Literally Unplayable: New RFM Shaft-Hornet Meta

[wolverine848 13,097]

10 minutes ago, BloodPressure said:

How ironic, within barely 14 days Rapid Fire Mode got both buffed and nerfed. Making full use of you arcade shots is going to be more intensive than previously - this goes for all Shaft-augments, but will affect RFM most

Shame.  

[KamiGT 143]

The irony within this thread is so damn thick I could cut it with a knife. It disgusts me that people can be so two-sided.

Dear Azonyx,

It absolutely floors me that you of all people would be the one to publish a thread with this name and speak the way you did in the first post. The whole reason game breaking buffs are so bad is because of players who treat the game like you do.

First, a look at my time with TO and how I have approached the game.

• I have been playing for ~7 years now, and as of today have 835 hours in the game.
• I have been extraordinarily conservative with the way I play. For most of the middle ranks, I was saving crystals through Pro Battle Polygon CPs and completing dozens of missions for mission chains so that I could amass a decent amount of supplies. At one point my account had been taken by a friend who subsequently used nearly all of my supplies, leaving me with about 100 of each. This is the original reason I had to play as carefully as I did (also a contributing factor for why my K/D is only .90, it used to be about .70)
• Once I was able to grind out all of these supplies and crystals, I was finally able to reach the Colonel rank (three stars), at which M3 kits are unlocked. I had saved about 1 million crystals and extremely carefully planned which kits I would buy so that my account would be structured in a way which would benefit my overall performance. I bought the Centaur kit, Raiden kit, and Rock Climber kit.
• After this, I continued to grind to get micro upgrades for all my new equipment, and over time I picked up some new turrets on mainly 50% sales to accompany my standard hull set. I also bought m3 protections for the turrets which appeared to be the most dangerous.
• I have used a drone for approx. 50 hours.
• Fast forward to today.

How have players such as you approached the game?

• First of all, I saw you in battle today before realizing who started this thread. You were running Vulcan and Hornet (huge f'ing surprise) and taking full advantage of the Hornet overdrive you are complaining about, pretty much dominating every player.
• According to your profile, you are nearly my rank and have spent 654 hours fewer than me carefully building your account to the rank it is at.
• You use only two specific turrets, Gauss and Vulcan. What portion of the player base uses these you might ask? Generally buyers who want to be able to take advantage of other players, or those who want to be able to keep up with these buyers.
• You have used a drone (a telltale sign of someone who has been using powerful equipment to abuse other players) for nearly all of your time in game. (166 hours roughly)
• You have used nearly as many supplies as me (57k vs 69k) and have only played 1/5th of the time I have.
• Your K/D is 5.43!!
• Your garage has very little diversity within it, and you clearly play almost exclusively to use the most brokenly powerful combos.

Why should we be the ones who have to adapt to your game breaking buyer metas (Vulcan, Gauss) as opposed to you just buying shaft protection and paying 1.2 mil to make it 50% all in the matter of a day?

Why is it suddenly so bad to see a turret buffed ridiculously? Is it because you don't have it?

How the actual hell can you be the one who complains when you are one of the players who exploits these imbalances and overall ruins the game on a daily basis for many players who haven't paid their way to success?

P.S.

Yes, I am one of the players who benefited from the inappropriately strong Shaft buff that happened, and yes, I had RFM for maybe a year before this buff took place. It's important to recognize your own bias in writing because that will allow you to make a stronger argument, so here is mine.

Why do you even play Tanki if you aren't going to take advantage of the wide variety of turrets and hulls and instead choose to subjugate hundreds of players via buying the newest, most broken, and often paywall locked equipment and using exclusively that?

[KamiGT 143]

And yes, you are right. This game has become literally unplayable because of players like you.

[wolverine848 13,097]

23 minutes ago, KamiGT said:

Why is it suddenly so bad to see a turret buffed ridiculously?

 

Yes, I am one of the players who benefited from the inappropriately strong Shaft buff that happened, and yes, I had RFM for maybe a year before this buff took place. It's important to recognize your own bias in writing because that will allow you to make a stronger argument, so here is mine.

Is this a rhetorical question?

 

I can't tell - were you defending RFM?

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

1 hour ago, KamiGT said:

First of all, I saw you in battle today before realizing who started this thread. You were running Vulcan and Hornet (huge f'ing surprise) and taking full advantage of the Hornet overdrive you are complaining about, pretty much dominating every player.

Because if the devs ain't gonna fix it, what harm will one more abusing its power gonna cause?

[ThirdOnion 4,898]

2 hours ago, KamiGT said:

According to your profile, you are nearly my rank and have spent 654 hours fewer than me carefully building your account to the rank it is at.

It's fine if you choose not to use a certain OP combo on principle. But I don't think it's fair to blame players who do. It is the responsibility of the developers to ensure balance within the game, and not the responsibility of players to use only "balanced" equipment. The reason Azonyx has fewer hours than you do is because a large part of their hours was most likely logged before the ratings system was introduced.

[KamiGT 143]

1 hour ago, wolverine848 said:

Is this a rhetorical question?

 

I can't tell - were you defending RFM?

1. Yes, it is a rhetorical question (I think the answer is quite clear according to most people's opinions on the forum and probably otherwise).

2. However, the deeper nuance here is the fact that RFM is potentially defensible when placed next to some of the other extremely overpowered pieces of equipment that certain groups of players have been avidly using lately. If RFM was standing alone crushing every other combo in the game, it would be even less defensible than it currently is. Which is to say, not much.

3. The other thing to remember about RFM is although it is hard for new players to pick up (so expensive these days) it is accessible to the general player base, unlike some of the other elements which make Gauss and Vulcan so powerful (heat immunity/EMP Salvo). Meaning, if RFM was broken and normal players bought it or started using it more to counter Gauss/Vulcan/Magnum, they would have a much easier way to counter buyer combos.

22 minutes ago, ThirdOnion said:

It's fine if you choose not to use a certain OP combo on principle. But I don't think it's fair to blame players who do. It is the responsibility of the developers to ensure balance within the game, and not the responsibility of players to use only "balanced" equipment. The reason Azonyx has fewer hours than you do is because a large part of their hours was most likely logged before the ratings system was introduced.

Third Onion. Here's the thing. The ratings system was not made yesterday, or the day before that. It has been around for years. I highly doubt that any hours on that account were logged before the system. Plus, as you can see, the only equipment said player has upgraded is new equipment, suggesting that the account couldn't have been around for a long period of time. Either that or he played like 600 hours on very low level equipment and did not upgrade a thing. That would explain how nothing except new turrets are upgraded. However, highly doubt that. Plus, I don't think anyone is getting a K/D of +5 with average equipment. Overall, highly doubt you are correct. (After further research, it appears ratings were added in 2015. October 29th)

 

It isn't completely about blaming his behavior (although I do dislike that, and so I choose to say so).

The main point I have been trying to make through all of this is that it is extraordinarily hypocritical to first take advantage of the most powerful equipment, beat everyone with normal gear, and then turn around and complain about how another turret has been made extremely broken. Don't you see you have been doing the same thing all along with X equipment that was previously/currently powerful? If your equipment was so good in the first place, can't you use the skills you have learned to at least counter the newest (RFM) threat to your dominance? After all, you have the next best thing...

[Azonyx 124]

Ok, let's dissect this critique point by point:

1 hour ago, KamiGT said:

It absolutely floors me that you of all people would be the one to publish a thread with this name and speak the way you did in the first post. The whole reason game breaking buffs are so bad is because of players who treat the game like you do.

Here is a different perspective. If even maxed-out buyers like myself are assembling in the forum to complain about these half-second kill metas, something has obviously gone wrong somewhere. And that is this game's ludicrous idea of "balance", which had been steadily crumbling since October 2016 into the cesspool that is Hornet OD + [insert newest buffed turret here].

1 hour ago, KamiGT said:

First, a look at my time with TO and how I have approached the game.

• [...]

And here is my history with the game:

• Played on and off since 2011 on many other accounts, starting as an F2P with Longcat970 then scaling up to this current alt
• Played enough hours to do an RTL at least four times and reliving the low, mid and high ranks on said alts but in different "meta" climates
• Sunk well over $2000 and an equivalent amount of hours on said accounts spread over the years, allowing me to play with almost every equipment combo and assess their relative strengths / weaknesses
• Lived through controversies such as the 2012 global rebalance + garage refund, economy rework, countless MU and turret balance changes (*cough* Shaft laser and penetration removal), alterations, MMS implementation, Shop / Tankoin overhaul, etc.
• Owned an M3 Hammer, Vulcan, and Striker on the same day of their release and seen their power level arbitrarily change over time
• Been a Shaft-Hornet main throughout the years and played with the OGs such as ShadowVisions, Stinger911, Vikingsrall, Contaminated, cheap_plastic_flower, [...] all of whom had different perspectives on the declining state of TO

I have just as much experience as you playing this game from beginning to end, if not more. I know perfectly well my place in the game's balance and that profile checkers like you will quickly point fingers and cry hypocrite without understanding the nuances of my position, hence why I made this topic.

4 hours ago, KamiGT said:

• First of all, I saw you in battle today before realizing who started this thread. You were running Vulcan and Hornet (huge f'ing surprise) and taking full advantage of the Hornet overdrive you are complaining about, pretty much dominating every player.
• According to your profile, you are nearly my rank and have spent 654 hours fewer than me carefully building your account to the rank it is at.
• You use only two specific turrets, Gauss and Vulcan. What portion of the player base uses these you might ask? Generally buyers who want to be able to take advantage of other players, or those who want to be able to keep up with these buyers.
• You have used a drone (a telltale sign of someone who has been using powerful equipment to abuse other players) for nearly all of your time in game. (166 hours roughly)
• You have used nearly as many supplies as me (57k vs 69k) and have only played 1/5th of the time I have.
• Your K/D is 5.43!!
• Your garage has very little diversity within it, and you clearly play almost exclusively to use the most brokenly powerful combos.

My three cents:

1. This alt was made to main Vulcan and Gauss. There is little to no point in buying the same equipment in similar Mk lvls for different alts.
2. I already had Vulcan long before the OP rework update, and Gauss in the first 2 weeks of its release. Would you believe me that it was pure luck they won the buff-cycle lottery while I was trying them? Probably not, because you would rather focus on how -I- break the game, and not the development decisions that give rise to it in the first place.
3. The power I have in battles is still limited by the parameters imposed by the devs, no matter if I drop $0 or $10000 on the shop. And even then, some random bloke with Hornet OD and any long range turret can just poof me away with a tap on Shift and two on Spacebar. And how do you counter this? You suck it up and join the meta - kill them before they kill you.

4 hours ago, KamiGT said:

Why should we be the ones who have to adapt to your game breaking buyer metas (Vulcan, Gauss) as opposed to you just buying shaft protection and paying 1.2 mil to make it 50% all in the matter of a day?

How is it -my- fault or other buyers' that such powerful buffs end up being in the game? The devs always have the final say in what is OP or not with each new patch. I am no less victim to their whims as you are. All we can do as players is to adopt the latest in the buff-cycle as prescribed by our TO overlords, or simply respawn again and again until you somehow gain spectator mode at -0.00 K/D.

4 hours ago, KamiGT said:

Why is it suddenly so bad to see a turret buffed ridiculously? Is it because you don't have it?

For the same reason you say it's bad because people who adopt the meta just to stay relevant in-game are "breaking your game."

4 hours ago, KamiGT said:

How the actual hell can you be the one who complains when you are one of the players who exploits these imbalances and overall ruins the game on a daily basis for many players who haven't paid their way to success?

I'll explain it to you in simpler terms - I'm complaining from this position because riding the meta is the only way to be competitive in the last 4 ranks of the game, which if you didn't already know are filled with 20/20 Defenders, Boosters, 50% protections, Titan domes, unlimited drugs, and other meta-Hornets that know how to deal with your and your whole team in more ways than one. Is that the players' fault? I don't think so. It is more the will of Hazel the Omniscient than anything.

4 hours ago, KamiGT said:

And yes, you are right. This game has become literally unplayable because of players like you.

Only half-right. This game has become literally unplayable as a consequence of devs' half-baked attempt at providing novelty to disgruntled buyers on the verge of quitting.

[Azonyx 124]

2 hours ago, KamiGT said:

2. However, the deeper nuance here is the fact that RFM is potentially defensible when placed next to some of the other extremely overpowered pieces of equipment that certain groups of players have been avidly using lately. If RFM was standing alone crushing every other combo in the game, it would be even less defensible than it currently is. Which is to say, not much.

Please do elaborate on this "potential" defense. Do you mean by destroying the user before they get a jump on you? There are so many open variables at play here. Let's assume then they are on a Hornet steamrolling through your base. If so, then it simply comes back to whoever can reliably deal the most damage in the shortest amount of time while minimizing received damage. What equipment can do all this? You guessed.

Keep in mind that an Mk7+ RFM on Hornet OD before the hotfix could potentially deal 2.1k damage before DD within 810 ms. In that same span of time a Gauss can at most deal 830 before DD, or get a bit less than half a lock-on, while the current Mk7+ Vulcan can deal ~713 damage if all shots land. My main complaint when making this topic is that before the hotfix an RFM shaft could literally spawnlock anybody without even a split-second warning should they come close, or just snipe to the same effect if you run far away. No amount of skill would have saved you when you spawned in front of an Overdriven RFM Hornet, only a maxed booster and/or timely Hornet OD on your part (or teammates') will. 

2 hours ago, KamiGT said:

The main point I have been trying to make through all of this is that it is extraordinarily hypocritical to first take advantage of the most powerful equipment, beat everyone with normal gear, and then turn around and complain about how another turret has been made extremely broken. Don't you see you have been doing the same thing all along with X equipment that was previously/currently powerful? If your equipment was so good in the first place, can't you use the skills you have learned to at least counter the newest (RFM) threat to your dominance? After all, you have the next best thing...

You may continue to discredit my stance on the basis of my background all you like, but the truth behind my complaint still stands. So long as TO supports / doesn't fix their broken idea of balance, we will continue to see the same narratives and situations about the Haves and Have-Nots on either side of the equipment meta.

On a final note, I should have indeed copy-pasted my main post and put it under my neglected Brigadier account Vermilion from 2017. Maybe then you would have been more likely to agree rather than cry hypocrite, even when all is said and done on this alt.

[wolverine848 13,097]

5 hours ago, KamiGT said:

1. Yes, it is a rhetorical question (I think the answer is quite clear according to most people's opinions on the forum and probably otherwise).

2. However, the deeper nuance here is the fact that RFM is potentially defensible when placed next to some of the other extremely overpowered pieces of equipment that certain groups of players have been avidly using lately. If RFM was standing alone crushing every other combo in the game, it would be even less defensible than it currently is. Which is to say, not much.

3. The other thing to remember about RFM is although it is hard for new players to pick up (so expensive these days) it is accessible to the general player base, unlike some of the other elements which make Gauss and Vulcan so powerful (heat immunity/EMP Salvo). Meaning, if RFM was broken and normal players bought it or started using it more to counter Gauss/Vulcan/Magnum, they would have a much easier way to counter buyer combos.

2)  OP is OP.  I really don't care if someone potentially could use it to counter another OP item.  They are using it on me.  Before the recent nerf, RFM combined with hornet OD meant my Hunter had 0% chance of using it's OD successfully.  The RFM could destroy my hunter in a split second before it got within EMP range.  Actually - even when the encounter happens within EMP range the Hunter still loses because RFM does all it's damage before the EMP can go off.  That hardly seems fair, does it?

3) Many players had RFM before the price was jacked up - and they can still buy it today - most likely on a sale day.  Increasing cost of an OP item does not offset the OP-ness of the item.  RFM was broken - it basically gave shaft the ability to have duplet while retaining full sniping abilities as well.  Most people (who don't rely heavily on it) will consider that "broken".

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

1 hour ago, wolverine848 said:

That hardly seems fair, does it?

Not. Fair.

1 hour ago, wolverine848 said:

 Increasing cost of an OP item does not offset the OP-ness of the item

Not to mention it encourage more P2W-ness.

[KamiGT 143]

Hey everyone, I am busy today so I will probably respond slowly (from my phone) as I get a chance, and edit my posts to add ideas.

First off, thank you Azonyx for responding quickly. I still think it is hypocritical to take the stance against Shaft when taking advantage of Gauss and Vulcan, even if you understand the f2p point of view (as in have been f2p at one point, like on Vermilion). But all of that aside (it isn't worth fighting about anyway, there are probably hundreds of people who are far more guilty that I'm not attacking on the forum), what I would ask you to do is PLEASE, PLEASE fight against every new broken update that comes out, even the ones you benefit from, and try to get other players on board so we can fix it.

Writing this late at night before I go to bed. Tonight I finished the challenge, even post-nerf RFM seems to be going strong and so does Vulcan (mainly I am seeing Vulcans, RFMs are only used paired with high level Boosters now). Shaft in general is still viable for use, but you need to make sure nobody gets close to you or you are absolutely screwed. The main thing which makes Shaft still unbalanced in my opinion is the fact that it pairs WAY to well with the Hornet overdrive. In certain maps, stock shaft is a good hard counter to Vulcan and Gauss, although the rest of the time it is impossible to keep up with these turrets (once when I was playing tonight I got melted by two Vulcan-Hornets without OD while inside a titan dome from full health). Specific maps that are good for sniping have been super integral to me being able to complete this challenge (plus the fact that I got premium from containers at a great time). I was also lucky enough to have saved 474 tankoins, which gave me the ability to get all the pass rewards after I completed the challenge (now I had enough). This challenge ran through thousands of drugs, and I used about ~800 repairs and around 1k of everything else (mostly fighting against Hornet combos to try and get stars).

Here is my greatest shaft battle results:

(can't post picture cause apparently you can't just upload one)

Sandal CP. Score of 415. 26 kills, 0 deaths. 2nd place  (to a guy with ten kills...) 8126 gs, 14/20 shaft, 14/20 hornet, no drone.

Basically, Shaft is still perfectly broken. I can sit behind the little fence and just shoot as fast as I can at anything that comes in front of me, and use the hornet overdrive as fast as I can get it. This strategy works in three maps: Highways, Brest, and Sandal. I am able to be so efficient because when I have the Hornet Overdrive, I can half charge my shot with DD and I am able to take down literally any tank (unless they have Lifeguard of course).

I figure if I am willing/able to call for a nerf on the one turret which gives me some modicum of competitiveness against players who have bought heat immunity, heat resistance, maxed their hornets, use maxed defenders, and use maxed vulcans with rubberized rounds, and tear me apart nearly every MM round, you guys should be willing to fight for a more balanced game too. It shouldn't matter what equipment we use, we should try and stay impartial to the situation and think about others and what this means for the future of the game.

 

I think shaft needs two things right now:

The reload (from a scope shot) needs to be slowed down a slight bit.

The arcade shot (not in RFM) needs a buff. It is absolutely useless.

As for the Hornet overdrive, that is causing most of the imbalance with Shaft, and it really needs to be gotten rid of or modified somehow.

 

Edited July 4, 2020 by KamiGT

[KamiGT 143]

20 hours ago, wolverine848 said:

2)  OP is OP.  I really don't care if someone potentially could use it to counter another OP item.  They are using it on me.  Before the recent nerf, RFM combined with hornet OD meant my Hunter had 0% chance of using it's OD successfully.  The RFM could destroy my hunter in a split second before it got within EMP range.  Actually - even when the encounter happens within EMP range the Hunter still loses because RFM does all it's damage before the EMP can go off.  That hardly seems fair, does it?

3) Many players had RFM before the price was jacked up - and they can still buy it today - most likely on a sale day.  Increasing cost of an OP item does not offset the OP-ness of the item.  RFM was broken - it basically gave shaft the ability to have duplet while retaining full sniping abilities as well.  Most people (who don't rely heavily on it) will consider that "broken".

Yeah, I agree with you on all accounts. What this really is is my own subconscious hypocrisy coming to surface. It isn't any better that Shaft is extremely broken because although it may help me it hurts you even more. The only way I was able to justify it was because it helped me win against Vulcan, Gauss, and hull alts for once, and I simply assumed everyone else was in the same boat. I apologize for that, and I'll try not to make the same mistake again.

I'm really starting to think that we need to make some sort of forum-wide, organized effort to stop this type of thing from happening, because we're all clearly so damn sick of it.

[Azonyx 124]

On 7/4/2020 at 12:51 AM, KamiGT said:

[...] what I would ask you to do is PLEASE, PLEASE fight against every new broken update that comes out, even the ones you benefit from, and try to get other players on board so we can fix it.

[...] you guys should be willing to fight for a more balanced game too. It shouldn't matter what equipment we use, we should try and stay impartial to the situation and think about others and what this means for the future of the game.

This is a very tall order to fulfill considering how TO has shifted its direction toward a "checks-and-balances" system similar to RTS games. Hull Overdrives, Modules, Drones, and Augments were made exactly so people HAVE to choose the right equipment in order to be efficient in battles, or else lose without a fighting chance.

However, the real problem in such a system arises when certain equipment combinations become too viable in too many situations. A glaring example would be the Hornet + [any non-melee turret] + Defender / Crisis meta - it can speedily cruise over any MMS map, hits like a truck on OD, and has its one weakness in armor offset by the drone. It can bypass most other ODs by either running away from it with ease or overwhelming the opponent before or even during their OD. It is no wonder that people who have even the slightest knowledge of statistics and min-maxing will flock to this perfect combination of speed, offense, and defense then call it a day.

Suppose Hornet OD gets fixed in such a way that the piercing damage is considerably nerfed or even removed. The next question would be, "How in the hell are we going to get through all those 50% modules with Defender camping by the Titan dome?" I would happily nominate for a Nobel Prize the person that can address that without opening up another Pandora's Box. But anyway,

8 hours ago, KamiGT said:

I'm really starting to think that we need to make some sort of forum-wide, organized effort to stop this type of thing from happening, because we're all clearly so damn sick of it.

Hear me out on this one and don't laugh just yet. TO is notorious for ignoring its playerbase's opinions, but they will never ignore cold, hard statistics - revenue, online player count, and whatever else profile parameters they snuck into the MMS algorithm. It is also common knowledge that most balance patches nowadays are done with the intent of promoting a new equipment meta, followed by a nerf once enough sales have been made. Therefore, I will play by TO's buff-cycle game and continue to "abuse" the Hornet meta. If enough people (read: everyone) just got it over with and switched to Hornet for at least a whole day or two, their Marketing Dept. will know something's up.

Here in Tanki Online, change on part of the community does not come without swift, decisive, and collective action.

[wolverine848 13,097]

10 minutes ago, Azonyx said:

"How in the hell are we going to get through all those 50% modules with Defender camping by the Titan dome?"

You picked one of the examples with many counters.

Titan and Hunter can counter directly.  

Wasp bomb combined with viking+high-damage turret like Rail or Magnum can make a giant dent on the fatty guarding flag.

And I don't think many are advocating for removal of Hornet OD - just nerf some aspects of it.  For starters it should NOT be able to spawn-kill.  That is just dumb.  Then remove part of it's penetration - like on the dome, or modules.  Leave penetration on DA and that solves the Defender drone.

[Azonyx 124]

3 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

You picked one of the examples with many counters.

Titan and Hunter can counter directly.  

Wasp bomb combined with viking+high-damage turret like Rail or Magnum can make a giant dent on the fatty guarding flag.

And I don't think many are advocating for removal of Hornet OD - just nerf some aspects of it.  For starters it should NOT be able to spawn-kill.  That is just dumb.  Then remove part of it's penetration - like on the dome, or modules.  Leave penetration on DA and that solves the Defender drone.

True, but in a post-Hornet OD world both still need to get relatively close. Without even the Titan dome there will still be people with Defenders and Mk7(+) Modules whom you have to 1-on-1 right after the other if you didn't get them all first with 1 use of Hunter / Wasp OD. And Viking, well... needs a lot of setup and leg room to maximize. Hornet's OD ignores all that and simply dances around the mechanics; after its nerf, it will be much harder to consistently get through all those defenses yourself, instead having to rely more on teamwork in MMS (*gasp*)

Personally, I would rather just do away with the ignore mechanics of Hornet and just give it a flat damage boost like a stackable DD so low rankers also reap the benefit while undrugged.

[cosmic666 1,055]

Simple solution SCRAP OVERDRIVES, i rest my airtight case.

[wolverine848 13,097]

27 minutes ago, Azonyx said:

Personally, I would rather just do away with the ignore mechanics of Hornet and just give it a flat damage boost like a stackable DD so low rankers also reap the benefit while undrugged.

That would be way too much like Viking then.  Better to have a whole new idea for it.

What bothers me most about these ODs is... fast hulls like Hornet can pack a punch like a modern main battle tank, move like a scout car and defend like a bunker with drones.  It's all-in-one and ruins the game.    I like Titan - but in todays TO it is just at such a huge disadvantage.  Was an awesome hull before OverDrives came along.

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

On 7/4/2020 at 3:44 PM, Azonyx said:

Suppose Hornet OD gets fixed in such a way that the piercing damage is considerably nerfed or even removed. The next question would be, "How in the hell are we going to get through all those 50% modules with Defender camping by the Titan dome?"

On 7/4/2020 at 3:59 PM, wolverine848 said:

Then remove part of it's penetration - like on the dome, or modules.

One solution: Completely ignore dome and Double Armor. However ignores opponent's module by 35% (basically 15% defence left if one is using 50% defence module). Render Booster effect obsolete when Double Power is popped with Radar.

The end!

[wolverine848 13,097]

4 minutes ago, FrozenRailgun said:

One solution: Completely ignore dome and Double Armor. However ignores opponent's module by 35% (basically 15% defence left if one is using 50% defence module). Render Booster effect obsolete when Double Power is popped with Radar.

The end!

Not enough defense.  And Booster is not common enough to be part of the real problem.

1) 15% is almost nothing.  A Magnum with average damage can one-shot a medium hull that is only slightly damaged... we're talking hang-nail here and it's dead.

And that leaves Titan dome as basically a counter to wasp bomb (or another dome).  Pretty sad.  I think allowing another Titan to disable a dome is worse than removing the healing.  That they did both is absolutely astounding - probably a result from all they cryers in siege mode.

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

7 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

Not enough defense.  And Booster is not common enough to be part of the real problem.

 

1) 15% is almost nothing.  A Magnum with average damage can one-shot a medium hull that is only slightly damaged... we're talking hang-nail here and it's dead.

 

And that leaves Titan dome as basically a counter to wasp bomb (or another dome).  Pretty sad.  I think allowing another Titan to disable a dome is worse than removing the healing.  That they did both is absolutely astounding - probably a result from all they cryers in siege mode.

Hm... ignore 15% of defence would be ok? I mean, 35% still provides good protection without being too OP. Didn't know Booster is not the real problem.

[cosmic666 1,055]

just been on my main and realised yet again why i stopped playing it, HORNET/MAGNUM  destroying everything on the map, ignoring spawn, and dealing no self damage when cornered with overdrive on. Pathetic. Main is now shelved for good until this HORNET fiasco is sorted with either overdrives being scrapped, or hornet seriously being nerfed. Why the devs are ignoring this obvious OP hull when they revamp everything else in the game is a mystery only they can answer, an explanation would be nice as to their reluctance to address this  major OP hull, especially when paired with MAGNUM. I think the reason boils down to CASH, as almost every decision they make concerning the game is cash oriented. The more OP the more players want it, therefore some will be willing to spend $$$ to buy it and max it out, along with whatever drones and alts they also need to complement this legal cheating piece of equipment. The devs have no shame when it comes to exploiting players on all levels within the confines of the game, the OP HORNET which up until now they refuse to deal with, the shop which favours the russian players  BY OVER  2/1  when it comes to any purchase,(need an explanation why that is the way it is to,) tankoins, the relatively new coinboxes (which are garbage) and the ridiculous X a zillion xp in battles, all implemented for the specific reason to generate cash, and tough luck on any player if you fall by the wayside due to the fortunate few, who have the cash to keep up with the ever increasing changes that get brought into the game, for the sole purpose of extracting as much money from every player they can. I've had enough and will never again WASTE cash on this biased and UNBALANCED game, which favours no one but them and the cynical, greedy,and underhanded way in which they behave towards the players who make the game what it is. 

[sharifsahaf 656]

3 minutes ago, cosmic666 said:

just been on my main and realised yet again why i stopped playing it, HORNET/MAGNUM  destroying everything on the map, ignoring spawn, and dealing no self damage when cornered with overdrive on. Pathetic. Main is now shelved for good until this HORNET fiasco is sorted with either overdrives being scrapped, or hornet seriously being nerfed. Why the devs are ignoring this obvious OP hull when they revamp everything else in the game is a mystery only they can answer, an explanation would be nice as to their reluctance to address this  major OP hull, especially when paired with MAGNUM. I think the reason boils down to CASH, as almost every decision they make concerning the game is cash oriented. The more OP the more players want it, therefore some will be willing to spend $$$ to buy it and max it out, along with whatever drones and alts they also need to complement this legal cheating piece of equipment. The devs have no shame when it comes to exploiting players on all levels within the confines of the game, the OP HORNET which up until now they refuse to deal with, the shop which favours the russian players  BY OVER  2/1  when it comes to any purchase,(need an explanation why that is the way it is to,) tankoins, the relatively new coinboxes (which are garbage) and the ridiculous X a zillion xp in battles, all implemented for the specific reason to generate cash, and tough luck on any player if you fall by the wayside due to the fortunate few, who have the cash to keep up with the ever increasing changes that get brought into the game, for the sole purpose of extracting as much money from every player they can. I've had enough and will never again WASTE cash on this biased and UNBALANCED game, which favours no one but them and the cynical, greedy,and underhanded way in which they behave towards the players who make the game what it is. 

they will counter the hornet od with od immunity - for 20 k tankoins only .take it or leave it

[sharifsahaf 656]

i wanna see the faces of those gold digging clowns who voted hunter OD as OP .like dudes no offense but i think you guys need a psychiatrist

[cosmic666 1,055]

2 minutes ago, sharifsahaf said:

i wanna see the faces of those gold digging clowns who voted hunter OD as OP .like dudes no offense but i think you guys need a psychiatrist

Every word you put in a post is offensive to those with intelligence, let's leave it at that shall we.