valid Death zones in Juggernaut Mode

[Cor7y 13,862]

Juggernaut mode is fun and all, but I'm sure there's one thing we all hate - Camping Juggernauts.

Seriously, those guys just stay in their base the entire time and camp. After having the fastest hull in the game. I don't know about others, but for me it just takes all the fun out of the mode. What's the point of playing if all the enemy juggernaut is going to do is camp the entire game?

 

So, I propose "Death zones" in the Juggernaut mode - Only for the juggernaut.

If a juggernaut stays at one place for too long, the system automatically detects it and sends a warning to the player to move out of that zone and gives him a grace time to do so. If he does not comply, he will automatically self-destruct, enemy team will get a point, and the Juggernaut will be passed on to the next player.

 

For example, say the Juggernaut has been camping in his base for too long in the Sandbox map. (Which happens 90% of the time)

The "allowed" camping time could be, say, 15 seconds. As time runs out, the player will see a kind of blinking light, indicating that he has to change position.

After the "allowed" camping time is over, the system warns him to get out of that area within 5 seconds (grace period), or he will self destruct.

The whole red marked zone will then become a self destruct zone for the juggernaut.

If he changes position and starts camping at another location, the same happens, and so on.

 

I believe this system will make Juggernaut games waaaay more interesting, as it forces Juggernauts to move around the map and play normally, instead of simply camping in their bases like couch potatoes.

 

Thoughts?

[NikmanGT 4,376]

Valid

Sounds good, I play TJR, so I know exactly what the suggestion is for, I don't like it when the Jugg starts camping, especially behind those containers on top left and right. But I think the time should be extended to 30 seconds, to give players a fair chance, 20 seconds would be too short, and they should need it sometimes to hide from Viking Overdrive or a continuous shaft aiming at them.

[Maf 32,306]

20 minutes ago, Cor7y said:

Seriously, those guys just stay in their base the entire time and camp. After having the fastest hull in the game. I don't know about others, but for me it just takes all the fun out of the mode. What's the point of playing if all the enemy juggernaut is going to do is camp the entire game?

If you're playing for the sake of your team and you're trying to win the game as Juggernaut, then camping in the base is the most effective strategy. It's not fun, but it's the only way to stand a chance against all the enemy viking overdrives and crazy augment/drone combos.

Death zones would work, but it's the wrong approach to solving the issue, in a sense that it's proposing a solution to a consequence of another problem, instead of the solving the original problem.

Original problem: Juggernaut is too exposed when outside the base so camping is the way to win
Consequence: People camp with Juggernaut in order to win
Your solution: Punish Juggernaut campers to prevent camping

Alternatively, you could solve the original problem to prevent people wanting to camp in the first place, such as giving the Juggernaut bonus OD charge if he kills a freshly spawned enemy, thus requiring him to leave the base in order to claim the bonus, or simply removing/editing maps on which hardcore camping is possible.

[Dopamine 2,161]

13 minutes ago, Maf said:

If you're playing for the sake of your team and you're trying to win the game as Juggernaut, then camping in the base is the most effective strategy. It's not fun, but it's the only way to stand a chance against all the enemy viking overdrives and crazy augment/drone combos.

Death zones would work, but it's the wrong approach to solving the issue, in a sense that it's proposing a solution to a consequence of another problem, instead of the solving the original problem.

Original problem: Juggernaut is too exposed when outside the base so camping is the way to win
Consequence: People camp with Juggernaut in order to win
Your solution: Punish Juggernaut campers to prevent camping

Alternatively, you could solve the original problem to prevent people wanting to camp in the first place, such as giving the Juggernaut bonus OD charge if he kills a freshly spawned enemy, thus requiring him to leave the base in order to claim the bonus, or simply removing/editing maps on which hardcore camping is possible.

Actually, I dont´t think it is that bad of an idea. If self destruction time is not too short (let´s say 20- 30s as Nikman suggested), this would not cause juggernauts to avoid these places at all cost. To do contrary, it would mean these areas would still remain powerful defensive resources, but you would have to be smart about using them (looking for viking od approachig etc.).

[Poppy 422]

I like it. Maybe not self-destruct, but just lose some hp.

[JustBlackWolf 878]

I mostly agree with Maf on this one, but the idea isn't too bad, if it gets implemented, in my opinion, these zones would need to be disabled if an enemy is in your spawn. If the spawn is empty, then the countdown can be applied.

Edited February 28, 2022 by JustBlackWolf

[DaringDeer 656]

This is one of my favorite modes (despite rarely getting to be jug) but excessively camping jugs with lots of healers make this mode frustrating at times.  Maf is correct that, given current game parameters, best strategy is to camp if you prioritize a win.  Anytime jug moves from safety he can die relatively easily via striker/shaft/freeze/viking OD.  It is hard to come up with changes that can improve the enjoyment in this mode.  I like Poppy's idea about taking passive damage while in own base for too long.  Some ideas:

• Where jug is on map affects OD charge rate
• When jug kills another jug something special happens like golds drop, bonus crystals/xp for jug, refreshes jug's OD
• Cap time allowed to be jug for 3 minutes after which time the jug will self-destruct without giving opponent a point and another player on team will become jug randomly (not the person who recently died which is gamed by many players to become jug).  

My biggest issue in this mode still is the unfairness in setting initial juggernaut.  In the groups I play in, there is a clear hierarchy (Tyzo then Law then TK then Viper) of who gets to be first jug, which is the juiciest time to be jug because you don't have to worry about ODs.   

 

[Dopamine 2,161]

1 hour ago, DaringDeer said:

• When jug kills another jug something special happens like golds drop, bonus crystals/xp for jug, refreshes jug's OD

Given the fact some juggernauts just launch themselves into the enemy territory without any apparent reason, I am kind of afraid what would happen if this got implemented .

[wolverine848 13,097]

6 hours ago, frederik123456 said:

Actually, I dont´t think it is that bad of an idea. If self destruction time is not too short (let´s say 20- 30s as Nikman suggested), this would not cause juggernauts to avoid these places at all cost. To do contrary, it would mean these areas would still remain powerful defensive resources, but you would have to be smart about using them (looking for viking od approachig etc.).

1) Entire team will be punished if the current JUG dosn't follow these rules.

2) Sometimes camping is the only way one team stands a chance - if they are overmatched, as we all know MM is far from perfect in setting up balanced teams.  If they realize they are overmatched early, many will just hit exit.

3) If ur gonna force the JUG out in the open, what's the solution about viking OD?  There's a reason so many players use viking in TJUG.

[Dopamine 2,161]

20 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

1) Entire team will be punished if the current JUG dosn't follow these rules.

TJR has an inherent flaw so to speak, and that is the whole team is punished for mistakes of the JUG, that holds true in the current state and wouldn´t change much with this update.

20 minutes ago, wolverine848 said:

2) Sometimes camping is the only way one team stands a chance - if they are overmatched, as we all know MM is far from perfect in setting up balanced teams.  If they realize they are overmatched early, many will just hit exit.

3) If ur gonna force the JUG out in the open, what's the solution about viking OD?  There's a reason so many players use viking in TJUG.

I mostly agree with your concerns but I don´t think no. 3 is valid, as I specifically stated this should not force the Jug out in the open. Rather, these hiding spots would still remain important, while more consideration would be needed to use them effectively. Of course if this condition is not met, then this change would be more detrimental than useful.

 

[NikmanGT 4,376]

On 4/20/2022 at 5:49 PM, max6782 said:

 

Topic Merged