.Nibbles said:

There's a thing called COVER, that makes it easier...

Oh, but when you die because you got just a little too close to that Mammoth, who 9/10 times has their Overdrive, you don't feel a sudden rush of anger?

i agree all overdrives are useful and are situational. hornet just seems more overpowered because it it what buyers use most often. and its what i have died to most on terms of overdrive by a far margin so idk if that makes it the most powerful maybe it does make it the most over powered . if the same buyers all use vikings then maybe i would die to Viking ods more idk. all ODs are situational and nearly all of them gives a buyer 3+kills if used right.

hornet is just easier to get kills then say hunter but in the end a hulls overdrive purpose is to stay situational in CTF Hunter would triumph over hornet, making enemy drop flag is very op

[wolverine848 13,097]

17 minutes ago, Mr.Nibbles said:

There's a thing called COVER, that makes it easier...

Oh, but when you die because you got just a little too close to that Mammoth, who 9/10 times has their Overdrive, you don't feel a sudden rush of anger?

Until they hit OD you have more than a good chance.  Wound them enough and they either die or hit OD too soon to save themselves.  It's easier to outrun a mammoth than it is a long-range turret equipped on horet.

1 minute ago, mjmj5558 said:

Sooo true. Once i've tested, an the avarage kills that you get from hornet OD itself is not more than 1-2. In my opinion, wasp is the best: sometimes you can even get 5 kills from an OD (same as viking), and it has a fast recharge.

I've been spawn-killed by the same hornet on same OD 2x in a row... on more than 1 occaision.

1-2 kills is low.  Hornet-Gauss can get 2+ with one shot regularly - especially in your wasp example when targets are bunched up.

Any left over after first shot die on the 2nd if they have not run.

[Azonyx 124]

20 minutes ago, Mr.Nibbles said:

Oh, but when you die because you got just a little too close to that Mammoth, who 9/10 times has their Overdrive, you don't feel a sudden rush of anger?

Since the advent of status effect indicators on HTML5 there is little to no reason why you should be surprised when you die next to a charging Mammoth. Even on Flash without the fancy OD indicators it should be common sense to keep your distance from a Mammoth.

You know what makes me furious though? I have all these decked out protections and Defender under a Titan dome with spawn protection on, and I STILL VANISH WITHOUT WARNING because of a stupid OD that can be used anytime anywhere with anything.

[fire199 267]

the one thing i do not agree with hornet overdrive is its ability to bypass spawn protection this is not needed the point of spawn protection is to give a fighting chance but with hornet it ruins it

does someone wanna make this into a idea and suggestion as im sure Maf would approve this 

 

if not ill do it myself 

Edited June 25, 2020 by fire199

[E_polypterus 2,374]

Hornet OD just has too many privileges than other ODs;

-Ignoring Titan dome’s protection.

-Ignoring protection given by modules.

-Ignoring double armor.

-Ignoring spawn protection. 

-Showing enemy health status

-Showing enemy locations.

All these combined with full MUs, double power and alterations make it very much over-powered. 

Just remove 2 or 3 of the above and it would be fine.

FINISH.

Edited June 25, 2020 by E_polypterus

[Venem 615]

All ODs are OP, when used by a skilled player. I think all of you will agree.

If a newbie uses Hornet OD, it's a waste, most of the time.

But if a pro uses it, he/she will surely get at least 3 kills.

I think, that those of you who got spawn-killed many times are unlucky. You were unfortunately in a battle where the enemy Hornets happened to be pros. I personally have never been spawn-killed by Hornet-users that had OD active. I have simply been lucky to not have encountered a skilled Hornet-user, at least when I spawn.

Same goes for other ODs. I'm a terrible Mammoth-player. I have never got more than 2 kills with Mammoth OD. In fact 80% of the time, enemy tanks manage to run away, and even kill me. But a skilled player will use OD at the right time and space, and get 3+ kills. I've seen that many times, and even been killed by a Mammoth OD that had killed 4 players before me.

Also, when it comes to Wasp OD, it's mostly luck! Very rarely do you find 3+ enemy tanks huddled together... Or even if you do, it's difficult for many to reach the grouped enemies (you get killed before you reach them). Hunter OD is a Wasp's nightmare. Especially when you save your Wasp OD for the Goldbox, and even find enemies close together, but there is a Hunter there too, with OD ready. Here, I'd like to emphasize on the "mostly" (in "it's mostly luck!"). I have seen skilled players who have done incredible stunts to drop the Wasp bomb at just the right time and place.

I really don't think any other OD is controversial enough to be discussed. (Titan's Dome not making the Titan or teammates immune to Wasp's OD is a problem, though...) Hunter's OD also takes some preparation time before causing havoc (or rather, causing absolute stillness). I have seen failed attempts to defuse a Wasp bomb by Hunter OD many times. Again, skill is the name of the game. (though I agree buyers tend to have an edge due to superior equipment...)

This is my personal opinion. Totally personal.

[cosmic666 1,055]

51 minutes ago, Mr.Nibbles said:

There's a thing called COVER, that makes it easier...

Oh, but when you die because you got just a little too close to that Mammoth, who 9/10 times has their Overdrive, you don't feel a sudden rush of anger?

Nope i just outrun them which is easy, crisis drone 15/20 speed boost then i kill them.

[cosmic666 1,055]

33 minutes ago, fire199 said:

i agree all overdrives are useful and are situational. hornet just seems more overpowered because it it what buyers use most often. and its what i have died to most on terms of overdrive by a far margin so idk if that makes it the most powerful maybe it does make it the most over powered . if the same buyers all use vikings then maybe i would die to Viking ods more idk. all ODs are situational and nearly all of them gives a buyer 3+kills if used right.

hornet is just easier to get kills then say hunter but in the end a hulls overdrive purpose is to stay situational in CTF Hunter would triumph over hornet, making enemy drop flag is very op

Nope wrong again.

[cosmic666 1,055]

6 minutes ago, SHREYA88 said:

All ODs are OP, when used by a skilled player. I think all of you will agree.

If a newbie uses Hornet OD, it's a waste, most of the time.

But if a pro uses it, he/she will surely get at least 3 kills.

I think, that those of you who got spawn-killed many times are unlucky. You were unfortunately in a battle where the enemy Hornets happened to be pros. I personally have never been spawn-killed by Hornet-users that had OD active. I have simply been lucky to not have encountered a skilled Hornet-user, at least when I spawn.

Same goes for other ODs. I'm a terrible Mammoth-player. I have never got more than 2 kills with Mammoth OD. In fact 80% of the time, enemy tanks manage to run away, and even kill me. But a skilled player will use OD at the right time and space, and get 3+ kills. I've seen that many times, and even been killed by a Mammoth OD that had killed 4 players before me.

Also, when it comes to Wasp OD, it's mostly luck! Very rarely do you find 3+ enemy tanks huddled together... Or even if you do, it's difficult for many to reach the grouped enemies (you get killed before you reach them). Hunter OD is a Wasp's nightmare. Especially when you save your Wasp OD for the Goldbox, and even find enemies close together, but there is a Hunter there too, with OD ready. Here, I'd like to emphasize on the "mostly" (in "it's mostly luck!"). I have seen skilled players who have done incredible stunts to drop the Wasp bomb at just the right time and place.

I really don't think any other OD is controversial enough to be discussed. (Titan's Dome not making the Titan or teammates immune to Wasp's OD is a problem, though...) Hunter's OD also takes some preparation time before causing havoc (or rather, causing absolute stillness). I have seen failed attempts to defuse a Wasp bomb by Hunter OD many times. Again, skill is the name of the game. (though I agree buyers tend to have an edge due to superior equipment...)

This is my personal opinion. Totally personal.

HORNET is the game changer nothing else. 

[Venem 615]

2 minutes ago, cosmic666 said:

HORNET is the game changer nothing else. 

Yeah, it does seem there is a sudden spurt of skilled Hornet users...

 

[Devoid 2,601]

35 minutes ago, cosmic666 said:

Nope i just outrun them which is easy, crisis drone 15/20 speed boost then i kill them.

Yes, but if you don't have Crisis drone (like the majority of the player-base), this isn't possible

[Azonyx 124]

37 minutes ago, SHREYA88 said:

All ODs are OP, when used by a skilled player. I think all of you will agree.

[...]

I think, that those of you who got spawn-killed many times are unlucky. You were unfortunately in a battle where the enemy Hornets happened to be pros. I personally have never been spawn-killed by Hornet-users that had OD active. I have simply been lucky to not have encountered a skilled Hornet-user, at least when I spawn.

The only thing luck has to do with Hornet OD is for them to roll low on their turret's damage range so that you survive with <5% HP.

Skill? The only skill involved with Hornet OD is point-and-shoot, hide while reloading. Which is what you normally do with other hulls anyway, minus the immediate carnage.

[Venem 615]

3 minutes ago, Azonyx said:

The only skill involved with Hornet OD is point-and-shoot, hide while reloading

Bro, that's the point! That is THE skill, which takes you to heights in Tanki! If you master it, then you're a pro! Many players, including me, struggle with turret-hull coordination, and using the keyboard in dangerous and demanding situations (like when Gold's dropping, or when your health is low... I tend to panic, and struggle to control my tank, and so do many like me).

So if you're a pro, then I respect your opinion. But do think about the majority of players, for whom it's difficult to "point-and-shoot, hide while reloading", when it matters the most in battle.

[D.A.R.K.N.E.S.S 432]

2 minutes ago, SHREYA88 said:

Bro, that's the point! That is THE skill, which takes you to heights in Tanki! If you master it, then you're a pro! Many players, including me, struggle with turret-hull coordination, and using the keyboard in dangerous and demanding situations (like when Gold's dropping, or when your health is low... I tend to panic, and struggle to control my tank, and so do many like me).

So if you're a pro, then I respect your opinion. But do think about the majority of players, for whom it's difficult to "point-and-shoot, hide while reloading", when it matters the most in battle.

No offense but you're third lieutenant. Unless you have a higher ranked account I don't know about, once you get into the Marshal+ and especially Legend ranks the vast majority of players know how to control their tank pretty well, so simple point and shoot mechanics is almost a given. 

The problem with Hornet OD that makes it so frustrating is that it bypasses EVERYTHING. Even the damned spawn protection which is literally there to prevent spawnkilling like ??? what kinda genius designed a system meant to prevent spawnkilling and then said "you know what, I'll allow spawnkilling, but only on a hornet" . 

Also, from my experience Hornet OD charges ridiculously quick, especially if you're able to get a couple kills without the OD, as most buyer drone users are. And then, pop the OD, turn on Defender to make yourself mostly invincible to anyone without Booster, and get to mashing. The kills in the latter half of the OD usually mean theyre already at 30-50% by the time it expires. 

I think the best nerf if the devs think the overdrive mechanics themselves are balanced would just be to increase the charge time - I'm sure that would lead to the least complaints and the least players even noticing anything was changed. Perhaps make it charge slightly quicker than Viking OD and we're golden. 

[wolverine848 13,097]

10 minutes ago, SHREYA88 said:

Bro, that's the point! That is THE skill, which takes you to heights in Tanki! If you master it, then you're a pro! Many players, including me, struggle with turret-hull coordination, and using the keyboard in dangerous and demanding situations (like when Gold's dropping, or when your health is low... I tend to panic, and struggle to control my tank, and so do many like me).

So if you're a pro, then I respect your opinion. But do think about the majority of players, for whom it's difficult to "point-and-shoot, hide while reloading", when it matters the most in battle.

It's not that much of a skill - it's akin to learning how to turn your turret.  They only need to hit you once.  So the cover is only needed if there are multiple enemies in that area.  And 90% of the hornet-users are longer-range turrets so relatively easy for them to get off 2, 3 or even 4 shots on one OD.

1 minute ago, D.A.R.K.N.E.S.S said:

No offense but you're third lieutenant. Unless you have a higher ranked account I don't know about, once you get into the Marshal+ and especially Legend ranks the vast majority of players know how to control their tank pretty well, so simple point and shoot mechanics is almost a given. 

The problem with Hornet OD that makes it so frustrating is that it bypasses EVERYTHING. Even the damned spawn protection which is literally there to prevent spawnkilling like ??? what kinda genius designed a system meant to prevent spawnkilling and then said "you know what, I'll allow spawnkilling, but only on a hornet" . 

Also, from my experience Hornet OD charges ridiculously quick, especially if you're able to get a couple kills without the OD, as most buyer drone users are. And then, pop the OD, turn on Defender to make yourself mostly invincible to anyone without Booster, and get to mashing. The kills in the latter half of the OD usually mean theyre already at 30-50% by the time it expires. 

I think the best nerf if the devs think the overdrive mechanics themselves are balanced would just be to increase the charge time - I'm sure that would lead to the least complaints and the least players even noticing anything was changed. Perhaps make it charge slightly quicker than Viking OD and we're golden. 

Hornet can generate OD through kills while OD is active right?  That is another problem.  They always seem to have it available.

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

@Mr.Nibbles Let's assume the abilities that Hornet's Overdrive gives the user are balanced (though they're not because every other Overdrive besides Wasp was nerfed considerably since release so relatively, it is strong). 

 

What then becomes a problem is the Hornet gaining Overdrive charge from score during the duration. Because if it goes on a killing spree or captures an objective, it significantly charges the Overdrive and will have it ready within the minute after the duration ends. You have the cycle of them jumping into the enemy base head-first, confident, because they know they can overpower their opponents with the Overdrive. They get the upper hand on newly spawned enemies because they bypass the spawn protection and with the right turret, they don't stand a chance.

 

What more? They have the most generous Overdrive charge retention period of all the hulls. And if they fail in the use of their Overdrive, they have the 2nd fastest passive charging rate of the 7 hulls. All of these come together to give the superior Overdrive, countering others by brute force. After all the nerfs, it is no surprise that there is a surge in Hornets. 

[E_polypterus 2,374]

12 minutes ago, D.A.R.K.N.E.S.S said:

No offense but you're third lieutenant. Unless you have a higher ranked account I don't know about, once you get into the Marshal+ and especially Legend ranks the vast majority of players know how to control their tank pretty well, so simple point and shoot mechanics is almost a given. 

The problem with Hornet OD that makes it so frustrating is that it bypasses EVERYTHING. Even the damned spawn protection which is literally there to prevent spawnkilling like ??? what kinda genius designed a system meant to prevent spawnkilling and then said "you know what, I'll allow spawnkilling, but only on a hornet" . 

Also, from my experience Hornet OD charges ridiculously quick, especially if you're able to get a couple kills without the OD, as most buyer drone users are. And then, pop the OD, turn on Defender to make yourself mostly invincible to anyone without Booster, and get to mashing. The kills in the latter half of the OD usually mean theyre already at 30-50% by the time it expires. 

I think the best nerf if the devs think the overdrive mechanics themselves are balanced would just be to increase the charge time - I'm sure that would lead to the least complaints and the least players even noticing anything was changed. Perhaps make it charge slightly quicker than Viking OD and we're golden. 

But it takes some sorta skill to use doesn’t it? That’s what @SHREYA88 is telling. Easier to use and master than other ODs but not too easy. You don’t need to be a big high ranked guy to see that do you? That’s common sense.

Edited June 25, 2020 by E_polypterus

[TheCongoSpider 8,942]

And it's easy to outrun a Mammoth Overdrive with anything as fast or faster than a Dictator. Dictators with speed boost will slightly outrun Mammoth Overdrives with speed boost. Mammoth generally needs both speed boost and double armour activated to make use out of the Overdrive now that it is not immune to damage or knockback.

 

Use it without double armour or bad protection modules and you will die quickly. Use it without speed boost and you're not catching anything that sees you coming unless they get stuck on a prop on the map.

 

 

[Venem 615]

15 minutes ago, D.A.R.K.N.E.S.S said:

No offense

None taken!

Of course, you are more experienced than me, and I don't have any alts above Third Lieutenant. So my opinions may be woefully uninformed.

I get your point, and I too think that Hornet OD ignoring spawn protection is outrageous.

However, as I mentioned earlier, I personally have never had my spawn protection ignored... So thanks for your opinion!

[Venem 615]

9 minutes ago, E_polypterus said:

But it takes some sorta skill to use doesn’t it? That’s what @SHREYA88 is telling. Easier to use and master than other ODs but not too easy. You don’t need to be a big high ranked guy to see that do you? That’s common sense.

Thanks, Poly! sorry, IOR. XD

[XxStriker 519]

2 hours ago, Mr.Nibbles said:

There's a thing called COVER, that makes it easier...

Oh, but when you die because you got just a little too close to that Mammoth, who 9/10 times has their Overdrive, you don't feel a sudden rush of anger?

Too bad the amount of times I died to hornet OD completely bypassing my protection+da is 100000000x higher than the amount of times I died to mammoth cause... You know, move? It's literally melee. I can't avoid infinite range oneshot guns all the time.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

7 hours ago, E_polypterus said:

Then why haven’t they nerfed firebird yet or gauss ... when it comes to devs you can never tell. They’re very unpredictable 

Simple. Gauss is ponytail boy's baby while firebird is his anger management toy. And everyone else in the development team simply loves hornet.

[cosmic666 1,055]

1 hour ago, D.A.R.K.N.E.S.S said:

No offense but you're third lieutenant. Unless you have a higher ranked account I don't know about, once you get into the Marshal+ and especially Legend ranks the vast majority of players know how to control their tank pretty well, so simple point and shoot mechanics is almost a given. 

The problem with Hornet OD that makes it so frustrating is that it bypasses EVERYTHING. Even the damned spawn protection which is literally there to prevent spawnkilling like ??? what kinda genius designed a system meant to prevent spawnkilling and then said "you know what, I'll allow spawnkilling, but only on a hornet" . 

Also, from my experience Hornet OD charges ridiculously quick, especially if you're able to get a couple kills without the OD, as most buyer drone users are. And then, pop the OD, turn on Defender to make yourself mostly invincible to anyone without Booster, and get to mashing. The kills in the latter half of the OD usually mean theyre already at 30-50% by the time it expires. 

I think the best nerf if the devs think the overdrive mechanics themselves are balanced would just be to increase the charge time - I'm sure that would lead to the least complaints and the least players even noticing anything was changed. Perhaps make it charge slightly quicker than Viking OD and we're golden. 

Nope we are anything but GOLDEN, not unless they make the charge time 7.01 secs THEN WE ARE GOLDEN.

[mjmj5558 2,346]

2 hours ago, wolverine848 said:

1-2 kills is low.  Hornet-Gauss can get 2+ with one shot regularly - especially in your wasp example when targets are bunched up.

Any left over after first shot die on the 2nd if they have not run.

The problem is that you watching the amount of kills you get, not the amount of kills that you wouldn't get without the OD. And that is not more than 1-2, of course, if you have luck, more, but sometimes 0 ( again, this doesn't mean that you don't get ANY kills, this means that you cozld get them without the OD. Of course, i think that ignoring spawn protection should be taken away from the OD.

Edited June 25, 2020 by mjmj5558

[D.A.R.K.N.E.S.S 432]

1 hour ago, wolverine848 said:

Hornet can generate OD through kills while OD is active right?  That is another problem.  They always seem to have it available.

This should definitely be removed -  no other offensive overdrive charges whilst in activation - imagine if Viking OD charged whilst active, you'd have 30-40% by the time it finished if you got 2-3 kills as I usually do. 

1 hour ago, E_polypterus said:

But it takes some sorta skill to use doesn’t it? That’s what @SHREYA88 is telling. Easier to use and master than other ODs but not too easy. You don’t need to be a big high ranked guy to see that do you? That’s common sense.

Every OD takes some element of skill (besides perhaps Dictator or Titan) but like I said, if the developers don't have an issue with the overdrive mechanics themselves i.e. how the overdrive works & functions, then a large part of why Hornet OD is so broken is that relative to its power, it charges far too quickly.

The developers recognised this with Viking's OD and that's why it has the slowest charge time of all the hulls - because of it's huge killing potential. Problems arise when they are aware of the killing potential but don't change the charge time or charge mechanics (as mentioned above) to compensate. 

59 minutes ago, SHREYA88 said:

None taken!

Of course, you are more experienced than me, and I don't have any alts above Third Lieutenant. So my opinions may be woefully uninformed.

I get your point, and I too think that Hornet OD ignoring spawn protection is outrageous.

However, as I mentioned earlier, I personally have never had my spawn protection ignored... So thanks for your opinion!

Must be nice... I recently created an alt and it's been fun owning noobs at First Sergeant  Noone really knows the true power of hornet down there so the OD is underrated

7 minutes ago, cosmic666 said:

Nope we are anything but GOLDEN, not unless they make the charge time 7.01 secs THEN WE ARE GOLDEN.

What? This must be a typo because 7.01 secs is ridiculously quick

57 minutes ago, XxStriker said:

Too bad the amount of times I died to hornet OD completely bypassing my protection+da is 100000000x higher than the amount of times I died to mammoth cause... You know, move? It's literally melee. I can't avoid infinite range oneshot guns all the time.

I can't believe hornet OD is even being put in the same sentence as mammoth OD... some things on this forum really blow my mind sometimes