[sigh] Why are the values not listed in BEFORE and AFTER format? Sheesh.

I understand your point of view. I posted basically the same point awhile back. There's no fundimenatal reason to divide the player base into PROs and NOs. But ... considering everything else about Tanki's patchwork system maybe this approach is the only shall we say "politically possible" way to go about it. I suggest we players push for the price to be lowered even more. And/or week-long passes should be given out via missions. If there really is a player base that wants the simple battle button and go system, then they can still have it. Lowering the price to a token amount lets the rest of th eplayers set no-drug, no-mu options, whatever.

I had an idea bouncing around since Halloween weekend. I'll mention it here because it seems to belong in the battle creation discussion. One of the best things about Halloween was you knew you could always find games for your missions. There'd be many DM, DTM, CP, and CTF games on Halloween maps so it was easy to start working on those missions. I suggest Tanki should dedicate every weekend to a different map. Ensure everyone gets that mission on Sat and Sun. Change the map weekly. Avoid using over-played maps to gie lesser-played maps exposure. Make the task and the reward about one third the Halloween missions, maybe one-half. Weekends would have lots of games on the featured map. It'd be easy find a game and there'd be regular relief from the Poly/Island/Etc grinding monotony.

I think the developers need to take the issue of mission maps very seriously in the wake of this battle creation change. Several players have pointed out the issue. Even with all the PRO game out there today I had a hell of a time finding a game on Future that had more than 1-2 people on each side. And of course I got missions on Future for two of my accounts. This sort of tedium has no upside whatsoever. It really gets irksome spending time just looking for a battle on your map.

I do not find Tanki to be pay to play at all. I do my daily missions and each week I use fewer supplies than I earn. Now with the PRO Pass being common I can find drug-free games for the 1st tie ever. That further reduces my drug use. I've gotten to the point where I have 400 or 500 of supplies including nearly 300 Repair kits. If I run across an obscene drugger I can match him if I have to. I've got good gear for my rank. I'm earning Cry fast enough to buy my next upgrade step. Unless you want to play Tanki for like 3 hours or more each day on the same account you can do just fine without spending a dime. But if you play a tone every day it starts making sense to buy Premium Passes. And hours/day even as a moderate user will eventually use up your missions drugs. I think its rather fair that someone using the game 3+ hours a game pay a little money for its upkeep.

I know what you are saying. The PRO pass cost whatever that might be is essentially a drain on earnings. It is very easy to image the game with every player able to use the PRO features automatically at no cost. On the surface there seems no compelling need to divide the player base into two groups like this at all. OTOH Tanki is full of such oddities. This approach might be the most workable at this time. This seems like an improvement because it is now possible to find drug-free games. So maybe when the whole system is rolled out this piece will make more sense. One thing is certain. The ability to set the PRO parameters works only when lots and lots of players are able to play in those games. So Tanki must find a way to ensure at least 40% (guestimate) of all accounts buy PRO passes at any given moment. So in the end they might just give the PRO passes out to everyone for free. That's the q00% sure way of ensureing a large player base for the PRO options.

Yeah the propganda explanation seems the most like;y. And it seems to work. The player base over at the TX playtest seems to believe the propaganda that TX is "an entirely different game". Well, when I was dabbling in TX I ran the 4 possible combinations of Viking/hunter plus smoky/thunder. I had an alt account that allowed me to play the same 4 combinations on m0 gear. TX is definitely slower. It's no mirage.

I understand the need to port to a new software standard. But I am being told TankiX is a "whole brand-new game". Which is, as you observe here, utter bull****. It's the same game. IMO that is probably a mistake. What sold 6 years ago does not automatically sell today. It certainly is a mistake, IMO, to roll out the same Drug concepts .... I have never heard a game's player base so hateful of that game's power-up system as in Tanki. But Tankji is keeping them unaltered in an act of stuborness that can only be described as epic in proportion.

If there is one thing Tanki can brag about is in having so very many maps especially for a game with this size player base. But they don't get used!

Yeah, I also resent Tanki's habit of blowing smoke up our asses when sincerity would sell so much better.

Your broader point is correct. Data without context mean nothing.

I tried TankiX and I agree. It plays like WW1-era tanks in mud except the tanks are the size of ocean liners. But really... what is the point to re-crating the same game with the same massively flawed Drugs system, same exact tanks concepts, same exact maps.. its the same game that plays worse but it does have heat-wave effects on the explosions. zzzzzzz

Well ... I guess the most important feedback is this: I am glad Tanki seems to be trying to address some key issues. I feel significantly better about their sincere intent as compared to a month or so past. As for how this last change is actually performing under live use ... You know, this is a big change with some big ramifications. I don't think we'll know for at least a month. Not until the player base settles into two groups. PROs and NOs.. My guess is success or failure will depend largely upon the relative size of those two groups. As far as immidiate impressions go. Drug-free issue: For the first time since I have played Tanki I have been able to find and play drug-free games. By that I mean on-map pickups but no personal power-ups. only 1 game I've found barred both. But I do not mind the on-map pick-ups... those affect map strategies and are available to any tank. So far so good. Tedium in finding a game issue: The Battle button is actually a benefit if all you want to do is find a game with a good number of players. The Battle button does not seem to over-use Poly, Noise, Mt C, Sandbox, etc. OTOH the tedium of finding a battle in the PRO section is now worse. Before I had to manually look at each battle to see rank level and competitive situations. Now i have to look at each manually for the same things,m plus look at the drug;/MU settings, plus sort out format battles (useless to me) plus sort out games that last for 999 caps or run for 10 hours. The tedium might end up worse!. So far a little good along with a great deal more worry that this will all backfire. Too many games played on too few maps issue: I just looked through servers EN1-6 with my lowest rated account and this issue seems worse if anything. The list of Sandbox games alone was almost a full screen top to bottom. This change has done nothing to address this issue and has possibly made it worse.. So far complete fail. Bottom line: I am encouraged by a major change because that speaks of a sincere attempt to improve matters. However, I suspect this approach is a band-aid. I would really like to see the ability to search across all servers for all games that match 2-3 serach parameters. E.g: Show me all CTF, TDM, CP games with [highest rank Colonel, no Supplies use]. Sow me all DM games on the map Tribute. Anyway ... we will see where this goes.

I too, hate that map. :) The map doesn't really matter. I fully afmit that in a 1:1 duel situation a freeze is way ahead of the Isida. Isida is like Smoky (to me) in that ambushing foes in larger DMs works better. BUT I've neve had a chance to do a 1:1 like that with someone I've met in the game. It'd be fun to see how the battle goes, And it'd be interesting to test a couple conditoins like rages and blocking angles too. :)

I know wolverene... we're all just arguing about how well Taki has moved the line. I guess what it boils down to is this: I am saying the nerf to Isida is not quite as bad as the rest of y'all are saying. There are certainly probably specific tactics or approaches that no longer work. But others do work. As an Isida player you earn exp and Cr and most importantly have fun while doing so. I attack, I defend, I roam, I cruise solo or I move with a pack. I do not feel limited in 'having to sit at the base and heal' in any regard. But when battle begins I have options no one else has. Everyone can try to kill the enemy. Everyone can try to dodge attacks. Everyone can duck behind cover and use the terrain and pop drugs. But when the ammo is flying only Isida has the choice of altering it's firepower from killing the enemy to saving the ally or the other way around. It is another option in the real-time split-second decision making chain that drives the adrenaline frenzy we call gaming. B) Isida gives you an option and choices no one else has. That adds to the fun ... if you do not mind a lower K/D. :)

My Isida missions yesterday were: 500 points in DM mode and another one was Kill 40 enemies. Now since I have to kill 40 enemies on my way to 500 pt in DM, that kill 40 enemy one really was a freebie. But they both paid a Crystal reward so I did them. Which makes me think of I_W_A's post above there. Now that I think about it one of the DM battles was on Barda with just Isida/Hornet me, plus one each of the other short-range turrets, plus two Twins. Everyone had light or medium hulls...I know the Twins had mediums and also the freeze. Anyway that match was tough. It was a hard match in constant combat with short-rangers with Twins jumping in from only a bit further away. I still scored 16-17 kills but I did probably have the better gear than most. I remembre this stuff because I was thinking about the debate here at the time. :) That fight made me realize how in DM I prey on the medium and long-rage hulls. In that DM when everyone was basically a short-ranger it was tough. Especially getting freeze-jumped, and them medium-hull Twins. Annyway, I really do feel the Isida is deadly enough to perform the DM missions. I wouldn't play DM on Polygon but give me Dusseldorf (no on-map Repair Kits by the way). Now if you really really love DM missions then Isida is probably not your turret.

Sure we can test it out that way. That's a great idea. :)

I knew the message would get lost in talk over he example. [sigh] The exact example does not matter. The effect is there is good situations and bad. In the long run those situations even out and the math remains. What the math says is this: An Isida tank has a tactical advantage no other tank has: It's effectively fights as though it had "One Hundred Plus X" percent Hit Points. What value X deserves to be in the long run is unknown. Now - the assumption here has always been that X is exactly 10%. My point to all this is that X is a higher number. Over the long run the Isida tank will re-gain much more than a mere 10% of it's own hull strength. The simple fact that the enemy tank can have more HP than the Isida is proof enough of that. My honorable counterparts in this debate have put forth that Isida now offers no tactical advantage over other short-range turrets. So why will anyone interested in a short-range turret every buy Isida? I've always said in counter that there will always be players who take Isida because they want to heal their teammates, the end. I've also suggested that experience shows the Isida seems capable from what I have seen. But my highest account is only a Major, so... So I am taking the debate one step further. I would like to suggest the Isida turret has at least two well-defined tactical advantages over the three other short-range turrets: Firebird, Freeze, and Hammer. For all 10 other turrets Isida has the advantage of fighting with an effective hull strength of 1xx% HP - and that number is bigger than 110%. For Firebird, Hammer and Freeze the Isida has the advantage of constant damage over distance. The next stage in the debate will of course be "but those advantages are not enough!". However it is at this point ladies and gentlemen that debate ends and game-play begins. Because leveraging these small advantages in combat is what winning and losing is all about. We cannot settle that question on the forum. It must be settled in Rio, Dusseldorf, and Berlin. :) Let me know the 1.5 million exp point view. I'll be here abusing warrant officers and lieutenants with m2 gear MUed to General-level power. :) Until the next update, of course

I still don't understand your concept of "clear" abuse. Am I right you say another player should be banned because they complain about supplies use in the game? That's not clear abuse, that is someone speaking their mind about a valid flaw in this game. When people dislike somethng they complain - admittedly not always in the most productive manner. But it is going to happen. If you want to silence this sort of commentary, you are so dead-flat wrong. But once again, I am not sure what you really want. Stuff about one's mom, base language etc of course should carry consequences. But that sort of stuff does seem to get attention.

Right, "drugger" as used in Tanki jargon is different than it is used in the general public. How can you expect a gaming company to ban a player for using that game's jargon. It's a vicious circle. Tanki would have to ban itself and [poof] would go out of existence in leap of pure logic. . :blink:

Hmm the other point of view in the soap opera. Seems like DejectedTomato here might be a bit of the control freak. People complain abut things they don't like. Takes a bit of a God complex to assume you can tell 50,000 other people not to speak their minds. On othe other other hand, I don't see the point in confronting the druggers. Hate the pusher, not the user. Tanki deserves our scorn for putting in a Supplies system that actually detracts from the game.

I so often just don't read the battle chat.

I am far from convinced. By now I've fought close to 100,000 battles so this notion there's still a vast learning curve to be climbed is pretty hard to swallow. But in practical terms I cannot be too worried. I expect to never hit Gizmo ranks. By the time I reach Marshal and the m3 drug/mult cluster**** of teh endgame, I'll probably have played enough Tanki. This is Tanki's major design flaw and it is colossal. The designers have given me, the player, exactly no reason to want to earn Exp Points and higher rank. In fact anecdotes about the Legend-rank endgame indicate the gameplay experience is inferiour to that at lower ranks. So I am using the last grade gear I'll ever have: m2. I'll never see what these God like players can do . lol

Yes, by moving all m3 gear to the same rank they merely pushed the same quality mis-match problem down to the lower ranks. As a lower-ranker, I plan to spend the rest of my Tanki career exploiting those mis-matches. :unsure:

I just traded in my m1 Viking for m2 only 2 weeks ago. It's that same driving experience as you have but just more so. :) After last weekend now I have it and Smoky m2 t MU 18 or 19. You ar right it is a very effective combo even w/o drugs. I can eneter games with 3-4 higher ranks now easilly. One tjhinng about the medium hlls for player like you and me should be pointed out. Ay at m3 and m4 the medium hull all thave teh same HP. At m0, m1, and m2 they do not. I could have bought an m2 Hunter, Viking or Defender at m2. But the HP vary at m2 from 2000 to a high of about 2170 for Viking. With every MU step the other 2 hulls close the gap with Viking but they do not catch up in HP until all hulls at a ful m3. So for players climbing the ladder, there are still differences like this to exploit. All 3 medium hulls are not equal for all players!