Mults and Saboteurs

[Bowser448 321]

As many of us know, players that intentionally assist the other team are annoying to deal with and ruins good battles. This is an issue that I have experienced before and I saw a topic get made about hackers, so I have decided to make a topic for the other type of battle violators. Please feel free to take the poll so the developers can hopefully see how often we encounter them and feel free to also discuss them here. You can include your frustrating experiences with them or maybe suggest a solution to the issue. I am also going to differentiate mult and sabotage to avoid any confusion.

Mult- Player who does nothing helpful the whole battle. This could be driving around the map and collection supplies while not firing at the other team or sitting in garage the whole battle.

Sabotage- Player who harms teammates rather than doing nothing and only assisting the enemy team. This would include a player who intentionally blocks his teammates. This could who include a player who uses weak equipment intentionally just to make themselves easier to kill thus helping the other team.

Edited January 20, 2022 by Bowser448

[DMR 683]

Sabotage every day, even by voting them, no one's coming to the rescue. I have some players which do sabotage [Names Removed] Moderators aren't doing their job correctly and vote option is useless

Edited January 20, 2022 by nikunj04

[ELECTR0_DRAG0N 223]

I have seen a few mults before, but sabotage is a much bigger issue. The type of sabotage I encounter the most are those who use mk1 and mk2 equipment instead of equipment suitable for their rank. I saw a marshal the other day use thunder mk1 and wasp mk2 and his KD was 1/35 with 30 points. It was TDM and we lost thanks to him! Also keep in mind that this player had mk6 and mk7 equipment he could have used instead.

[wolverine848 13,097]

14 minutes ago, ELECTR0_DRAG0N said:

I have seen a few mults before, but sabotage is a much bigger issue. The type of sabotage I encounter the most are those who use mk1 and mk2 equipment instead of equipment suitable for their rank. I saw a marshal the other day use thunder mk1 and wasp mk2 and his KD was 1/35 with 30 points. It was TDM and we lost thanks to him! Also keep in mind that this player had mk6 and mk7 equipment he could have used instead.

Marshal?   I've seen Legends with GS < 4000.

[numericable 2,375]

I dont see that many mults these days because of MM - sure there are weak players with low gear or that barely play, but i believe they do this, not to encourage the opposite side to win but because there are players that watch TV while playing, for example so their attentions are not fully kept by the game, or some who play in mobile at school, these were just fast examples but there would be a plenty of situation where players dont take the game seriously. But these, aren't the ones you mentionned - that do not play to help friend ect. Those were found in the golden days of the pro battles modes, i used to olay 15 hours matches daily during holiday 2018, and i found them very frequently, but as the MM is the main source of income now, they mostly dissapeared by the time passes.

Edited January 20, 2022 by numericable

[Maf 32,306]

"Multing" is when one person is playing on one team, and then they log in with a second account, and put the second account into the enemy team, where that account stays inactive and takes up a slot to make the team weaker. This is only relevant in PRO battles, where one can actually choose which battle and which team to join. In Matchmaking it's extremely difficult to get into the opposite team intentionally, so I highly doubt that there's people persistent enough to do that for a tiny unfair advantage. Most of the "mults" you see in battles are just people playing badly for whatever reason.

[alkyng 3,080]

For saboteurs, I rarely see any of them, but mults are everywhere, with the change I see

6 hours ago, Bowser448 said:

Sabotage- Player who harms teammates rather than doing nothing and only assisting the enemy team. This would include a player who intentionally blocks his teammates. This could who include a player who uses weak equipment intentionally just to make themselves easier to kill thus helping the other team.

With your model of a mult, this should be considered as a mult.

BTW, mults/saboteurs were alot in the game before MM, especially in 2011-2014 where there was alot of unorganized clans wars that was full of D3S. I see one of clans make a player join the opposite team ruining the battle for them. He also take the enemy flag (his clan) preventing his teammates from taking it, while he is staying in enemy team, no one kills him, because it's pre-agreed.

But for non-clan battles, it was rare to find a mult who help the other team and no one kill him. Because not all of the 10 players are knowledgeable and have the intuitive sense that this mult is actually helping them. This was for pro battles. And definitely is impossible for MM.

Edited January 20, 2022 by asem.harbi

[NikmanGT 4,376]

I play MM frequently, but I don't see any person "Sabotaging" according to the above definition.

"Mults" I can agree with and see them everyday on battle, quite frequently since the GS update issue which allows Legends to be equipped with low ranks players very frequently.

No team work, just you solo trying to achieve the objective (capturing the flag, scoring a goal) and killing enemies.

The same happens with players in High Legend battles too, I know the difference between attacking style or defending style but muting is another thing, far worse than both combined.

[alkyng 3,080]

13 minutes ago, nikunj04 said:

"Mults" I can agree with and see them everyday on battle, quite frequently since the GS update issue which allows Legends to be equipped with low ranks players very frequently.

Players who have a low GS because they're on low ranks aren't mults.

14 minutes ago, nikunj04 said:

I know the difference between attacking style or defending style but muting is another thing, far worse than both combined.

Yes you mean Shaft defenders who selectively choose which player to kill, preferring to kill a far Wasp than killing the player who meters around them and have the flag on him.

[NikmanGT 4,376]

1 hour ago, asem.harbi said:

Players who have a low GS because they're on low ranks aren't mults.

This is a frequent case for Legend ranks too, and by mults here means just moving around the map, not turning their turret etc.

[DMR 683]

2 hours ago, nikunj04 said:

I play MM frequently, but I don't see any person "Sabotaging" according to the above definition.

"Mults" I can agree with and see them everyday on battle, quite frequently since the GS update issue which allows Legends to be equipped with low ranks players very frequently.

No team work, just you solo trying to achieve the objective (capturing the flag, scoring a goal) and killing enemies.

The same happens with players in High Legend battles too, I know the difference between attacking style or defending style but muting is another thing, far worse than both combined.

You can see players sabotaging often especially in JGR mode

[Inkling_Boy 124]

I think tanki needs some form of anti-mult system in the game. I don't encounter many, but I know other players encounter them more often.

[ELECTR0_DRAG0N 223]

 

3 hours ago, Inkling_Boy said:

I think tanki needs some form of anti-mult system in the game. I don't encounter many, but I know other players encounter them more often.

I have an idea of one. I asked about it on questions to developers and they answered the worst questions possible instead. I asked them about an anti-mult system. I said it should disconnect and ban players who score 0 points over a 5 minute period. This of course would be disabled in parkour mode.

[wolverine848 13,097]

10 hours ago, Maf said:

"Multing" is when one person is playing on one team, and then they log in with a second account, and put the second account into the enemy team, where that account stays inactive and takes up a slot to make the team weaker. This is only relevant in PRO battles, where one can actually choose which battle and which team to join. In Matchmaking it's extremely difficult to get into the opposite team intentionally, so I highly doubt that there's people persistent enough to do that for a tiny unfair advantage. Most of the "mults" you see in battles are just people playing badly for whatever reason.

We use the term more loosely - include those who equip items well below the average for their rank, or those who are "in" the battle but not actively participating (they could be sitting there not moving, chatting away and ignoring the battle).

Basically anyone who takes a team spot but not contribute in any meaningful way to the battle.  Your team is playing a tank short.

[Maf 32,306]

14 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

Basically anyone who takes a team spot but not contribute in any meaningful way to the battle.  Your team is playing a tank short.

Well, in that case the definition greatly depends on where you draw the line on "meaningful contribution". I don't really judge individual players on how they perform, but I instead look at teams overall and see how well the number of "mults" on each side balances out.

[wolverine848 13,097]

Just now, Maf said:

Well, in that case the definition greatly depends on where you draw the line on "meaningful contribution". I don't really judge individual players on how they perform, but I instead look at teams overall and see how well the number of "mults" on each side balances out.

And how do you do that?

1) MM can't balance ppl doing nothing - unless - they get kicked for not meeting a low scoring threshold

2) I've seen many battles where the Teams are not close to even - by either rank or GS (Legends with 3500 GS) or combination of the two.

You know what contributes?  The win-x-missions-on-winning-team.  Encourages players to quit a battle as soon as their tea starts losing. Change that to top-2 each team or top-4 battle and less players will exit battles = (somewhat) more balanced teams.

[Maf 32,306]

2 hours ago, wolverine848 said:

And how do you do that?

By K/D and score mostly. Anyone with less than 0.4 K/D and <150 score halfway through the game is a mult in my book. I don't mind it as long as the enemy has the same number of similar players — they can do their own thing for all I care. The only time I do mind it is when they get in my way 

[VIC2000 92]

40 minutes ago, Maf said:

By K/D and score mostly. Anyone with less than 0.4 K/D and <150 score halfway through the game is a mult in my book. I don't mind it as long as the enemy has the same number of similar players — they can do their own thing for all I care. The only time I do mind it is when they get in my way 

Don't no how they get in your way when your flying above the battle most times with your fav hack, unless you bump into planes due to dodgy steering.

A mult is someone who deliberately chooses a low G/S, blocks you intentionally, stops you from capping a flag/gets you killed so they can cap, hinders you when you are trying to aim.

One could say the biggest mults are the devs. 

Edited January 20, 2022 by VIC2000

[wolverine848 13,097]

58 minutes ago, Maf said:

By K/D and score mostly. Anyone with less than 0.4 K/D and <150 score halfway through the game is a mult in my book. I don't mind it as long as the enemy has the same number of similar players — they can do their own thing for all I care. The only time I do mind it is when they get in my way 

I agree on the parameters and we seem to agree that "mult" stands for more than the original definition.

But things are not always balanced that way.  And it shows in the score.  And that's when players start exiting - why waste their time on a lost battle?  Especially when completing missions might be next to impossible.

I really don't understand why players enter a battle if they don't plan on playing the game.  Makes no sense.

 

Just finished a JUG battle where my team had a decent lead.  Next thing I know we've lost 4 players and the other team is catching up.  Something not right there - mass exodous from the winning team and we end up losing 9-8.

Edited January 20, 2022 by wolverine848

[BruhBruhThingThing 413]

11 hours ago, Inkling_Boy said:

I think tanki needs some form of anti-mult system in the game. I don't encounter many, but I know other players encounter them more often.

And how they implement it will kick players if they stop moving for 0.0000001 seconds.

[Maf 32,306]

On 1/21/2022 at 3:10 AM, VIC2000 said:

when your flying above the battle most times with your fav hack

Just goes to show that you couldn't care less about having civilised discussions, and instead keep parroting the same old arguments, despite them being invalid for months at this point.

I've seen enough.

[BruhBruhThingThing 413]

6 minutes ago, Maf said:

Just goes to show that you couldn't care less about having civilised discussions, and instead keep parroting the same old arguments, despite them being invalid for months at this point.

I've seen enough.

Speaking of which. An unrelated question, I noticed their name got slashed, I've also seen it quite a few times. So what does it mean if someone's name got slashed?

[Maf 32,306]

On 1/21/2022 at 3:11 AM, wolverine848 said:

But things are not always balanced that way.  And it shows in the score.  And that's when players start exiting - why waste their time on a lost battle?  Especially when completing missions might be next to impossible.

It's fine when the weaker players leave, since they don't contribute much to the battle result and I totally understand that they might want to leave as soon as they complete their mission, or they just get frustrated from having to fight buyers with thousands more GS points than them.

What really triggers me is when a strong player (or worse — a group), that was clearly chosen by MM to be the "carry" in that battle, immediately leaves the instant their team starts losing, thus ruining any chance for a balanced battle in that round.

Just had one of those a couple days ago, on Berlin RGB. Two clans in opposing teams — 4 people in enemy team, and 3 people in my team. Including myself, that makes an even 4vs4 fight between players with top-tier gear. I was looking forward to finally having an intense, balanced battle. The score was 0-0 for nearly 7 minutes, both teams getting very close to scoring a goal. Then, one enemy player gets extremely lucky and somehow drives past our defence, barely scores and dies. No big deal, right? We'll just fight back and score two goals in return! Nope — our team's group immediately bails, gets replaced with some mediocre players, and the enemy scores another 6 goals within the next 4 minutes.

Smh my head

 

6 minutes ago, BruhBruhThingThing said:

Speaking of which. An unrelated question, I noticed their name got slashed, I've also seen it quite a few times. So what does it mean if someone's name got slashed?

It means the account is deactivated.

[wolverine848 13,097]

1 hour ago, Maf said:

Just had one of those a couple days ago, on Berlin RGB. Two clans in opposing teams — 4 people in enemy team, and 3 people in my team. Including myself, that makes an even 4vs4 fight between players with top-tier gear. I was looking forward to finally having an intense, balanced battle. The score was 0-0 for nearly 7 minutes, both teams getting very close to scoring a goal. Then, one enemy player gets extremely lucky and somehow drives past our defence, barely scores and dies. No big deal, right? We'll just fight back and score two goals in return! Nope — our team's group immediately bails, gets replaced with some mediocre players, and the enemy scores another 6 goals within the next 4 minutes.

Do you think the Top-3-winnders teams might be a contributing factor?

When I had finished daily missions yesterday only thing left was one of those weekly top-3 we can't change.  Whenever MM put me in a battle with my team already losing, or less than 10 min in battle, I exited.  What do I have to fight for?  Can't possibly finish my mission and I'm not wasting supplies when I know I will get less than their worth in any reward.

I'm sure there's been a bajillion complaints about those missions.  Keep passing along our feedback - Top-3-Winners does NOT induce us to play.  It does the opposite - encourages us to quit battles.

[x_Sorinel_x 552]

6 hours ago, Maf said:

No big deal, right? We'll just fight back and score two goals in return! Nope — our team's group immediately bails, gets replaced with some mediocre players, and the enemy scores another 6 goals within the next 4 minutes.

The chance ? What was the chance that you will score 2 goals and win ? Maybe 5% ? Or ZERO ? I do the same, enemy team is ahead, instant "run". Tired to waste time and 1000 druggs for noob players in my team.

15 minutes battles. You think I play all the time ? If enemy is ahead in first 2-3 minutes, instant "run".