What the Mk1 that better than Mk7..?

[Tokamak 1,021]

Vulcan Mark 7+ deals 100% more damage than Mark 1, while the overheating time difference is only 30%, so Mark 1 is not better than Mark 8. 

[Tokamak 1,021]

2 minutes ago, yellowghetto said:

?

More kills with Mark 1 than with Mark 7.

[yellowghetto 3,206]

Just now, Tokamak said:

More kills with Mark 1 than with Mark 7.

I dont get it, but isnt Wasp Mk7 faster and more HP than Wasp Mk1?

[Tokamak 1,021]

6 minutes ago, yellowghetto said:

I dont get it, but isnt Wasp Mk7 faster and more HP than Wasp Mk1?

The premise of this weird topic is based on one factor comparaison, here it is the efficiency of one stats and its effect compared between the lowest and the highest Mark.
In case of Wasp speed is not affecting the result of the damages from the bomb, only the HP of the opponent faced at that level.

This topic is trying to find stats that would have stronger result than its high mark. In principle overdrives with fixed damaged across the Mark range (e.g Mammy and Wasp) are performing better at low mark, and gradually lose their strength as the gap decrease between fixed damages and increased HP. 
While the overdrive of viking directly and dictator indirectly increase with the strength of the turret Mark.

[alkyng 3,080]

7 hours ago, yellowghetto said:

This topic doesn't make much sense. Direct Damage is the scariest thing about Vulcan. The overheat is just the annoying part. 

Vulcan Mk8 is basically Mk1, but Double Damage.

Also an Mk1 EMP Gauss is weaker than Mk8 EMP Gauss using your logic. The aiming time does decrease over levels. 

EMP Gauss is just your assumes and TheCongoSpider, no one said about it here.

6 hours ago, Tokamak said:

The premise of this weird topic is based on one factor comparaison, here it is the efficiency of one stats and its effect compared between the lowest and the highest Mark.
In case of Wasp speed is not affecting the result of the damages from the bomb, only the HP of the opponent faced at that level.
This topic is trying to find stats that would have stronger result than its high mark

Don't put your failure on the topic, you couldn't reach your idea that's your problem. We didn't understand you, you must elaborate more, not putting Your failure on my topic

Edited January 5, 2021 by asem.harbi

[yellowghetto 3,206]

3 hours ago, asem.harbi said:

EMP Gauss is just your assumes and TheCongoSpider, no one said about it here.

Don't put your failure on the topic, you couldn't reach your idea that's your problem. We didn't understand you, you must elaborate more, not putting Your failure on my topic

What is assumed? It clearly says that the upgrade time is decreased on the Wiki!

Also 100% damage buff from Vulcan Mk1 - 8 is much more of a difference than a 30% added heat resistance time.

[alkyng 3,080]

13 minutes ago, yellowghetto said:

What is assumed? It clearly says that the upgrade time is decreased on the Wiki!

The upgrade time is decreased????? what do you mean by the upgrade time? could you capture it from the wiki? there is not such an advantage for EMP Gauss Mk1 than Mk8.

14 minutes ago, yellowghetto said:

Also 100% damage buff from Vulcan Mk1 - 8 is much more of a difference than a 30% added heat resistance time.

But the Vulcan IB damage is dependent on the heat and fires, not the direct damage, so the 33% difference affect too much.

[wolverine848 13,097]

9 hours ago, Tokamak said:

The premise of this weird topic is based on one factor comparaison, here it is the efficiency of one stats and its effect compared between the lowest and the highest Mark.
In case of Wasp speed is not affecting the result of the damages from the bomb, only the HP of the opponent faced at that level.

This topic is trying to find stats that would have stronger result than its high mark. In principle overdrives with fixed damaged across the Mark range (e.g Mammy and Wasp) are performing better at low mark, and gradually lose their strength as the gap decrease between fixed damages and increased HP. 
While the overdrive of viking directly and dictator indirectly increase with the strength of the turret Mark.

The 7th post on p1 nullifies this - as Blood already tried that explanation (via Lifeguard)

Asem, for some reason, thinks there's a case where an mk1 is actually better than an mk7 - if you could pick either.  Which is never the case...

[yellowghetto 3,206]

5 hours ago, asem.harbi said:

The upgrade time is decreased????? what do you mean by the upgrade time? could you capture it from the wiki? there is not such an advantage for EMP Gauss Mk1 than Mk8.

But the Vulcan IB damage is dependent on the heat and fires, not the direct damage, so the 33% difference affect too much.

Sorry, I meant the lock-on time is decreased. I was busy and typed what was on my mind quickly...

[alkyng 3,080]

25 minutes ago, yellowghetto said:

Sorry, I meant the lock-on time is decreased. I was busy and typed what was on my mind quickly...

No problem, you're the best one to have a discuss with always♥

[Mirza7 235]

Hmm..  interesting.. maybe I should buy IB since I got HI for wasp from cont.

About overheat: what is the temp per bullet and bullet per sec when IB is equipped ?? [for mk8]

 

[alkyng 3,080]

3 minutes ago, Mirza7 said:

Hmm..  interesting.. maybe I should buy IB since I got HI for wasp from cont.

About overheat: what is the temp per bullet and bullet per sec when IB is equipped ?? [for mk8]

How dare are you neglecting my topic and asking for Mk8 Vulcan.

Btw, it's 0.07% for Mk1 if you want to dive into my experiment

[Mirza7 235]

2 minutes ago, asem.harbi said:

How dare are you neglecting my topic and asking for Mk8 Vulcan.

Btw, it's 0.07% for Mk1 if you want to dive into my experiment

alright alright! lets take Mk1. but 0.07% of what ?

[alkyng 3,080]

1 minute ago, Mirza7 said:

alright alright! lets take Mk1. but 0.07% of what ?

the picture couldn't load..

But it's 0.07% temp per projectile... your question! 

Btw, also for Mk8 it's the same, but Mk1 is cheaper and faster for overheat resistance

[alkyng 3,080]

@Mirza7 Why you confused? I told you, Mk1 Vulcan or Mk2 or Mk8 raise the temp by 0.07% per bullet, so no difference.

Also the number of bullets per seconds isn't known, I think it's the same for every modification.

And we all know Vulcan couldn't ignite other tanks before he get overheat by himself, Mk1 get overheat in 9 seconds, Mk8 get overheat in 12 seconds. So for sure Mk1 here is superior. Btw, go to purchase IB for Vulcan, and then you will regret why you didn't hear me, 12 seconds is a very long waiting to ignite the enemies.

[Mirza7 235]

18 minutes ago, asem.harbi said:

@Mirza7 Why you confused? I told you, Mk1 Vulcan or Mk2 or Mk8 raise the temp by 0.07% per bullet, so no difference.

Also the number of bullets per seconds isn't known, I think it's the same for every modification.

And we all know Vulcan couldn't ignite other tanks before he get overheat by himself, Mk1 get overheat in 9 seconds, Mk8 get overheat in 12 seconds. So for sure Mk1 here is superior. Btw, go to purchase IB for Vulcan, and then you will regret why you didn't hear me, 12 seconds is a very long waiting to ignite the enemies.

I was confused by % that does not make sense. in wiki temperature section they mentioned it as 0.07/ms.

[yellowghetto 3,206]

Plot Twist: Enemy has Heat Immunity :O 

Because we are talking about Augments here.

[alkyng 3,080]

32 minutes ago, Mirza7 said:

I was confused by % that does not make sense. in wiki temperature section they mentioned it as 0.07/ms.

I gave you the 0.07% by the "Augments" section, Temperature and heats in the game is a really complicated thing, I hardly swallowed it. Btw, the only thing you should care now that you know it's the same for every modification, other info are a complicated and I didn't understand it and don't want to understand it also, really complicated.

4 minutes ago, yellowghetto said:

Plot Twist: Enemy has Heat Immunity :O 

Because we are talking about Augments here.

[Mirza7 235]

BTW for Vulcan Mk-1-0 bullets per sec = ‭13.3333 and Mk-7-10 bps = 18.1818

100% heat in:

Mk-1-0: ‭1.0714285714285714285714285714286‬ sec

Mk-7-10: ‭0.78571428571428571428571428571427‬ sec

How significant is the difference?

> Difference in HP dmg = ‭857.14285714285714285714285714299‬ HP

Hence Mk-7-10 will deliver heat faster than Mk-1-0

if both turrets start firing at the same time (ideal) mk1 would have done 9000 900 dmg before mk7 even heats up. :P

Edited January 7, 2021 by Mirza7

[wolverine848 13,097]

9 hours ago, Mirza7 said:

if both turrets start firing at the same time (ideal) mk1 would have done 9000 dmg before mk7 even heats up. :P

How much damage does mk8 do before mk1 heats up?

Edited January 6, 2021 by wolverine848

[Mirza7 235]

21 hours ago, wolverine848 said:

How much damage does mk8 do before mk1 heats up?

BTW nobody bothered to check this but 9000 is a bit exaggerated. I am talking about only heat damage in reality its just 300(hp/s)*3(s)=900.

As far as total dps is concerned: [without heat]

Mk-1-0: 293.33333333 dps

Mk-7-10: 800 dps

Ans:800 for 9 sec= 7200 :D

also 293.333333 for 9 sec = ‭2,640

After 9 sec Mk-1-0 would have 293.3333 + 300 = 593.3333 dps; add 3 more seconds of this to 2640= ‭4,419.9999‬ (corrected) dmg in 12 sec

In 12 sec Mk-7-10's dmg = 9600; after 12 sec, dps for Mk-7-10 will raise up to 800+300=1100 dps

Edited January 7, 2021 by Mirza7

[alkyng 3,080]

10 hours ago, wolverine848 said:

How much damage does mk8 do before mk1 heats up?

No he did a bad calculations, from this you know how bad the calculations he did, as the game smallest units are way way more bigger than this accuracy he did, that wont benefit either the reader or the true calculations. I afraid for the degree he will get in maths exam.

Btw, to answer your question, Mk1 can do 4400 dmg till Mk8 overheat. Mk8 can do 6400 dmg till Mk1 overheat.

20 hours ago, Mirza7 said:

BTW for Vulcan Mk-1-0 bullets per sec = ‭13.3333 and Mk-7-10 bps = 18.1818

100% heat in:

Mk-1-0: ‭1.0714285714285714285714285714286‬ sec

Mk-7-10: ‭0.78571428571428571428571428571427‬ sec

How significant is the difference?

> Difference in HP dmg = ‭857.14285714285714285714285714299‬ HP

Hence Mk-7-10 will deliver heat faster than Mk-1-0

if both turrets start firing at the same time (ideal) mk1 would have done 9000 dmg before mk7 even heats up. :P

First your calculations are wrong, after 12 seconds of each Mk1 and Mk8 Vulcan, Mk1 will do 4400 damage, Mk8 will do 9600. (I calculate also the burning after 9 seconds for Mk1).

The difference is approximately the double for Mk8, but what! this is just if you simultaneously shooting a certain tank without moving. But for normal occasions, the three seconds difference from 9s (Mk1 burning starts) to 12s (Mk8), will allow Mk1 to do 1780 damage, Mk8 2400 damage in those 3 seconds.

But what guys, is my topic wrong?? for sure No. In those 3 crucial seconds, neither Mk1 nor Mk8 will make its all bullets reach the target, just small amount for sure, and this is directly straightfully in sake of Mk1, as the small amount will give the Mk1 to do 300 dmg for every seconds. And the small amount of bullets will give the Mk8 as neglectable dmg in these 3 seconds.

Vulcan Mk8 is just superior in calculations, but in real battle, both are dependent on the igniting, as the small amount will allow both to raise the temperature to 300dmg per second, and the real bullet damages is neglectible. But if you insistently want just a pure calculations that didn't happen in the game. Ok..

So we just virtually imagined that both firing simultaneously at a certain tank in this 3 seconds, and the Mk8 is superior with 620 dmg approx. So I will also assume virtually that in this three seconds Mk1 Vulcan is igniting 8 tanks together, I will assume he igniting them in one second, so 8 tanks burning for 2 seconds + the direct damage for Mk1 = 5680.

So either in calculations or in reality without arbitrarily, both are in sake of Mk1Vuclan.

[Mirza7 235]

You can check last 2 points in https://en.tankiwiki.com/Temperature I verified my calculations by this. virtually or uncertain does not exist because then anything could happen like HI or defender or titan dome or you might be sniped before you even start firing.

_{I am more into programming & hacking, so no math degree :p}

Edited January 7, 2021 by Mirza7

[wolverine848 13,097]

9 hours ago, asem.harbi said:

Btw, to answer your question, Mk1 can do 4400 dmg till Mk8 overheat. Mk8 can do 6400 dmg till Mk1 overheat.

The key number is ...before mk1 overheats.

That's where mk8 shines - it does a lot more damage, and would kill a medium hull before the mk1 even starts to overheat.

 

[TheCongoSpider 8,957]

@asem.harbi 

 

The current Incendiary Band is not like the 2019 Incendiary Band where the majority of the damage came from afterburn. The majority of the current Incendiary Band's damage comes from direct damage from the projectiles. The statement that an Mk1 Incendiary Band is better than an Mk7+ Incendiary Band is untrue. Do you mean to tell us that in a battle with Legends, using an Mk1 Incendiary Band will net higher rewards than an Mk7+ Incendiary Band?