declined Add a delay and an indicator for crisis's supply changing ability.

[TheCongoSpider 8,968]

Too many things are intertwined with each other for them to just apply a big nerf like this to Crisis, not without other complimentary changes happening. 

What is Crisis' purpose in the current line-up of drones? What do the devs intend for its continued existence? it a passive moneymaker that also adds fun and variety to a buyer's gameplay? To use it to its full and intended potential, you need to be burning hundreds of supplies every battle. 

 

The average TTK across the board has been decreasing over the years, and drone paramaters have been changing to suit that. Different status effects can be and are active in battles. Overdrives charge slower than before. This may be the intended gameplay speed they are trying to achieve. 

 

Take the Booster drone for example. After the rework and nerfs, it was meant to be a low-risk, smaller constant boost to your turret's efficiency. While Crisis was the big boost in efficiency with the risk of being vulnerable while you are dishing it out. Booster when it got nerfed to 20% locked the main attraction of the drone, major interaction changes, behind the Adrenaline augments. Many complained that there was little to no point using Booster when Crisis existed. It gave a much larger bonus that they could benefit from if they used ranged turrets that minimised the risk of being vulnerable. 

 

A way they could have increased Booster's worth was by nerfing turret damage across the board and then buffing Booster. But in doing so, they'd be changing the overall speed of gameplay. Many augments may become much worse than the damage nerf lets on. Defender may become more potent at its job than they would like it to be. Lower damage means extra time for the speedy drones, Crisis and Trickster, to capture objectives. Where will Crisis' bonuses be with this change? What would then be its purpose compared to the others here? Would it have an even higher bonus than the new Booster? How much higher? Some maps and game modes may suffer sudden imbalance with this major shift.

In the end, they went down the route of giving Booster the BARE minimum buff of +5%, which allowed it to regain many of the interaction changes that were previously locked behind Adrenaline. Instead of changing the speed of gameplay, they simply made Booster slightly better at its current job. That tells me that low TTK across the board and the experience/atmosphere it gives players everywhere around the game is crucial to them for the foreseeable future. 

 

I personally don't agree with the suggestion but if it's getting any substantial nerf, it's not going to be in the near future. If it is in the near future, then it's going to have other changes accompanying it which may make the experience in battle better for some and worse for others. 

[Akame 4,599]

On 10/11/2023 at 5:04 AM, PirateSpider said:

 

 

Also, if you want to convince us that crisis truly isn't OP with your screenshots, then I'd suggest you not use light hulls because they obviously die quickly.

LOL, I literally main shaft hopper for a long time now.

YOU can NOT simply say 'oh crisis is op, needs a delay', and then tell me 'to not use light hulls, they die quickly', make your mind up, crisis is either op or it isn't. 

OR do you want to finally admit it also depends on the rest of the combo.

On 10/11/2023 at 12:26 PM, firety31 said:

You have a large gallery honestly that we even can borrow things from it honestly

  Hide contents

 

Ah yes, ignore the flipped enemy and defenceless base, because that clearly shows 'crisis is OP' and not that 'players are bad'. That was also on the early access of ares where people didn't understand much of it. Feel free to filter more gifs, I have not posted a bunch here, there are far more on the EN TO Discord Content channels.

 

The 'adding a delay' is not the way to go about the change, the parameters itself are like the post above mentions.

[PirateSpider 1,491]

On 10/11/2023 at 6:08 AM, TheCongoSpider said:

Too many things are intertwined with each other for them to just apply a big nerf like this to Crisis, not without other complimentary changes happening. 

Not really a big nerf, maybe to those that use it in this way, but in general, its a pretty small nerf.

On 10/11/2023 at 8:58 AM, Akame said:

LOL, I literally main shaft hopper for a long time now.

YOU can NOT simply say 'oh crisis is op, needs a delay', and then tell me 'to not use light hulls, they die quickly', make your mind up, crisis is either op or it isn't. 

OR do you want to finally admit it also depends on the rest of the combo.

I never said that crisis is OP with any combo. Besides, light hulls will die quickly regardless of what drones or protections you use, that has been common knowledge for the community for so many years now.

[Hypersomnia 1,739]

On 10/11/2023 at 7:20 PM, PirateSpider said:

Besides, light hulls will die quickly regardless of what drones or protections you use

Take a guess on what hull i was using. Wink wink nudge nudge radar hull with cat ears turret.

Do you honestly play this game or just got mad that random Crisis user killed you a couple of times and decided to make this monstrocity of a topic?

Spoiler

If you think you can get this score by just camping in the same place you never played with Hornet + Gauss. Also i know your response will be "yOu uSed CrIsiS GRRRRR". Yes I did and it did play a role. But Hornet is by far the most important part of this conbo.

 

On 10/11/2023 at 7:20 PM, PirateSpider said:

Not really a big nerf, maybe to those that use it in this way, but in general, its a pretty small nerf.

> Make the item literally unusable in most situations

> "not really a big nerf"

On 10/11/2023 at 6:58 PM, Akame said:

Ah yes, ignore the flipped enemy and defenceless base, because that clearly shows 'crisis is OP'

Also wastes 12 supplies instead of 3 if not less that most of the players would use in the same situation and still cap because the enemy team doesn't exist.

[Akame 4,599]

On 10/9/2023 at 5:20 PM, PirateSpider said:

 

Yeah, well a crisis tryharding with it makes it even more broken.

 

On 10/11/2023 at 5:20 PM, PirateSpider said:

 

I never said that crisis is OP with any combo. Besides, light hulls will die quickly regardless of what drones or protections you use, that has been common knowledge for the community for so many years now.

Clearly stated well, in the early messages but not consistently enough, we all know heavier and well protected hulls will generally plough through the average game provided a generic decent augment. That is naturally common knowledge already. But to to penalise an item because a few categories are broken with it, is hefty. We all know nerfs will come; eventually, helios flashbacks, etc etc etc. 

Again, adding a delay isn't the answer. Especially with the servers being as is.

[TheCongoSpider 8,968]

On 10/11/2023 at 12:20 PM, PirateSpider said:

Not really a big nerf

Your suggestion is a big nerf to the maximum potential  of the current state of Crisis. 

 

On 10/11/2023 at 12:20 PM, PirateSpider said:

maybe to those that use it in this way, but in general, its a pretty small nerf.

Your suggestion seems to discourage active gameplay with the drone and instead encourages camping with it. There's more than enough camping in the game as it is. 

One of the things I like about the current Shaft is that there is incentive to be proactive with the turret and a "punishment" for camping (long sniping reload). I had always found it asinine that Shaft had a 3-second sniping reload for so long. There was virtually no punishment for missing a sniping shot because you'd be back in sniping mode 3 seconds later. 

[alkyng 3,081]

On 10/11/2023 at 7:33 PM, Kimura said:

Take a guess on what hull i was using. Wink wink nudge nudge radar hull with cat ears turret.

PirateSpider should have made his statement more clearer by saying :Besides, light hulls will die quickly regardless of what drones  Except Crisis.

On 10/11/2023 at 7:44 PM, Akame said:

We all know nerfs will come;

Why do you think the nerf will come?

On 10/11/2023 at 8:17 PM, TheCongoSpider said:

Your suggestion is a big nerf to the maximum potential  of the current state of Crisis. 

A big nerf? Crisis still has 60% increased damage and permanent active supplies, and has the most important factor in the game, speed. I don't see how 1 or 2s delay would be a big (or as some assumed unplayable) nerf!

On 10/11/2023 at 7:44 PM, Akame said:

Again, adding a delay isn't the answer. Especially with the servers being as is.

Server lags don't chase Crisis users only, it affect everyone. Literally this sentence can be said about every drone, I suggest to make Booster's increased damage to be as OP as Crisis +60%, because the no-damage lag.. lol

On 10/11/2023 at 6:58 PM, Akame said:

Ah yes, ignore the flipped enemy and defenceless base, because that clearly shows 'crisis is OP' and not that 'players are bad'.

But I haven't ignored a heavy hull being able to jump literally an obstacle with Crisis's game lagging speed

[PirateSpider 1,491]

On 10/11/2023 at 9:33 AM, Kimura said:

Take a guess on what hull i was using. Wink wink nudge nudge radar hull with cat ears turret.

 

Care to tell use what drone you used in that battle?

On 10/11/2023 at 9:33 AM, Kimura said:

Make the item literally unusable in most situations

Honestly, if you can't adapt to something like this, then maybe you arent as good as you brag about.

On 10/11/2023 at 9:44 AM, Akame said:

Clearly stated well, in the early messages but not consistently enough

What the "it" I'm talking about in that post?

On 10/11/2023 at 9:44 AM, Akame said:

Again, adding a delay isn't the answer.

Then what is your "answer"?

On 10/11/2023 at 10:17 AM, TheCongoSpider said:

Your suggestion seems to discourage active gameplay with the drone and instead encourages camping with it.

Actually, if anything, it'll encourages utilizing the players surroundings more.

It'll encourage more non crisis users to not run away from a crisis user whether it be moving away, self destructing, or even leaving the battle.

[alkyng 3,081]

On 10/11/2023 at 9:14 PM, PirateSpider said:

Honestly, if you can't adapt to something like this, then maybe you arent as good as you brag about.

Oh, even Kimura! I remember back in the days Akame used to say he is a very skilled player while posting his endless gifs with the most balanced combo at that time 2020 (Hopper - Crisis - Shaft RFM). While the most logical posters were considering themselves as average in discussion, because this is the only valid assumption to rely your discussion on. It seems there are mutual thoughts between Crisis users, I would like to test that adrenaline that makes me this delusional tbh!

[MEXICAN-SKY 308]

On 10/11/2023 at 6:17 PM, TheCongoSpider said:

There was virtually no punishment for missing a sniping shot because you'd be back in sniping mode 3 seconds later. 

Shaft was primarily invented for the game to be used as a "SNIPING" turret.

Then the devs in their wisdom gave it a laser so you could see where they were sniping from (makes sense-NOT)

Now they have, along with multiple other turrets gave it the ability to "heal".

The complete stupidity of these updates, augments and the legal paladin hack not withstanding are what makes this game not only complicated, but broken for many players.

Crisis was broken back when it FIRST came out, (and that was only because it was container based and you had to be lucky to get it) now it is just another drone, that along with whatever combo you have along side it gets squished by the huge array of augments that have imo ruined the game.

Augments are the issue not drones and certainly not crisis.

[PirateSpider 1,491]

On 10/11/2023 at 11:21 AM, firety31 said:

Oh, even Kimura! I remember back in the days Akame used to say he is a very skilled player while posting his endless gifs with the most balanced combo at that time 2020 (Hopper - Crisis - Shaft RFM). While the most logical posters were considering themselves as average in discussion, because this is the only valid assumption to rely your discussion on. It seems there are mutual thoughts between Crisis users, I would like to test that adrenaline that makes me this delusional tbh!

Honestly, I still have my doubts on his claims of getting 1500+ every battle, even though he showed me many screenshots of him doing it.

But that's another matter.

[Akame 4,599]

On 10/11/2023 at 7:21 PM, firety31 said:

(Hopper - Crisis - Shaft RFM). 

LMAO RFM, I despise that augment, try again.

On 10/11/2023 at 7:09 PM, firety31 said:

Besides, light hulls will die quickly regardless of what drones  Except Crisis.

 

funny; you must be talking about camping players

On 10/11/2023 at 7:14 PM, PirateSpider said:

 

Then what is your "answer"?

 

Reducing the damage buff would be suffice, reducing ttk.

On 10/11/2023 at 7:09 PM, firety31 said:

 

A big nerf? Crisis still has 60% increased damage and permanent active supplies, and has the most important factor in the game, speed. I don't see how 1 or 2s delay would be a big (or as some assumed unplayable) nerf!

Server lags don't chase Crisis users only, it affect everyone. Literally this sentence can be said about every drone, I suggest to make Booster's increased damage to be as OP as Crisis +60%, because the no-damage lag.. lol

But I haven't ignored a heavy hull being able to jump literally an obstacle with Crisis's game lagging speed

You clearly haven't played enough with crisis. or you simply hide a lot. Just because a few others can use it effectively in a 1-1 situation (assuming equal combo), doesn't mean it needs a 'delay'.

You cannot win an average 1-2 situation unless you have a better combo than what you face. I've seen more than enough TTK examples in games with other boosted drones inclusive.

Also buffing booster to +60% would easily bring hordes of Boosters back because of the TTK for many augments/turrets along with the ability to NOT worry about switching and simply supply uptime which can be generally maintained, ofc not at spawn, but at a better reduced overall supply consumption rate. There was a clear reason why Booster was hard nerfed.

 

[PirateSpider 1,491]

On 10/11/2023 at 8:35 PM, Akame said:

Reducing the damage buff would be suffice,

By how much?

On 10/11/2023 at 8:35 PM, Akame said:

reducing ttk.

Hmmm.

[Akame 4,599]

On 10/12/2023 at 4:52 AM, PirateSpider said:

By how much?

 

Currently it is tuned towards the basic items in the game, i.e Hammer gets to deal 2k+ per basic shot with max damage, if it disrupts the relative order to reduce meta gaming. Similar exists for other items but not for everything.

You should check out the booster/crisis drone interaction pages created by Congo, they're fairly informative about those 2 damage buffing drones. Then go figure. Naturally dev's have made these parameters on purpose.

[PirateSpider 1,491]

On 10/11/2023 at 9:17 PM, Akame said:

Currently it is tuned towards the basic items in the game, i.e Hammer gets to deal 2k+ per basic shot with max damage, if it disrupts the relative order to reduce meta gaming. Similar exists for other items but not for everything.

Honestly, if crisis gets a 10-20% nerf in its bonus damage, then I'd also be fine with it.

[Hypersomnia 1,739]

On 10/11/2023 at 9:09 PM, firety31 said:

PirateSpider should have made his statement more clearer by saying :Besides, light hulls will die quickly regardless of what drones  Except Crisis.

But... Defender... Literally... Has... The... Same... Amount... Of... Armor... Boost... But Crisis light hulls are the ones that don't die quickly? Hmm... Interesting.

On 10/11/2023 at 9:14 PM, PirateSpider said:

Care to tell use what drone you used in that battle?

Care to read a spoiler below the pic?

On 10/11/2023 at 9:14 PM, PirateSpider said:

Actually, if anything, it'll encourages utilizing the players surroundings more.

It'll encourage more non crisis users to not run away from a crisis user whether it be moving away, self destructing, or even leaving the battle.

And why would i utilize surroundings more when literally every other drone is Pew Pew enemy ded? Also we all love our lovely scorpions and magnums shooting behind a wall making surroundings useless half of the time in the first place. No +2000 artificial ping to a crisis user for no reason will not make people "use their surroundings more" lmao. Also I wish people we're scared of Crisis just like you're explaining here. Would make my life easier.

 

On 10/11/2023 at 9:21 PM, firety31 said:

Oh, even Kimura! I remember back in the days Akame used to say he is a very skilled player while posting his endless gifs with the most balanced combo

You said that light hulls are glasscanons and I showed you that they're not. Now all of a sudden Crisis + Light Hull = Defensive Juggernaut? Huh...

Also if you're going to say Gauss + Hornet + Crisis is the most unabalanced combo of the year then show me a screenshot of you EVEN FINDING A GAUSS + HORNET USER let alone him getting 1000+ score. Also I got 1700+ score with Trickster drone once so now we're going to add 2 second delay to trickster too?

On 10/12/2023 at 3:08 AM, PirateSpider said:

Honestly, I still have my doubts on his claims of getting 1500+ every battle, even though he showed me many screenshots of him doing it.

> I doubt on his claims of getting 1500+ every battle

> even though he showed me many screenshots of him doing it.

Ah yes. Another one to my collection. Also I never claimed I get 1500 every battle. I said I average out at 1000+ score per battle. My highest being around 2200 score and lowest obviously a 0.

 

It is very clear that you two just try to trash on Crisis but got disproven and now resort to changing your own theories about it just to sound right. Re-read your own comments and write down your points.

[alkyng 3,081]

On 10/12/2023 at 6:35 AM, Akame said:

or you simply hide a lot. Just because a few others can use it effectively in a 1-1 situation (assuming equal combo), doesn't mean it needs a 'delay'.

On 10/12/2023 at 3:02 PM, Kimura said:

You said that light hulls are glasscanons and I showed you that they're not. Now all of a sudden Crisis + Light Hull = Defensive Juggernaut? Huh...

Also if you're going to say Gauss + Hornet + Crisis is the most unabalanced combo of the year then show me a screenshot of you EVEN FINDING A GAUSS + HORNET USER let alone him getting 1000+ score. Also I got 1700+ score with Trickster drone once so now we're going to add 2 second delay to trickster too?

Care to take a look? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

[Akame 4,599]

On 10/12/2023 at 6:05 AM, PirateSpider said:

Honestly, if crisis gets a 10-20% nerf in its bonus damage, then I'd also be fine with it.

Sounds reasonable enough; I don't know what changes would happen but it is the most realistic nerf direction for most part.

[alkyng 3,081]

On 10/12/2023 at 6:49 PM, Akame said:

Sounds reasonable enough; I don't know what changes would happen but it is the most realistic nerf direction for most part.

If combined with the other suggested nerfs then yes Crisis would be more plausible

[PirateSpider 1,491]

On 10/12/2023 at 5:02 AM, Kimura said:

Care to read a spoiler below the pic?

Its funny that you hid your spoiler above a quoted post. What's even more funny is that you're saying that crisis is "balanced" but you're also providing information and evidence that says otherwise. Your pic was just the latest example of this. You're always shooting yourself in the foot, aren't you?

On 10/12/2023 at 5:02 AM, Kimura said:

> I doubt on his claims of getting 1500+ every battle

> even though he showed me many screenshots of him doing it.

Ah yes. Another one to my collection. Also I never claimed I get 1500 every battle. I said I average out at 1000+ score per battle. My highest being around 2200 score and lowest obviously a 0.

Maybe I'll look around in your forum profile when I'm bored over the weekend.

On 10/12/2023 at 5:02 AM, Kimura said:

It is very clear that you two just try to trash on Crisis but got disproven and now resort to changing your own theories about it just to sound right. Re-read your own comments and write down your points.

When did we get "disproven"? Care to share?

On 10/12/2023 at 8:49 AM, Akame said:

Sounds reasonable enough; I don't know what changes would happen but it is the most realistic nerf direction for most part.

Perhaps you'd like to suggest a new topic for it?

[Hypersomnia 1,739]

On 10/12/2023 at 7:27 PM, PirateSpider said:

Its funny that you hid your spoiler above a quoted post. What's even more funny is that you're saying that crisis is "balanced" but you're also providing information and evidence that says otherwise. Your pic was just the latest example of this. You're always shooting yourself in the foot, aren't you?

Is big score means OP now? Aight. 
Hyperion.
 

Spoiler

Pre 20% damage nerf Booster.
 

Spoiler

Trickster.

Spoiler

Yes this is somehow a MM battle.

So what are your horrible non-sense nerfs for these drones?

 

On 10/12/2023 at 7:27 PM, PirateSpider said:

When did we get "disproven"? Care to share?

You two are constantly changing your points to make crisis feel like some godmode item. Latest one is light hulls going from easy to kill to all of a sudden invincible when paired with crisis.

 

On 10/12/2023 at 8:05 AM, PirateSpider said:

Honestly, if crisis gets a 10-20% nerf in its bonus damage, then I'd also be fine with it.

Wow you finally turned on your brain and said something that could happen and make at least some sense.

[alkyng 3,081]

On 10/12/2023 at 8:01 PM, Kimura said:

So what are your horrible non-sense nerfs for these drones?

Honestly Pirate made a horrible non-sense nerf when he decided Crisis to get -20% damage nerf, I don't know how he suddenly become this tolerant. Definitely -20% nerf is never sensible

[PirateSpider 1,491]

On 10/12/2023 at 10:01 AM, Kimura said:

Is big score means OP now? Aight. 
Hyperion.
 

  Reveal hidden contents

Pre 20% damage nerf Booster.
 

  Hide contents

Trickster.

You do realize that your screenshots won't convince me, right?

If you really want to convince me that you're good enough to get 1500+ score per battle, you'll have to record videos of battles you play in.

On 10/12/2023 at 10:01 AM, Kimura said:

You two are constantly changing your points to make crisis feel like some godmode item.

Perhaps you'd like to point out where we keep changing our points?

On 10/12/2023 at 10:01 AM, Kimura said:

invincible when paired with crisis.

I have never said that. That was all on the other guy.

On 10/12/2023 at 10:01 AM, Kimura said:

Wow you finally turned on your brain and said something that could happen and make at least some sense.

And when was the last time you made a sensible post?

 

Oh yeah, thats right. You never did.

On 10/12/2023 at 10:29 AM, firety31 said:

Honestly Pirate made a horrible non-sense nerf when he decided Crisis to get -20% damage nerf, I don't know how he suddenly become this tolerant. Definitely -20% nerf is never sensible

Honestly, I'd be fine with any nerf that's significant enough.

I would've suggested a damage nerf to begin with, but unlike the majority of the player base, I know how people are.

They'd be like:

" Oh, not another simple damage reduction"

[MEXICAN-SKY 308]

On 10/12/2023 at 7:43 PM, PirateSpider said:

Oh, not another simple damage reduction

Damage reduction to anything is more than just a simple nerf. It targets the fundamental mechanics of it's ability to be effective.

Crisis and It's extra 60% damage is negated by so many defences that it makes it, as I have already stated an above average addition to your combo.

I play crisis non stop with magnum and I can tell you from my years of playing it it has lost a lot of it's potential to do damage, because of all the augments it has to negate, which is impossible to do.

When magnum decides to actually work and do damage in battle then crisis plays it's part, but only against players without magnum protection. Players with magnum protection, which is usually at least 50% of the enemy from the start always survive my direct hits UNLESS they are crits. 

You would think that doing an EXTRA 60% DAMAGE with a maxed out combo would obliterate most players, It does not. 

Your views on crisis and giving it a nerf (regardless of which nerf it should get in you opinion) are unfounded, misguided and ultimately so very wrong.

I use crisis as my main drone and it is not the OP game changer you make it out to be, that is left to the legal hack paladin.

 

[PirateSpider 1,491]

On 10/12/2023 at 2:06 PM, MEXICAN-SKY said:

Crisis and It's extra 60% damage is negated by so many defences that it makes it, as I have already stated an above average addition to your combo.

I play crisis non stop with magnum and I can tell you from my years of playing it it has lost a lot of it's potential to do damage, because of all the augments it has to negate, which is impossible to do.

When magnum decides to actually work and do damage in battle then crisis plays it's part, but only against players without magnum protection. Players with magnum protection, which is usually at least 50% of the enemy from the start always survive my direct hits UNLESS they are crits. 

All of these things are not unique to crisis. Every drone has to go through this.

Don't believe me? Then maybe play a few battles with a different drone.

On 10/12/2023 at 2:06 PM, MEXICAN-SKY said:

use crisis as my main drone and it is not the OP game changer you make it out to be, that is left to the legal hack paladin.

Bro thinks paladin is an OP game changer while crisis is balanced.