Let's Discuss Shaft!

[wolverine848 13,097]

''Shaft can one-shot a Viking with scope.  Then also, in two seconds kill a hornet if it happens to be close?''

 

two seconds?? so here you assume that after firing a scope the Shaft with have a FULL CLIP and then finish off a hornet in 2 seconds?

Because it can't finish it in 2 seconds if it has to reload

 

you are right that the last delay does not matter for the damage

 

If we follow how you say it is,

shooting 3 times will take 3 seconds alone, and if you add the delay of the first 2 shots (.5 each) that will add a second making it 4 seconds to unload the entire clip

two seconds?? so here you assume that after firing a scope the Shaft with have a FULL CLIP and then finish off a hornet in 2 seconds?

Because it can't finish it in 2 seconds if it has to reload

This is not what I'm saying.  I clarified that as "OR".  The two seconds was the amount of time it takes to deliver 3 shots IF the reload is 1 second.  But based on this "arcade shot reload decreased to 0,5s" it is actually 2x 0.5 = 1 second.

 

http://en.tankiforum.com/index.php?showtopic=377922&page=1  post#2...

 

 

If we follow how you say it is,

shooting 3 times will take 3 seconds alone, and if you add the delay of the first 2 shots (.5 each) that will add a second making it 4 seconds to unload the entire clip

You misunderstand what delay is... "delay" = Re-load.   Re-load = delay.   Shot -- 0.5 -- Shot -- 0.5 -- Shot.    One second to deliver 3 shots.

[Truthteller 4,204]

two seconds?? so here you assume that after firing a scope the Shaft with have a FULL CLIP and then finish off a hornet in 2 seconds?

Because it can't finish it in 2 seconds if it has to reload

This is not what I'm saying.  I clarified that as "OR".  The two seconds was the amount of time it takes to deliver 3 shots IF the reload is 1 second.  But based on this "arcade shot reload decreased to 0,5s" it is actually 2x 0.5 = 1 second.

 

http://en.tankiforum.com/index.php?showtopic=377922&page=1  post#2...

 

 

If we follow how you say it is,

shooting 3 times will take 3 seconds alone, and if you add the delay of the first 2 shots (.5 each) that will add a second making it 4 seconds to unload the entire clip

You misunderstand what delay is... "delay" = Re-load.   Re-load = delay.   Shot -- 0.5 -- Shot -- 0.5 -- Shot.    One second to deliver 3 shots.

''Shaft can one-shot a Viking with scope.  Then also, in two seconds kill a hornet if it happens to be close?''

 

You did not use OR here

 

You can only accounting for the DELAY and ignoring that is takes a second to fire each shot too, you are confused because you haven't used this alteration and are just looking at wiki and confusing yourself.

Edited March 21, 2019 by Truthteller

[wolverine848 13,097]

''Shaft can one-shot a Viking with scope.  Then also, in two seconds kill a hornet if it happens to be close?''

 

You did not use OR here

 

You can only accounting for the DELAY and ignoring that is takes a second to fire each shot too, you are confused because you haven't used this alteration and are just looking at wiki and confusing yourself.

"I read what you posted and then I clarified - which it seems you did not read.  I meant that you can scope someone at long range, OR you can have the option to fire rapidly at close range if needed.  Can Hammer do that?"   post# 7119

 

Shots from smoky, Thunder, hammer, shaft are instantaneous. As soon as you press space-bar server records a hit or miss.

~ no travel time.

[Truthteller 4,204]

"I read what you posted and then I clarified - which it seems you did not read.  I meant that you can scope someone at long range, OR you can have the option to fire rapidly at close range if needed.  Can Hammer do that?"   post# 7119

 

Shots from smoky, Thunder, hammer, shaft are instantaneous. As soon as you press space-bar server records a hit or miss.

~ no travel time.

Ok, the damage is instantly done but it still takes 3 seconds to use the full clip not 1 second

 

Compare this to Railgun, Magnum or Duplet and it takes longer for a Shaft to kill a light hull then.

[TheCongoSpider 8,962]

Ok, the damage is instantly done but it still takes 3 seconds to use the full clip not 1 second

 

Compare this to Railgun, Magnum or Duplet and it takes longer for a Shaft to kill a light hull then.

Tried it in the Test Server just now. 

 

Many players get confused and accidentally count the shots as delays as well. When a guy said how M4 Duplet empties its clip in 0.54 seconds, I had to correct him and said that it empties it in 0.27 seconds because there is no delay on the first shot as it is already loaded. The guy thought shots=delays and calculated it wrong. In theory, I thought Rapid-Fire Mode would release all of its shots in 1 second or 1.05 (basically slightly above 1 second) seconds if it wasn't the former. What I got after testing it was that it empties the clip in 1.5 seconds and not 1 second as I had originally thought. 

 

Personally, I prefer to use Standard M4 Shaft. I like to shoot every 1.5 seconds when my clip is empty instead of every 2.5 seconds. It's only good for short range anyway. Anywhere after 70 meters and you're practically tickling the enemy. 

 

 

And I  don't like it that people think things are OP because they see the damage it does when used with the Booster drone. Like, do they have any common sense? They need to know that the Booster drone makes anything overpowered but no, let's judge it based on how it performs together with a 20/20 Booster Drone. 

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

Tried it in the Test Server just now. 

 

Many players get confused and accidentally count the shots as delays as well. When a guy said how M4 Duplet empties its clip in 0.54 seconds, I had to correct him and said that it empties it in 0.27 seconds because there is no delay on the first shot as it is already loaded. The guy thought shots=delays and calculated it wrong.

 

In theory, I thought Rapid-Fire Mode would release all of its shots in 1 second or 1.05 (basically slightly above 1 second) seconds if it wasn't the former. What I got after testing it was that it empties the clip in 1.5 seconds and not 1 second as I had originally thought. 

 

It's only good for short range anyway. Anywhere after 70 meters and you're practically tickling the enemy. 

 

How the hell it is 1.5 second?? Wait..... its firerate is 0.75 second?

[wolverine848 13,097]

How the hell it is 1.5 second?? Wait..... its firerate is 0.75 second?

According to WIKI - the arcade reload = 0.5 s ... yes... 1/2 second... same as Smoky autocannon (until energy depleted)

 

So in practice it probably takes somewhere between 1 second and 1.5 seconds to empty the energy pool = 3 shots.

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

According to WIKI - the arcade reload = 0.5 s ... yes... 1/2 second... same as Smoky autocannon (until energy depleted)

 

So in practice it probably takes somewhere between 1 second and 1.5 seconds to empty the energy pool = 3 shots.

Alright wolv. You are right. However testing the alternation to prove your point is crucial. Edited March 22, 2019 by FrozenRailgun

[TheCongoSpider 8,962]

According to WIKI - the arcade reload = 0.5 s ... yes... 1/2 second... same as Smoky autocannon (until energy depleted)

 

So in practice it probably takes somewhere between 1 second and 1.5 seconds to empty the energy pool = 3 shots.

I did it! I proved my Autocannon vs Rapid-Fire Mode disparity I saw a while ago. In the Test Server just now, I emptied my clip and saw the firing rate of Shaft with Rapid-Fire Mode. Then I equipped Autocannon on M0 Smoky (so if anything, by logic if there was any disparity, it would shoot slower than Shaft) and M0 Smoky with Autocannon shoots FASTER than Shaft with Rapid-Fire Mode. 

 

I knew they couldn't be the same. I see the speed at which Autocannon Smokies hit me every day and I see the speed at which Rapid-Fire Mode Shafts hit me from time to time. They are either doing this on purpose or they made a mistake. With how things have been, the former is very much more likely. 

[wolverine848 13,097]

I did it! I proved my Autocannon vs Rapid-Fire Mode disparity I saw a while ago. In the Test Server just now, I emptied my clip and saw the firing rate of Shaft with Rapid-Fire Mode. Then I equipped Autocannon on M0 Smoky (so if anything, by logic if there was any disparity, it would shoot slower than Shaft) and M0 Smoky with Autocannon shoots FASTER than Shaft with Rapid-Fire Mode. 

 

I knew they couldn't be the same. I see the speed at which Autocannon Smokies hit me every day and I see the speed at which Rapid-Fire Mode Shafts hit me from time to time. They are either doing this on purpose or they made a mistake. With how things have been, the former is very much more likely. 

Could be a mistake on WIKI or a mistake in implementation (a la supercumulative crits)... who knows.

 

FYI on the smoky m0... the re-load is superceded by the Alt.  Auto-cannon fixes reload (at 0.5s) regardless of m-level of the turret.

[TheCongoSpider 8,962]

FYI on the smoky m0... the re-load is superceded by the Alt.  Auto-cannon fixes reload (at 0.5s) regardless of m-level of the turret.

I had a feeling you would have told me that when I saw how I phrased the sentence. I know that it fixes the reload to 0.5 seconds on all modifications. I just made sure to use M0 Smoky so, if anything, it would show that the turret at the lowest modification shoots faster than any Shaft with Rapid-Fire Mode. (It's just a precaution and to further justify the "mistake" they may have made.)

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

Hm... I feel like Light Capacitor should get a buff.

[TheCongoSpider 8,962]

Hm... I feel like Light Capacitor should get a buff.

Yeah, I don't see why you would run Light Capacitors unless the entire enemy team is light hulls. I guess what makes it balanced is how fast you're able to kill unprotected heavy hulls? If it gave a decreased reload speed after a scoped shot, then I may buy it but with its current stats, I'd rather use Short-Band Emitters. 

[TheCongoSpider 8,962]

Some more Assault Emitters (Short-Band Emitters) games. Putting them in 3 spoilers so you won't have to look at all of them in one spoiler. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Made the drawing kill here.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

Yeah, I don't see why you would run Light Capacitors unless the entire enemy team is light hulls. I guess what makes it balanced is how fast you're able to kill unprotected heavy hulls? If it gave a decreased reload speed after a scoped shot, then I may buy it but with its current stats, I'd rather use Short-Band Emitters.

 

To me, the energy consumption per second need buff. From 400 energies per second to 500 energies per sec.

 

And.... energy recharge should be 200 energy per sec with Light Capacitor. Regardless what M it is.

 

Hm.... let's see.... Hornet's Overdrive, Double Power and M4 LC.... one shot KO to anything even the most heavily protected heavy hull. Except the Juggernaut.

[EmperorTrump 10]

The laser from Shaft obviously needs to be removed.

 

Also, the rotation speed in sniping mode is way to slow.  Whenever an opponent finds you (usually because of the laser), there's no way to turn Shaft fast enough to defend yourself.  You are just a sitting duck at this point.  

 

And why can't you exit sniping mode without firing a shot and having to wait for the recharge?  This is especially bad when an opponent attacks while in sniping mode because the turret doesn't have fast enough rotation, so you have to fire the shot at nothing then wait for reload time which isn't usually fast enough to defend.

Edited March 30, 2019 by EmperorTrump

[Pyre 3,485]

 

The laser from Shaft obviously needs to be removed.

 

Also, the rotation speed in sniping mode is way to slow.  Whenever an opponent finds you (usually because of the laser), there's no way to turn Shaft fast enough to defend yourself.  You are just a sitting duck at this point.  

 

And why can't you exit sniping mode without firing a shot and having to wait for the recharge?  This is especially bad when an opponent attacks while in sniping mode because the turret doesn't have fast enough rotation, so you have to fire the shot at nothing then wait for reload time which isn't usually fast enough to defend.

 

Not being able to defend itself while in sniping mode is kinda the point of having a sniper turret; effective at long ranges, but vulnerable up close.  Only go into sniper mode if you are in a safe place. If there are enemies close by, your arcade shots are enough to protect you.

[FrozenRailgun 1,771]

The laser from Shaft obviously needs to be removed.

 

Also, the rotation speed in sniping mode is way to slow.  Whenever an opponent finds you (usually because of the laser), there's no way to turn Shaft fast enough to defend yourself.  You are just a sitting duck at this point.  

 

And why can't you exit sniping mode without firing a shot and having to wait for the recharge?  This is especially bad when an opponent attacks while in sniping mode because the turret doesn't have fast enough rotation, so you have to fire the shot at nothing then wait for reload time which isn't usually fast enough to defend.

Oh hell no! If Alternativa removes the laser, guess what? Bunch of tankers gonna spam Eagle! Just learn to hide your laser.

 

LOL you have a buffed arcade shot to help you.

 

The 3rd paragraph.... you are right now. I noticed that even when charging sniper shot for more than 1 second...... double-tapped the Enter spacebar..... And it fires the shot. Probably a secret nerf that Alternativa did or a bug.

[POKEFREEK 19]

can anyone tell me which alteration is best for shaft??

[wolverine848 13,097]

 

The laser from Shaft obviously needs to be removed.

 

Also, the rotation speed in sniping mode is way to slow.  Whenever an opponent finds you (usually because of the laser), there's no way to turn Shaft fast enough to defend yourself.  You are just a sitting duck at this point.  

 

And why can't you exit sniping mode without firing a shot and having to wait for the recharge?  This is especially bad when an opponent attacks while in sniping mode because the turret doesn't have fast enough rotation, so you have to fire the shot at nothing then wait for reload time which isn't usually fast enough to defend.

 

So... just pick off players with one-shot-kills every 10 seconds or so?  That sounds fair... :blink:

There's a reason the scope was added in the first place.

 

You aren't supposed to stay in scope for half the battle.  Battleground awareness is also a skill.

[DieselPlatinum 5,121]

can anyone tell me which alteration is best for shaft??

Obviously it's the rapid fire mode.

[ghost-guns 1,486]

Obviously it's the rapid fire mode.

That rapid fire alt is so annoying. Shaft is suddenly a short ranged attacking weapon. I was playing with a beefy mammoth thunder combo and a shaft wasp was totally decimating me.

[TheCongoSpider 8,962]

That rapid fire alt is so annoying. Shaft is suddenly a short ranged attacking weapon. I was playing with a beefy mammoth thunder combo and a shaft wasp was totally decimating me.

Well, Shaft's damage drops to 25% after a short-range equivalent to Hammer's minimum damage range. That's a huge drop. You have to get in close to deal good damage. They made the arcade shots short-ranged, you know. It's impractical to shoot arcade shots across the map unless it is a medium hull you left with a slither of health after a sniper shot. 

 

I can't seem to figure out my Shaft's minimum damage range. I have a good idea of it but when I think I'm about to do about 1,300 damage to finish them off, I end up doing 33 damage. Since they are running away, I have to shoot them 2 - 4 more times to kill them which is enough time for a teammate or enemy (in DM or Juggernaut) to steal the kill. I prefer sniping shots over using arcade shots as my primary weapon. 

[wolverine848 13,097]

Well, Shaft's damage drops to 25% after a short-range equivalent to Hammer's minimum damage range. That's a huge drop. You have to get in close to deal good damage. They made the arcade shots short-ranged, you know. It's impractical to shoot arcade shots across the map unless it is a medium hull you left with a slither of health after a sniper shot. 

 

I can't seem to figure out my Shaft's minimum damage range. I have a good idea of it but when I think I'm about to do about 1,300 damage to finish them off, I end up doing 33 damage. Since they are running away, I have to shoot them 2 - 4 more times to kill them which is enough time for a teammate or enemy (in DM or Juggernaut) to steal the kill. I prefer sniping shots over using arcade shots as my primary weapon. 

Does Arcade not have "weak damage" around 25%?   If so - that 33 does not sound even close to being correct...

 

Unless you are facing 50% module in addition to other factors.  Which means you weren't going to do 1,300 damage either.

[TheCongoSpider 8,962]

Does Arcade not have "weak damage" around 25%?   If so - that 33 does not sound even close to being correct...

 

Unless you are facing 50% module in addition to other factors.  Which means you weren't going to do 1,300 damage either.

Sorry about that. I meant to say 334 damage.